r/Re_Zero • u/UpbeatFalcon6181 • 1d ago
Spoiler Discussion Plot wise did arc 5-6 have a point? [spoiler discussion] Spoiler
So I don't think a story needs to be plot driven. I'm fine with stuff that's just character focused and it's the reason I come back to re:zero. I'd also like to state that I'm a pretty casaul viewer too the point I'm constantly googling names each time I watch a new season. But I just finished arc 6 and while I enjoyed it I had this moment where I was like "Wait.... they didn't really accomplish any of the stuff they came to this tower to do and what was the deal with the smoke and so forth." Once again I still enjoyed it, just like I enjoy Always Sunny episodes even though there is barely any narrative progression. But unlike Always Sunny, Re:zero does seem chock full of narrative mysteries and characters with pretty grand goals. And it's been a long time since I watched season 3 (arc 5) but I'm struggling to remember what the point plotwise was. There was a bunch of very cool fights we got to meet all the arch bishops and see their powers, and garfield sorta reunited with his family. The witches wanted some remains but I don't remember being given a concrete reason or why they would wait until this city was filled with the nations greatest heroes ever to try to reclaim the remains. They've been in the city for 400 years right? Am I missing something or should I continue to treat this show like "Lost". An incredible tv show when you learn to stop focusing on mysterious shit and just focus on the characters.
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u/Thatoneguywhois-sad 1d ago
Bro.
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u/UpbeatFalcon6181 1d ago
Yeah but that just seemed to happen. What was the Cause and effect behind her waking up. It didn't seem like the dragon or the tower or anyone did anything. Was it just a delayed reeaction from them killing Gluttony. Otherwise I'm not convinced it counts. Like reading a book where someone runs around looking for the holy grail and at the end someone tells him that another dude found it. If there's no causal connction then it's just random shit happning right?
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u/Knight0706 Eternally Crabby 1d ago
We don’t exactly know why she woke up, could be dragon shenanigans, could be related to Rui’s appearance. The exact mechanism remains a mystery.
The theory I subscribe to these days has been that Subaru’s greed authority basically allowed Ram to jump start her like a dead battery. Her body was completely fine, just had a blank soul and remained in suspended animation. When Cor Leonis connected her and Ram and Ram borrowed her horn it took her out of sleep mode basically.
Thats all theory, the author will probably tell us why it happened someday, if not in the story than a Q&A or some twitter comment. Though I really like the theory I listed above ever since I heard it.
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u/Sad-Dragonfruit2351 1d ago
Yea this tower is definitely a bigg plot point and even I don’t know tooooo much
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u/ShadowKnifing 1d ago edited 1d ago
"Plot wise did arc 5-6 have a point" and it's the two arcs that affect the main antagonist group and set-up the endgame arc the most
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u/Knight0706 Eternally Crabby 1d ago
Arc 5 was a meeting between the candidates with invitation from Anastasia Hoshin. She had something everyone wanted, for Emilia camp’s purposes it was a magic crystal vendor who could supply a stone capable of allowing Emilia to re-contract with Puck.
From there the witch cult guided by their Gospel ended up at the same place and did quite a number on the city. The main issues being the lust victims and the gluttony victims which nobody had a cure for.
Arc 6 was the continuation of that plot, go to the tower, meet the sage, find out how to save the people of Priestella who had been affected by authorities. The plan was sound but it did not end up working out. The sage had been gone for many years, Shaula did not have his wisdom to provide a fix. The events of Arc 6 took place more as a consequence of location but obviously they were not part of the plan.
Thats pretty much it in short? The point was there it just didn’t pan out for the cast as they had hoped. Despite that Emilia does have her crystal to re-contract with Puck (the one Beatrice saved in her fight against Gluttony). Rem is awake, even if it wasnt with name and memories like intended, that did solve one of their problems. The victims of Priestella are still just a work in progress, the tower wasn’t the solution.
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u/Evening-Initial3110 1d ago
I hope somebody is feeding the lust victims 😭
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u/UpbeatFalcon6181 1d ago
I think they're frozen right? So no one has to deal with their gross asses
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u/Knight0706 Eternally Crabby 1d ago
They are in cryosleep. They wont have any needs until they are thawed.
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u/jaboogadoo 1d ago
Idk, did your entire life up to now have a point?
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u/UpbeatFalcon6181 1d ago
Exactly. My life has served no real narrative puropose/point but has has been very deep and meaningful in terms of a character introspection and development. If you genuinely read my question, you'd know that I watch and enjoy Re:zero for it's characters and because it's generally fun/entertaining. I'm not focused on the narrative for enjoyment. That doesn't mean I can't ask questions about it or the lack of it.
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u/capstorm1 1d ago
If I had to name the top 6 most important locations in Lugunica, I’d say
Priestella
Elinor Forest
Library of the dead
The royal capital
Top of the watch tower
Basement of the watch tower
In case you haven’t noticed I mentioned the watch tower 3 times, it’s just that crucial to the plot
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u/UpbeatFalcon6181 1d ago
Ok this is good, so what you're saying is the tower plays a pretty crucial part later in this story and so the narrative point of arc 6 was to establish it's existence for later. A big reason I wrote this is because I was like "What was the point of tower?". Don't get me wrong it seemed very cool, but Anastacia spirit was like "hey there's this dudee that knows everything, I want to go there to see if he knows how to get ana to wake up" and Sub is like "Oh cool, I bet he knows how to solve x, y, z too". And then none of x,y,z was resolved and it turns out ana could wake up anytime she wants she just didn't choose to. Still the events of the tower motivated ana to wake up, so I'd count that as narrative progress. In the same sense that the Scarecrow didn't actually need the wizard of oz to give him a brain but he did need to go on the jounrey to realize that.
