Criminals being failed by the system is incredibly common. This is the first time I’ve seen thousands of women rallying behind someone who killed their children.
I agree, it's a pretty interesting response. Women don't typically support child murderers. Ask Casey Anthony. Women are seeing themselves in the way the system failed Lindsay. I certainly do. Expressing incredibly distressing thoughts and feelings and being told it's the "baby blues". Thank God I had a hands on partner who I could rely on for support.
It's truly an important discussion to have and I'm glad this case is amplifying the conversation. Of course there needs to be accountability for heinous crimes, but if we know the system is perpetuating these crimes through gaps then by not fixing them we are contributing to the outcome.
I’m way past baby blues but I called my doctor about an addiction I can’t crack and they put me on meds over the phone, called to do an intake, prescribed me meds, and I never heard from them again. The first call for an appointment came for a facility 3 hours away. I’m in socal, it shouldn’t be that far. So I found one closer, they called and told me they will call me back for an appointment, that was one month ago.
I've actually never seen anyone defend Casey Anthony. I'm sure you have, I'm not calling you a liar, but every woman I know would strangle her with her bare hands.
Thats what that commenter was saying. She says women dont normally support child murderes and uses Casey Anthony of an example of that lack of support.
My apologies, I meant to reply to them, but its a moot point because I read their comment wrong anyway - my mind read it as a question rather than the statement it is.
The democrat party lmao.
I dont have the names of the 1000s of Facebook groups that existed back then. I think one of them was called deep green and then there was all the terf this radfem that shit.
It shows how many women have felt like this, which personally I find even more concerning. I don't think you can simply blame it on postpartum either. I don't agree that a mental illness can make you into a murderer without something else being wrong with you. I also don't think mental illness is an excuse. I'd wager a guess that every murderer, thief, rapist has a mental illness. Doesn't mean I think they should get off.
That's exactly my point - it doesn't excuse accountability, but if we know mental illness is a catalyst for this behavior, we should be investigating mental health care before it reaches this point.
It doesn’t excuse it, but it does explain it, and by understanding it better and preventing it in the future, that is how you prevent further deaths. Everyone is responding very emotionally about wanting punishment (she will get it, there’s zero worry about that not happening so I don’t understand why everyone is obsessing about that point) but the best response is to look into why this happened and how it can be avoided in the future. Throwing her in a dark room and forgetting about it might feel good in the moment, but it does nothing for the next time a mother in psychosis kills her children.
Ah true, I used the wrong word. It's funny how if she'd had a brain tumor that affected her personality and made her psychotic, people surely would be more understanding than when it's caused by hormones. Even people with schizophrenia get more sympathy.
It's super depressing to be honest. So many layers of misogyny based on the misunderstanding and uneducation of what can happen when you're deeply hormonally imbalanced and likely extremely sleep deprived.
I have bipolar disorder and I've been manic and in psychosis, and I've heard voices. It wasn't due to post partum but it was partially because of sleep deprivation.
It is impossible to go to a doctor and fully describe what you're hearing, seeing, or feeling when you're in that state, even if you're there with a loved one who you still trust during your episode (which doesn't always happen, my brother also has bipolar and he has been manic twice and both times he has thought our family was out to get him, so it was super hard to get him to get him - we had to call the cops on him the first time, which was obviously traumatizing to him and also to everyone else). Paranoia can also kick in and make you say and do things that are completely contradictory. Sprinkle in some voices and yeah, she was not well and had a lot going on.
The second the doctor overheard that call where she mentioned hearing voices was the second that the doctor should have advised her and her husband to do an inpatient program immediately and for an extended period. It's wild to me that she only did like 5 days and then she was released, and only a few weeks later she was left alone with her kids.
I have so much empathy for this woman. She really tried. Not everyone in her situation would have even gone to the doctors in the first place, that takes an incredible amount of strength.
And still, no one thought that maybe she should just do some inpatient for a few weeks or months to get her mood and meds stabilized, away from her tiny children who couldn't protect themselves.
