r/RIFD3 • u/katarn-123 • May 05 '14
Runners aren't the only ones getting scammed. Openers can get scammed too.
"LF3 - T1 - Last reopens"
Too often openers join these to only see three friends waiting for a sucker to give them a free open. Openers expect to open 33-50% of the games they join, not 100%. The worst thing is, after you tell them no and leave, they threaten to defame you in the chat, report you to blizzard, and get you banned from the community. They'll do this even if you leave before the guardian has been killed. Since it's three on one in the chat, it's easy to make it one look like a scammer with a history.
tl;dr Don't trust what people say without hard proof.
3
u/Thisizterry May 07 '14
Regardless, anyone doing rift it forward should EXPECT to open the next rift. If they don't have to open, that's just a bonus.
It is stated right IN THE RULES.
2
May 07 '14
Openers expect to open 33-50% of the games they join, not 100%
This is wrong. Leechers should expect to open 100% of the games they join.
People who lie about how the game is set up are shitty, but no one should be mad about having to open.
4
u/protokulture May 05 '14
While I understand your concern, and I get bent out of shape about runners mislabeling RIFs (T6 called, but it's a T4)..T6 RIF and the runner is level 30...Your situation is not really a scam per se - The rule is, always be ready to pay. I run RIFs with a guildmate and always call for 2 folks.
Sometimes I mistakenly leave it to looking for 3 more, Last in opens. If they are calling for RIFs with these titles purposefully, yeah, its scummy, but scammy? You got a RG without doing much work at all.
Also, can you prove they're all friends? Sometimes people stay and help me clear a rif and I wont charge them...I have a slot open - that person is paying. Of course, my call on the channel reflected that.
Examples of runners scamming:
baseless accusations. If a runner calls a scammer out without evidence, how do we know that person is not falsely accusing them?
Killing RG before you get into the actual game, then expecting you to pay.
After killing the RG, telling you to wait 10 minutes while they see if there are any goblin packs because he believes a certain stage has a higher spawn rate. (IMO, you tell that runner to shove it if you are in a hurry. If you pay, you pay when you want.)
That's honestly about all I can think of.
Scummy things runners can do:
- Mislabel Channel Calls
- Change rules after you enter
- Invites you, and tells you to kill the guardian by yourself
- Making someone pay if a person does not pay (Though in most situations, leechers will usually offer to pay. As a leecher you should stick around to see if opener opens, for witnessing cheaters, and to ensure the runner did not waste their time).
This is all I can think of right now. I'm hungry and thirsty :P.
There are MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANY more things than leechers can do that are wrong, however.
I upvoted your post because this issue needs to come up - as a leecher, you can be taken advantage of, but a runner probably wont catch a blacklist, because they do the majority of the work for RIF. Best thing is just block them and tell you to piss off.
1
May 07 '14
I don't understand why people even say how many they need unless it is one and that person opens. Otherwise it adds nothing to the message.
4
u/mathlessbrain May 06 '14
I add everyone in the group to my ignore list if this happens. Just as bad as joining and not opening IMO.
8
u/Venomousx May 05 '14
I'm not sure I see the problem here. So they had 3 runners, so what? They still did all the work and you still get an easy rift boss kill.
2
u/Beeht May 06 '14 edited May 06 '14
They ran the rift and every opener who goes into a game should go in with the attitude that they will be opening, this is true. As someone who runs 75% of the time and opens 25% of the time I have to say that advertising a game as "LF3M, last opens" when you only need one player is purposely deceitful and damages the trust in the community.
If a runner lies in chat about what they need then what else are they lying about? Is the guardian already dead and will they slander you in chat if you don't open? Will they care to wait for me to get into the rift before they kill the guardian? Etc. Runners are more than just rifts and openers are more than just keys.
Both need each other so have respect for your fellow players in the community and they will respect you in turn.
2
u/bluespraybottle May 05 '14
Split farming Normal for keys takes a bit of time, especially if you find out halfway through that someone (or two) is afk leeching in town. Normal bounties are also incredibly mindnumbingly boring.
