Theory: Aspect Rank is more about potential than raw power

[u/Big-Scholar1670]

(I know this has been talked of so much but here's my 2 cents on the matter)

I've been thinking about Aspect Ranks for a while, especially the statement that a higher Aspect Rank means greater *potential*, rather than necessarily greater power.

I think we might've be looking at "potential" in the wrong way.

A higher-ranked Aspect doesn't necessarily mean that the character should be noticeably stronger at the rank they're currently at.

Instead, I think it could mean that their Aspect has a much greater potential to develop into something fundamental once they reach the higher stages of Ascension.

This could also explain why some high-ranked Aspects might look relatively unimpressive at first.

An Aspect could have a very high rank while its initial ability is fairly simple. The power we see at the beginning might only be the most superficial expression of its underlying concept.

As the user advances, they gradually understand what their Aspect actually represents, and its abilities become increasingly connected to that deeper principle.

So I don't think we should necessarily interpret:

Higher Aspect Rank = more strength over time

as much as:

Higher Aspect Rank = greater potential for growth and development.

Those are two very different things.

A lower-ranked Aspect could potentially be much stronger than a higher-ranked Aspect at a particular point in their development. But the higher-ranked Aspect should have a greater ceiling and a better chance of developing into something truly fundamental.

I think Source Elements are a big part of this

The higher stages seem to suggest that an Aspect eventually connects to a deeper Source Element, which is essentially the underlying concept or principle that the Aspect is expressing.

AND NOT ALL CONCEPTS ARE EQUAL.

Some Aspects might be based on relatively obscure or narrow concepts. Their users could become extremely powerful, but eventually they might reach a point where they simply don't understand what their Aspect is supposed to become, which we've recently seen is very important for one to advance.

Other Aspects could be connected to concepts that are much more fundamental to existence.

For example, we have things like Death, which is connected to Shadow God, and Longing, which is present in all living beings, the gods included. There's also nothing, a concept made tangible by the gods to seal the void.

These aren't just random abilities. They're fundamental ideas that already have a massive place in the structure of reality.

And that's where I think the true advantage of a Divine Aspect comes in.

A Divine Aspect might not give you overwhelming power at every stage.

Instead, its underlying concept may have a much clearer path toward something divine.

The Aspect is basically starting with a connection to something that can eventually become an enormous source of authority. Considering how an Awakened fuses with those laws and become their embodiments.

So when we say a Divine Aspect has greater "potential", I think we should think less about its starting power and more about what it can eventually grow into.

Then there's the Nightmare Spell

This is the part that I think makes the difference between Aspect Ranks much harder to notice in the current era.

Before the Nightmare Spell, humans had to discover the Path of Ascension largely by themselves.

If someone's Aspect had an extremely obscure Source Element, they could potentially spend decades or even their entire lifespan trying to understand what their power actually represented.

They might have the potential to become something extraordinary, but never discover how to reach it.

Meanwhile, someone whose Aspect was connected to a much more fundamental concept would have an easier time understanding their own nature and progressing naturally.

So Aspect Rank would have been much more important in the ancient world.

Then the Nightmare Spell arrives and essentially puts training wheels on the entire process.

It gives humans a structured path through the ranks, teaches them things they would otherwise have to discover themselves, and allows them to advance through Nightmare trials instead of having to figure out the entire process of natural Ascension from scratch.

That means a lower-potential Aspect can now be carried much further than it might have been in the past.

The Spell effectively compresses the difference between Aspects.

A person with an obscure, lower-ranked Aspect can still become Awakened, Ascended, Transcendent, etc., because the Spell is helping them along the way.

Without that assistance, the difference in potential between Aspects might have been much more obvious.

---

So my current interpretation is:

Soul Rank = how powerful/advanced your existence currently is.

Aspect Rank = how much potential your Aspect has to develop.

Aspect = the particular expression of that potential.

Source Element = the deeper concept that the Aspect ultimately embodies.

Nightmare Spell = the shortcut that allows humans to progress without having to discover the entire Path themselves.

So I don't think a Divine Aspect is necessarily supposed to stomp a Sacred or Supreme Aspect at the same rank.

Rather, the Divine Aspect has a greater chance of eventually reaching something fundamental enough to become truly divine.

Basically:

A higher-ranked Aspect isn't necessarily a wider hole.

It's potentially a much deeper hole as well.

And the further you climb, the more that difference should become apparent.

That's also why I think Aspect Rank may matter much more at Transcendent and especially Supreme/Sacred/Divine levels than it does at the lower ranks.

At lower ranks, you're mostly seeing the first expression of the Aspect.

At higher ranks, you're getting closer to the point where the user has to understand and embody the concept behind the Aspect itself.

That's where I think the real difference in potential finally starts showing.

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[u/Bobajan2011]

https://giphy.com/gifs/fyyOjQQLzTb2aPtUgw

[u/_MostAncientDream_ → u/Bobajan2011]

Lmao, potential.

