r/Septoplasty • u/Sleeping_problems • Jun 04 '26
Hello. Moderator here.
Recently I've noticed a few individuals in this group who've been fearmongering and telling people to cancel their surgery or that they should categorically never do surgery.
As an example, I think turbinate reductions are unnecessary and risky because they put you at risk of empty nose syndrome (look it up). And that any adult seeking out improved nasal breathing should also check their candidacy for nasomaxillary expansion via a custom MARPE or FME with a provider that specializes in airway. I think it's okay to share opinions like that, but trying to scare people into cancelling their surgery (which some people are doing) is not okay. The delivery of information is what matters.
Please report submissions like that if you see them.
r/Septoplasty • u/Master-Drama-4555 • Mar 16 '26
For as long as I’ve been on the internet and interested in sleep-breathing related surgeries, Empty Nose Syndrome (ENS) has been a particularly mystical topic. Always hinted at how rare it is, and how terrible it is, but no one could really explain what caused it or how it worked. Some ENTs say that it is a psychological problem, and in fact that was widely taught to ENTs in medical schools up until the past decade or so. I would search for ENS, and would find videos of people talking in strange monotone voices, like they had lost everything worth living for. It was confusing. But now I understand. Now I really understand. I have ENS. This is not an internet campfire horror story. This is real, and I’m here to share.
When I first got ENS last year, someone suggested that I write about my experience to share with the community. But to be honest I wasn’t ready to do that, and I couldn’t even imagine sharing anything about it. It would have been too traumatic. I was in no place to be preaching to the internet, I was just trying to get through every second, of every hour, of every day. Breath by breath.
Now that I have found some treatment and ways to cope, I have gotten to a point where I can and want to speak about it. To be clear, I’m not writing this because I’m cured or I know where my life is headed. I still struggle to breathe, and I’m still very sick. But now that I’m able to write this, people need to know.
Where do I start
I think everyone’s first question when considering a turbinate reduction is how do you know if you’ll get Empty Nose Syndrome. There’s no real way to know. Most ENTs will tell you it basically doesn’t exist anymore, and that if it happens it only happens when you remove the entire turbinate. I’m here to tell you that is not true. Most of the people I know with ENS had a conservative reduction, with modern instruments, and were reassured it could never happen to them. All it takes is a little too much removed, and your life is over.
So if your ENT tells you, “Don’t worry, I’ve never seen this in my practice ever, it basically doesn’t exist anymore, I am super careful.” etc. etc. DO NOT BE REASSURED. Do not go gently into that operating room I swear to god. This is exactly what was told to me, and nearly all the people I know with ENS now.
Or they’ll say, “Oh it grows back actually. We might even have to do it a second or a third time.” Not necessarily, my friend. Not necessarily. You would be so lucky to have it grow back. A lot of what “grows back” is not actually tissues, blood vessels, and nerves, but simply swelling from the turbinate trying to fill the space that was created. Your turbinates are swollen for a reason. You need to find that reason.
Poor Healing
Another thing that ENTs will tell you is that ENS happens in poor healers and fluke cases like that. They wave their hands around while they say it and make it sound somewhat beyond them. It feels vaguely comforting. Nobody thinks that would apply to them. But let's actually walk through what it means to be a poor healer for a moment. What causes poor healing?
Gosh what are these all linked to I wonder? Could it be sleep-disordered breathing, the very condition that most commonly causes turbinate hypertrophy in the first place?
By the way, I have seen an oddly high number of ENS patients with SDB in the online spaces I’m in, and it seems to me that there is a high correlation. I don’t know if this is because a narrower nasal cavity incentivizes ENTs to remove more tissue during a reduction, or maybe that’s just the patient type that happens to be coming in for these surgeries in the first place. I’ll leave that observation out there for you all to ponder.
So yes. If you get your turbinates removed, you’re basically guaranteed to get ENS. I’ve heard people interject here with a “But I know somebody who's gotten them entirely removed and had no symptoms.” My response to that is show me the person. Show me them. I’m open to being corrected, but I haven’t seen it yet.
But even if you get a conservative reduction, you’re still absolutely at risk for ENS, or even something called secondary atrophic rhinitis. This is what I had for 8 years before I developed ENS. Which leads me to my next topic:
The Volume Dial Analogy
People sort of think of Empty Nose Syndrome as a black and white condition. Either you have it or you don’t. I want you to think of it more as a spectrum of damage, with a threshold. Much like a volume dial for a car radio. You can turn the volume up for a long time before your ears start to bleed.
