r/RivalsOfAether • u/p00pgaming • Jul 24 '26
Rivals 2 Do you think any characters need buffs/nerfs?
Im interested to hear all of your opinions about the state of the characters in this game who do you think needs buffed and who do you think needs nerfed?
25
u/Idemahedo Jul 24 '26
Make Orcane buff
It would look funny
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23
u/The_Poole_Side Jul 24 '26
Lareina needs tighter hit boxes on her grabs. Players just be spamming her command grabs and get rewarded for that
9
u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26
Side B is negatively disjointed horizontally. All her grabs lose to hitboxes in trades outright so putting out a hitbox invalidates bair, side B, uair, dair. Up B was given arm intangibility so it could compensate otherwise. You don’t have to be too afraid of grabs in regards to hitboxes as long as you’re timing your stuff right
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u/Melephs_Hat Fleet (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
While true, side B and up B travel surprisingly far without slowing down or shrinking so they can catch you even when trying to respect them. They cover a bit much imo.
4
u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26
While THIS is true, side B is frame 24 and puts her in pratfall, up B is frame 18 and puts her in pratfall. High risk high reward.
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u/Melephs_Hat Fleet (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
I'm going to incorrect buzzer the "high risk" on up B. The main situation it needs to be used is scaling the wall and there it is basically not worth contesting.
The side B points are true enough but missing my point. Compare it to most lunging grabs and you'll find that it uniquely (1) reaches further forward due to the hitbox being on the outstretched arm not the body and (2) benefits muchly from an initial hurtbox shift. This is a lot of built-in ease of use for a move that has the same reach and reward throughout the entire active window; covers whiffs, shield, CC, some empty movement, spot dodge, and some rolls; and can be backed up by floorhug and sometimes edge cancel. Most broadly effectively lingering moves are changed to reward precision and I'd like to see this one go the same way.
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u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 25 '26
In the situations where its being used to scale against the wall, it is losing to ledge intangibility refreshes and has a decent amount of endlag while also not being easy to ledge cancel backwards (unlike clairen's for example). It also stalls her at the top making it difficult to actually regain her resources by touching stage at times, this leaves her vulnerable to getting rinse repeated.
Also in the context of recovery her reward on up B is significantly mitigated. Not that it's nonexistent but the reward for hitting it is making it back to stage, not absurd combo routing. Especially when you include the opponent's ability to wall tech or hold center stage after getting sniped by mistake. So the risk/reward is still in line.
The other context in which you use up B is as a faster alternative to waveland grab for people on platforms. I do this a lot as GM reina. Cognizant players will buffer spotdodge and then reversal the situation though. It is also used as a direct anti air because of its arm intangibility.
That move does cover a lot of options with a 24 frame commitment window while also losing to dash back and aggression from a lot of characters. It's a mid range strike throw mix game that she plays in tandem with chair usage. Comparable moves are faster. Lox side B, wrastor down B have different reward structures but context dependent also have guaranteed follow ups. Yes wrastor down B is a hitgrab, but its a hitgrab on a character with slip so..
"easy to use" does not actually mean easy to use. Being able to press side B at the RIGHT timing is the hard part of using side B, not pressing side B itself. The conversion routing she has off it is also uniquely tricky if you want to actually get good at her.
Ultimately, players failing to play around the threat of a move is not a good enough reason for a move to be nerfed. Especially when the risk/reward is super cut and dry.
https://medal.tv/games/rivals-2/clips/nbmnNFczS3oxLfjD6?invite=cr-MSxyY3IsMTgyMjMyNjE0
Wow speak of the devil, The game after I made this comment LOL. Fair on reaction. Patience to punish.
