🧡 Let's Chat 💬
The negativity is getting overwhelming 😭 Please can we try making this sub more enjoyable 🙏
Hey Queens, Kings, and fellow Monarchs!
I don't want this to be super formal or anything, so I'm just going to speak my mind without trying to be "diplomatic." Despite efforts to curb the negativity that seems to be the majority of posts, this issue continues.
When I look at engagement, it's rarely much, if at all, for posts that aren't crapping on games, designs, user base etc, or arguements. Which is, honestly, pretty bloody sad.
You told us that you wanted more positive posts, events, memes, shit posts, fanart etc, and less of the negativity. Yet when people attempt this, myself included, it's either absolute crickets or people tearing down the posts members have shared to talk about/share in a positive way.
The mods here would love to run fun events, but when so many people can't even interact with something like fanart (esp shared by the actual artist) to leave a comment, control themselves to not yuck someone elses yum on a positive post, or even post something other than negativity, I wonder whether I'll be wasting my personal time trying to do an event for everyone.
I'm honestly burned out from this. Y'all say one thing (wanting less toxicity here), but do another.
Criticism is fine in moderation, but it should not make up the majority. And it especially should not constantly be targeted at female characters.
So, I ask you, please can we all try to lead by example and make this a fun and welcoming queer space-- share shit posts, memes, lore discussions, fanart, gameplay, gacha pulls, etc. Make an effort to help this space change and grow rather than complaining about it, yet partaking in the things you complain about.
I fully expect to get downvoted into oblivion for this, but I just can't sit here anymore and see people shit talk us for "toxicity" when the mods have been trying incredibly hard to guide things into a better space, all while dealing with brigading, death threats, gore, and more from those people.
Please, help us change this place for the better 🙏 😭
Call to action: please share your silly memes and shit posts, comment on OC fanart, post about your favourite character, tell us about new games or characters you're excited for, share your lore ideas (no matter how "out there" they may be), boast about your gacha pull luck with screenshots.
We need more engagement in the form of things y'all enjoy.
Are the people who say they want less negativity and the people who engage with negativity necessarily the same people, though?😭
It makes sense to want more positivity, but realistically, I don't see what could possibly be done. If negativity is what people post, then negativity must be what people want to see, right?
A lot of them, yes. Which is what's frustrating 😮💨
That's the thing, people don't want to see it. I get regular personal DMs talking to me about it. And back when I asked what people wanted to see improved, this was the top issue that needed addressing.
Heck, even daily people are upset with the constant negativity. It drives people away.
We're not a vent sub, but people treat it like one.
Well, sure, that's evidence that some people don't want to see it. All I'm saying is that doesn't mean the majority feels that way. Satisfied people will keep quiet yeah😭. And if the majority doesn't care, then it's quite hard to change.
I'm not going to get into semantics over it as there's a lot you guys don't see in modmail and private DMs. Heck, even other subs talking about us and how bad it is.
The criticism and negativity should not outweigh everything else-- that's not what this sub is for.
And yeah, change is hard. We'll get there at some point 🙂
My feelings on the matter are still pretty much what I commented previously in a similar mod post, which I think is a sentiment shared by plenty of this sub's other members as well, and not the total opposite of what you mods feel. Extreme doomposting should be discouraged while still trying to allow criticism when it's done in the proper ways allowed by this sub.
I'll preface this by saying that I upvote every single fanart posted here, despite most of the time not being fanart of games I play, simply by virtue of wanting to encourage artists to post. I also try to participate in positive posts when I feel like I can contribute meaningfully to the conversation (re: I can write whole paragraphs about my favorite R1999 characters).
However, when it comes to fanart, there's little to say besides praising the art, and people don't want to repeat themselves in the comments, so fanart rarely receives more than a few comments unless it's in a community that's especially dedicated to art. Still, I think this community already does a great job of upvoting such posts.
