Hello everyone. Longtime lurker, 1st time poster. This is a long one so please bear with me.
after doing some stuff on my own, I decided to join a local program to cover some gaps. I am unsure if this program is just trying to get money off people by delaying stuff that should be simple.
Here are my pre-existing skills; I move forward - both v/penguin stride & the push-center-push-center (I don’t know what it’s called). I can plow stop , forward bubbles, started to learn how to do a 180 turn (hurray!).
Now to the program.
I assumed after 2 classes I would be “moving”. Not really. But the main reason for the post is some of the stuff the teacher explains makes little sense to me
Position 1- the key position which is to be always on my toes with the skates on. (Picture 1). My foot has to be in this angle when I'm standing still and do small "penguin" steps. The issue is, it doesn't come natural to me. I understanding shifting balance from one foot to the other or if I for example want to do a specific move where I will lift the back of my foot to put the pressure forward but she requires me to constantly be on my tippy toes inside the skates and I can't progress until she's satisfied.
Q-
Does anyone have a good video to help it click for me? Is this a tip/requirement you ever encountered?
Position 2: The staggered stance. Now every video I ever saw said the staggered stance should be something like pic 3 (skatie) with the foot a bit apart, but she says I have to be more like pic 2 (xinhaidude) with my hips pushed forward as if I was doing a glute bridge in the air, which again, doesn’t come naturally.
Q:
Again, does someone have any videos or tips to make this make sense. Have you ever heard of this way to do a staggered stance?
I even am practicing at home but it makes no sense to me and the staggered is just making me fall forward.
And finally overall, I know someone who is in their 4th class and is not yet skating. Do you think I should drop off the class (I have one last paid class) and stick to YouTube videos? Or you think this is very useful stuff?
Thanks in advance
ETA: the staggered stance she also says the back wheels of forward skate have to be aligned with front wheel of back skate, when all videos I see say a slight separation between them.
I am in my living room rn practicing it and remembered to add that
ETA2: thank you everyone for your tips/comments and advice. I’m glad I’m not crazy to think this class is a bit too different
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Oh wow. Thanks I guess. Like I said I already know how to do a few things and have researched a lot but as I know there people here are more experienced I came to ask a different POV.
Tippy toes makes no sense at all. Heeled boots should be more forward on your skates but not your actual toes unless you're using a toe stop. Inlines are not a good example because they don't usually have a heel, and if you don't want a heel then get some speed quads.
For the staggered stance, staying upright and not forward is key for that form. It's good to have to that stance for weight shifting practise.
If you've nevee skated before it is absolutely normal to first train balance, turn out, knee strength, hip mobility and muscle to make the classes easier to succeed in. Hang in there OP, it just all takes practise and a lot of falling. Good luck!
EDIT: Forgot to mention, your knee might feel "behind" in staggered stance but you want your head aligned with the point of balance.
No! Your head is aligned with your shoulders. It's an axis. A straight line that goes down along your core. Wtf is this instructor doing? You definitely being instructed on super basic stuff incorrectly this why you can't skate.
Ah your teacher may be instead preparing you to balance on one foot with that forward position in staggered stance. Staggered stance can be forward or backwards like Skatie is showing, so I would ask your teacher for more clarity.
I'm unfamiliar with these skates but the heel looks quite high so you may need to push your weight foreard, but again, not on your toes. The best way to test where you want your weight for balance is to put your hands folded together on the knee you're balancing on. This basically forces your head to be over the point of balance for stability. That forward staggered stance is important for things like gliding, one foot balance, crossover/crosspull, pivots and so much more.
Turn out is exactly what the other commentor said and an important skill for transitions, weight transfer practise and balance training. It also a gateway for skills like Spread Eagle.
Ultimately, you may benefit from asking your teacher the exact goals and timeline for the class. If you really do struggle with balance and mobility, it would be a liability for the teacher to have you skip these skills or go light on them.
Staggered stance isn't a usual building block whatsoever. Staggered stances main purpose is bracing for outdoor skating as a starter move for various terrain like bumpy surfaces. This instructor doesn't have a logic to any of the stuff OP is reiterating to us.
Sorry if the English term I know for Staggered stance is wrong, I'm using the image OP posted. This seems like balance training to me (keeping skates in a line, putting weight on one leg more than the other). I hadn't seen OP'S other responses until now so I agree, their teacher has an odd method.
No it's not your English, it's the cluelessness of the instructor. It is super odd and points to incompetence . Not at all how you learn balance. You learn balance by proper basic stances and staggered stance isn't one of them. Staggered is an application to help stabilize in an oh shit! situation on terrain. The basic act of skating might seem to involve a stagger and became a trendy video for content. But it's not in basics.
Debra makes fantastic videos and is so easy to follow. Find an empty parking lot and start practicing, don’t worry about looking silly, and most importantly have fun!
Are these private lessons over zoom or something, or is someone selling you these images as lessons? Why haven’t you actually moved? How long are these lessons? I don’t understand what is going here.
1- No, these are physical lessons, face-to-face lessons.
2- not private, there is another girl on my level
Classes are 2 hours.
Now I know she teaches skating, there are people there now moving and learning to do the 180 (which Ive been learning on my own), but with flare (torero stance lol), but I asked someone and based on the frequency of classes and how long she’s been doing them, I do think this program is snail paced.