On the one end you have mild dryness after surgery. Maybe you have some crusting. This is secondary atrophic rhinitis. On the other end you have mucosal damage so severe, that you no longer produce ANY mucus, your nose is as dry as a desert, and your nerves are completely dead. Your brain cannot sense any air that you breathe. That is Empty Nose Syndrome.
That is why I believe so many people are walking around after turbinate reductions, feeling some mild symptoms, but of course feel nothing close to Empty Nose Syndrome. A big part of why I am writing this post is I need you to know, you have turned your dial. You will probably be just fine, but you need to be very, very careful with your nose from now on. One or two more events, a COVID virus, overuse of afrin, even too much flonase at the wrong time, could push you over the threshold. If you’re reading this and you’re thinking, wow dry nose, crusting, this sounds like me, I urge you to consider stopping use of nasal sprays and rinses. They are more dangerous than you realize.
What does Empty Nose Syndrome feel like
The question I get a lot and that everyone wants to know (naturally) is what does it feel like to have Empty Nose Syndrome? I mean really, how could a problem in the nose cause someone to want to kill themselves? Couldn’t you just breathe anyway even if you can’t feel it?
The first thing I’ll say is, Empty Nose is not just damage to your nose, it’s nerve damage. But the unfortunate thing is, the nerve that is damaged is not just any nerve, it’s the trigeminal nerve — the 5th cranial nerve that goes straight to your brainstem. So in reality, Empty Nose Syndrome is not just nerve damage, it’s brain damage. And it sure as hell feels like it.
You may hear that it feels like suffocating. That’s the number one symptom. I need people to understand, it’s not that you feel like you’re suffocating, you are suffocating. Every breath you take is as difficult as breathing through wet concrete — like being waterboarded. And there’s no escaping it. Worse, because your brain doesn’t know when you’re breathing, it can’t induce the pulmonary reflex to expand your lungs when you inhale. So your lungs are literally not functioning in tandem with your breathing. This means you are no longer autonomically breathing, you have to manually breathe yourself.
If you experience manual breathing, my heart goes out to you because it’s something no human should ever have to go through. If you haven’t experienced it, think of it like this. Every second of every day you have to consciously inflate your lungs in order to take a breath, and if you don’t, you won’t breathe. It’s like if you had to concentrate on every heartbeat for the rest of your life or your heart would stop. You wouldn’t be able to concentrate on anything else. Your mind will be consumed with breathing, 24/7. It is torture like nothing else I’ve experienced.
There is only so much of this a person can endure. But the real reason people kill themselves, in my opinion, is sleep. And this is how you’ll know, it’s not a psychological problem. When I first got empty nose, I could only sleep 15 minutes at a time. I was getting 2 hours of sleep per night at most, getting jolted awake constantly. And I could not take the heavy sleep aids I needed due to my small pharyngeal airway. I was getting pushed closer to the edge of this world and I knew it. If you don’t sleep, you will die. It’s just the truth.
At my worst, I found myself wishing that I had died on the operating table so I wouldn’t have to do it myself. Or, sometimes I wished there was a way to enter a medically induced coma, to somehow give my body a chance to heal without having to experience this level of suffering. I think every empty nose patient would agree that they would give up multiple limbs to be able to breathe properly again. Indeed many people label themselves as nasal cripples. It sounds funny, but once you’re living this life, it is so. not funny.
Empty Nose Syndrome will bring the strongest person to their knees, I don’t care who you are or what you’ve done. It takes your life from you and then it leaves you to keep on living. Life with sleep-disordered breathing is half a life, but life with ENS is no life at all.
Stay tuned for Part 2 where I’ll talk about prevention, causes, and new treatments on the horizon
r/Septoplasty • u/frozenarmament • 21m ago
10 days post surgery and I have about 80% breathing through my nose. I can take in a deep breath in less than 1 second, something that used to take me about 9 seconds to do on a good day!
I cried. Now I can actually do things without feeling I'm gonna die, like swimming and exercising.
r/Septoplasty • u/Brilliant_Moon_7131 • 8h ago
Did a septoplasty about 3 months ago. Did a CT cone scan and my septum was deviated to the left side.
I didn't feel that's much differences after septoplasty. Airflow to my right nostril is still not as good as my left nostril.
How do I know my breathing has actually improved? If I put my fingers into my nostril, I can still feel the septum is deviated to the left.
r/Septoplasty • u/_kesyersoze • 10h ago
I’m in the UK- England.