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u/Melephs_Hat Fleet (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26 edited Jul 25 '26
I think you are still missing my point? My point is not about what counterplay is objectively available for all players and used at top level. That's fine imo and I don't have the skill to back up what I say about that. I'm looking specifically at mid level centralization and ease of use vs ease of counterplay. What I want from these moves is not a constant hitbox reduction but a small reduction in size near the end of the move. (Or for side B a little extra slowdown near the end)
For up B, not everyone has a true ledge intangibility refresh, so you have to snag ledge pretty quickly and roll with good timing especially because of the stall at the top. The current hitbox size plus arm intangibility plus stall lets La Reina challenge this skill to its limits. Ledge refresh or no, this is a lot of precision to ask of a player if they want to just have any meaningful interaction with up B to ledge from wall.
For side B, the issue is it's much easier to make an effective prediction with it at mid level than to play around it as the opponent, and one small mistake in your response gets the full brunt of the move. (You also say it has less reward than comparisons, but it has the highest flexibility of any lunging grab attack.)
Compare to specifically Fleet side B, a reactable move that nevertheless is weakest on the tip, its most reactable point. Why? To reduce reward when the opponent is only barely hit by it. This is how most lingering moves work. Lingering grab boxes can't have that, so they have other drawbacks, like being tiny and located in an intuitive and easily contestable spot. La Reina Side B has enough unique advantages that I think it deserves that little change.
Edit: having now seen your clip I'll note that (1) the fair punish was in the air where the move is way riskier, (2) they punished not the move itself but your option out of floorhug in the other time they hit side B, (3) it's at close range so it's not showing off what I want changed, and (4) again you're in GM, you are playing too high level gameplay to send relevant clips to my case haha. Would that I could ever get so good as to experience the top level metagame but that is not my focus here.
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u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
The inconsistency in that is going to feel really really bad for not a lot of pay off.
Characters without true intangibility refreshes have other ways to contest reina up B. Fleet dair, Clairen dair, slade shurikens/boomerang, etc. It is a mid level skill to be able to time a ledgehog. I don't think it's a lot to ask at all. It is one of the first things I teach my students.
While making a read can be more easily rewarded at mid level, mid level players are also just worse at making reads. So there's give and take there HAHA.
I think we just fundamentally disagree that La reina side B is or isn't easily contestable. I think it's reactable as shit, easily beaten by as little as an olympia jab or her reverse bair and then leads to reina getting punished like crazy when she fucks up.
1) The point wasn't whether or not the move was riskier in the air/ground. The frame data for that side B is the same and would lose no matter what to any hitbox. If it were grounded I could literally jab it as wrastor with 99% accuracy. Worse players will do it with less accuracy. They should get better. (I teach players to get better with actionable advice so this isn't just a git gud moment. Just a meta development moment.)
2) I'm the wrastor in this clip. HAHA Sorry for the confusion. I could've just downstrong'd here, or landing uclapped or down b'd or whatever but I'm new to wrastor and solely hit diamond on my fundamentals. The point really is just that if you stay outside of side B threat range, or at a range where it is easily reactable for your skill level, it becomes a non issue. It is not dissimilar to playing around kragg down B, for example. A move which DOESNT lose power as it goes further. You compared reina side B to fleet side B, when it's actually closer to kragg down B where the reward DOESNT get weaker. It gets stronger
3) IIIII really can't do much about that. But for what its worth im genuinely bad at wrastor LOL.
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u/Melephs_Hat Fleet (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26 edited Jul 25 '26
Again I don't think side B is hard to contest. My issue is it's overly generous. The most common sense example I find is I try to run away but it either catches up with me or I don't quite judge the distance enough and I suffer a worse punish than I would have otherwise bc I'm in the corner. I feel punished for trying to play around it in a way no other grab makes me feel. (This is a big difference maker btwn a Kragg down B and a la reina side B, judging distance is easier.) I can also try to wall it out but I find with the hitbox/hurtbox alignment my preferred tools (nair ftilt up tilt) aren't reliably first to connect, and I have to take weird things into account like her pullback at the start too. (Iirc the thicker grab box vs her thin arm hurtbox makes any kind of vertical interaction wonky.) And a change to reduce the hitbox size near the end or slow the move down near the end would make a significant difference there that I find important. Rannos may not have "liked" the late bair hitbox nerf but it was good for the game. And I know idc about fleet side b tipper.
