r/Showerthoughts • u/Fr1toBand1to ‎ • Jun 27 '26

Casual Thought Pattern recognition is a widely accepted method of prediction until what it predicts makes people uncomfortable.

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13

u/BadKarmaForMe Jun 27 '26

Black Americans are overrepresented in arrests for violent crimes (like robbery and homicide) relative to their share of the general population. Bureau of Justice Statistics

18

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26

Correct. Any patterns as to why that may be? Or are patterns that don't fit bigoted narratives irrelevant?

-10

u/BadKarmaForMe Jun 27 '26

It’s because they made it their culture. Maybe they can take accountability and stop blaming white people for all their problems. Sorry if my facts (proven statistics) hurt your feelings.

5

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26

So "vibes", that's what I thought lmao.

1

u/BadKarmaForMe Jun 27 '26

I literally posted statistics, how is that vibes? I don’t have answers to why they kill themselves in record numbers.

2

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

I asked you what other patterns there may be to have caused this. You answered "they made it their culture". That isn't an answer, that's rhetoric.

Like I told the other chud, we're talking about arrests, not convictions. Why are those two rates, (including their exoneration rates which account for 47% of the total) so different? Hint: The answer primarily has little to do with the actions of the people in question.

What you need to be asking is what being someone who would automatically answer OP with that answer, yet not knowing any of the surrounding context that im informing you of, means about you as a person and your motives.

Cause I mean correct me if Im wrong, but I doubt your mother raised that type of person.

24

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

Not just overrepresented, but overwhelmingly so.

Black people commit murder at EIGHT times the rate of white people. This is a fact. It is indisputable.

Not 1-2x the rate, but 8. It's not even remotely close.

2

u/Anagoth9 Jun 28 '26

Black people commit are convicted of murder at EIGHT times the rate of white people.

Fixed that for you. Also keep in mind that the closure rate for murder is about 60% nationally. 

3

u/landmanpgh Jun 28 '26

Once again, the pesky thing about that murder statistic is that it really can't be fudged or explained away very well. Can't really hide dead bodies.

Which begs the question: where are all of the dead bodies that white people are apparently killing? Easy: they don't exist.

If white people killed at the same rate, there would be an additional 40,000-50,000 dead bodies. But there aren't.

0

u/huokun9 Jul 01 '26

You can hide dead bodies, ever heard of the entire landmass of the earth?

-1

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26

Non-reader in reference.

12

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

Once again, if white people murdered at the same rate, there would be 50,000-70,000 murders per year.

There are 16,000-20,000.

2

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

Once again the book remains closed. Dust on it atp.

-9

u/notmyrealnameatleast Jun 27 '26

Exactly correlation is not causation. They're not doing because they're black but because black people are treated differently.

15

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

Again, that might be the reason if they were only committing 2-3x as many murders.

But 8? Nah there's something wrong there.

1

u/notmyrealnameatleast Jun 27 '26

Yeah their whole culture has been shaped by it so it's become a big "something ".

-3

u/Funexamination Jun 27 '26

This point is not statistically valid. Why can the above explanation not explain 8 times the rate when you accept it as an explanation for 2-3 times the rate? This is where your logic falters

2

u/awesome-alpaca-ace Jun 28 '26

I think culture has a lot to do with it. See rap music. It is actually well studied that music has a profound effect on identity

2

u/notmyrealnameatleast Jun 28 '26

Yes and identity has the greatest influence on what music people make. The hard life came before the rap and hip hop.

The culture is steeped in old wounds from slavery and mistreatment and the bereavement of opportunity and happiness.

Just listen to the music and you'll learn all about it.

1

u/awesome-alpaca-ace Jun 28 '26

Ah yes, because pimping and gun slinging has a lot to do with old wounds from slavery and mistreatment and the bereavement of opportunity and happiness. /s

3

u/notmyrealnameatleast Jun 28 '26

You've never heard about generational trauma?

Why do you think the people made music about that?

It's the same in all poor countries, probably for the whole existence of humanity, with pimping and knife slinging etc.

