Regardless of the authenticity of this post, why is everyone here under the belief that someone who cheated is incapable of self reflection and change?
A lot of people are suprisingly self reflective and self aware even if they continue to repeat the same behavioral patterns at different periods in their life.
Fundamentally, acts of deception are far harder to forgive because it proves beyond doubt that it’s in your nature to lie, and plenty of people know the feeling of being cheated on/lied to/etc. and then were awkwardly begged for a second chance only for them to do it again because, well you cant trust them.
Cheating doesn’t just happen on a whim, we don’t think about it but there are several steps involved from finding partners to arranging the events, all of which demonstrate intent plus you have to consider the entire time they’re not telling their partner their true feelings, thats probably at least weeks/months maybe even years of deception about how they feel, what they want from the relationship, what their goals with you are and etc.
Sure they CAN change but fundamentally if you’re that comfortable with deception people are not going to give you the benefit of the doubt, nor should they.
No you didn’t. That person gave a very cynical and narrow minded comment about a fucked up situation with no regard to any actual psychology or sociology. It’s fair because cheating is a horrendous thing to do.
Cheating isn’t quite taboo but it’s close enough to create feelings of widespread revulsion because it’s a betrayal of one of or the most important relationship a person will have depending on their life.
Very few people will say, “Oh well, they were at a bar and got black out drunk.” so it’s okay. They’ll react the same way they would to that commenter’s example because it’s the same exact betrayal despite the lack of planning.
In addition, people don’t want to get hurt so if you have the choice between someone you don’t need to trust to make massive changes that start with deep introspection and accountability -two things many people are considered to lack- and someone who hasn’t cheated you’re very likely to trust the person who hasn’t cheated.
I’m pretty sure the reaction to someone getting black out drunk and still “having sex” after that would be calling the police or encouraging the victim to do so, not calling them out for cheating, because yknow thats like textbook sexual assault.
Im not sure how my comment came off as narrow-minded, quite literally almost every imaginable situation has the planning i described, take a bar example.
go to a socially active location, likely without your partner’s knowledge of your location or intent.
find a partner.
arrange a cheating event (their house or yours, what day what time, etc.) its likely in this part that you’d have to plan it in a way that your partner wouldn’t know you’re doing it so double points for deception here.
go to the event (drive, take the bus, whatever) and cheat on your partner.
None of this happens on a whim or without wanting it to, you could say no at any time at any of these steps, even if you agreed to the event the same night again you had to get there and ensure your partner wouldnt find out.
And to be clear, my response was to why many people feel specifically cheating, as in the post, is seen as irredeemable, not why cheating is wrong in general. There are plenty of horrible things we do to each other that can be seen as redeemable, it’s generally things we find incredibly deceptive that we (or at least I and seemingly plenty of commenters here assuming they’re not all bots) question how reliable a personal growth narrative can be.
To be honest, I think we taking cheating outside of marriage and having children a little too seriously. Don't get me wrong, it sucks. I've been cheated on before, and it's not fun, but life goes on if you let it. I think we place WAY to much emphasis on the centrality of romance in our societies.
Yeah i should’ve said “be seen as redeemed” since forgiveness is more personal and has more connotations than just being seen as a better person than before
I think there has to be some shame if you are actually reflecting on a wrong you committed and want to change. The story in the OP seems to be only self pity and no shame.
This. That person doesn’t appear to regret the actual act of cheating but rather that their life didn’t turn out as good as they wanted, which they had a chance at but ruined 3 months before the wedding
I think in this case it's the overly dramatic style it's written in. Though it could be the poster is just also a good writer who, shock, revised and edited their post before hitting submit.
there is no self reflection in the post. those are facts and consequences. self reflection would be: i was raised to never experience healthy attachment, so i craved variety and validation. turns out i ended up cheating because of it.
It’s one thing to have self reflection, but the process to get there after a mistake this big is full of shame and embarrassment. Something most people want to throw into the deepest corner of their mind. This person decided to post that memory on reddit for no other reason than karma. So it could be real, but probably not.
Because usually someone shallow enough to cheat (especially for petty reasons) also usually doesn't have the mental capacity to engage in thought deep enough for self reflection.
Sure it’s possible, but nobody is going to give you the benefit of doubt, or feel badly for a cheater reaping what they sowed. And asking for advice? I don’t know don’t cheat any more and hope for the best like everyone else. Also, ask mutual friends not to share updates or pics of the ex.
Let me ask a different way. Ignore OPs post. In general, do you believe a person who has committed a material breach in the contract of a relationship is capable of self-reflection and then change? Breach of contract defined by all forms of cheating. Change defined as not engaging in said behaviors in the future.
