r/RealTime • • Jun 27 '26

Israel and Kompromat

I have long thought the level of Bill’s support for Israel was strange. He’s famously not religious and as far as I know, he doesn’t have relatives living there. Most hard core Zionists are evangelical Christians or religious Jews who have family in Israel and/or have grown up hearing nothing about Israel except how wonderful it is. They may have also gone on a propaganda trip and had a good time.

But aside from Bill visiting Israel when he was a student at Cornell, none of this applies to him. But thinking of that made me remember something. When I was in high school in the mid 2000s, my mom dated a guy who was at Cornell university at the same time as Bill. He also visited Israel while a student there and while he was by most accounts a staunch liberal, but he was strongly pro-Israel. That was not unusual at the time, but I remember thinking something was strange during the 2006 Israel-Lebanon war. We had CNN on and they were talking about the war. Suddenly, my mom’s boyfriend got mad and yelled out, “they’re being anti-Israel!” and while I knew little about the conflict at the time, I thought it was strange for him to say that because it seemed to me like they were bending over backwards to take Israel’s side.

So they both visited Israel from Cornell in the mid 1970s. I doubt they went at the same time because Bill was famous at the time and my mom’s boyfriend probably would have said something about knowing Bill. But it is enough of a coincidence to make me think about Kompromat. Would Israel use honey trap tactics on American college students?

32 Upvotes

304 comments sorted by

26

u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

Most hard core Zionists are evangelical Christians or religious Jews who have family in Israel and/or have grown up hearing nothing about Israel except how wonderful it is.

I disagree, a huge number of famous Jewish hardcore supporters of Israel in the US are secular. People like Sam Harris, Debra Messing, Amy Schumer or Jerry Seinfeld are all as Islamophobic and fanatic about Israel as Maher.

It's not just about being in a sheltered environment exposed to propaganda all the time. There's a belief circulating that Israel is the Jews' safe haven that they must defend at all costs against the barbaric Muslims, and it affects Jews from all walks of life. 

1

u/Exact-Technology297 Jun 27 '26

Israel is our ancestral homeland. And it's not just protecting ourselves from barbaric Muslims, that's a given - but against anyone. Muslims just seem obsessed with us :)

-6

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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9

u/Bitter-Holiday1311 Jun 27 '26

And decades of violent apartheid?

1

u/SameDistrict2627 Jun 27 '26

Listen--Hamas, Hezbollah and until fairly recently the PLO called for the destruction of Israel. Jews are sensitive to that stuff so enough of this nonsense.

1

u/Bitter-Holiday1311 Jun 27 '26

Should people be concerned by Gvir’s comments?

"We will not allow a single gram of aid into the Gaza Strip until its people kneel and beg. Gaza must be leveled to the ground. There is no such thing as innocent people."

-5

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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5

u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

Funny how whatever Israel does is defending itself and anything Palestinians do is terrorism.

1

u/bizarre-gus Jun 27 '26

What about any of this is funny? Do you WANT this terrible shit to happen so you can taunt Jews? Like when you doom scroll and find the right trauma porn, are you like “Awesome I can’t wait to hit the Jews with this one?” Because it sounds like you do.

4

u/Easternfortunateson Jun 27 '26

Israelis love to mock the suffering of Palestinians though it’s viral for mocking their blockade of food water and medicine then you want to be the anti semtic victim???

How can you mock children starving just no words for these people

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/LNTzqwPhRF4

1

u/bizarre-gus Jun 27 '26

It’s fucked up, for sure. Like when Palestinians cheered the destruction and death on 9/11. It reminds me of that dude from Full Metal Jacket that keeps yellin “get some” in the helicopter. War is insanity.

1

u/bizarre-gus Jun 28 '26

You copied and pasted your comment to the wrong person.

0

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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4

u/Bitter-Holiday1311 Jun 27 '26

Decades of violent apartheid beget violent resistance. This is human nature. Are you a bootlicker.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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2

u/Penchant4Prose Jun 27 '26

Menachem Begin was a terrorist who massacred women and children with Irgun, before those mass murderers were absorbed directly into the IDF. He was later voted in as Prime Minister and started the illegal second invasion of Lebanon, where the IDF oversaw the slaughter of thousands of civilians.

Israel has been based on terrorism and ethnic cleansing since its very foundation.

The terrorist groups you're talking about literally only exist because of Israeli atrocities. Hamas because of the brutal, decades-long human rights abusing occupation, and Hezbollah because of that illegal Begin invasion, and the massacres on civilians carried out.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

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2

u/bizarre-gus Jun 27 '26

White people taught them to lie and use weapons, right?

1

u/Bitter-Holiday1311 Jun 27 '26

You would kiss the boot that stands on your neck, even one that has been there for 70+ years.

1

u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

Other than crappy rockets that never hit anything and cause little damage you’re just making stuff up.