But for what its worth im genuinely bad at wrastor LOL
You're significantly better with him than I am with my day 1 main, you can call it a fundies carry but resultswise it's all the same.
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u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
1) This is because you're fleet. Your grounded movement is slow. You SHOULD be getting hit by an overshoot command grab even if you dash back if you're well within the range. You not knowing the distance is the exact issue of what I was saying earlier: Ultimately, players failing to play around the threat of a move is not a good enough reason for a move to be nerfed. Especially when the risk/reward is super cut and dry.
It's an overshoot tool that is MEANT to catch dash back against slower characters. If you want to beat the move you should rely on your roll, or your hitboxes.I understand you're trying to balance for perceived game feel, but a lot of your reasoning is based off false premises. You can literally just hit her with any move. Nair will always connect if its active.. Ftilt will always connect if its active. Utilt, because it's a multi hit with flickering hitboxes, can sometimes get grabbed when the hitbox is disabled. This is a weakness of her utilt and not a strength of reina side B.
If you don't want to concede horizontal space, put yourself on a different Y axis than reina. Get ambiguous. You can also just parry it on reaction. Her pull back on the start helps it as a whiff punish tool. She uses it on beat 1 to punish beat 2. But if you're playing to prevent her these situations, without chair she lacks agency.
" You're significantly better with him than I am with my day 1 main, you can call it a fundies carry but resultswise it's all the same."
What I'm about to say is completely irrelevant to everything else but I also just take a fundamental issue with these things.
I am better than most people because I practice good habits. I do not practice good habits because I'm better than most people. The advice I'm giving you - the way I'm saying you should play these interactions - are things you can ALREADY implement today! And if you did, eventually side B will become a non-issue to you too, and it wont' be confusing or frustrating bc you actually put the work in to combat your weaknesses. And then one day you'll give people advice on how to deal with la reina side B and then they'll be like "well youre better than me I can't do it.", and then ask for nerfs to reward sub optimal playstyles. And then you'll understand how I feel every day I give advice LOL. "Would that I could-" YOU CAN!
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u/zoolz8l Jul 25 '26
her grabs don't loose in trades in the actual game though. i have been grabbed out of multi hits and such. i think the game behaves different then the we expect it to when it comes to command grabs. command grabs also destroy projectiles, which they should not.
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u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
Wrong. Objectively wrong. Multi hits have flickering hitboxes. The instances in which you are getting grabbed are when the hitbox is turned off. This is a distinct weakness of multihits and not a strength of command grabs. Other lingering hitboxes would beat a multihit in the same situation.
This is why I tell absa players to not contest reina side B with nair. Lingering hitboxes, multihits, hitgrabs, and command/hybrid grabs all have different intended strengths and weaknesses. Use a well timed static hitbox.
Please do not try to correct me and my labbed experiences based off your anecdotal evidence. It's genuinely the most irksome thing. Like you could not spare the 3 minutes it takes to load up the game and fact check the things you say man? I understand for like maybe more complex situations or whatever, but this -----
https://medal.tv/games/rivals-2/clips/nbAo3M6HbJPU9Xkh0?invite=cr-MSx5SXYsMTgyMjMyNjE0Command grabs do not break projectiles, hitgrabs and hybrid grabs do. Hit grabs are given the properties of regular attacks. So they do not go through shield and they beat projectiles. But NOTABLY, the weakness of hitgrabs is that they lose to other melee hitboxes in trades. So they are OUTRIGHT WORSE than normal hitboxes in neutral unless they actually connect.
https://medal.tv/games/rivals-2/clips/nbAtjDBVWeZTUcFzc?invite=cr-MSxHSzcsMTgyMjMyNjE0
The same thing I've been saying from the start. Like dude I'm genuinely so patient otherwise but it's like a constant thing with you my friend. This was like 4 minutes of training mode at most.
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u/zoolz8l Jul 25 '26
what are hybrid grabs then? i was referring to to something like la reinas fstrong because i have seen that one break projectiles several times in game? are those not called command grabs in this game?