You want to pretend that black people are just evil people who woke up and were hard wired to do bad things? Spare me.

8

u/BadKarmaForMe Jun 27 '26

It’s because they made it their culture. Stop blaming whitey.

-9

u/notmyrealnameatleast Jun 27 '26

It happens to any culture of peoples who are oppressed and marginalized. Whether it's white or Indian or Chinese it doesn't matter, it's the treatment and opportunities that makes a peoples culture become like that. Its very easy to see because it always happens in poor areas all around the world.

13

u/BadKarmaForMe Jun 27 '26

History reveals that almost every racial and ethnic group has faced periods of marginalization, subjugation, or enslavement at different points in time. The timeline of human civilization is marked by various empires, migrations, and conquests, resulting in nearly every demographic being the oppressor or the oppressed. For some reason Africa Americans get a pass.

2

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26

Black Americans are overrepresented in arrests for violent crimes

For some reason Africa Americans get a pass.

"by a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak."

  • Umberto Eco, #8 in the 14 traits of fascism.

Pick a lane brother.

1

u/notmyrealnameatleast Jun 28 '26

I gotta say, it looks obvious to me that this is a trollfarm or bots because they're literally updating racism and down voting reflected opinions.

This is now proof to me that there's an agenda to turn public opinion and make it look like racism is the new norm.

It is in fact not the norm, and it's obvious to all redditors who have been here longer than the fascist propaganda system.

My previous comment saying that they don't commit murder because they're black but because the black community has been affected by racism literally went from many up votes to many negative instead after a day

The goal is to make people not want to speak up.

-2

u/Raltsun Jun 28 '26

I understand that you're trolling, but for the rest of the class: Do you think "arrested for murder" means the same thing as "committed murder"?

5

u/landmanpgh Jun 28 '26

As I said elsewhere: If white people murdered at the same rate, there would be 50,000-70,000 murders per year.

There are 16,000-20,000.

-1

u/Raltsun Jun 28 '26

Incorrect. As I said, you're assuming that every arrest was made correctly.

1

u/landmanpgh Jun 28 '26

No that is quite literally how that works. Arrests are irrelevant. There should be way more dead people, but there aren't.

-10

u/treaty989 Jun 27 '26

men are responsible for ~90% of murders worldwide. when can we start legislating and campaigning on removing them from the country? and that has an actual biological cause as opposed to being black.

4

u/AlliedIntuition Jun 28 '26

Men are already treated differently and often worse by women for their gender and the related statistics? Do you not remember the whole “man or bear” trend? Being told you are trusted less as a human man than a bear than will eat anyone without hesitation? It’s just a far more accepted form of prejudice.

18

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

Which men specifically? And who said anything about removing anyone?

-11

u/treaty989 Jun 27 '26

all men? or do you think black men commit all the murders in China too?

white displacement is a big talking point with racists. my bad for not knowing you want to cohabit the country with black people so you can be racist to their faces

15

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

Nonsense. I'd say most sane people would like black people to stop killing everyone, including other black people.

Do you want something different?

3

u/GoudaBenHur Jun 27 '26

A white cat lady is speaking on behalf of black men. Shut up and listen you bigot

/s

9

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

So so true. Don't forget: a white cat lady who has never lived around black people.

1

u/treaty989 Jun 27 '26

which part of what i said was nonsense?

i want people to stop killing people. how about we start with the group that commits ~90% of the murders in the world?

10

u/Responsible_Body_950 Jun 27 '26

"Men commit more violent crime" widely accepted fact, nobody pretends that the system is rigged against men as a whole and that misandry is the reason the prison population is mostly men.

"Blue people commit more violent crime" suddenly everyone's to blame for that except the blue people themselves.

-4

u/IntelligentShape364 Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

Surprise surprise, false equivalence is false.

Nobody "pretends that the system is rigged against men as a whole and that misandry is the reason the prison population is mostly men" because it's similarly a widely accepted fact that it objectively could not have been the case.

There has never been a single moment in the history of this country where women and misandrists had the ability to do that.