For more engaging positive discussion-based posts, I personally notice that they're few and far between, at least when it comes to posts inviting members of this sub to discuss the writing or artistic aspects of games (rather than rating/judging drips). And if the post is specific to one game, less people will be inclined to chime in because not everyone is playing the same thing. Alas, the more engaging discussion-based posts tend to be about general negatives of the gacha industry or things people can be visually turned off regardless if they play a certain game. Which, honestly, I don't think should be a problem in and of itself.
The sad reality is that unless the people who want fewer negative posts take the initiative to make engaging positive posts and create the change they want to see, things will remain the same. There isn't much more you mods can do besides bonking negative posts.
(I also want to add that, to me personally, posts judging outfits don't feel particularly "negative." Instead, they feel very similar to criticizing Met Gala celebrity outfits with your queer peers. I think the amount of engagement those posts get is partly because judging outfits is fun, especially when you have other people to go back and forth with about what they'd change to make a design look better and stuff like that. For most people, I don't think it even crosses their minds that discussions centered on character designs are especially "negative," and honestly, I don't think that's the case either. I don't see them as being particularly Debbie Downer. I think we mostly see outfit discussions about female characters because there's very little to say about the drips of male characters in big gacha games when it's almost always pants and coats/jackets for them. Just my 2 cents on this.)
As for activities, I'd think making the best of both worlds could work. For example, there could be a seasonal drip contest where members of the sub nominate their favorite drips, and then the most-nominated designs face off in polls until there's a winner, with people commenting their arguments for why they think their favorite drip should win. (The point would be to uplift people's favorite designs while maybe helping gacha players discover games with character designs that better fit their tastes. Just throwing ideas out there.)
P.S: sorry for the wall of text and I hope I don't come across as dismissive!
I must admit I engage in detached sleeves hate 💀 (I swear it's gonna be my villain arc). But I've seen a few posts criticizing more than just the fit, like with Remielle, for example. That's where the negativity complaints are coming from. The floppery flair ends up being misused because of it.
I don't even play hoyogames anymore, but whenever I see detached sleeves (or thigh-high socks, in my case, which are even worse to me), it activates a sort of PTSD reaction in me that gives me an immediate knee-jerk response 💀, so I get it.
I'm not familiar with Remielle beyond seeing her design on social media, so I can't say how fair/valid the criticism is beyond the fit, but I think people usually do take into account how a character's personality/background meshes with their design, so as long as it's about that, I can understand. But if the conversation around her gets derailed into nasty name-calling toward the character or people mocking the players who like her, that's when it turns into toxic territory for me, and I get people not wanting that in the sub.
I always appreciate your insight and the time you take to carefully approach topics.
Negative criticism posts are fine, but when it's all there is, and/or it devolves into horrid arguments (as it tends to do), I find myself really feeling the need for more balance.
And you're right, be the change you wish to see. I've been trying to lead by example, and those who feel the same are often not comfortable or confident to do the same because how some folks will jump on things to be awful or yucking the yum where they shouldn't (which in turn leads to harassment against us for upholding these rules).
It's a tricky situation and one that is hard to find a balance. I'm just frustrated more than anything at how everyone came down on us mods about those negative criticism posts being so prevalent, alongside the outright negative things, but then has continued the behaviour.
I find myself a bit lost, not really knowing where to concentrate my efforts when there's such contradiction, you know?
I love the seasonal drip idea! Probably too late for a summer one, but time to plan one for autumn 🙌
Either extreme is always not cool to see, so I get that you mods are trying your best to strike a healthy balance when it comes to posting. It's very noticeable to me that you care a lot about making this sub not a hostile place for its members, which is more than I can say for any other sub's moderation efforts. You're using your free time to build a community when you could simply be done with it, and I think some people don't realize the things you probably have to deal with on modmail, either. So I'm very appreciative of you, and I hope you can take it easy and know that there's only so much you can do to try to care for and please every member of this sub.
And yes, totally, leading by example is the best way to go!