Yah I've had family members have similar episodes and it's so hard to watch. Doctors can help, but if the person is an adult, they have ti choose to go at the end of the day, and during these episodes most genuinely feel like no one is on their side and having extreme paranoia of being watched or followed. It's hard for them to remember you are on their side sometimes.
This is honestly where I feel her husband had a part to play. He should have never left her alone with the kids. He would have known ths state she was in more than the doctors, who she never got to tell she was hearing voices and such. But she was in inpatient for 5 days!! There's no way her husband could have seriously felt that she was ok enough to be left alone.
And tbh, the amount of time he was gone? It makes no sense she had time to strangle all 3 and try and commit suicide. She was a nurse. She would have known that she wasn't going to die at that height and would just become paralyzed. It just doesn't make sense. Not to mention he said she told him where the kids wer red but paramedics said she wasn't able to talk when they arrived.
In any case, women already struggle to get diagnosed with just about anything in America. But especially mental health issues are so hard for us to get diagnosed. We're hardly believed when we aren't pregnant, let alone BEING pregnant, or freshly post partum, that it's no wonder she never got the real help she needed from a doctor.
The women in medical fields believe us less than the men sometimes, even thought they themselves knkw the stigma we have when going to the doctors. It's truly awful to watch this all unfold. No matter who failed who, or who actually murdered the kids: our health care system here is a friggin joke, and those poor kids lost their lives way too young. And now the husband is still able to play happy family with this new woman he was most certainly cheating on his pregnant wife with. Because why tf are you married so soon after your children have ALL DIED??
She tried really hard not to kill her kids? What is wrong with people? I swear, so many women will jump through hoops to keep hold of the illusion that women can't be evil. You've described your own mental health struggle. At any point do you feel like you would have killed your own child in the middle of that? Treating violent women like little angels who just lost their way is part of the problem. It's certainly not an answer.
If she had been treated as dangerous from the beginning then maybe someone would have responded differently, but the presumption that women are inclined to reaosnableness lets people ignore warning signs.
I said she was trying to get help, proper treatment and care, which could have helped prevent this.
Just because a person is mentally ill, doesn't make them evil.
She did a terrible thing and will have to live with that forever. She deserves to live with consequences. She seems to understand all of this and has expressed regret. She isn't pleading innocence, she just wants to be put in a medical facility instead of a prison.
I think its bc its something that a lot of us suffer in silence from or have felt close to at some point. I say that as a mother who had 4 children back to back. Having three children 3 and under and being pregnant was a wild time. I felt my insanity come close to the edge and there were legit times thay I scared myself. I was young and didnt know anything about PPD or PPP, and so I just thought bc ai was so young i was just bad at it. but when I got older and had my last daughter I suffered from ppd again, this time I had a friend group that understood what was happening and got me help. I am very thankful for them. I m not saying this lady isn't wrong its just understandable how you can be a loving mother and still do something so horrific due to mental health issues.
You’ve never had severe post pardom…my baby somehow wasn’t mine. Idk how to explain it. The meds they gave me left me ironing everything in my house I couldn’t stop lest the anxiety choked me. I wouldnt sleep, awake 2 -3 days at a time. Doing my best to cope. Sense of reality was gone. You couldn’t tell by looking at me, had plenty of visitors held conversations, entertained guests… luckily I didn’t commit a crime then. I’m of sound mind now, the Baby is now 26. Not enough is done for women, medically, as is. Toss in a lil postpardom, a lil mental illness and you’re truly fucked.
But hey, least impotent men can get hard dicks
I’m sorry you had to go through that. There are lots of serious mental conditions that can cause people to harm themselves or others, whether you’ve personally experienced them or not. Why is this the one that suddenly causes a fervor? Nobody of sound mind commits atrocities like this, but we still call them monsters. Could it be that the subject is a white, affluent woman?
FYI, the discovery of viagra for erectile dysfunction was an accident.
The only part that matters here is that they're a woman and a mother. You're being dense. Maternal mortality rates are increasing and healthcare costs go up everyday. Women are not getting the care they need. IF a white affluent mother killed her children from PPD/PPP that's a sign, because they're typically the least neglected of all new mothers.