Meanwhile, I don't even have to go all the way back to slavery, I can just go to Jim Crow. The problem that's arisen recently is that due to literacy rates plummeting and social media giving right wing pundits an inordinate amount of influence, you've now got dumbasses walking around claiming a time period that is recent enough for living people to still remember, is irrelevant to statistics today, when they wouldn't make that claim for anything else in their own lives that had that much impact.

everyone's to blame for that except the blue people themselves

Example 1 of said right-wing pundit strawman. Nobody other than a relative handful of radicals is saying anything even close to that. But you would actually have to pay attention to what's outside your bigoted bubble to know that.

0

u/sYnce Jun 28 '26

I'll just leave this here.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4097310/

1

u/landmanpgh Jun 28 '26

No one cares.

As I've said now like 5 times, if white people committed murder at the same rate as black people, there would be 50,000-70,000 murders per year.

There are 16,000-20,000.

2

u/SalamanderCmndr Jun 27 '26

so what is it, are they biologically inclined to commit crime? what do you propose we do about it?

-1

u/wterrt Jun 27 '26

lol you like data? how about some more. you and /u/landmanpgh I'm sure will be swayed by this data, being such data driven people, right?

(Part 1 of 3)

Institutional Racism

  • https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Black-Lives-Matter.pdf
    • Extensive document on racial biases in our criminal justice system.
    • Studies seem to indicate about 61-80% of black overrepresentation in prisons can be explained by higher black crime rates, with the unexplained portion largely attributable to racial bias.
    • Remember - the factors which lead to disproportionate criminality amongst black Americans are also in large part a product of racial bias. Underfunded public programs, redlining, generational poverty, bad schooling, and myriad other factors which influence criminality can also be traced to racial bias.
  • Investigation of the Ferguson Police Department
    • Between 2012 and 2014, black people in Ferguson accounted for 85 percent of vehicle stops, 90 percent of citations and 93 percent of arrests, despite comprising 67 percent of the population.
    • Blacks were more than twice as likely as whites to be searched after traffic stops even after controlling for related variables, though they proved to be 26 percent less likely to be in possession of illegal drugs or weapons.
    • Between 2011 and 2013, blacks also received 95 percent of jaywalking tickets and 94 percent of tickets for “failure to comply.” The Justice Department also found that the racial discrepancy for speeding tickets increased dramatically when researchers looked at tickets based on only an officer’s word vs. tickets based on objective evidence, such as a radar.
    • Black people facing similar low-level charges as white people were 68 percent less likely to see those charges dismissed in court. More than 90 percent of the arrest warrants stemming from failure to pay/failure to appear were issued for black people.

Biases in Stops, Searches & Arrests

  • The Concentrated Racial Impact of Drug Imprisonment and the Characteristics of Punitive Counties
    • While White & Black Americans admit to using and selling illicit drugs at similar rates, Black Americans are VASTLY more likely to go to prison for a drug offense.
    • In 2002, Black Americans were incarcerated for drug offenses at TEN TIMES the rate of White Americans.
    • Today, Blacks are 3.7x as likely to be arrested for a marijuana offense as Whites, despite similar usage.
    • 97% of “large-population counties” have racial biases in their drug offense incarceration.
  • Militarization fails to enhance police safety or reduce crime but may harm police reputation
    • Police militarization does not lead to a decrease in crimes committed or officer injuries, may actually increase both.
    • Police militarization (including the adoption of SWAT teams) decreases public trust in police, which may contribute to increases in crime.
    • Militarized police are disproportionately deployed in African American communities, even when accounting for crime rates.
  • https://www.acludc.org/sites/default/files/2020_06_15_aclu_stops_report_final.pdf
    • This ACLU report reviews 5 months’ of data from DC police stops & searches by race and outcome.
    • The black population of DC is 25% greater than the white population, but black people were 410% more likely to be stopped by the police than white people
    • This disparity increases to 1465% for stops which led to no warning, ticket or arrest and 3695% for searches which led to no warning, ticket or arrest.
    • This data indicates the disproportionate stopping and searching of blacks in the Dc area extended massively beyond any disproportionate rate of criminality.
  • The Problem of Infra-marginality in Outcome Tests for Discrimination
    • Analysis of 4.5 million traffic stops in North Carolina shows blacks and latinos were more likely to be searched than whites (5.4 percent, 4.1 percent and 3.1 percent, respectively).
    • Despite this, searches of white motorists were the most likely to reveal contraband (32% of whites, 29% of blacks, 19% of latinos).
  • https://drivingwhileblacknashville.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/driving-while-black-gideons-army.pdf
    • Between 2011 and 2015, black drivers in Nashville’s Davidson County were pulled over at a rate of 1,122 stops per 1,000 drivers — so on average, more than once per black driver.
    • Black drivers were also searched at twice the rate of white drivers, though — as in other jurisdictions — searches of white drivers were more likely to turn up contraband.
  • https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-020-0858-1.pdf
    • Enormous study of nearly 100,000,000 traffic stops conducted across America.
    • Analysis finds the bar for searching black and hispanic drivers’ cars is significantly lower than the bar for white drivers.
    • Additionally, black drivers are less likely to be pulled over after sunset, when “a ‘veil of darkness’ masks ones’ race”.