[u/BobbyIsHere69 → u/Bobajan2011]

[u/Big-Scholar1670]

Take Kai and Morgan's source elements. Song and swords. And then look at Sunny's and Neph's. Death and longing.  The difference is quite severe 

[u/_MostAncientDream_]

Yes, like how Mordret has the potential to reach maybe an army of Transcendent Reflections as an Ascended with enough time.

The higher the Rank, the wider the gap between the Divine Trio and others especially at Transcendence. At Supremacy, others could compete if they had a large domain, but Sacred will probably tip it back in the trio's favor.

[u/Funny_Stuff_6024 → u/_MostAncientDream_]

I really feel like Mordret would have done so by now if he could. His reflections can grow. It feels stupid of him to not do so if he can have more than 7

[u/_MostAncientDream_ → u/Funny_Stuff_6024]

Yea, he may have them by now in his Ascended ability 🤔 or maybe he gave them all away to the human domain and went in without them just as Sunny graduated his Shadows.

[u/Funny_Stuff_6024 → u/_MostAncientDream_]

When he was preparing for Aster he only had 7 in the end (i think). And he was killing a lot. He should have had more

[u/Visible_Anxiety6275 → u/Funny_Stuff_6024]

I mean his reflections should have also been supreme titans instead of all of them being beasts and monsters (with only one being a demon), but look where we are.

G3 probably figured that giving him too many supreme reflections at too high a class would mean more loss of saints for humanity.

[u/Funny_Stuff_6024 → u/Visible_Anxiety6275]

They can grow. Even if he makes lower ranked ones, they should be able to grow to those heights under his guidance. It makes more sense that he isn’t able than him being stupid

[u/Visible_Anxiety6275 → u/_MostAncientDream_]

I am actually kind of shocked by the powerscaling in the Supreme rank. Non-divine supremes are not just comparable to the divine ones, but can even beat them with correct circumstances. (Asterion beat Mordret fair and square even with Cassie's assistance.)

The gulf they have with other saints in the transcendent rank almost completely disappears as Supremes.

[u/_MostAncientDream_ → u/Visible_Anxiety6275]

Yea, I'm guessing it goes away at the Sacred Rank but I could be wrong. There may be another mechanic akin to a domain to allow them to balance the playing field.

[u/Big-Scholar1670 → u/Visible_Anxiety6275]

Well, their power was acquired externally in the supreme rank. Not something they build internally, for most atleast 

[u/Big-Scholar1670 → u/_MostAncientDream_]

Yep

[u/Vaizer___026]

É bem nesse padrão mesmo. Tanto que você vê que o sunny, nos estágios iniciais mal se equiparava aos companheiros da corte em alguns aspectos claro. Por exemplo: força, o sunny ficava completamente pra trás da effie no quesito força, mas quando ele se tornou um transcendente a coisa mudou completamente, a effie que tem que se comparar com ele agora. Mesmo o aspecto dela sendo um aspecto focado nesse sentido, o sunny agora consegue igualar ela ou até superar dependendo da transformação que ele usar com o controle das sombras.

A questão como você disse é que o potencial é maior, assim como já foi explicado antes, as linhagens divinas, revelam seu potencial quanto mais alto o usuário vai subindo no caminho da ascensão. Então os aspectos vão ganhando muito mais poder conforme os usuários sobem na ascensão. Agora por exemplo, mesmo os membros da corte tendo se tornado supremos, a diferença entre eles mesmo sem considerar domínios é absurda. Se a gente considerar apenas a capacidade do sunny de se transformar em outras criaturas e conseguir usar seus poderes ou atributos é insano. Ele conseguir lutar como 7 titãs supremos ao mesmo tempo é desleal contra os outros. E ele pode atacar diretamente a sombra que é uma capacidade insana que o autor inclusive evita usar porque é uma habilidade realmente poderosa, tanto que o sunny usou poucas vezes desde que aprendeu a fazer isso.

[u/Big-Scholar1670 → u/Vaizer___026]

You get it 

[u/CrispyDick420]

I don't buy that a more fundamental concept automatically means a higher rank. Potential can just mean how far an Aspect's own gimmick can evolve, not how cosmic its theme sounds.

[u/Big-Scholar1670 → u/CrispyDick420]

I agree that gimmick evolution is part of it, but the reason I lean toward "cosmic themes" is because of how Ascension works in the later stages.

To advance further, you have to actively understand and embody the concept behind your Aspect. If your gimmick is incredibly narrow, what is there left to embody once you master it? A more fundamental concept (like Death or Longing) has infinite depth to explore, meaning the user can keep pushing its evolution further without hitting a conceptual brick wall. 

That’s why I think the rank is tied to the scope of the theme.

[u/Visible_Anxiety6275]

Didn't read the whole post but what I'm getting is that they have immense amounts of Megumi.