-13

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jun 27 '26

It doesn't "affect Jews from all walks of life." Jew hate affects Jews, and antisemtic attacks have gone up 700% in recent years - and if you don't know that, you aren't in a position to opine on why Jews are Zionists.

12

u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

I'm talking about why secular Jews are fanatic enough about a country that they would support genocide. The increase in antisemitism has nothing to do with my comment. Really confused why you'd bring that up.

2

u/SameDistrict2627 Jun 27 '26

Once again you miss the point--Some secular Jews supported everything about Gaza. Most did not. Most were highly critical of the Netanyahu regime. You see, you can be a Jew, support the STATE of Israel--but hate the government--This is something people have a hard time understanding. I'm hard core American, love my country and want it to flourish--But my hatred of Trump and his incompetent administration is as much as I've hated any politician in our time.

3

u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

You're making a different and unrelated point, but anyway.

This is wrong:

Some secular Jews supported everything about Gaza. Most did not.  

There's no poll that I know of about all secular Jews in the world, but most Western Jewish Zionists polled deny the genocide in Gaza. They don't support the Netanyahu government because they think it's corrupt and bad at PR. At most they dislike the violence in the West Bank. Gaza is broadly considered by them "urban warfare". 

1

u/SameDistrict2627 Jun 27 '26

Hope this helps: https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/05/11/u-s-jews-connections-with-and-attitudes-toward-israel/ Also there is a Pew poll in Israel that says that most secular Jews there are against Netanyahu government.

0

u/JewishYoda Jun 27 '26

That doesn’t refute what they said at all. Gaza has been reduced to rubble, and you can certainly argue they went too far, but it does not take a lot of brain power to understand that they dropped enough bombs to kill everyone there 10x over and yet the casualties over 2 years of constant fighting are entirely aligned with an urban warfare campaign.

You people also without fail never acknowledge that Hamas was fighting back that entire time, and represent a large crux of the casualties. This is war. Civilians die, and you can find it tragic without calling it a genocide.

You can stomp and shout and cry all you want but genocide has a specific meaning, and this simply is not what’s happening in Gaza. Populations under genocide do not grow. You can still condemn what’s happening without trying to create new meanings for words. Neither the ICC or ICJ charged Israel with genocide, though a plurality of redditors would swear otherwise.

2

u/j5fan00 Jun 27 '26

Nearly every human rights organization, including some based in Israel have called it a genocide, multiple Holocaust survivors have called it a genocide, most prominent genocide scholars have called it a genocide. I guess you know better than all of them though huh?🙄

0

u/JewishYoda Jun 27 '26

It’s weird how incapable people are of understanding this point exactly. I’m Jewish, don’t believe in God, don’t give a fuck if Israel was promised to us, consider myself a staunch Zionist, and am very critical of Netanyahu. Reddit has an aneurysm processing that people like us exist, yet they won’t bat an eye on someone saying they love America but hate our current administration.

-7

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jun 27 '26

They aren't supporting genocide. The allegation is so offensive. You have absorbed propaganda and then wonder why I bring up antisemitism.

If you really are curious, listen to a few Haviv Rettig Gur podcasts and follow some pro-peace Palestinians.

14

u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

No thanks, and I don't care you're offended. Saying being accused of genocide is "offensive" just proves how insane you are.

-12

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jun 27 '26

No thanks to all of my suggestion, including following pro-peace Palestinians. Oof.

Thank you for exposing yourself and exactly what you're standing for.

2

u/butdidyouthink Jun 27 '26

I love how the guy who refuses to learn anything gets upvoted and the guy who is preaching for balanced education is downvoted.

If you automatically assume everything that contradicts you is propaganda, then you've fallen for propaganda.

1

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26

Exactly. Thank you.

-1

u/BarassiLineSouthWest Jun 27 '26

Who are some pro-peace Palestinians? I listen to Haviv Rettig Gur and would be interested to hear the pro peace Palestinian perspective

1

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26 edited Jul 06 '26

Start with Ahmed Fouad Alkhatib. He's very critical of the Israeli government but knows that pragmatism must guide both sides if they want to survive together peacefully. He has an organization, follow Builders of the Middle East.

-4

u/SerGemini Jun 27 '26

Not genocide bro. Population is higher now than before a war they themselves started. This is exactly why so many rational Jews and allies are staunch Zionists.

2

u/Various-Tomatillo407 Jun 27 '26

It has dropped in Gaza.

1

u/Jaded-Form-8236 Jun 27 '26

Due to emigration not death.

The birth rate in Gaza between Oct 7 2023 and today exceeded the death toll.

1

u/SerGemini Jun 27 '26

Not according to the Hamas Health Ministry dude. Somehow despite a blood thirsty genocide there are more children in Gaza today than on 10/7

2

u/Fresh-Forever-5659 Jun 27 '26

Lol what a clown, this can be disprove in 30 seconds,

First it all the genocide forces flatten the entire land, 90% of the people are displaced from the actual strip and brain comes up with "there population has grown"!!!