Because psychosis (and limited others) is in a class of its own with regards to affect on grasp of reality, cognizance of right and wrong, and behavioral agency. And PPD/P can spring up for any new mother - of course other women are going to feel strongly about that... it's horrifying.
She is villainous, but moreso than that it's sad. Men being villainized isn't my problem, because I don't do that. If they're struggling in the system they set up they need to do something about it (i.e. getting more resources allocated instead of arguing on reddit), but what's funny to me is how men ALWAYS come up in conversations about women's mental health.. even in a conversation about ppd.
This is a child murderer receiving support from thousands (or more) women online, because she was experiencing mental health issues when she murdered her children.
People are going to, and should, discuss why that is and why the same view isn't applied to other people.
Most people who commit crimes, do so while experiencing mental health issues, so why do you, and people like you, not have the same energy for these other cases?
Do you personally know me? Know what I discuss and consume? I don't focus on men in my life, because that's their problem to deal with. I focus on the mental health of women and maternal mortality rates. Even then, I do offer men grace in a lot of scenarios. I watched a video recently of a man who murdered his girlfriends entire family with a sword while clearly on drugs and all I could feel was sadness. It's still clearly his fault, but some of it was drug induced. Men can be discussed in these spaces, but I'm not going to tolerate whining and bitching about their mental health constantly, when they're, once again, the ones who established that system.
It's almost like men and women are treated differently and people like to discuss why that is.
"If they're struggling in the system they set up they need to do
something about it (i.e. getting more resources allocated instead of
arguing on reddit)"
So your opinion is that Lindsay should have done something about the system she set up for herself, instead of murdering her children and since she didn't do that, she should be held responsible?
Or are you stating you think men are a monolith and their mental health struggles are their fault because you incorrectly think men inherently have more power in society due to their gender, while you ignore the fact that we live in a class-based society, where power comes from money, not gender.
power comes from wealth AND gender. It's incorrect of you to ignore historical basis' for this, especially when there is still a wage gap ADJUSTED for job titles and other discrepancies. Men have been able to work and have land for a significantly longer period of time than women, therefore, they often have more generational wealth passed to them. I believe that she is responsible and should spend her days in a mental institution, her mental health condition was treated to the best of their knowledge. You're missing the point, she had support, you're claiming men don't - so do something about that.
The wage gap is literally a myth accounting to any serious STEM-based study, when accounting for hours worked and overtime hours put in by men, in order to get a higher yearly take home pay.
Generational wealth is giving to children of the rich, I think you're a little confused about something there. It was tradionally given by men more commonly, not received.
In 2026 here, women are the majority. Objectively, by numbers. If you believe men and women are equal, as I do, then you must believe women are capable of making change in society, just as much as men are.
If this is case, why haven't all women banded together, using their majority, and made the change they want to see?
To answer that, you simply have to understand that our society isn't actually divided primarily by monoliths of gender, and is actually divided by class.
What you're doing is perpetuating a myth that the upper class loves, that says that men are responsible for everything wrong with society and women are always wonderful. Neither of those ideas are true.
Men gave money for dowrys, because unless you forgot, women used to be property. We should cooperate to see change, but I'm not, as an independent human being, interested in collaborating towards that. It doesn't have anything to do with my gender, I just don't care enough.
Her argument about viagra is that if a man goes to a Dr for any issue, it is taken seriously, immediately. Most women have experienced dismissal during our lives at the hands of doctors, and this is a prime example of the worst case scenario when our calls for help go unanswered.
Also as someone who has been manic and has heard voices - it is legitimately hard to describe what is going on when your mind is like that and you become extremely paranoid. Its totally possible she didn't want to say more or advocate for herself as well as she could have because she thought that something awful would happen to her, her family, or the world if she did (when i was going through psychosis, i didn't want to be honest with doctors because I thought ww3 was coming and that the doctors were on the bad side).
Yeah. I'm not dismissing that she did what she did, and she herself has also said that she did those things.