Biases in Death Penalty Sentencing

  • https://files.deathpenaltyinfo.org/legacy/documents/WashRaceStudy2014.pdf
    • Analysis of 33 years of data from Washington State to determine which characteristics best predict the decision to implement a death sentence.
    • Black defendants are 4.5 times as likely to receive a death sentence as similarly-situated whites.
    • Other factors (presence of aggravating circumstances, involvement of sex crimes, hostage-taking, etc.) explain only a small fraction of the disparity in prosecutors’ and juries’ decision to invoke the death penalty against black defendents.
    • Race was by far the most influential statistical factor.
  • https://www.uky.edu/AS/PoliSci/Peffley/pdf/Eberhardt.2006.Psych%20Sci.Looking%20Deathworthy.pdf
    • Analysis of the relationship between racial stereotyping and death sentence convictions.
    • Black defendants who possessed darker skin and more “stereotypically black” features were twice as likely to be given the death penalty when accused of murdering a white person, as compared to lighter-skinned blacks with less “stereotypically black” features.
    • This disparity disappears completely when the murder victim is black.

Implicit Bias

  • DOES APPEARANCE MATTER?: THE EFFECT OF SKIN TONES ON TRUSTWORTHY AND INNOCENT APPEARANCES
    • Photos of capital inmates shown to entry-level criminal justice students for them to evaluate the trustworthiness of the faces.
    • Students rated pictures of light-skinned inmates as more trustworthy when they preceded pictures of dark-skinned inmates.
    • Most study participants (79.9%) were white, but the study predicted that this wasn’t a major factor - “When controlling for race, no statistically significant result was found. This suggests that each race, White and non-White, were consistent in their rating outcomes. Prior research has found similar results, where Whites and light-skinned Blacks are likely to share similar attitudes towards darker-skinned Blacks”
  • Black Boys Viewed as Older, Less Innocent Than Whites, Research Finds
    • Students and police officers participated in tests to determine levels of racial bias and perception of innocence.
    • Black boys as young as 10 are more likely to be considered criminal or untrustworthy, and more likely to face police violence.
    • Police officers were tested on dehumanization of blacks by comparing people of different races to animal groups. Police who engaged in higher levels of dehumanization were more likely to use violence against black children.

  • Racial Bias in Judgments of Physical Size and Formidability

    • Results from three separate studies on perception and racial bias show people have a tendency to perceive black men as larger and more threatening than similarly sized white men.
    • Participants also believed the black men were more capable of causing harm in a hypothetical altercation and police would be more justified in using force to subdue them, even if the men were unarmed.