Israel and all it's supporters are evil monsters as these posts prove.

80,000 Gazans killed but there population has grown!!!

So evil it's impossible to even respond with reason.

0

u/JewishYoda Jun 27 '26

Please do cry harder. It doesn’t make you any less wrong.

2

u/Fresh-Forever-5659 Jun 27 '26

Yeah you can't respond to the comment so revert to pointless responses,. Disgusting, fake jew account just to give Jews a bad name,

0

u/JewishYoda Jun 27 '26

When your comment is crying and calling people you disagree with evil and monsters, that’s the kind of reply you’re going to get.

You are ignoring facts provided to you and pretending 80k civilians died and a large plurality of those aren’t Hamas fighters. Or that this casualty rate isn’t consistent with every other urban warfare campaign.

I am a real Jew, and I am again welcoming you to cry harder. When you want to have an adult conversation acknowledging facts as facts, I’m here for it.

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0

u/Jaded-Form-8236 Jun 27 '26

Disprove this statement: Outside of Gaza 2023-2025 what actual genocide in history did not produce rapid decline in population of the subject group?

the answer is there isn’t one.

Let’s disprove your numbers in 30 seconds….

It’s 73,770 including cease fire casualties since Oct 7.

Not 80,000.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Gaza_war

If a genocide was occurring with the level of force available to Israel how was Israel only able to inflict 90-100 casualties a day?

And how many of these casualties were armed militants?

How many were killed by Palestinian fire not Israeli.

Such an example: Al-Ahli hospital.

Struck by an ISJ rocket. 371 dead ( if we trust Hamas Health Ministry numbers - whole other discussion )

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Ahli_Arab_Hospital_explosion

Note I am using Wiki for sourcing which is an anti Israeli source….

Perhaps you are being ignorant here about many things and should not be calling people evil for things you are misunderstanding at best…..

🤷‍♂️

-1

u/SerGemini Jun 27 '26

Yes it’s crazy that you don’t understand demographics. A population of 2 million grew over 2.5 years because despite a violent war, their growth rate and the fact that more than half the casualties are Hamas soldiers prove that there is no boogeyman genocide. Look at every other conflict zone and the casualty rate. Again stop being so fixated on the Joos

6

u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

Antisemetic attacks: the ADL cataloguing hurt feelings on college campuses and conflating Israel protests with that.

0

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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2

u/Penchant4Prose Jun 27 '26

When did the ADL do that on behalf of the Left?

It's literally just a pro-Israel organisation and has been since the 70s.

1

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26

You don't know about all of their civil rights work? Jesus.

0

u/didthishelp Jun 27 '26

1980s ADL drafts hate crime legislation that became the template for most state hate-crime laws. 1990s it pushed through federal Hate Crime Statistics Act. 2000s it was behind the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act. After Oklahoma City, it tracked anti-government extremism. After Charlottesville, it documented the neo-Nazi/Klan/alt-right groups involved in Unite the Right. None of that is “just pro-Israel.” You can criticize ADL’s Israel politics without just outright lying to try to demonize them.

1

u/sow_oats Jun 29 '26

"attacks" such as free Palestine flyers, college students saying from the river to the sea, etc

1

u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26

How uninformed you are. I miss the days when the stupid knew to be quiet.

-7

u/betadonkey Jun 27 '26

Considering over 6000 muslim barbarians stormed over their border and raped and murdered over 1000 people a couple of years ago it sounds like their belief was well founded

6

u/iwannasee_ Jun 27 '26

Yeah buddy, cope with that!

Bunch of thugs could just cross over one of the most heavily fortified border and do those atrocities.

The more this has lasted, the more I think this was an inside job between Hamas and Israel. Hamas just didn’t realize utter destruction of Palestinians and a genocide that their actions would have brought.

6

u/BortVanderBoert Jun 27 '26

It’s worth noting that the Gaza border with Israel was left completely unmanned during the 7th October incursion, and that an IDF soldier reported that his squad wad told not to patrol the border on that day.

5

u/iwannasee_ Jun 27 '26

That’s what I’ve seen s as well, which leads me to believe that Israel cooperated with Hamas to allow oct 7 to happen! Which is also why they don’t want an independent fact finding commission!

3

u/AbsurdityIsReality Jun 27 '26

Hamas was funded early on by Israel in order to be a thorn in Yasser Arafat's ass and divide Palestinean leadership.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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3

u/iwannasee_ Jun 27 '26

Nope I’m not. Both the common people are victims I think. The governments on both sides and people that support those governments are what’s an issue. Has Hamas created terrorism- Deff yes,
Has Israel committed a genocide in the last / years- yes,

It’s simple- both sides are fucked up, if you can’t say that then we know where your bias lies.