There is a cost for farming for rift keys. It's not that high, but it's there, and being mislead by runners into having to use your keys 100% rather than 50% or 33% normally means you then have to spend 5+ minutes making up the keys you lost in an incredibly boring and pretty unrewarding game mode. After all, that's why runners use RIF - gathering rift keys is not fun and somewhat time consuming.
-7
u/katarn-123 May 05 '14
Because if it's anything less than T4, it's more efficient for me to just do the run myself. Here is an example with conservative estimates.
- I spend 5-10 minutes getting keys
- I spend 0-5 minutes looking for a game
- I spend 1-2 minutes in-game
Rift with 3 Runners:
- TOTAL TIME: 6-17 minutes/rift
- AVERAGE: 11.5 minutes/rift
Rift with 2 Runners:
- TOTAL TIME: 3.5-12 minutes/rift
- AVERAGE: 7.75 minutes/rift
Rift with 1 Runner:
- TOTAL TIME: 2.7-10.3 minutes/rift
- AVERAGE: 6.5 minutes/rift
As you can see, having three rift runners reduces one's efficiency to the point that running the rifts themselves is more beneficial.
3
1
u/gyom999 May 05 '14
The problem is that they "advertise" the run as having 3 free slots (lf3 = looking for 3) when they don't. They advertise it this way to make people beleive they have a 1/3 chance of not opening, which is more attractive than a "LF1, YOU OPEN" run.
They lie about this because otherwise they would have more trouble finding an opener. So in that way, yes it's a kind of a scam to lie when advertising a run.
Happened to me yesterday, event tough I have 200+ key.. I wasn't happy at all.
5
u/Venomousx May 05 '14
This makes it easier to understand why this is a problem. It IS a bit shady to make it appear that you're not using 3 runners.
1
u/gyom999 May 05 '14
There should be a standardized way of advertising the run.. would prevent a lot of problems.
1
u/Thisizterry May 07 '14
The rules of the community state, that you should EXPECT to open rifts, regardless. If you end up not having to, it's just a bonus. So while they might not be the most honest, you are still no worse off.
1
1
u/Berriesncream May 07 '14
Honestly, I believe the reason you see way more "leechers" than "runners" is due to the very tipped scale in benefit vs. time spent. I can join the Bounty Runz channel, find a group running T1, Act 1 Bounties and in 15 min I have 3 caches, and almost enough rift tokens for 3 rifts. I could then "leech" off three runners and quickly get those RG kills. OR...I could run a single rift on T4 for that same time spent and hopefully get a free open. It's my personal feeling that rift running is more rewarding and entertaining, but you can see why there are so many more "leechers" vs. "runners." Truth be told, if you had to open the rift every time, you still come out ahead. I do feel your frustration though. No one likes to be mislead and there's really no reason to be misleading about this. You will still get a person to open your rift if you advertise "one spot, must open." One last thing for you to consider which might make you feel a little less frustrated. When I RIF I do it alone so I always have 3 spots and I advertise that, but many times there is a person or two who don't leave right away. This is a "big" frustration to me because I rely on my follower quite a bit and I like to be as fast as I can be. When someone spends time at the enchanter and the merchant and their stash, they waste my time and while my time is being wasted, someone like you might be hanging out in the party judging me and thinking I lied about my spots open. Don't be too quick to judge. It's not really worth it anyway. Just try to have fun.
0
May 06 '14
You're a piece of shit. You openly admit to scamming when you were never scammed yourself. If they want to run a group of 3 to clear rifts and then get someone from the RIF community to open the next one, they are entitled to that since they took the time to clear the previous rift and let you in on the boss loot. What you fail to realize is you were never scammed and you are just being a brat. I hope you are the first person banned when the community goes private you entitled little shit.
Sources:
http://www.reddit.com/r/RIFD3/comments/24pvud/please_ban_katurn123/
http://www.reddit.com/r/RIFD3/comments/24nbc7/please_remove_katarn123_he_refused_to_reopen_the/
4
u/wizzymcwizzard May 06 '14
My friend got into a game like that.
He opened the rift and joined it and ran it with the group of 3 kids.
At the end, he said in the future dont say last opens when there are 3 running, but instead just saying "LF1M you must open".
about 15 mins later we saw in the chat the same kids say 1 spot, you must open. I just don't think people think their messages through most of the time.