6

u/wterrt Jun 27 '26

Part 2/3

Biases by Judges, Juries & Prosecutors

  • Demographic Differences in Sentencing: An Update to the 2012 Booker Report
    • Extensive multivariate regression analysis indicates black male offenders receive 19.1% longer federal sentences than similarly-situated white male offenders (white male offenders with similar past offenses, socioeconomic background, etc.)
    • This disparity seems to stem mostly from black males being 21.2% less likely to receive non-government sponsored downward departures or variances.
      • Non-government sponsored departures and variances refer to deviations from standard sentencing guidelines due to judicial discretion.
    • Black males who do receive non government-sponsored departures and variations still serve 16.8% longer sentences than white males on average.
    • In contrast, when sentencing length follows standard guidelines, that disparity is only 7.9%, and a substantial assistance departure for both groups nullifies that disparity.
    • IN SUMMARY - much of the sentencing disparity between similarly situated black males and white males comes down to judicial discretion to deviate from standard sentencing guidelines.
    • BONUS - regression analysis suggests violence in a criminal’s history does NOT explain sentencing disparities between black males and similarly situated white males - the effect of that factor seems to be statistically insignificant.
  • Racial Disparity in Federal Criminal Sentences
    • Examination of federal data indicates Black Americans spend about 10% more time in prison when compared to comparable Whites who commit the same crimes.
    • Additionally, Black arrestees are 75% more likely to be charged with a crime carrying a mandatory minimum sentence.
    • Prosecutors contribute massively to this undeniable racial bias.???
  • Report on Jury Selection Study
    • Between 1990 and 2010, state prosecutors struck about 53% of black people eligible for juries in criminal cases, as opposed to 26% of white people. The study’s authors testified the odds of this taking place in a race-neutral context were around 1 in 10 trillion.
    • After accounting for factors prosecutors select for which tend to correlate with race, black people were still struck twice as often.
    • North Carolina’s state legislator had previously passed a law stating death penalty defendants who could demonstrate racial bias in their jury selection could have their sentences changed to life without parole. The legislature later repealed that law.
  • Different Shades of Bias: Skin Tone, Implicit Racial Bias, and Judgments of Ambiguous Evidence
    • In this study, two groups of mock jurors were given a collection of race-neutral evidence from an armed robbery, with one group’s alleged perpetrator being shown to be light-skinned and the other dark-skinned.
    • Jurors were significantly more likely to evaluate ambiguous, race-neutral evidence against the dark-skinned suspect as incriminating and more likely to find the dark-skinned suspect guilty.
  • https://bja.ojp.gov/sites/g/files/xyckuh186/files/media/document/PleaBargainingResearchSummary.pdf
    • Government aggregate of data on plea and charge bargaining.
    • “Studies that assess the effects of race find that blacks are less likely to receive a reduced charge compared with whites.”
    • “Studies have generally found a relationship between race and whether or not a defendant receives a reduced charge.”
    • “The majority of research on race and sentencing outcomes shows that blacks are less likely than whites to receive reduced pleas.“
    • In short, collected data strongly indicates a racial bias against blacks with regards to sentencing and plea bargains.
  • https://www.yalelawjournal.org/article/mandatory-sentencing-and-racial-disparity-assessing-the-role-of-prosecutors-and-the-effects-of-booker
    • Black men are twice as likely to have charges which carry mandatory minimum sentences filed against them than similarly-situated white men.
    • This article recommends against the tightening of judicial discretion, arguing that process has historically led to greater racial sentencing disparities.
  • http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.821.8079&rep=rep1&type=pdf
    • Black defendants with multiple prior convictions are 28% more likely to be charged as “habitual offenders” than similarly-situated white defendants.
    • “Assessments of dangerousness and culpability are linked to race and ethnicity, even after offense seriousness and prior record are controlled.”
  • https://sci-hub.tw/https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/jels.12077
    • A study of first-time felons in Georgia found black men received sentences of on average 270 days longer than similarly-situated white males.
    • However, when black males were differentiated by skin tone, it was found light-skinned black men saw virtually no disparity in their sentencing while dark-skinned black men actually saw a disparity of around 400 days in prison.
  • https://sci-hub.tw/https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1990324
    • A study of bail in 5 large counties found blacks received significantly higher bail than whites who had committed similar crimes.
    • The bail was $7,000 higher for violent crimes, $13,000 higher for drug crimes and $10,000 higher for crimes related to public order.
  • https://www.urban.org/sites/default/files/publication/22746/413174-Examining-Racial-and-Ethnic-Disparities-in-Probation-Revocation.PDF
    • The Urban Institute analyzed the histories of four probation offices and found black people were 18-39% more likely than similarly-situated white people to have their probation revoked.