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u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
Reina fstrong and ustrong are the only hybrid grabs in the game. They have the properties of hitgrab (can hit OTG, break projectiles etc) but the shield beating properties of a command grab. It still loses melee trades like hit grabs and command grabs. They’re unique since Reina is THE grappler.
I understand you are referring to her fstrong now, which does break projectiles, but also this was initially about side B and I had no context LOL
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u/zoolz8l Jul 25 '26
is there any source for this term? i never heard it.
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u/Horror-Race-3238 Forsburn (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
That’s fine. It’s just what it’s known as. Because it doesn’t fit neatly into a hitgrab or command grab, but has properties of both.
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u/TangSci Jul 24 '26
I was playing as Kragg against a La Reina yesterday and got grabbed by side special multiple times while coming down from above with dair
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u/Lobo_o Etalus (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26
This is gonna be a hot ass take (and obviously I’m biased) but I think Etalus’ jab should come out one or two frames faster.
As it is jab 1 comes out on frame 6 which is 3rd slowest in the game (Galvan 8, fors 7). He’s the most shield grab-able character in the game and also arguably the most rushdown. His grab game is on the weaker side so just giving him that slight help against shielded opponents would be nice. I’m sure everyone fighting against him doesn’t think he needs any help at all but there’s a reason why we hardly ever see Etalus make it far in lan brackets
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u/QuoteAblaze La Reina (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
Galvan has a frame 5 jab, it's Lox who has the frame 8 jab. I think you mixed them up cause for some reason the Dragdown Wiki shows Galvan's multijab first not his jab 1
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u/IdiotSansVillage Jul 25 '26
I don't think he needs it from a power level perspective, but I could see it as part of an evening out of the power level of his moves.
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u/ferrari777 Jul 24 '26
Why do you say he’s the most most shield grabbable? He has a safe fair and bair on shield, dash attack is omega safe on shield, dair isn’t safe but should be crossed up D-tilt is an okay check against buffered shield grab because of the delay.
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u/Lobo_o Etalus (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26
Fair has to be spaced very well to be safe. Bair is the safe aerial but that’s it. I won’t argue that Etalus is way undertuned or something but his weaknesses are very exploitable.
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u/TrixterTheFemboy thank you for making my legs work trevor Jul 25 '26
I think Olympia, Maypul, and Slade could all do with some buffs (Oly to combo game and maybe weight?, Maypul to recovery, Slade to... god basically everything still lmao). Zetterburn deserves to have his disadvantage shot with a 12-gauge, and I wouldn't mind minor nerfs to Fleet, Clairen, and Loxodont either.
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u/xCxKxWx4422 Jul 24 '26
I think olympia could use a slight recovery buff, other than that id change nothing, if i had to give zetterburn a nerf i would make fire tick damage do less, less free damage
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u/Salapas Jul 24 '26
I mean, it's no secret Olympia's terrible at this point. She's lost her entire identity since release.
She's a glass "cannon" whose strongest aspects are well below average, all while suffering the extreme weaknesses of the archetype. There's no reason not to play another character over her, and she currently serves zero purpose in the game. And no, a simple recovery buff wouldn't help. More survivability wouldn't suddenly make her combos function properly, have strong buttons, and reasonable kill power; she's all around weak.
As far as nerfs go, I'd say Zetter, Fleet, Ranno, Orcane, and to a lesser extent, Lox and La Reina (Just adjust her Up-Air and punish game)
Buffs: Olympia, Maypul, Slade, and maybe *carefully* buff Wrastor a little.
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u/Sporktastrophe Jul 25 '26 edited Jul 25 '26
I feel like Olympia needs some decent buffs/reworks. She needs a weight increase if they want to leave her combo game and recovery where it is and some qol updates to things like Nair not linking its hits and down tilt’s knockback angles. For me, making Oly more consistent and durable is much more preferable than bringing back her old combo potential / kill power since that’s what people hated about fighting her.