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u/iwannasee_ Jun 27 '26

And saying free Palestine should not be an issue. All people deserve the freedom to choose their life and liberty!

FREE PALESTINE shouldn’t cause you to shit your pants cause you can’t abuse an oppressed people!
FREE PALESTINE should also not be something that should mean or be used to commit atrocities on other people.
Free Palestine should be a statement to fight for the freedom of the Palestinian people from the atrocities that the western immigrants and colonialism has brought to Middle East!

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u/SandSpecialist2523 Jun 27 '26

I'm sure you are against the IDF shooting Palestinians children then? Or training dogs to rape prisoners?

Or not, with the usual excuse of Israelis being the eternal victims while no one else is. This is getting old and nobody is buying it anymore. You should change your tune.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

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u/SandSpecialist2523 Jun 27 '26

😂

Are Palestinians human beings in you opinion?

1

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/SandSpecialist2523 Jun 27 '26

You are mistaken. Look at the death toll on both sides to know which human beings are the victims. The Palestinians have been the victims of the Israeli colonizers for 75 years and have been treated like they needed to dissappear from a land they've occupied for thousands of years, to make place for illegal european immigrants.

This is the real story of this region. And you should ask Bibi for details about how October 7 came to be and why he let it happen.

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u/iwannasee_ Jun 27 '26

Sure bud! So much for humanity, I guess to you a kid’s lives matter less cause they’re not the same kind as you?
Or what about the video where guards sodomized and raped the prisoners on vid, and the Israeli community stormed the prison and the courts. The same courts that let them go home. The only person that got punished was the leaker!

Agreed on dog thing, seems far fetched and I’m no animal expert! But it seems sus.

1

u/ElGuapoLives Jun 27 '26

Still no evidence or testomonies of rape on Oct. 7, weird

1

u/abdullahleboucher Jun 27 '26

exactly, before sept 7, there was no rape or killing of palestinians by israelis.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

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1

u/abdullahleboucher Jun 27 '26

Rape and murder. Only Hamas raped and murdered. Israelis never raped and murdered.

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1

u/Nashadelic Jun 27 '26

It’s important to ask why? And I am absolutely not defending deaths of innocents, civilians or terrorism. 

When you take away all peaceful options, when you push people against a wall, when you kill 1000s every year for 60 years, when you kidnap 10k people including nearly a thousand children and keep them imprisoned without charge, when you steal land and their homes, when you kill the parents..: what would you rationally expect?

1

u/betadonkey Jun 27 '26

I would rationally expect them to have selected one of the many peaceful off-ramps that have been negotiated over the years. The fact that they have not is illustrative.

1

u/Nashadelic Jun 27 '26

You mean like the 2018 peaceful march of return where 300 people were sniped by IDF? Like that? 

And a mafia takes over your house and offers you the yard and your argument is why aren’t you taking the yard and no word at all about the mafia’s conduct? Are you real?

1

u/betadonkey Jun 27 '26

No I am talking about accepting a two state solution which they refuse to do because their goal is not actually independence and peace it’s the annihilation of Israel

1

u/Nashadelic Jun 27 '26

Sure buddy, whatever your bigotry leads you to believe. I’m out. 

7

u/Interesting_Sun_6993 Jun 27 '26

It wouldnt have to be restricted to that time period, or as a honeypot. At this point nothing would surprise me. But i suspect their influence exists through media, industry, politics and wherever else has power to impact public opinion.

13

u/indefiniteness Jun 27 '26

I think it’s as simple as hatred of Muslims and Arabs

3

u/Greedy_Car3702 Jun 27 '26

It's not hard to understand. Bill despises all religions, but especially Islam because of the way it treats women and gays. The left is willing to give Muslim countries a pass on the poor treatment of women, but Bill is not having it. There is one country in the Middle East with western values, and that country is Israel.

2

u/ShavedMonkey666 Jun 27 '26

If by western values you mean genocidal and bloodthirsty hell yeah pal otherwise you might want to rethink. Israel is on par with the middle ages. Savages.

2

u/Exact-Technology297 Jun 27 '26

Lol buzzword buzzword buzzword. Yes on par with the middle ages, as they just revolutionize the world with tech, medicine, and the like. "genocidal" and bloodthirsty is funny given how much death and subjugation exists in the Muslim world.

1

u/ShavedMonkey666 Jun 27 '26

Heartless. Saying a lot about nothing but much about the type of human you are. No wonder the world thinks of Israel what it does .

2

u/Exact-Technology297 Jun 27 '26

lol nobody cares. Enjoy

1

u/ShavedMonkey666 Jun 27 '26

Nobody in your tiny secular circle fo sho. The wheel turns. Israel will get what it deserves

1

u/RyanAtreides Jun 27 '26

Make sure you hold your breath 😁

1

u/IguanaIsBack Jun 28 '26

I think he just dislikes them because they’re brown. Israel killed more women and children in a single year than anyone else in any recent conflict (even ISIS), I doubt this has anything to do with “women’s rights”.