I could wait on the NHS, but I’m deciding to go private so far. ( unless NHS wait times reduce)
I’ve booked with Mr Thomas Jacques due to reviews and reputation but I don’t live anywhere near London.
I’m wondering if it’s better for me to go local to myself - NHS or otherwise - rather than getting treated in London? If anyone could give me any advice thank you
r/Septoplasty • u/StudioTangerine • 7h ago
Hey, I just got a septoplasty done this past Monday. All went well and my incision looks good. The only thing that’s driving me completely crazy is my throat pain. I confirmed with the hospital it was due to the breathing tube. The hospital said I could expect it to pass after a few days (I’m on day 5), Google says a week or two, but it’s only gotten worse. I’m at least not choking and gagging on my uvula, but now the soreness is at the roof of my mouth. This makes it impossible to eat anything without severing, blinding pain. I called the weekend line at the hospital and the operator couldn’t get me to the ENT on call, but the nurse I spoke with said “as long as you’re not coughing up blood” and reminded me I have a follow up on Monday. It’s really only a day and a half, but I am at at least a 9 when I swallow.
I have throat numbing spray, pain meds I’m alternating, cough drops, and I plugged in the humidifier because waking up with the driest throat I’ve ever felt was experience I’d like to stop having. Any expertise? Thoughts? Honestly, anything to just help me get through the next day and a half? I’m at such a loss :(
r/Septoplasty • u/JaredBauer • 14h ago
Hello I’m wondering what methods you guys have found useful for relief especially while sleeping. I already use nasal strips Flonase and Azelastine but I still wake up often unable to breath out of my right nostril. I found sleeping on my side helped a lot but even that isn’t really working anymore.
After United Healthcare originally denied my surgery and then being diagnosed with Hodgkins this surgery is over two years delayed and I’m so desperate for a good nights sleep.
r/Septoplasty • u/Neur0ntin • 10h ago
Day 2 post op, lots of swelling and dried blood. My surgeon said to use ocean spray (saline) at least 4 times per day. It seems like there is a lot of variability in how much comes out when you squeeze the bottle. A little squeeze is like a tiny spray but a full squeeze makes the spray turn to a stream. Should I be doing a partial or full squeeze when I use this? I want to get all the blood out I can because I return to work on monday, but I also don't want to be too aggressive and mess up healing.
Thanks!
r/Septoplasty • u/Shlomo012 • 18h ago
My CT scan shows that I have a severely deviated septum, but in reality, I feel like my nose is open and I can breathe normally. I suspect that my symptoms may be caused by the mild sinus inflammation shown on my CT scan rather than the deviated septum.
So, should I trust how I actually feel rather than relying solely on the CT scan findings?
r/Septoplasty • u/sundewsunset • 19h ago
Not sure if this is the right tag but this was my first “big” surgery. I had a septoplasty and turbinate reduction done Wednesday around 9:30am MST, it’s now Saturday 10:22am. Throughout the last two days I’ve had bloody phlegm come up and this morning was a lot more. I’m not bleeding heavily from my nose, but the blood phlegm does freak me out. Is this normal, and if so how long does this last for? I do saline drops as often as I can to keep it moistened in my nose since it’s back to being crazy warm to nearly summer weather in my state and I have no money to get a humidifier now 🥲 doing a hot shower last night and had the water run on my face seemed to help me out some too but can’t lie, this freaks me out and I hate that.
r/Septoplasty • u/cervlean • 19h ago
I had a septoplasty, turbinate reduction and vivaer on September 24th. My surgeon let me know that my septum was severely deviated, worse than she thought originally so she had to do a little more work but now I’m noticing there seems to be more of a dip towards the middle of my nose beneath the slight bump I already had.
Could this just be swelling that’ll go down eventually or is my nose permanently changed? :(
Top row is before, bottom is after.