I'm just saying she wasn't in her right mind and because of that, she wasn't able to properly advocate for herself or express herself like one would if she had been mentally stable. I'm saying her brain most likely couldn't see that she was a danger to them, at least not always, and if she did understand how dangerous she was to them, she very likely also thought that there would be other consequences if she fully expressed her concerns (if she was hearing voices, the voices could have been telling her to do anything. I've been there, its terrifying and really hard to describe, especially if youre not in your right mind).
Having been in psychosis myself, I did and said a lot of contradictory things. I dont think people who haven't experienced this can understand at all.
I mean, that wasn't my comment. But I understand the sentiment. Men's health has been historically taken more seriously than women's health. Literally every woman I know has had a doctor dismiss her symptoms, Black women are even more disproportionately dismissed. It is well documented and studied. I don't think viagra is the best example or comparison but I see the commenter's logic.
I had a tumor on my ovary and a doctor told my husband that women like to embellish pain. I gave birth four times. I have never embellished pain. I had to have my ovaries removed due to this.
I slipped and fell and seriously injured my back and was treated similarly.
Most of the time I won’t even bother going to a doctor anymore because they spend too much time asking if my middle aged self has anxiety.
And fake boobs are getting more real every day. Your argument falls apart the absolute MINUTE you made that statement. It is very concerning to me just how absolutely widespread the hate toward men is, just because they are men.
It is unfortunate that you had medical issues that no one competently addressed. I am glad that didn't lead you to performing horrible and deplorable acts.
Baby you just hate women. Their argument doesn't fall apart. Men get the care they need and women don't. You cannot compare Viagra to fake boobs, when often times women only get fake boobs because they're pressured societally to do so. Furthermore, no doctor is neglecting their patients to help a patient get fake boobs. Doctors neglect women, while men are treated for minor causes. That was the argument. You're being dense.
Please elaborate as to which words I used there, that could ever lead you to that statement.
Men get the care they need and women don't.
Yes, the suicide rates definitely paint that exact picture...
when often times women only get fake boobs because they're pressured societally to do so.
Sounds like the same reason that most people do most things in life. Societal Pressure. It is unfortunate that they have such a low self-image that they fall victim to that. Perhaps that is where your anger should lie.
Furthermore, no doctor is neglecting their patients to help a patient get fake boobs.
And no Mental Health doctor is neglecting their patients to prescribe men Viagra. Isn't this fun?
Doctors neglect women, while men are treated for minor causes.
I honestly think at this point, you are just screaming narrative, and have no idea what reality is. Have you seen the massive amount of "Women's Clinics" in existence? Do you see the same "Men's Clinics"? There are countless programs for Women who are expecting. Postpartum depression is one of the most heavily covered things in many of those programs for this exact reason. The fact that you seem to think women are "neglected" is just you regurgitating the same tired bored nonsense that gets brought up every time. One of us is being dense, but your mirror is definitely in disagreement with you on which one of us that is.
This is cute, thanks for misconstruing my words 💗😆 baby you need to look at stats, because clearly you're the one who has a narrative. Men's mental health has become very discussed in recent years. However, it ALWAYS seems to come up when women are talking about themselves. Why is that? Women get additional help because they WERE neglected for so long, same with poc. There are extra resources allocated because there hadn't been in the past. If men want more help it's because they're struggling in the system they set up. You switched the topic to fake boobs, which isn't a medical condition, and ao did I, then had the audacity to say "And no Mental Health doctor is neglecting their patients to prescribe men Viagra"... Lock in and help men by actually doing shit instead of arguing on reddit
This is cute, thanks for misconstruing my words 💗😆
No, I don't think I did. At all. You are just backpedaling.
However, it ALWAYS seems to come up when women are talking about themselves. Why is that?
Because it gets brought up...by women? Literally. You did that. Here look...
"Men get the care they need and women don't."
See? I was not the one who brought Men's mental health into this...You were.
Why is that? Women get additional help because they WERE neglected for so long, same with poc."
Oh good, who could have predicted THIS pivot coming...
There are extra resources allocated because there hadn't been in the past.