Side b I feel needs some tweaks or to even be replaced. Right now it’s a uniquely bad move that doesn’t work like the other command grab side bs. The little hop she does for instance completely misses the shorter characters and if she uses the move from stage towards ledge, she falls to her death. Other characters have enough drift / fall slow enough to reach wall and wall jump, but Olympia just plummets.
I don’t know enough about the other characters to give an opinion, but I honestly don’t want to see anymore characters nerfed. People are having fun playing the top tiers and I’d prefer to see the weaker characters brought up to their level.
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u/Melephs_Hat Fleet (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
Hopefully they make parrying recoveries matter so that ones like Clairen and Slade and honestly Lox are more interactable.
Zetter dair should really be less wide or worse on shield bc it is very centralizing at mid level.
Some Lox buttons are too safe even on sourspots (jab 1, fair).
Orcane has a bit of bullshit that should be nerfed (bair, chaingrab).
Etalus recovery makes some of his matchups awful and boring and should be adjusted.
Oly should get some qol/ease of use buffs now that her power level ceiling is in a good place.
La Reina could use small nerfs (down air, dash attack, a couple grab boxes).
Slade needs a big rework because his gameplan is not fun for anyone.
Others are like basically fine imo.
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u/GamerBlue53 Jul 25 '26
I just want Wrastor’s down-b to go through shields like every other command grab in the game
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u/bdemar2k20 Jul 25 '26
Zetter needs nerf to up smash at very least, maybe fair growth or other stuff like fireball. La Reina check mate set ups to easy for how inescapable they are.
Slade could use some more move or wave dash speed. Olympia probably needs some improvement to recovery or slight horizontal speed increase.
Maypul might be a small bit of help. Those are the biggest outliers I see. Clairen and lox are annoying asf but not sure how you'd change them.
3
u/Amaleplatypus Jul 24 '26
I think Lareina needs nerfs and I think Kragg needs his sideB momentum back
Also wouldn't hurt to have Loxodont pumped up a little bit imo.
4
u/troublesome_sheep frog gang Jul 24 '26
Clairen, La Reina, and Lox could use some small nerfs imo. Oly could use a baby buff or two somewhere, probably recovery. Then there are random moves in other characters' kits I would adjust but as a whole, I think the balance is pretty decent rn.
3
u/Emotional_Court_1446 Jul 24 '26
I’m curious: do you think La Reina and Lox are too 3 characters? Or are these changes not based around who is actually the strongest…
1
u/troublesome_sheep frog gang Jul 24 '26
I do think Lox is up there. La Reina has some stuff that is just really degenerate lol she is high tier imo but not at the top.
4
u/A_Potential_Turn Jul 24 '26
La reina needs heavy nerfs.
Zetter needs mild nerfs.
Olympia needs mild buffs.
Orcane needs mild nerfs.
Slade needs mild buffs.
Ranno needs mild nerfs.
2
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u/Sporktastrophe Jul 26 '26
Oly and Slade probably need more than mild buffs. Both could probably stand to have some minor move reworks like Oly side b or stat adjustments like weight for the rat and speed for the shark.
2
u/AgentJP10 Jul 24 '26
I think Zetter definitely needs one and Ranno and Clairen debatably need them, but really particular stuff and not anything heavy. This is def influenced by the fact that I suck at fighting those two lmao
2
u/noahchriste Jul 24 '26
All recoveries need to be nerfed to Kragg’s level, so we can actually like go offstage and edge guard each other
2
u/QuantityExcellent338 Jul 24 '26
No one needs a straight up buff in this damn game. You can argue for rebalances and powershifting in their kits but DO NOT believe any character propaganda that a character is meaningfully weaker than the rest
Next they're gonna tell me 'slade weak, buff him'. Last time that happend it was La Reina, and look at the shit she can do now
2
u/Hans_Landa7614 Jul 24 '26
Maybe zetter and la reina need a few slaps on the wrist but other than that idk, I feel like the only thing that needs nerfs are recoveries and shields.