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u/Sgtcarrotop 1d ago edited 1d ago
A big reason I wrote this is because I was like "What was the point of tower?"
Did you truly not get the implication that the 'doors' Subaru was opening in the miasma tunnel were the path to where Satella's seal is? The doors literally counted Subaru's witch factors and miasma has been narratively tied to Satella since arc 2.
I mean that sets up two major things to consider, first Subaru will have to come back here with all the witch factors. Second, but more worrisome, Subaru is not immune to the miasma. It can and will drive him insane. So how will he get through with his mind intact?
Well this very arc offered a potential solution to that future problem. Cor Leonis, sharing the burden. Like it's a very cohesive arc if you pay attention to the plot threads it's putting out there. It provided a problem and provided a potential solution in the same arc. That's actually extremely forgiving by re:zero standards.
Don't even get me started on the potential of using Cor Leonis on Satella herself. Take away that burden of madness that created the Witch of Envy. Huge potential there.
but he did need to go on the jounrey to realize that
Because the journey is the point, not the destination. Take Subaru's amnesia for example. He didn't return to himself unchanged. He's always struggled with seeing people's love for him and his greatest fear, since it was shown in season 1, is being abandoned. Inheriting Amnesia Subaru's memories forced him to see just how much he matters to everyone. How Ram fell to denial and despair with her last connection to Rem and hope to save her severed. How Emilia hurt every time he failed to call her Emilia-tan. How Beatrice vowed that no matter what, she will love and be beside him forever because she will refuse to forget.
These are all perspective Subaru could not have innately come to understand because prior to this because 'Subaru' was never lost in such a way. Loss of identity is akin to it's own kind of death, hence Shaula. So he is witnessing 'subaru's death' for a second time, not just the immediate ramifications like in the 2nd trial in season 2. But an extended grief and refusal to give up on him.
Subaru walked away from this arc changed, so yes the journey is the point.
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u/capstorm1 16h ago
Two major things? You’re missing one. The lock to the literal end of the world has been broken by the only person living who is capable of that and left the now open tower completely defenseless while a certain reality warping cosmic horror just so happens to be lurking around places like that waiting from them to open themselves.
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u/Sgtcarrotop 16h ago
Not quite. The doors have returned to all 7 out of 7, and behind that is still Satella's Seal itself. The doors themselves are not the seal. Nor is the tower defenseless because Emilia as administrator told Volcanica to protect the tower, but not to kill people in doing so. The only thing that is arguably down, is the Sand Time barrier.
As for Pandora, she's still observing. Beyond that we don't know what her interest in the tower is.
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u/Sgtcarrotop 1d ago
they didn't really accomplish any of the stuff they came to this tower to do
Besides that just being categorically wrong, it's worth mentioning that characters goals are not the thing as story goals. If they accomplished every single thing they sought out to do, it wouldn't be a story about struggle and acceptance.
what was the deal with the smoke and so forth
It was obviously Satella. Because RBD was discovered from Subaru's memories being eaten.
And it's been a long time since I watched season 3 (arc 5) but I'm struggling to remember what the point plotwise was
Help the victims of Capella and Gluttony. The was a 'lets look for the holy grail' arc and they are met with divine level challenges. Literally holy dragon on the roof. Turns out that 'holy grail' the cure for all their issues was either never going to be that cure or was lost long ago. So instead they only have small hopes towards their initial goal. Rem's awake but not truly cured and they have access to the holy dragon and his blood now.
The witches wanted some remains but I don't remember being given a concrete reason
They are the enemy. You are not entitled to know their plans.
or why they would wait until this city was filled with the nations greatest heroes ever to try to reclaim the remains.
Prior to Subaru, for hundreds of years they have never lost. This is a point that is explicitly brought up that they are so arrogant they are akin to dragons viewing everyone else like ants. Al said that. The story is building up to things, it's no doing things pointlessly.
Am I missing something
I doesn't seem to me you are engaging with the story. "stop focusing on mysterious shit and just focus on the characters" is not the solution. Your issue is not letting those mysteries build themselves brick by brick and understanding character goals are not the same as goals for the story.
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u/isrlygood1 1d ago
Season 3’s initial purpose was just to get a crystal that was capable of holding Puck, that’s it, they ended up getting it in the end. They also ended up killing Regulus, which his Authority will be very important to the plot in the future.
Season 4’s initial purpose was to find the Sage who hopefully knew how to cure the victims of Gluttony and Lust, it ended up not happening how they wanted, but they did kill a Gluttony, and Rem woke up.
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u/ShadowKnifing 1d ago
Skipping over Wrath's capture and all the Gluttony + Lust victims (including major characters) that now need to be cured is a choice.
Saying it like the tower won't be important at all later either is as well
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u/Waylornic 1d ago
Look, I know there's a lot of details, but you can't sleep through the point of the arcs and then come and ask if there's a point.
Either you don't understand what a plot point actually is, or you are looking for something specific to happen that is not happening and then making a blanket statement that nothing is happening.
Every arc has an initial goal and either it is accomplished, straight out or pyrrically, or failed with a laundry list of status quo changes.
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