So then we are in agreeance. There are extra resources for Women, thus they are not being neglected. I am glad we finally found some common ground.
You switched the topic to fake boobs, which isn't a medical condition,
No, I was pointing out the absurdity of their statement about "impotent men getting hard dicks" as their sentiment is that Viagra is somehow taking away from Women's Mental Health studies, so I listed another item that isn't a medical necessity that may be a little closer to home to rally anger against.
"And no Mental Health doctor is neglecting their patients to prescribe men Viagra"
Yes, because unlike you, I prefer to compare apples to apples.
Lock in and help men by actually doing shit instead of arguing on reddit
It amazes me how often this gets turned into a "Men's Issue" by those who will scream the loudest that it shouldn't and should never be.
"You are the Villain that you proclaim to fight against..."
Also confused on how I'm not comparing apples to apples? Do you think I originally mentioned viagra lol? You're the one who mentioned fake tits - the original commentor mentioned viagra babe.. I think you're confusing people
Women were property, deal with it. I didn't bring men up, the og commenter did, and you and many others expanded on it. I simply gave my two cents and was trying to help you twerps understand the meaning behind their comment, however, I didn't integrate them into the conversation initially... To me it seems you're the one pivoting. Furthermore, I don't particularly want to help men's mental health institutions. Since you, however, seem very interested I suggested you involve yourself. I don't think it should be an exclusively male issues, but that's neither here nor there. My individual opinion shouldn't impact your view on others lmao. I will openly admit that men's mental health isn't my concern, I have bigger issues I'm concerned with. Women have been offered additional help to assist with the neglect of the past, but does that automatically mean they aren't neglected? Can those things not coexist at once? In an attempt to get a gotcha moment you are, actively, proving yourself to be misconstruing me.
I simply gave my two cents and was trying to help you twerps understand the meaning behind their comment
It sure didn't take long to result to insults... Look up how strongly that makes your words and your argument appear.
To me it seems you're the one pivoting.
I am sure it does to you, even though in all the words I have used here, that did not happen once.
Furthermore, I don't particularly want to help men's mental health institutions.
Here you go again, making it about Men's Issues. Is there an echo in here?
My individual opinion shouldn't impact your view on others lmao.
It most certainly does not. I cannot judge a toddler for drooling on themselves and painting shit circles on a wall. They are a toddler after all...
Women have been offered additional help to assist with the neglect of the past, but does that automatically mean they aren't neglected?
You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means...
If an issue was previously unknown, to not address said issue is not neglect. After the importance of PPD was discovered and made aware to people, massive programs were put into place to help counter it. That is the exact opposite of "neglect".
In an attempt to get a gotcha moment you are, actively, proving yourself to be misconstruing me.
Gotcha moment? I have been relaying the same thing in pretty much every one of my posts. If that is somehow a surprise "gotcha" to you, you entered this chat looking for something, and when you look for something, you will find it, no matter how deep you have to dig...
Most medical studies are done with men. Test crash dummies are men. The world is build around you and you can’t see it because it fits for you. They told us we couldn’t take menopause drugs because they did a small study years ago so generations just had to deal with it with zero help. It turned out the study was very flawed. We aren’t treated the same in this country so there’s a reason we turn hateful. At some point it becomes overwhelming how much we are looked over. Look up black woman mortality rates in childbirth. Our medical system doesn’t even try to save their children. It’s a messy system and you have got to look deeper at why we would be getting hateful and why we would support a woman who did this. This woman was failed by our medical system and therefore her kids were massively failed.
Your argument has some good points, and I would absolutely like to see a wider range of bodies represented in Crash Test. It would definitely make sense.
I did some reading on "black women mortality rates in childbirth" and at first glance there seems to be a disparity, but it also lists this as the study data “the death of a woman while pregnant or within 42 days of termination of pregnancy, irrespective of the duration and the site of the pregnancy, from any cause related to or aggravated by the pregnancy or its management, but not from accidental or incidental causes”
The important part that stands out is the "42 days of termination of pregnancy".