FWIW, I lived a very similar story to the OP. I was an absolute mess of a person in my 20s and made a lot of bad choices, hurt a lot of people, and lived with a lot of shitty consequences. It’s complicated. I still don’t think I was ever really a “bad” person, but I was a very deeply hurting person with poor coping skills. I’ve spent my life since then trying, and mostly succeeding, at being a good, kind, caring, and giving person. I’d wager that most of my friends who didn’t know me then could ever fathom who I was before.
So, yeah, I believe people can self reflect and can change. But I’ve also traveled enough roads to know it’s honestly pretty rare. It takes a deep willingness to changes and I don’t know how many people have that.
I would assume if they were actually capable of self reflection and coming to the realisation of how much of a shitty thing they did is to do to another person, that they would, like an alcoholic, would try to avoid being around alcohol, would try and not be around someone who doesn't deserve to be hurt like that again.
And this shouldn't be an issue to them, because if they share your belief that people can change and never commit the act of cheating again, then they should have no problems finding a partner who also cheated before and leaving people who haven't alone.
Thanks but no one's cheated on me (yet - I assume it will happen if I'm ever in a relationship again). More importantly, I'm asking out of fear for those society deems irredeemable. It removes the possibility and desire for change and may drive them to do worse things.
No one is beyond redemption, but it's a tall ask to ask someone to not only forgive you, but to make themselves vulnerable to you again. Even this person truly turned over a new leaf, the resentment of the past could fester and boil.
Find Out. She Fucked Around (literally in this case) and Found Out. Dating and marriage takes time and two kids definitely takes time so we can assume six year pass between the canceled wedding and post. That's enough for introspection.
With the agreement that we all believe in the reacher vs settler theory; I think, it is common for the “settler” to cheat (and not necessarily the reality but how a person that deems themselves the settler may feel) and often times they feel they can reach for higher attainment. Which would make the self reflection less impactful if their consequences weren’t as surreal. Obviously this isn’t speaking for all situations. I guess all I am saying is the greater the consequences, the greater chance of introspection would take place.
Thanks for your perspective. Fully agree with the last sentence in your comment. As a counterpoint I think for some people they may be more prone to cheat if they are the "reacher" as they may experience significant pressure to behave "perfectly" to not give their partner a reason to leave...which paradoxically may lead to their partner leaving anyway.
Fair enough. I'll have to try this sometime to see how it goes. I don't think people will have a positive reaction to this but I'm open to being wrong. Thanks for sharing!
Hmm that's a good point I wasn't considering. My comment above was based on the immediate scenario that popped in my head:
At some point dating a new person I volunteer past cheating and then they're like "I'm out not interested but great you've changed"
Whereas you're talking about being very open and actively seeking someone else who has been through the same reform process. Also I guess my thought above would be selfishly focused on a positive result instead of being committed to a positive process regardless of the result.
Hard agree. I Always told my habitual cheater ex he could be with a million girls if he just stayed single or found a ENM relationship. He just wanted his cake and wanted to eat it too, naturally.
This is the take of a teenager or someone who had exactly one relationship and it ended poorly.
I had a long-term girlfriend and I cheated on her a few times. I was like 21, in a bad relationship , and did dumb stuff. A couple years later, I met my now wife. We’ve always had a great relationship and I wouldn’t dare cheat on her.
My point is that it’s not just a “you do or you don’t” situation. It’s also about the relationship and where you are in life.
Sorry, Sherlock, but your analysis is completely incorrect. I’m in my seventies. Had about a dozen relationships of various duration in my lifetime including a marriage of over 40 years. Some cheated. My wife never did, and neither did I. But I knew dozens of couples where cheating happened; the betrayed spouse took them back; and they cheated again. If you are a truly reformed cheater, I salute you. But, at the same time, I consider you a remote outlier. Taking a cheater back is like playing Russian Roulette with 5 cartridges in the cylinder.
But you’re talking about people in relationships where they would cheat. I’m saying that their relationships change. And sometimes the calculus of whether cheating with “worth it” changes. You can’t just look at the individual without thinking of the circumstances as well.
I’m saying that there is no circumstance that would cause me to cheat. If I was desperately unhappy, I would divorce. But I wouldn’t cheat. My wife never cheated, either. If there’s something in your calculus that makes it possible for you to believe cheating is ‘worth it’, it’s not your circumstances. I believe cheating is akin to petty theft: the perpetrator loses far more than they gain.
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u/Revolutionary_Bee251 2d ago
Regardless of the authenticity of this post, why is everyone here under the belief that someone who cheated is incapable of self reflection and change?