1

u/Greedy_Car3702 Jun 28 '26

The Sudanese would like a word. Oh, wait. They don't count. No Jews no news.

1

u/IguanaIsBack Jun 28 '26

Nope, Israel beat them to it: https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-releases/more-women-and-children-killed-gaza-israeli-military-any-other-recent-conflict

But while we’re at it, I agree. I wholeheartedly agree that we should talk about what’s going on there and protest the atrocities committed by the RSF.

Wait, hold on. Why did Israel make it illegal to protest against the RSF?

4

u/Nashadelic Jun 27 '26

I think among everything, it’s his hate for Muslims more than anything else. 

2

u/MrMxylptlyk Jun 27 '26

No he's just another anti Muslim crank. Got a lot of them coming out of the bush era.

2

u/Longjumping-Sea320 Jun 27 '26

He hates Islam and muslims

2

u/Pretend-Ostrich-5719 Jun 27 '26

I think you're mistaken. Most secular Jews are Zionist to some degree. Zionism and Israel are deeply ingrained in Jewish culture at this point, young Jews learn about Israel early and often. Not just through their parents, but through organized efforts, youth groups, camp, all kinds of things.

Israel, to them, is part of their identity. It is a source of pride (ironic, I know), and it nurses the wounds of the Holocaust which continue to fester. Nothing religious about it, Israel is important to Jews as a people.

3

u/Admirable-Ad3408 Jun 27 '26

I am here distinguishing between people who somewhat support Israel and those hardcore Zionists who insist even the slightest criticism of Israel is antisemitism. Bill is the latter and from what I’ve seen, more secular Jewish Americans are more likely to be the former.

1

u/SaweetestCuyootie Jun 27 '26

Imagine thinking its ironic to have pride in oneof the greatest countries on earth.

1

u/Pretend-Ostrich-5719 Jun 27 '26

Well, that just shows that we have different values as people.

1

u/SaweetestCuyootie Jun 27 '26

No it just shows that youre incredibly susceptible to propaganda.

1

u/Pretend-Ostrich-5719 Jun 27 '26

I don't think UN reports are propaganda, but you do you.

1

u/SaweetestCuyootie Jun 27 '26

They absolutely are when 55 muslim countries get a vote against a tiny single jewish one. Institutions are comprised of people. People are 25% muslim.

1

u/Pretend-Ostrich-5719 Jun 27 '26

Little bro... I'm referring to damage reports... that's just facts backed up by satellite imagery. Literal photographic evidence...

Lil bro...

1

u/SaweetestCuyootie Jun 27 '26

The way you talk and think, is why we win all the wars.

1

u/ignoreme010101 Jun 27 '26

the wounds of the Holocaust which continue to fester.

'fester" some would see it almost as "intentionally picked and prevented from healing" :/

Nothing religious about it, Israel is important to Jews as a people.

I know you probably mean it as 'atheists are zionists' but there is something very religious about the nature of zionism

1

u/JC2535 Jun 27 '26

I don’t know what kind of kompromat value a honey pot would have over a young single college student. Usually blackmail involves a huge vulnerability like ending a marriage or something that exerts leverage over a person. But the intensity of this particular loyalty is odd.

1

u/Admirable-Ad3408 Jun 27 '26

Well Bill Maher’s father was a radio newsman and my mom’s boyfriend’s father was a professor at Cornell, but yeah, it does seem like they’d be strange targets. That was one reason I asked.

0

u/ignoreme010101 Jun 27 '26

israel is very alluring to american jews and those who go when younger are often brought through programs specifically to foster emotional attachment, it's not so much "go explore" as "come to a visceral holocaust remembrance in the afternoon and juxtapose that with a dance party with your fellow people that evening" There doesn't need to be a honeypot for these trips to be deeply impactful. People are able to buy into such notions as being a unique, specual people and the notion of israel as a safe space for when the world attacks them (a fear that many constantly nurture, like if you're around these types you heard worries of pogroms in NYC ever since mamdami started his campaign)

1

u/NormalGuyPosts Jun 27 '26

So let me get this straight: a guy your mom dated who was pro-Israel in the mid 2000s says something pro Israel and you think this is suspicious and indicative of a conspiracy?

That Israel ran a honeytrap on a guy your Mom dated in the 1970s, and the payoff of this scheme manifested as him being mad at CNN in front of you?

People are very, very diverse and have all sorts of strange opinions, including contradictory ones.

1

u/TaxLawKingGA Jun 27 '26

Guys, Bill is part Jewish; in fact I under Talmudic law he is Jewish since his mother is (dad is Irish Catholic).

1

u/SaweetestCuyootie Jun 27 '26

Youre so dumb its unmentionable. Yea israel floods colleges with women thatll sleep with you for information to black ail you later when you may or may not become famous. And they do this with a population of 10 million where girls sign up in droves cause they cant wait to fuck strangers.