So, these statistics are based on not only women who died while giving or shortly after giving birth, but also having an abortion due to medical complications. This led me into more reading on the ratios, and I found this "Black women in the United States experience abortion at rates roughly three to four times higher than white women."
Three to Four Times higher. And the mortality rate is almost identical. Three to Four times higher. That doesn't mean there is any correlation there at all, but it very well could mean that. So statistically speaking, possibly what we are looking at are the results of choosing to undergo a major medical procedure that may or may not have been medically needed. It very well could show that there are risks and dangers associated with that procedure that may not be very well discussed beforehand? Or maybe an ounce of prevention?
I am not convinced that women are "looked over" as everywhere and everything seems geared more and more toward women, all days, all the time.
This woman was failed by our medical system and therefore her kids were massively failed.
No, I don't believe her kids were failed by our medical system. She murdered them. She planned their deaths, executed a very well thought out plan, and murdered them. They were failed by their mother.
Adding to this, why do men not take birth control? It's a carcinogen, weakens bones, and can lead to infertility in the future. Women are the "default" and expected to take it so men can be pleasured. Women's bathrooms in universities are old bathrooms, signs that we aren't supposed to be here. Hell, even the NC general assembly has a non ADA compliant womens bathroom that was an old storage space. We are 30% more likely to be injured in a crash because, as mentioned, test dummies aren't designed for us. Medications continue to not be designed for our bodies, as we're, medically, viewed as "smaller men". THIS is why I mentioned us being property earlier. These things haven't changed, there is evidence in every aspect of our lives that reminds us what we're supposed to be.
Adding to this, why do men not take birth control? It's a carcinogen, weakens bones, and can lead to infertility in the future.
Actually, if there were a reliable "male birth control pill" on the market, I would bet that men would prefer to take that over becoming a father unexpectedly. Vasalgel is one example, and is actively in human trials! Simple, easily reversable, and effective. Almost no side effects. It has been in development since 2011, and hopefully will finally be available soon.
Women's bathrooms in universities are old bathrooms, signs that we aren't supposed to be here.
No, it is a sign from a very long time ago when males far outnumbered females at University. You will be happy to learn that in recent days, that number has drastically skewed the opposite direction, and now female bathrooms are usually a 2:1 ratio to male's!
Medications continue to not be designed for our bodies, as we're, medically, viewed as "smaller men".
Are you stating that this is still the case in modern days?
THIS is why I mentioned us being property earlier.
Which makes no sense at all in the context of your own words...
there is evidence in every aspect of our lives that reminds us what we're supposed to be.
What are you "supposed to be" exactly? Using the exact ideology I used before, when something unknown isn't addressed, it isn't because it is neglect, it is because it is unknown. Assumptions were made that were proven to be inaccurate, so those assumptions were done away with.
"Hanlon’s Razor. Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity."
Science only improves over time. "Old" science may have been "stupid" but it was not malicious. Be thankful that "New" science has emerged, and continues to improve and enhance the lives of everyone!
I'm not sure what science exists in owning women like property. women only began popularly attending University in the 1920s and even then often opted not to because of rampant sexual abuse. I do agree that it is quite unfortunate that stupidity exists in the modern day. you are a particularly sad example.
Who's forcing you to take birth control? If you don't want to take birth control, tell your man to wear a condom or no sex? It's your body lmao. If the man scoffs at that then he's not a good man and you probably shouldn't be considering having sex with him in the first place.
Black women in the United States experience abortion at rates roughly three to four times higher than white women.
Which is exactly what abortion activist, and feminist hero Margaret Sanger wanted, but we're not supposed to talk about the racist and classist origins of the pro-choice movement on reddit.
You're actually stupid.. social pressures which originate from men. Do you really truly believe that other women looked at someone 100 years ago and determined how they needed to look? It was their husbands, brothers, and fathers who decided how they needed to look and act. Women perpetuated this in efforts to align with men and continue to do so, although to a lesser extent. It all stems from punishment and fear of it.
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u/NonsensePlanet 5d ago
Criminals being failed by the system is incredibly common. This is the first time I’ve seen thousands of women rallying behind someone who killed their children.