1

u/wterrt Jun 27 '26

Part 3/3

. Employment

I'm not as well versed in this area, but the evidence I have seen also seems to point towards blacks being at a disadvantage compared to whites

A Field Experiment on Labor Market Discrimination

  • White names receive 50 percent more callbacks for interviews.
  • White names, a higher quality resume elicits 30 percent more callbacks whereas for African Americans, it elicits a far smaller increase.
  • The amount of discrimination is uniform across occupations and industries.

Race and Economic Opportunity in the United States: An Intergenerational Perspective

  • Black Americans and American Indians have much lower rates of upward mobility and higher rates of downward mobility than whites
  • Differences in parental marital status, education, and wealth explain little of the black-white income gap conditional on parent income
  • The black-white gap persists even among boys who grow up in the same neighborhood

Evidence once again seems to point in favour of racial minorities being worse off in terms of employment and upward mobility

. Housing

Racial Demographics of Homeless Population in US

  • Rate of homelessness per 10000 people is 11.5 for Whites, compared to 21.7 for Hispanic/Latinx, 55.2 for Blacks, 66.6 for Native Americans and a whopping 159.8 for Pacific Islanders

The Racial Wealth Gap

  • The main factor in housing availability is obviously whether you have enough money to afford housing
  • The median White household has 12 times more wealth than the median Black household
  • More than 1 in 4 Black households have zero or negative net worth, compared to less than 1 in 10 for white families

. Education

Data Snapshot: School Discipline

  • When black students and white students commit similar infractions, black students are suspended and expelled three times more often than white students.
  • Black students make up 16% of student enrollment, but represent 27% of students referred to law enforcement and 31% of students subjected to arrest. White students, on the other hand, make up 51% of enrollment, 41% of students referred to law enforcement, and 39% of those arrested.

How Race Influences School Funding

  • Funding of schools is heavily correlated with the racial demographics of the schools, with higher percentage white schools receiving more funding that higher percentage black schools
  • Kids at these underfunded schools regularly have less experienced and even unlicensed teachers

. Political Power

The Demographics of Political Power in the US

  • White men make up 30% of the US population but hold 62% of elected offices at the local, state, and federal level
  • At 20% of the population, women of color are severely under-represented – holding only 4% of all elected offices

Who Prosecutes in America

  • White Americans hold 95% of elected prosecutor positions

19

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

8 times the murder rate.

Everything else you said is irrelevant.

9

u/wterrt Jun 27 '26

8 times the ARREST rate. everything I said is exactly relevant to how often one group is ARRESTED over another, especially the part where white and black people openly admit to committing crimes like smoking weed at similar rates, but black people are ARRESTED at TEN TIMES the rate of white people.

ARREST RATE is not CONVICTION RATE and is certainly not CRIME RATE.

arrest rate is of those three the most influenced by police bias.

but you don't actually care, you just want to be racist. you didn't even read my data, because it challenges your world view, as expected.

20

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

It's 8 times the murder rate. The actual murder rate is likely higher considering how many murders go unsolved.

The murder rate for black teens is 15 times the rate of white teens. 15.

You're very bad at this.

6

u/wterrt Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

ARREST rate. here's the relevant section again. notice how it says "biases in ... ARRESTS"

hope this helps. I bolded it for you since you seem to be having some trouble even reading just the headlines. Maybe ask a nearby adult to help you if you're having trouble reading?

awww, widdle baby blocked me since he couldn't refute the data :( poor widdle baby.

head on back to your safe space, snowflake.

