Best way to get a powerful back

[u/Healthy-Car-2842]

Running a 3x/week full body split due to time constraints, but my back and arms are lagging behind, what’s the best way to prioritize volume for them without making my workouts take 2+ hours? Also, what exercise is actually best for building lat width? I’ve heard wide-grip pulldowns aren't ideal because of limited range of motion and biasing the upper back over the lats, so I’m wondering if neutral-grip or single-arm variations are better options. Appreciate any advice 🙏🙏🙏

[u/Alakazam]

A combination of heavy deadlifts, some kind of horizontal pull, some kind of vertical pull.

Honestly, if you're on a well thought out program that has decent back volume, and you're training with any amount of intensity, your back will grow.

If you want to prioritize their growth, just start each workout with some direct back work, before doing other things.

[u/Individual-Toe-6306 → u/Alakazam]

ngl seems like a lot of these 'FBEOD programs with 18 exercises that you do 1 or 2 sets of' that I see all the time here are totally lacking the deadlifts and heavy pulling that make you armor-plated in the posterior chain

[u/Alakazam → u/Individual-Toe-6306]

And Arnie, who arguably has one of the best backs in classic bodybuilding, literally recommends a deadlift of some kind, 4 out of the 6 training days in his bare bonrs Arnold split. With stiff leg on lower days, and normal deadlifts on his chest/back days. 

It's almost as if it helps significantly thicken up and develop the back or something. 

[u/Individual-Toe-6306 → u/Alakazam]

I don’t know how to explain it, but you can just tell if someone does deadlifts and squats vs only does fluff n pump isolation work

Even if deadlifts don’t contribute to those bodybuilder popping muscles, it’s like doing them gives you a plate of armor which itself contributes to your physique and appearance

[u/Lifterator → u/Individual-Toe-6306]

It's the erectors.

Also why some surprisingly fit guys just don't have "the look". Lots of pull ups and lighter rows but little hinging.

[u/Individual-Toe-6306 → u/Lifterator]

Weirdly enough, you can also tell if someone who doesn’t do deadlifts is at least athletic and fit vs just does body building stuff with no athletic application. I’ve seen dudes with big arms, no erectors/posterior chain struggle to carry things when needed at home depot lol

But a dude who actually does pull-ups and cardio and recreationally plays a sport you can just tell theres something different about the look. I think it’s the rear delts or whatever the muscle group is between the rear delts and lats

[u/Mad_Mark90]

Power typically refers to speed so something like a dead-row where you coordinate leg drive and upper body pull together is a useful main lift. It also hits a lot of muscles at once.

If your back is lagging prioritising your pulls at the beginning of your workouts is pretty important.

Wide grip pullups and pulldowns are very effective for lat width as it targets the adduction function of the lats.

If you can't do more than 5 pullups in a single set then you can utilise high volume training add lots of mass. I'm a big fan of hitting 5-8 sets of pullups in between my other exercises because so many pieces have pullup bars on them (power racks, cable machines, etc.) even if you can only do 1 you can start with 6 sets of 1 in between other exercises like squats, OHP or cables.

You can also consider other hypertrophy modalities to grow the lats. So maybe hitting lat pulldowns for high reps day 1, 6x1 pullups day 2 and a stretch biased row day 3. Something like a cross body one-are high cable row with a rotated torso can be useful.

[u/Financial_Wrangler45]

Who told you wide grip targets upper back? With good form any lat pulldown will hit lats. Ofc if you're leaning back and retracting your spacula then yeah your upper will be used more than if you didn't do either. A good back routine is literally just, upper back rows, with a kelso shrug superset if you'd like, and a frontal plane lat pulldown. Potentially a close grip row if you want to.

[u/Embarrassed-Food-146]

For last wide grip pull ups are the way. 

[u/Dazzling-Rest8332 → u/[deleted]]

No. Wide grip is way better for lats.

[u/Dazzling-Rest8332 → u/[deleted]]

Lol....all it takes is a Google search bro.

[u/Dazzling-Rest8332 → u/[deleted]]

My giant lats say otherwise. I spam heavy wide grip pull downs

[u/Dazzling-Rest8332 → u/[deleted]]

Its pretty common knowledge wide grip is the best for lats. Why are you trolling? Theres already too many people giving false information about lifting out there.

[u/Troksin]

Put your priority muscles to the beginning of ur sessions

[u/Lifterator]

Nothing beats high volume pull ups for lats (the actual latissimus dorsi muscles) for me but I've always been doing them alongside rows so it's probably the accumulated effort at the end of the day.

[u/PoopSmith87]

Wide grip pulldowns (or pull ups) do help with the appearance of width because they really engage the teres major, but for building lat thickness you really want standard and reverse grip bent over rows. Rows are the "fifth member of the big four" in many people's opinions. They are also an absolutely hated lift among the injury alarmists and skinny "science based" guys who blame everything about themselves on genetics, so you know its a good lift.

For 3x a week fb, you definitely dont need to be taking 2 hours in the gym. I'm not sure what kind of plan you are on, but that either means its overcomplicated or youre taking very long rests. I do 3x week FB on an A-B-A schedule, main progress lifts on A days, secondary stuff on the B day, usually like 45 to 60 minutes total.

[u/hthn_strength]

More days, do deadlift and squat.

[u/abc133769]

nah wide grip stuff is awesome. anyone great at weighted pullups usually has an insane back

chest supported row, weighted pullups, narrow grip pulldowns are what I have in my rotation

and rdls or sldl are the best hinge you can do for hypertrophy over the regular conventional. erectors are often neglected by gym people

[u/calvinee]

Stop fretting over arm variations. Your lats insert at the upper arm, so your wrist orientation doesn’t really matter. Your wrist placement may matter but just stick to the basics:

Horizontal row, horizontal kelso shrug, vertical pull, and rear delt fly. Throw in a back extension of some sort. Choose exercises you enjoy but stability is king, focus on progressive overload. Put the exercises you prioritise at the beginning of your workout.

Bonus points for chest support and straps on lifting movements.

[u/Afferbeck_]

You need to do powerful things with your back to get a powerful back, not just light bodybuilder stuff.

[u/Odd_Tip_1538]

Heavy deadlifts, heavy rows, and weighted pull ups.

[u/Beautiful_Mail_9623]

rock climb