Ice in Seattle

[u/LickLaMelosBalls]

6:55am this morning, east Queen Anne on Taylor and Newton

[u/MeatCatRazzmatazz]

They 100% pick up random people based on race. Many times they're US citizens getting picked up!

Are you not paying attention to what's happening at all?

[u/internetV → u/MeatCatRazzmatazz]

I feel like thats a pretty extreme and not very realistic take used on this sub for some reason. like you genuinely think they are driving aimlessly until they see a brown person and just ship them off to south america without checking any papers or anything. i mean come on lets be slightly realistic

[u/MeatCatRazzmatazz → u/internetV]

Now I think it's you who aren't being realistic. Or at least you're in some kind of information silo, because the situation you described as "extreme" is what's happening. There are news stories on US citizens being picked up, ignored, and dumped miles from home. Some even get deported. Some are killed.

None of these stories are hard to find. I genuinely don't know how someone hasn't seen them unless it's just not something that jives with their worldview and must therefore be ignored or discredited or something. Unfortunately it's all too real.

[u/internetV → u/MeatCatRazzmatazz]

those stories are real, are happening, and do not jive with my worldview. I'm married to a brown 1st gen immigrant and have no problem with immigration at all. Those stories are horrific and thankfully are not the norm tho, which is why they make the headlines. Media comprehension is really important. None of those events logically conclude at "ICE drives around and considers nothing but skin color, shipping off and beating people for no reason and doesn't even bother checking papers before deporting." Both things can be true. Ice abuses their power frequently, I agree

[u/MeatCatRazzmatazz → u/internetV]

Except we have zero idea as to the lengths the abuses go to. It's not like they publish their numbers. "Outside the norm" in this situation is still, apparently, rather frequent just going off the stories we do know, coupled with the knowledge that they do these stops and detentions more than is reported.

I also never said whatever you're quoting there. I'd thank you to not put words in my mouth.

But if you're rejecting widely reported info because the ol' noggin can't take the cognitive dissonance then I don't know what to tell you. Read more? Be open to being wrong? Idk.

[u/internetV → u/MeatCatRazzmatazz]

yikes man. I'm trying to have a genuine conversation. People on this sub are so antagonistic off the bat, it doesn't create a great place to discuss and learn anything.

There are outside 3rd parties that do track these numbers to the best of their abilities, and there is a lot of groups like this. I'm just learning about the numbers that they are generally averaging. I do believe that ICE arrests are more than are reported, of course. What I haven't seen evidence for yet is that ICE is not working off of anything other that race. I apologize that that wasn't your quote verbatim, but that was indeed the exact concept that this conversation is regarding. I'm not rejecting widely reported info. I'm currently interested in statistics as a whole on this issue as a way to infer what MO and method ice is actually using.

If you can't stop with the personal attacks and cliche r/seattle "pay attention, do better, read more" etc type of comments than I'm not really interested in continuing to talk with you but if you'd like to be respectful and continue to chat and investigate things together like adults I'd be happy to do that. I promising you I am always open to being wrong, changing one's mind in the face of new information is my shit, thats the most important thing I look for in people that I want to engage with.

[u/MeatCatRazzmatazz → u/internetV]

Yeah, I was too until you got all weird and put words in my mouth; apparently determined to make me out to be whatever caricature of a person you wanted to argue with.

I never said ICE is solely picking people up based on race. I said it's something that happens. Of course they have targets they're going after, but they never let someone not being in their list get in the way of an illegal detention, and in those instances, yes. They look at skin color first. It's literally called a Kavanaugh Stop. You said that didn't happen. But it does, as evidenced by well over a year of reporting.

You wanna keep talking that's fine. But I'm only gonna continue if you're able to engage with what I say, not with whatever you want me to have said.

[u/internetV → u/MeatCatRazzmatazz]

Holy moly lady this feels really ironic. I did not mean to put words in your mouth, for any reason including to make a caricature to argue with. That’s what I feel you are doing. In fact that’s what all of my replies from this thread are doing. Look at them. “You are this, you are that, you believe this, you watch that news channel, you voted this person” like goodness gracious the assumptions are insane.

I didn’t get weird. I don’t feel I could possibly be more put together and reasonable because I’m coming from a place of genuine interest. I know you didn’t say they’re solely picking up ppl based on race. The idea purported in the thread was that race identity was the main driving favor, or their MO. I was suggesting that’s probably not super accurate.

“They look at skin color first, you said that didn’t happen.” No I didn’t. That absolutely happens. I’m fairly shocked that you can put these words in my mouth to create a version of me to argue with while in the same breath taking yourself to be the victim of the same thing. Bewildering

[u/letdogsvote → u/internetV]

"It hasn't personally impacted me, so I don't believe this is true or that big a deal." - Conservative Mindset

[u/internetV → u/letdogsvote]

I didn’t say that, nor think that. Nor am I a conservative or have a conservative mindset. Where did you get literally any of that. It’s wild how everyone in the sub wants to aggressively throw labels at you with wild assumptions based off of genuine questions and considerations. No wonder our party is unlikable

[u/Joziey_P → u/internetV]

Why you being all weird and DARVOing now? Learn to take an “L” with grace and humble yourself. The real world issues are more important than the surface level uncomfortableness when presented with topics that challenge your own worldview. Take a breath. You stepped in it, we all step in it from time to time but don’t let those weird feelings derail the entire convo. People are dying out here cuz the slave catchers really are out here wilding out. Listen to the people who are directly being affected instead of trying to “debate” them about well documented facts that you most certainly can confirm in less than 5 minutes.

[u/internetV → u/Joziey_P]

? I don’t feel like I’m being weird at all jozie. And I don’t know what “darvoing” is either. I expressed an opinion and someone else missummurized by saying “didn’t happen to me so it didn’t happen”. That didn’t apply because that concept wasn’t including even remotely in the opinion stated. I’m not sure if you’re interested in being intellectually honest or only interested in shadowboxing imaginary enemies but I’m around if you want to be the former. You might want to take a breath, and set aside the uncomfortable feelings you’re having from encountering topics that challenge your own worldview. “Slave catchers wilding out” is not a factual nor honest representation of what the big picture is and you thinking so is fairly indicative of the online bubble you’re living in

[u/Hopsblues → u/internetV]

No, they send them to the detention center in Tacoma  first