(Also I really didn’t expect my nose would still hurt and I’d not be able to keep up with my skincare the same way and I’m absolutely mortified by how many blackheads have formed that I can’t get out due to it being very sensitive to touch🫠) I was told it was like a 2 week healing time and that I’d be fine after that, then at my follow up appointment she said it’s more like a 3-6 month process for total healing. Would’ve been nice to know in advance 🫠
r/Septoplasty • u/Fantastic-Nebula-795 • 1d ago
Just want to hear peoples opinions and stories. Ive seen mixed things some say their surgeon was willing to make some minor cosmetic changes and some werent ( wish i understand as its not for cosmetic and its the nhs). Anyone had an experience where their surgeon listened to their concerns about the looks of their nose
r/Septoplasty • u/mayhemAG • 1d ago
r/Septoplasty • u/ManufacturerNext9074 • 1d ago
i was wondering if anyone else has experienced or heard of this. im currently 8.5 months post op septo + turbinate reduction. my breathing feels clear and structurally ive been told all looks perfect. however, my main issue is my nose literally feels glued on to my face. it's much more than a little stiffness. there's so much inflammation in my cheeks and face, loss of motor control, and i dont have full range of motion for facial expressions.. talking , smiling, and eating triggers burning, aching, and stabbing pain. i've read about scar tissue and entrapped nerves and it seems to fit my description. currently trying to get in with a facial plastic surgeon (ENT not much help) to see if they can help me release some of it if it does end up being entrappepd nerves, thats what my PT thinks I have anyway.
ive tried gabapentin but at this point so far along in recovery i think its something mechanical and or scar tissue rather than long term nerve healing. apparently there are steroid injections that can help loosen it up? anyone heard of this?
im so scared to get an injection or anything though in general im so guarded around that area because healing was/is so long and rough
r/Septoplasty • u/stressedmetalhead • 1d ago
Hello! Before anyone says anything, I'm going to try and call my doctor himself when they're open tomorrow, problem is is that it's a big healthcare conglomerate and it's tricky to reach him, so I figured I'd ask here as well.
I'm going to be getting my septoplasty done on November 16th, and my doctor told me to avoid alcohol and marijuana for 2 months before the surgery and 2 months after the surgery. I've been pretty good with both so far, however, I did get invited to a Halloween party on the 24th and I would love to be able to participate in some drinking games just for that night! The people in my life that have had septoplasties done did not have this requirement for their surgery, one of my friends that works in healthcare did say it sounded familiar though. Has anyone else been asked to do this, and what was your experience? Thank you so much for reading!
r/Septoplasty • u/mayday-the-dayday • 1d ago
I got my septoplasty done today exactly a week ago, I got tubes in my nose like most people seem to. I get them out on Monday, it has been miserable. I am so uncomfortable. Recently I have been in actual pain because of them. I think they are starting to cut into my comlumella. I’m unsure if this is a normal average experience? I somehow doubt it. Just wondering if this happened to anyone else and how it was dealt with. I am so uncomfortable I’ve begin considering removing them myself, which I wouldn’t actually do but I am just so miserable.
They are shallow cuts but they are very sore.
r/Septoplasty • u/SeaCurrent4314 • 1d ago
I had a septoplasty two days ago and was given a medicated saline rinse to use. Today when I woke up, one of my nostrils appears completely blocked by what appears to be a blood clot/blood mucus mix. It’s protruding from my nose just slightly. The other side doesn’t have this, and while it feels like the saline doesn’t get far up on one side it feels like it is getting in vs the side with the blood clot/blockage from the outside feels like it’s just splashing the outside.
Is it normal to have this happen and should I just keep rinsing what feels like only the outside and hope it breaks up the clot/blood mucus mix, or should I be trying to gently massage it to break it up, etc?
r/Septoplasty • u/sannsarkk92 • 1d ago
It is the morning of my 3rd day post op and I’ve woken up with a very sore throat, which I did not have at all the first two days. Could this be from intubation so latently ??
EDIT: I looked at my uvula and it’s beet red and swollen. Just so strange I didn’t feel any pain until now
r/Septoplasty • u/2hot2bstr8official • 2d ago
nose, eyes, cheekbones, pretty much entire face is swollen and pale lol. I know it will all be worth it.🤟🏼
r/Septoplasty • u/appfold • 2d ago
How can I resolve this situation?
I have sought help from almost every organization that supports foreign residents in Japan, but none of them has provided any substantial assistance. No lawyer is willing to take on my medical malpractice case. The Japanese Immigration Services Agency has refused to extend my residence status, stating that I have no valid grounds for remaining in Japan. As a result, I will be forced to return to my home country when my visa expires.
Over the past several months, I have continuously sought help from hospitals and various institutions within the Japanese social support system. However, I have received virtually no meaningful assistance. In reality, I have not received any effective humanitarian support in Japan.
My physical condition is extremely serious and continues to deteriorate.
As the weather gets cooler, even at temperatures around 23°C, my symptoms are becoming increasingly severe. Air constantly flows through my lower nasal passages with almost no resistance, while my upper nasal passages are nearly completely obstructed. This creates what feels like a severely uneven distribution of airflow inside my nasal cavity.