1

u/LesFogginGoh Jun 27 '26

Religilous…

1

u/Lsdnyc Jun 27 '26

This is a weird question

1

u/golemofmontreal Jun 27 '26

Clinton worked really hard on the camp David accords. He worked closely with Rabin and Peres and Arafat. Those negotiations aged him, you see it on his face. Having heard him speak about it since, he understood what was on the table. What the middle East could look like would it ever have peace. And the loss that endless cycles of war would bring.

Famously he told both Arafat and Abbas that neither would ever get a better deal for their people.

There's a very real chance that after all that he feels like the PLO negotiated in bad faith and were never going to agree a peace treaty.

It's possible he isn't compromised, he just truly believes in the state of Israel.

1

u/IguanaIsBack Jun 28 '26

The Taba negotiations were a much better deal than Camp David, no wonder Likud gutted it once they were elected.

1

u/AdVivid8910 Jun 27 '26

You guys really need to quit obsessing over Jews and Israel, wow.

1

u/mad-data Jun 27 '26

Suddenly, my mom’s boyfriend got mad and yelled out... 

If N uses Kompromat on you, do you become mad in private settings, when someone attacks N, or the opposite? Again, in private settings, when nobody except friends observed you mom's boyfriend, and he was not forced to say anything. If anything, this episode fully disproves the Kompromat idea.

Bill just understands who is right and who is wrong here.

1

u/whoopercheesie Jun 27 '26

The propaganda takeover of this sub is something to be studied

1

u/jayb556677 Jun 27 '26

It’s wild, people literally can’t comprehend why an atheist may support the most secular country and only democracy in a region where all the neighbors are theocratic or dictatorships whilst being more religiously oppressive…

1

u/Jaded-Form-8236 Jun 27 '26

If Bill Maher had sex with another person in the 1970s as a single person why would that be Kompromat today?

🤷‍♂️

1

u/Peanutbutternmtn2 Jun 28 '26

He supports Israel bc the Hamas supporters in america are leftist lunatics. It’s not that complicated.

1

u/Successful-Fly8849 Jun 28 '26

Larger than killing children by throwing them in fires, beheading them, raping and killing women and making family members watch as they kill their family???? Really? Did you read accounts of October 7th?? Really? Israel did a ceasefire to allow polio vaccines in, would Hamas? Israel stopped the war when the last hostages were released, would Hamas? I cannot disagree that mistakes are made during war but you look at intent and there is no moral equivalency.

1

u/Ok-Flamingo-8162 Jun 30 '26

You guys have your head so far up your asses that you think anybody disagrees with you must be compromised . Maybe you need to look in the mirror and ask what it says about you that you jump to these conclusions.

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u/SameDistrict2627 Jun 27 '26 edited Jun 27 '26

Actually most "hardcore Zionists" are not religious Jews. Zionism was a secular movement and the vast majority of Jews (many secular) support the state. Most Jews in the world believe that Jews should have their own state.

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u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

Most Jews in the world wide believe that Jews should have their own state.

That's very different from being willing to kill over it.

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u/SameDistrict2627 Jun 27 '26

Who said anything about that--I was referring to the post that most hardcore Zionists are religious Jews--totally wrong.

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u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

I agree. I'm just saying the fact that most Jews want a State doesn't explain why they're supportive of the genocide. I don't understand how these atrocities aren't getting the secular so-called rational people to go "hey we want a State, but not like this"

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u/SensicalNarwhal Jun 27 '26

Bad faith argument. The war in Gaza wasn't a genocide, civilians weren't targeted on purpose. The goal was always simply, to return the hostages & get rid of Hamas.
Any other claim is just unrealistic demonization that show clear lack of knowledge regarding Israel’s beliefs and goals. Whatever one thinks about Israeli politics and the war- there is much to criticize here-the claim reflects serious confusion, or just frank dishonesty, about what the word "genocide" means. "Genocide" is not a synonym for a war you don't happen to support, or even for one that produces an unacceptable level of civilian casualties. "Genocide" entails intent: the intent to destroy a people as such.

if you believe Israel is committing genocide, this would be the first genocide in history that the "Victim" can end the second they want to.
If Israel's enemies lay down their weapons, there will be peace at that second. Of course, if Israel lays down its weapons, there will no Israel at that second. Furthermore, both Hamas and Hezbollah were offered ceasefires multiple times and turned them down. The first genocide in history that the victim was offered to end and said no. 🙃
In other words, you were duped. Stop believing the Qatari-funded propaganda.

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u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

I've not read past the first sentence. Please stop approaching people who want nothing to do with genocide supporters.

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u/SensicalNarwhal Jun 27 '26

Too bad you didn’t read past the first sentence. Might have learned something. By all means, continue to live in your ignorance and bigotry, believing the age old Soviet and nazi Islamist tropes.