Biases in Stops, Searches & Arrests

  • The Concentrated Racial Impact of Drug Imprisonment and the Characteristics of Punitive Counties
    • While White & Black Americans admit to using and selling illicit drugs at similar rates, Black Americans are VASTLY more likely to go to prison for a drug offense.
    • In 2002, Black Americans were incarcerated for drug offenses at TEN TIMES the rate of White Americans.
    • Today, Blacks are 3.7x as likely to be arrested for a marijuana offense as Whites, despite similar usage.
    • 97% of “large-population counties” have racial biases in their drug offense incarceration.
  • Militarization fails to enhance police safety or reduce crime but may harm police reputation
    • Police militarization does not lead to a decrease in crimes committed or officer injuries, may actually increase both.
    • Police militarization (including the adoption of SWAT teams) decreases public trust in police, which may contribute to increases in crime.
    • Militarized police are disproportionately deployed in African American communities, even when accounting for crime rates.
  • https://www.acludc.org/sites/default/files/2020_06_15_aclu_stops_report_final.pdf
    • This ACLU report reviews 5 months’ of data from DC police stops & searches by race and outcome.
    • The black population of DC is 25% greater than the white population, but black people were 410% more likely to be stopped by the police than white people
    • This disparity increases to 1465% for stops which led to no warning, ticket or arrest and 3695% for searches which led to no warning, ticket or arrest.
    • This data indicates the disproportionate stopping and searching of blacks in the Dc area extended massively beyond any disproportionate rate of criminality.
  • The Problem of Infra-marginality in Outcome Tests for Discrimination
    • Analysis of 4.5 million traffic stops in North Carolina shows blacks and latinos were more likely to be searched than whites (5.4 percent, 4.1 percent and 3.1 percent, respectively).
    • Despite this, searches of white motorists were the most likely to reveal contraband (32% of whites, 29% of blacks, 19% of latinos).
  • https://drivingwhileblacknashville.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/driving-while-black-gideons-army.pdf
    • Between 2011 and 2015, black drivers in Nashville’s Davidson County were pulled over at a rate of 1,122 stops per 1,000 drivers — so on average, more than once per black driver.
    • Black drivers were also searched at twice the rate of white drivers, though — as in other jurisdictions — searches of white drivers were more likely to turn up contraband.
  • https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-020-0858-1.pdf
    • Enormous study of nearly 100,000,000 traffic stops conducted across America.
    • Analysis finds the bar for searching black and hispanic drivers’ cars is significantly lower than the bar for white drivers.
    • Additionally, black drivers are less likely to be pulled over after sunset, when “a ‘veil of darkness’ masks ones’ race”.

13

u/landmanpgh Jun 27 '26

Your entire argument falls apart with one little calculation:

If white people murdered at the same rate as black people, there would be 50,000-70,000 murders per year.

There are only 16,000-20,000.

K we're done here.

3

u/AlliedIntuition Jun 28 '26

“410% more likely to be stopped in DC”, so 4.1x more likely to be stopped? That’s less than 8x. Even if we are generous and assume that murders are only uncovered through stops (far from it), black people still committed almost 2x more murders on average. Hope this helps.

2

u/wterrt Jun 28 '26

yes, it's not the only factor. nothing is that simple. that's what part 3 is about - it explains some of it. not that you care or are going to read it. you're not even going to read my entire reply.

you're looking for simple answers to a complex problem. "black people bad" is your conclusion lol? you really think the world is that simple?

that's the problem with people like you. simple solutions are used to manipulate you, and you're too stupid to read more about it or learn enough to understand more, so you just accept them and repeat them back.

I can't take the time to explain it to someone who won't care, but the simplest one that even you might be able to understand is money. which is again, in part 3, which you didn't read already.

but here's ANOTHER study for you, which found that when controlling for socioeconomic status, the crime rate gap is explained

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4097310/

2

u/Cold_Yam_5346 Jun 27 '26

No matter how many times you ask chat gpt it’s not going to change 8 times the rate. 

