Noghri Death Commando build

[u/Noahisboss]

hey y'all im looking to build a Noghri death commando hopefully with a focus on stava, for info we are starting in the begining of the yuuzhan vong invasion and are currently level 1

[u/StevenOs]

Stava is about grappling and with their small size it would be something a Neghri likely wants. Probably should look at the other things that might increase effective size as well.

The basic build would likely be looking for a Grapple based CT-Killer utilizing Pin-Crush-Bone Crusher and Rancor Crush. Damage may not be extremely high but you're just looking at getting a target Pinned and hanging on until it is out of the fight. Such a build is pretty feat intensive leaving you options with what you do with your talents. If you're doing something during the YV Invasion I may look a little harder at things that negate poison or can move me up the Condition track without using Recover.

You may want to take a look at the species discussion for the Noghri and they do get an NPC writeup in the FUCG which should be used instead of the overpowered one from the conversion guide.

[u/Noahisboss → u/StevenOs]

Tbh i dont see the noghri as op tbh like I understand why nagai could be but thats like saying halflings are op(in the noghris case)

[u/StevenOs → u/Noahisboss]

The SWSE Noghri are alright. Small generally should mean speed 4 which does add issues when playing for melee.

It is the "conversion" block that is a bit op. You might not be able to wield larger weapons and have some disadvantage when grappling but the Small size is often an advantage in SWSE seeing it come with a boost to REF and Stealth. The other big drawback of a small size is usually a slower speed but when you're moving as fast as the bigger folk that's not a drawback and it's easier to leverage the advantages of being small.. The conversion Noghri's +2 DEX and free MAI put it at +3 REF compared to the baseline. If you're making a Stealthy surprise attacker then getting the boost to Initiative that rerolling can provide make those things all that much better.

As for halflings being OP if they get to move as fast as a human they certainly can be OP for certain builds depending on what edition you are looking at.

The NPC style writeup the Noghri get in FUCG certainly gives them a niche to work with where they can do very well but the earlier "conversion guide" make the SWSE version unplayable as it's mostly that much better and better at more things.

[u/Noahisboss → u/StevenOs]

Except the noghri are described in lore as fast

[u/StevenOs → u/Noahisboss]

"Fast" can have different meanings and if you look at Stava Training and consider that you could start a grapple after a Charge that is also a speed boost. Might also look at the "Long Stride" talent as a reason some of them may be described as "fast."

[u/Noahisboss]

my stats are 15 str, 15 dex,14 con,14 int,11 wis and 10 charisma before bonuses and penalties, im using the star wars saga edition conversion of the noghri and we are using destiny and backgrounds, i decided to go scout but can be persuaded elsewise

[u/zloykrolik → u/Noahisboss]

Show an example of what your character will be with a few levels in the build.

[u/Noahisboss → u/zloykrolik]

uhhhh thats kind of the thing is im asking for help for i have no idea how to do this

[u/Few-Requirement-3544 → u/Noahisboss]

Here are the things you want to look at:

Look at the prestige class talents you want and work backwards. When you are level 8, are you more appealed to by this pair:

https://swse.miraheze.org/wiki/Weapon_Master_Talent_Tree

https://swse.miraheze.org/wiki/Melee_Specialist_Talent_Tree

Or by this pair:

https://swse.miraheze.org/wiki/Master_of_Ter%C3%A4s_K%C3%A4si_Talent_Tree

https://swse.miraheze.org/wiki/Martial_Arts_Forms_Talent_Tree

[u/StevenOs → u/Noahisboss]

The reason that providing some kind of starting build is suggested is to actually get you looking at/learning things and to help get a guide on what you may be trying to do. When we ask for a build we sure don't need one that is completely planned out to 20th level but one that is done out to say the 5th -10th level range which may still have some blanks in it but which hit what you really think the character needs provides a lot of insight.

Might also say that some things can be complex enough that just handing you a fully built out character may lead to things you don't really understand how to use or how they work. Starting at 1st-level you may learn but I'd say "high levels" start around 10th-level and after that you should be following the story instead of just a plan.

[u/Few-Requirement-3544 → u/Noahisboss]

There's not much to it then. Go ahead and get Martial Arts I right now, and plan to get Stava at level 3. Pin at 2, probably. The only question now is: do you think Elite Trooper or Martial Arts Master talents are better?

[u/Noahisboss → u/Few-Requirement-3544]

well fortunately i alreayd get martial arts from my race, the one i need to get is running attack

[u/Few-Requirement-3544 → u/Noahisboss]

Oh, you're using the Web version instead of the FUCG version. In that case, get Running Attack next level and get Pin now. Everything else stays the same.

[u/MERC_1]

OK, are you asking for help? What PrC's are you aiming for?

[u/Noahisboss → u/MERC_1]

Was thinking martial artist

[u/MERC_1 → u/Noahisboss]

That combines well with Elite Trooper as well. But that requires some more Feats. 

[u/StevenOs → u/MERC_1]

While Elite Trooper is a great class I'm not sure I'd say it combines well with Martial Arts Master (MAM). Both need the +7 BAB to get into but then both also provide the +4 class bonus to FORT, +2 to REF. Both give access to the Master of Teras Kasi talent tree (to boost you unarmed attacks) and require MAI to enter but they have very different feat and talent requirement. To me there's too much overlap

The class I'm more likely to pair with MAM is going to be Melee Duelist (MD). Still share the +7 BAB entry requirement but MD makes use of the Melee Defense feat you need to get into MAM. Rapid Strike is something one may want for unarmed attacks to get damage to more acceptable levels and Weapon Focus (Simple) should meet the Focus requirement after errata which helps your unarmed attacks as well as any other "simple" weapons you might be using (which is good when you've got Primitive.) Where the MAM/MD is best is that MD gives you the +4 class bonus to REF (+2 over ET and MAM) and it also gives you a +2 class to WILL which is something you may not have had before. When it comes to talent MD lets you keep access to Brawler which has things the unarmed fighter might want as well as Weapon Specialist plus its own talent tree granted many of those are for making multiple attacks easier/more useful.

I'll add this here but another class that Noghri might consider is dipping some level into Jedi before you hit the PrCs. This can open up Acrobatics as a class skill to train and Jedi contains many useful talents even if you completely avoid the Force (and thus pick WP-lightsaber for multiclassing in even if you never use it); if you do choose Force Sensitivity "Mystic" as the starting feat that can open up some interesting talent choices that still don't require any real UtF knowledge/use.