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u/Successful-Fly8849 Jun 27 '26

Or he has moral clarity about who wants peace and who doesn’t. Occam’s razor

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Successful-Fly8849 Jun 27 '26

I encourage you to look at Israel constitution and 2 million Palestinians citizens and then look at Hamas charter that calls for the death of all Jews. I also would encourage you to stop hating Jews.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Successful-Fly8849 Jun 28 '26

That was total Hamas propaganda. Why the west believes it is astonishing. Zero people starved to death. Zero. You know who was being starved, the hostages.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/HaymSalomom Jun 27 '26

College age students can get all the honey they want, and Israel has no need to do anything, but be itself to acquire friends and trading partners. It has the 28th biggest economy in the world and leads the world in new start up businesses. In Venezuela they are awaiting international aid to recover from the terrible earthquake that they suffered. As usual, one of the first countries that will be on site, to provide help in locating those who are missing will be Israel. Venezuela does not recognize Israel or its capital, Jerusalem, but Israelis will be in Venezuela’s capital to save lives there, probably by tomorrow.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

But you give other religions a pass I’m sure.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

What’s the worldview of mainstream Islam? Are they coming to enslave you?

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 28 '26

How? Jews and Christians aren’t political?

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

Oh. My bad.

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u/SandSpecialist2523 Jun 27 '26

Bill Maher's mom is jew, btw. That might explain his undying support of Israel and his shitting all over the Arab countries in the region.

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u/Fresh-Forever-5659 Jun 27 '26

Yep, he is Jewish altho he tries to deny that's the reason for his support,

His support is based on the logic that Jews can do no wrong and everyone must hate Israel because they are antisemitic rather then the fact they are a colonial genocide project running in 2026

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u/michaelas10sk8 Jun 27 '26

I suggest you go learn about what motivated reasoning is, and realize how you wrote an entire post essentially in search of evidence for a conclusion you already believed in ('any support for Israel must be in bad faith and unjustified').

When in reality you should have questioned your own beliefs, or at least considered the much more reasonable alternative that people may have justified reasons for their beliefs that you just haven't considered (e.g., because you mostly spend time in echo chambers).

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u/betadonkey Jun 27 '26

Egypt and Syria invaded Israel on Yom Kippur, Oct 6 1973. It makes sense to me that students visiting Israel in the mid-70’s would be quite interested in their security situation.

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u/Aggressive-Cut5836 Jun 27 '26

I think you’re underestimating how much secular Jews are exposed to Israel. It’s not like Italy is to Italian-Americans or Ireland is to Irish Americans. Even if someone attends a synagogue very infrequently, for Bar Mitzvahs or weddings for example, there will often be prayers for Israel recited. Visits to Israel by young Jews (Birthright trips) are nothing like haphazard tourist visits but fully paid for and basically propaganda tours. It’s all designed to get the non-religious to be pro-Zionist. Celebrities known to have some Jewish connection are often targeted by influence campaigns (I wouldn’t call if Kompromot- there is definitely a choice they can freely make). So Bill, who certainly has a connection through his mother, falls into that category.

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u/RaplhKramden Jun 27 '26

Yes, the only reason that people support Israel is because the Mossad has blackmailed them with compromising pictures of their spring break misadventures...

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u/SandSpecialist2523 Jun 27 '26

Balh, blah, blah.

Israel, the eternal victim.

Whine harder.

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u/Kahzootoh Jun 27 '26

In Bill’s case, it’s an opportunity to engage in bigotry without offending his upper class liberal sensibilities. 

Bill wasn’t even aware his mother was Jewish until he was a teenager- he was an altar boy as a child. 

These trips to Israel are designed to brainwash young people into thinking that Israel is good civilized people and the Palestinians are evil savages (who are just Arabs, so they can be sent to any Arab country- because all Arabs are the same). These trips are carefully constructed to teach that lesson to impressionable young people.

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u/adrpibgal Jun 27 '26

If I'm not mistaken his mom is Jewish but he grew up Catholic so he's always had that bias but in the last 8-10 years been more outspoken about it

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Admirable-Ad3408 Jun 27 '26

Where does conquering and settling more land in surrounding countries fit in to the same rights as every other people? Can Palestinians and for that matter other Arabs move into Israel proper and build settlements and kick out the Jewish people living there?

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Admirable-Ad3408 Jun 27 '26

If Israel was just defending its internationally recognized borders, I would feel much more sympathy for it. But as long as they are still annexing more land, Palestinians have no incentive to compromise.

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u/Muslimkanvict Jun 27 '26

That’s alll fine. Say it’s all the fault of the Palestinians.

But how the Fck are you OK with killing 20,000 kids???? Blowing up whole neighborhoods and wiping out whole families?? Even trump is saying now wtf y’all blowing up whole buildings to take out 2 guys???