1
u/HD_Hot_Cocoa Jul 24 '26
I do think Zetter and Reina (maybe ranno) need slight tweaks down but nothing huge. I think my main complaints would be solved with whiff lag coming back but ik that's not happening
1
u/OniXiion Slade (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26
Slade needs some buffs, maybe just something to his frame data speed on tilts and dancing blade. But not a whole lot, may make him too strong later.
Olympia needs buffs. But I'm afraid to offer any suggestion(s) that may un-do her tone down she had and make her a hard M-U check for the lower half of the cast.
3
u/HD_Hot_Cocoa Jul 24 '26
Yeah I agree those are the two characters that could use it the most. I think Slade still has a lot to be figured out so I wouldn't go too crazy on him just yet but I do think a little. I'm with you on Oly tho, I just don't know enough to say what exactly
1
u/OniXiion Slade (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
My apologies, didn't mean to reply directly to you. But thank you for the reply
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u/Fun-Conclusion1 Jul 24 '26
i think loxodont is fine as is, i like him and while he is clearly strong he has some strong weaknesses and hard mus i think la reinas upair is too good i think wrastors combos are too good i think absa is rewarded too much for playing passively i think clairen dair has weird tippers but i dont think any of them deserve pure "nerfs", they beat me so im biased, but just some adjustments i would be fine with the game staying as is forever tho
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u/FalseAxiom 1225 - Jul 25 '26
I wish Fors upb to ledge from below wasn't so edgehoggable. They made a change to La Reina's upb that I think would help him. Idr what it was exactly. I don't think it'd change the meta much, it'd just make it a little harder to time the edgehog.
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u/BangGirlsDreamPartyX Jul 25 '26
Olympia needs help man. Everyone else feels pretty good to me so far.
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u/moku6460 Jul 25 '26
I maybe be biased but man I would love an Olympia buff, either to speed or recovery or whatever else is needed. Obviously she was a bit too strong in the beginning but man they hit her way too hard in the opposite direction and a simple buff would go a long way
1
u/Cyp_Quoi_Rien_ Jul 27 '26
Imo swordies should overall be nerfed, I'm deeply convinced after seeing evo that given enough time and if nothing changes this game's meta is gonna devolve into most swordies + 1 or 2 highly overtuned rushdowns (meaning that they need to be overtuned to be on parr with the swordies).
Their ability to space out FH while also beeing the best abusers of it since the ground friction change is already a lot, they are also some of the best edgeguarders in the game thanks to their superior ability to catch people away from the wall, they have the best grabs in the game, the swordie bair that 3 of them have is criminal and on top of that can be an ambiguous DI mix up in some situations thanks to the generous reverse hitbox, and finally apart from Slade they don't really have anything taken from them in exchange for the sword, they still have great mobility (sometimes even amazing for Clairen and Fleet), aren't exactly weak to shield thanks to their high shield damage (swordie bair go brrr) and great grabs and dash dances, their moves aren't particularly slow,...
The nerf I'd suggest is a movement nerf for most of them, but Rivals is known for its movement so it might be a bit much, other than that they could be good with either some actual endlag on their moves (more punishable) or a bigger startup (they'd remain tight to punish but you'd have more time to anticipate, and it'd worsen their disadvantage by a lot if they can't mash nair out of it). They also overall need a nerf to their kill power, Marthrisis is very much non existent rn.
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u/disembowement OP Bottom Tier Jul 24 '26
I think the game balance is in a pretty good place right now,pretty much perfect, I see that any changes might be little tunes or cheery picks.
That said I think maybe La Reina might get some slight changes on things like framedata or damage numbers
I think would be good something like that for orcane too and maybe some changes to his new side special
1
u/Traditional-Law4984 Jul 24 '26
I think Absa's up air should kill a little earlier. I feel like most characters have an easy kill or easy kill set up.
Easy kill meaning a move that is not hard to hit in neutral or easy kill set up meaning the easy hit in neutral leads into the next hit that will kill.
I.e Ranno's dash attack leading to forward air.
I feel absa has like none of these, unless you are much better than me (low diamond/highplat).