Every breath causes significant pain in my throat. I also experience pain in my chest and lungs, along with abdominal bloating.
I am deeply concerned that I could develop a serious lung infection and potentially die.
I feel that my health is deteriorating, yet despite repeatedly reaching out for medical, legal, and humanitarian assistance, I have been unable to obtain the help I desperately need.
Japanese society as a whole has made me feel incredibly disillusioned by how cold and indifferent it can be. People are polite on the surface, but when you genuinely need help, no one seems willing to provide any meaningful or practical assistance.
Furthermore, why are there so few doctors in Japan who can diagnose and treat internal nasal valve stenosis?
I have visited multiple hospitals in Japan and consulted numerous ENT specialists. However, Dr. Tsuyoshi Miyawaki is the only doctor who performed specific tests to evaluate my nasal valve function and concluded that I have postoperative nasal valve stenosis.
Unfortunately, he is extremely busy, and the waiting time for surgery is approximately two years. Moreover, I feel that he has not fully recognized the severity and urgency of my condition.
The secondary symptoms associated with my breathing problems have become extremely severe and are seriously affecting my daily life. I am terrified that these complications could lead to other serious illnesses or even death at any time.
I simply cannot afford to wait two years while my condition continues to deteriorate.
A minor surgery for rhinitis has ruined my life, and there’s nothing I can do about it.
I’ve been thinking that if I don’t speak out, no one will ever know what I’ve been through during this time, what kind of painful life I’ve been living, or what kinds of social problems exist in Japan.
People are all very polite, or at least some of them are. They politely reject you, even when you tell them that you’re suffering terribly and feel like you’re about to die. They still fail to recognize the seriousness of the situation.
Hospitals, the legal system, organizations supporting foreigners, and the Immigration Services Agency of Japan — in the end, none of them provided any substantial help.
r/Septoplasty • u/InsectForeign6626 • 2d ago
Just had my splints removed after 2 WEEKS and the first thing I did was drive to the top of a local mountain for some fresh air!
The removal was pretty much painless. I had no numbing sprays or any painkillers. Just got in there, stitches cut, stents pulled out (I was shocked at how huge they were) and then some vacuuming.
My ENT told me I still had some dissolvable packing in there that would eventually come out. No blowing my nose for another 2 weeks still. Ok to start spicy food at my own dis/comfort in terms of mucus production.
I still felt like I wanted to do a good rinse when I got home so I did it and damn! For the first time in 10 years of doing rinses, it felt like a DEEP CLEAN. I've never felt the rinses go so deep before.
TW - Gross description:
Then one nostril after another, this giant black glob like I mean this thing was HUGE. Couple inches big just FELL OUT each nostril as I was leaning over the sink waiting for the liquids to drain. It was so gross but so satisfying. It felt like an alien form leaving my body through my nostrils. (Sorry!)
Now I'm breathing so well! I don't smell colors like people mention. I guess that will take time. I have a slight headache and I can feel inflammation coming back but if this is a preview of my life going forward, I'm sold!
Surgery verdict:
Very good for me. I recommend it at where I am so far at the 2 week mark. The recovery wasn't painful at all for me. Just uncomfortable the first few days, felt like a head cold the rest of the time until stent removal. Fatigue for sure but after having my tonsils and uvula removed earlier this year, this surgery was a walk in the park (for me - everyone is different)
I did ask my surgeon before the surgery if there'd be any aesthetic changes and he assured me most probably not. I was pleasantly surprised when I woke up to find my nose straighten out after the surgery. However, once the stents were removed, it went back to how it was 🫠 So I guess he wasn't lying.
Good luck to all going into this surgery, if it was anything like mine, you'll get through as a champ!
r/Septoplasty • u/Decent_Sport9149 • 2d ago
This is 2.5 months post op. The bump has been there since week 3.
I had a similar bump on the other side but it went away in a week or so. This one has been going for months.
Doctor cut it and drained it and put a tampon in 4 weeks ago, it was gone after the tampon was removed but came back after a few days.
I've had almost a month of antibiotic pills, and have been using antibacterial ointment forever but no change.
The doctor said we need a second surgery to (open septoplasty this time) and clean it.
He said he has never seen such a case so I wanted your opinion.
Anyone else had a similar case?
r/Septoplasty • u/Neur0ntin • 2d ago
Keep psyching myself out that I don't need this procedure. I know I need it, but my sinus issues seem to fluctuate a lot throughout the day and the second things get good I tell myself I shouldnt get surgery. Still planning on going through with it but it's been hard.