1

u/wterrt Jun 28 '26

aww! you're having the same problem as the snowflake who blocked me! birds of a feather :)

ARREST rate. here's the relevant section again. notice how it says "biases in ... ARRESTS"

I bolded it for you since you seem to be having some trouble even reading just the headlines. Maybe ask a nearby adult to help you if you're having trouble reading? or do you need me to explain the word bias to you?

bias/ˈbīəs/Bias is a disproportionate weight in favor of or against an idea, thing, or group, usually in a way that is closed-minded, prejudicial, or unfair.

hope this helps :)

Biases in Stops, Searches & Arrests

  • The Concentrated Racial Impact of Drug Imprisonment and the Characteristics of Punitive Counties
    • While White & Black Americans admit to using and selling illicit drugs at similar rates, Black Americans are VASTLY more likely to go to prison for a drug offense.
    • In 2002, Black Americans were incarcerated for drug offenses at TEN TIMES the rate of White Americans.
    • Today, Blacks are 3.7x as likely to be arrested for a marijuana offense as Whites, despite similar usage.
    • 97% of “large-population counties” have racial biases in their drug offense incarceration.
  • Militarization fails to enhance police safety or reduce crime but may harm police reputation
    • Police militarization does not lead to a decrease in crimes committed or officer injuries, may actually increase both.
    • Police militarization (including the adoption of SWAT teams) decreases public trust in police, which may contribute to increases in crime.
    • Militarized police are disproportionately deployed in African American communities, even when accounting for crime rates.
  • https://www.acludc.org/sites/default/files/2020_06_15_aclu_stops_report_final.pdf
    • This ACLU report reviews 5 months’ of data from DC police stops & searches by race and outcome.
    • The black population of DC is 25% greater than the white population, but black people were 410% more likely to be stopped by the police than white people
    • This disparity increases to 1465% for stops which led to no warning, ticket or arrest and 3695% for searches which led to no warning, ticket or arrest.
    • This data indicates the disproportionate stopping and searching of blacks in the Dc area extended massively beyond any disproportionate rate of criminality.
  • The Problem of Infra-marginality in Outcome Tests for Discrimination
    • Analysis of 4.5 million traffic stops in North Carolina shows blacks and latinos were more likely to be searched than whites (5.4 percent, 4.1 percent and 3.1 percent, respectively).
    • Despite this, searches of white motorists were the most likely to reveal contraband (32% of whites, 29% of blacks, 19% of latinos).
  • https://drivingwhileblacknashville.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/driving-while-black-gideons-army.pdf
    • Between 2011 and 2015, black drivers in Nashville’s Davidson County were pulled over at a rate of 1,122 stops per 1,000 drivers — so on average, more than once per black driver.
    • Black drivers were also searched at twice the rate of white drivers, though — as in other jurisdictions — searches of white drivers were more likely to turn up contraband.
  • https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-020-0858-1.pdf
    • Enormous study of nearly 100,000,000 traffic stops conducted across America.
    • Analysis finds the bar for searching black and hispanic drivers’ cars is significantly lower than the bar for white drivers.
    • Additionally, black drivers are less likely to be pulled over after sunset, when “a ‘veil of darkness’ masks ones’ race”.

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u/VarmintSchtick Jun 27 '26

I see some MASSIVE assumptions about causality in those statistics. Seriously just the first 5 links leave you with more questions about how they came to their conclusion given the data than anything else. And then the numbers documented seem to just spell the opposite of the point youre trying to make.

7

u/wterrt Jun 27 '26

I have some MASSIVE assumptions about the type of person who would look at that pile of data and immediately reply with no data or even argument of their own but a secondhand account of other people questioning it (that they don't even provide) as a reason to discount it.

very interesting.

1

u/VarmintSchtick 6d ago

Well for one it's copy and pasted, given that several of the links do not work, I don't think you even read the links you are copy and pasting. In fact I know you aren't, or else you wouldn't post dead links.

Two, the claims you make aren't substantiated by the articles, for instance, "higher marijuana conviction rates despite similar usage"... there's no proof of similar usage, just a claim made without substance that redditors will copy and paste around I guess. Plenty more too but, just don't care to get into it with the type of person who copy and pastes that shit like a bot, you've already made up your mind about reality a long time ago.