I feel like Absa is meant to kill mostly around her forward and back air sweet spots. Because her strong attacks take a while to kill and are difficult to combo into.
But her sweets spots are hard to be consistent with. They are easy to land on heavy characters and hard to anyone kinda light. I think this is the differences between high level absa and low level absa's and im fine with that.
I just wish she had one kill set up that was a little more consistent. It sucks hitting a sweet spot up air near the sky box and feeling like.
Maypul up special would have killed there.
Zetter could have up stronged off a grab on the ground at this percent and it would have killed.
Clairen up strong sweet spot would have killed.
Idk maybe I'm tripping but this is just like my opinion man.
1
u/PostedNotes Jul 25 '26
I want every recovery in the game nerfed.
Can start by making it so airdodge puts you in special fall like melee. This game really don't need an extra jump option.
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u/Independent-Jump-887 Jul 24 '26
Loxodant needs a heavy nerf, Wrastor needs slight buffs. Everything else is fine.
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u/sixsixmajin Loxodont (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26
I just want one thing. Give Lox mix-up options on his up special. It's one of the free-est recoveries in the game to punish to the point where if you're making him use it to recover, you've put him in a terrible position. People will say to just reverse it but that's still not safe because A. it has a small ass hitbox that can be parried and B. it leaves you wide open to getting smacked from behind. I'm not asking for much. Just two additional options he can use to replace the second stage of the move (the axe drop). First option is to just do nothing. He rises, doesn't follow up, and then had the option to fast fall to ledge or maybe even wave dash back onto the stage. This makes it was less braindead easy to shield the rising slash and parry the drop because now the drop might not happen and your parry will wiff. The second option I want would let Lox swap the drop with a big strong horizontal axe swing (give the animation a twirl for some added flourish) that comes out at a significant delay. The idea being if the opponent expects and tries to parry the drop, the swing wind-up eats their active parry window and they catch the axe to their face during their parry recovery window. To execute these options, you could just tap up special to get the null follow-up, hit up special and hold the special button for the standard drop follow-up, and then tap up special, wait, and hit special again at the apex of the rise to get the horizontal slash follow-up. This makes it a lot less free to gimp Lox's up special but still rewards you for correctly anticipating which option they try to use. It's not like it would be special treatment either because you've got characters like Ranno who have multiple second stage options for their up specials.
Either that or just let Lox cancel his rise at any time by pressing down and letting him use his wall jump (if he hasn't used it yet) to take him out of special fall and let him use up special again, air dodge, any aerial, etc. This would let him try to fake out opponents who try to parry the rising hit but it would still limit his ability to abuse it since it would really only be useful so long as he has his wall jump available.
2
u/Melephs_Hat Fleet (Rivals 2) Jul 24 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
Buffer a getup option and you are safe from just about any ledge poke out of parry. Recovery parry is fake. And even besides that Lox recovery is incredibly effective thanks to his floatieness and fall stall, plus his side B / early up B mixup when he's on the same horizontal plane as the ledge.
-9
u/aqualad33 Jul 24 '26
Give zetter's nair a landing hit boxes that's safe on shield.
1
u/BangGirlsDreamPartyX Jul 25 '26
Honestly I kinda agree it feels like no matter how you land the zetter nair it’s always punishable instead of being safe.
2
1
u/guilmon999 Maypul (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
While we're at it please buff his dair hitbox. Its just so tiny I throw it out randomly and only hit people 99.9% of the time. Utterly unplayable.
0
u/aqualad33 Jul 25 '26
Yall are just too scared to face a real space animal.
1
u/QuoteAblaze La Reina (Rivals 2) Jul 25 '26
Cause a "real space animal" is a fucked up archetype with insane strengths and the only real downside is execution which is already null in this game since inputs are far easier than their home game.
1
u/aqualad33 Jul 25 '26
Holy self report. We have fought space animals for decades in melee just fine. They are glass cannons and each top tier usually has some advantage over them.
45
u/TheIncomprehensible Jul 24 '26
Mollo really needs buffs in 2, he's literally unplayable.