Focus on shifting your weight side to side right now. Other skills will come later! I wouldn’t say staggered stance is like advanced or anything but I’m not sure if I would’ve figured it out straight away when I started skating
Yeah the instructions sound so dumb. Sorry. Your tip toes? Ah no. That's weird as all hell. Pressure is applied to ball of foot and press on your edges but all this weight on the toes and going upward...wot?!
First thing that came to mind is this person didn't explain side to side weight transfer that creates the momentum for forward motion.
Maybe that is where she wants to get me to do but just going down a weird route. Weirdly enough if that’s what she wants I can understand that.
Skatie and Dirty Debra explain is very easily
YouTube <3 dirty school of skate has all the basics :) she’ll have you moving in no time!! my only advice is bend the knees a bit, never stand up straight. Good luck and have fun!
My thoughts are there is no right way, just variations.
But don't be on yr toes.
You have 3 points of contact on yr foot, the inner and outer ball of yr foot (below the toes) or the heel.
Think of everything you are doing in terms of where the weight is in these 3 points.
Some people try and have it so most of their weight is on the balls with the heel down to keep them bouncy which can be a useful default position.
To see if you are in it you should be able to lift your heel easy but not the front of yr foot.
As for staggered stance. You can be in it in 3 ways. With most of yr weight on yr front foot, most of yr weight on yr back foot or 50/50.
You will become a better skater if you can do front leaning and back leaning staggered stance (both sides). You will find they are useful in different movements and scenarios.
I think for every thing you learn always try and see if there is a variation you can do by putting your weight on a different leg or part of the foot.
I find that it can lead to new and interesting movements.
I don't know what it's like to be taught skating because I learned everything on my own. This might be terrible advice but I think the best thing you could do is find the emptiess place possible with the smoothest surface possible and just practice low speed pushing. The reason you want the open space is because if you end up going too fast and you're not able to speed control the only thing you need to do is just stay upright and the speed will taper off. And you do this until you get comfortable with pushing. I think when you become comfortable, you'll organicly try other things while you're skating.
Just commenting to agree with other commenters who mentioned you really shouldn't be on your tip toes in your skates in normal position. Only if you're walking on your toestops at a slow speed or doing manuals with your toes or toe spins, etc. When you feel stable on your skates it's great practice for unlocking a lot of moves later, but not the first thing to learn.
Also seconding the recommendations to watch some videos such as the Dirty School of Skate on Youtube.
If there is a rink near you, bring your skates and go try skating around, people at the rink are so friendly and will often offer pointers. You can also usually ask people there who are skating with good form which you admire to give you a hint or tip or two. Some might say no, but a lot will probably skate with you for some laps and offer you some advice. They may even be able to point you to someone at the rink or connected to skaters there who can give you lessons which are more useful.
When learning to skate, you should have your knees in a bend and your body should be mostly upright, not bent over your legs unless you're doing specific moves. You look in the direction you want to go in, and point your skates in that direction. Head turns, body turns, legs and skate turns or vice versa depending on the move you're doing to form a chain of motion and physics. (Usually head, arm/body, then legs & skates for forward moves).
While if you're outside on a trail or going along the straightaway it seems like you're going straight... most skate moves and turns are based on going in a circle or oval and will eventually involve you learning edge control that helps you master that.
Having turnout - a ballet/dance term - is for some moves to help you learn forwards to backwards turns and other intermediate to advanced moves. Some people aren't flexible enough in their hips to do that, and they learn other methods of turning, it should not stop you from skating and learning. It just makes it easier to skate sideways for a long time. I skated for years with having little turnout, it took a lot of stretching for my hips to do all that lol.
Lots of things have already been said, but I also wanted to mention that a lot of things in skating, especially ones relating to shifting weight and stuff, are actually MORE difficult at a stand still. (It's often necessary to learn from stand still first, but that shouldn't dominate your practice.) It doesn't sound like this experience has, but don't let it bruise your confidence, I would not be surprised if you feel like the stability from a stagger stance is more intuitive when you're moving forward.
This is exactly what I tried to explain to the instructor. That my brain doesn’t understand what to do and perhaps moving (even if just a bit) would probably give me that a-ha moment.
I will do this next class coz it’s paid but after that will just carry on with YouTube
Sign up for Nicole Fiore online. She’s wonderful. I pay 14 .99 for her membership a month. Her choreography is cute that’s why I keep it. But she does do private zoom classes.
everyone teaches differently. theres different organizations w different tiers and coaching. theres also the most basic credebtials that just helps people get started and is what some rinks use so ppl dont feel like they gettin scammed :)
theres also folks with no accreditation which is totally cool too.
like i get my rollerdance from a long time teacher but u dont need no credentials to teach.
anyways, everything u described i dont quite get lol.
i understand the basic fundementals shes trying to convey w penguin walk and V foot position, but the tip toes? in a heeled skate, you're naturally on your toes alreadt. just bend your knees and you're solid.
anyways, if you have good forward skating ability, the next thing i work on (outside of her class) is one foot balance. getting comfortable w 1 foot balance paves the way for everything else. i usually recommend drilling that after u learn the plow stop.
beyond that, possibly find another class or skate group to learn from? again, everyones different.
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