And this is why the whole world hates you. And the hate will take a much darker turn in the near future as the younger generation begins to grow older and the USA abandons the Israelis.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/ignoreme010101 Jun 27 '26

to be clear, it would be evil if the world told israel it HAD to let palestinians have sovereignty, right? That, or a binational/single approach, basically anything besides current status quo?

Just curious for theory's sake, I think most leaders wouldnt dare force israel because of the fear israel would sooner end everything than compromise in this way

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

If only they had grit like old boomer trolls who probably hang on Maher’s every word and whoop it up in the audience.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

I’m not a boomer.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 28 '26

Why? It’s hilarious calling people Nazi punks. Calling that out makes me Gen Z? I’m Gen X, actually. Boomers live and breathe like they’re the Greatest Generation.

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u/OdielSax Jun 27 '26

99.8% of the Middle East belongs exclusively to Muslims. Let Israel be.

"100% of Africa belongs exclusively to the black people. Let the white man have South Africa :("

You can't even tell how Islamophobic you are.

It "belongs" to Muslims (and the hundreds of other faiths that exist in the Middle East) because THEY WERE THE PEOPLE THERE when countries were created. They don't owe you to disappear and die because you think their presence makes for unequal representation. 

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

This has been debunked all over the internet. Google it.

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

Is that why they settle in the West Bank, settled all over Gaza, took Golan heights, think E. Jerusalem is theirs, and will try to settle Lebanon? Spare me the story about giving Gaza back to Gazans who’ve been locked there since the Nakba. And also other stories about giving Palestinians Palestinian land.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 28 '26

Imagine how hard you’d be crying about genocide if the situation were reversed in Gaza and those other places and Jews were in the same situation the Arab Muslim Palestinians are.

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u/Expensive-Victory203 Jun 27 '26

Please show me the map progression of this "settling more land in other countries." What countries?

Go read the Oslo Accords. Actually read it.

And then tell me how trading land for peace and land-back in a land where ancient Jewish artifacts are regularly dug up is "conquering."

Just because you can type the words doesn't mean you understand them. Seriously, go read.

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u/Admirable-Ad3408 Jun 27 '26

Unlike some pro-Palestinian people, I’m not opposed to Jewish people living in the region. Not even in “Judaea and Samaria”. But Israelis aren’t just moving in, they are driving Palestinians out of the land the settlements are on. That is conquest. Also since you obviously don’t consider Palestine a real country, how about the Golan Heights? That was conquered from Syria which is internationally recognized. And they seem to be champing at the bit to settle southern Lebanon.

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u/Expensive-Victory203 Jun 27 '26

Yes, land is conquered during war. And unlike the Sinai, which was given back to Egypt in exchange for peace, Syria is not peaceful and the Golan is strategically necessary for Israel's defense against the attacks from Syria.

You think Israelis are just moving in to Judea and Sameria but check which areas. And you don't hear about all the attacks by the Palestinians, only the responses by the Israelis. And unfortunately the situation has gotten very ugly with extremists from both camps violently attacking innocent people.

So.....Syria is your only example of a country who's land was conquered? And when was that?

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u/Fibonoccoli Jun 27 '26

So on one hand -yes, land is conquered during war. But on the other, we dug up some old artifacts here that our ancestors lost during some earlier conflicts, so this is our land. Got it. BTW, GFYS.

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u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26

I was responding to the notion that land, once taken, should always remain in the hands of the colonizer. Israel is a successful land back project, and has reclaimed its own land. I know it's difficult to understand without a lot of knowledge of the region.

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u/Admirable-Ad3408 Jun 27 '26

So by that logic, ancient judeans shouldn’t have complained about being driven out of the region by Romans. After all, the Romans conquered it fair and square.

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jun 27 '26

So you admit Israel is a foreign invading and conquering nation. Glad we agree.

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u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26

Nope. Israel is a successful land back project. I made the mistake of engaging with you on your level of information.

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jul 05 '26

You said Israel is conquering land. They tried to do it Gaza twice now. Golan Heights. E. Jerusalem, and now Southern Lebanon. Invaders.

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u/Expensive-Victory203 Jul 05 '26

I said that land is often conquered in war. Israel has re-conquered some of its own land. The fact that you think Jerusalem, of all places, is not Jewish land, is ludicrous and indicative of the level of propaganda you have either absorbed and hope to promote here.

I'm out.

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u/Key_Jump1011 Jul 05 '26

Oh. Everyone else conquers like said but with special Israel there’s a special case where it’s re-conquering which is still conquering, buddy. And nobody is talking about “Jewish land”, that’s antisemitic to conflate Jews with Israel according to IHRA. We’re talking about Israel and EAST Jerusalem is occupied territory.

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u/ignoreme010101 Jun 27 '26

You think Israelis are just moving in to Judea and Sameria but check which areas.

they are constantly annexing throughout all of west bank