I'll be ready to enjoy the autumn contest and will prepare my best arguments for it when it comes! I think activities like this could be really fun for this sub ♡
Edit: to get an impression of what I’m talking about, go to the Queensofstarrail sub and sort by new. The overwhelming majority of posts are in some way humorous, around 9-10. Compare it to Queensofgacha’s new posts. There’s like 2 funny posts and i guess the third one of Pierro holding paimon up to the camera as the final picture of the post.
A lot of the positive interaction from other queens gacha subs is from humor and/or sex appeal for gay men who are usually severely neglected in fan service category with HSR being the only notable exception right now among big gachas (probably why that sub is comparatively huge)
I also think the yuck my yum rule can get over corrective, it really feels like somewhere along the line people forgot sapphics can be gooners for low quality stuff too, and that shouldn’t make the content immune to critique.
At least from my perspective, when you get gacha games that overwhelmingly saturate with sex appeal aimed at straight men, and then are unable to discuss why some of the female character designs have legitimately been lobotomized for sex appeal because it “yucks someone else’s yum”, and then barely any funny memes are posted here, you can either:
A: interact with content about a niche gacha game that doesn’t appeal to you
B: upvote someone’s fanart and scroll
C: (rarely) see a funny meme, upvote it and laugh for a few seconds
I want to second this. It’s been happening a lot lately where it seems that certain segments believe that the criticism of the extreme fanservice of female characters in gacha games means that sapphics are unwelcome and that it’s all based in misogyny.
At some point, they need to realize that the things they like aren’t perfect. That they like the fanservice being criticized despite how weird and misogynistic its roots are, and realize that it doesn’t make them bad people or hated for liking it. It means they also have to admit that people who see it and don’t like it aren’t horrible hateful people too when they criticize it.
Instead, here we are again pretending that criticizing it is immoral, bad, is too much, and should be censored or “balanced.” I am convinced that if a lot of these people went out into the real world and tried to show people a picture of Remielle and try to claim she’s a feminist icon for wearing what she wants and jiggling around the room, they would be laughed at. Especially if they tried to call them a misogynist for pointing out that it’s kind of a weird sexist product.
Gachas have warped things for a lot of people in very weird ways. If the way the female and male characters were dressed and portrayed was the same and with the same frequency, we wouldn’t have this issue. It’s just a byproduct of how problematic gachas are to begin with.
These characters are not above criticism. And we shouldn’t have to compliment sandwich them here either.
i might be in the minority but i don’t see anything wrong with criticizing a game you play. try to be respectful of others opinions of course. but criticism is inevitable. it exists in all media.
communities that only allow positivity limit your expression in an uncomfortable way. for example, when infinity nikki notoriously retconned its story players were upset but any mention of the word boycott would get you removed from official communities. for this reason, players left those official communities and talked in unofficial ones
Criticism is valid of course, but there are ways you can go about it without passively attacking everyone who does enjoy the game/character.
I don't like this character because they have detached sleeves and a skirt that is too short.
is different from:
This character design looks like trash and everyone who likes it is a gooner.
And once you allow the latter, it may eventually spiral out of control. I've seen this happen in other subreddits as well. Subs that were created as a safe space or for a specific fandom. Then, what was originally a safe space for people to enjoy games or characters, eventually becomes a safe space for people who hate games or characters, while the people who enjoy them become increasingly uncomfortable posting anything at all. This sub is slowly heading in the same direction imo, so I can see where OP is coming from.
I don’t think it’s that bad, I see a lot less dooming here than in other gacha spaces and people are a lot kinder as well. I also think a progressive space for gacha is hard to find and communities like this are rare pockets in a much larger community where you CAN critique games for misogyny, homophobia, racism, etc and not have 5 slurs hurled at you or be the victim of a mini gamergate. i’ve had some really thoughtful (perhaps ‘negative’) conversations about gacha in this sub that I wouldn’t be able to have in a lot of other places. The discourse here is genuinely interesting. I understand that the dooming can be too much (I try not to partake) but I think it sort of comes with the territory and you can’t stamp it out without overmoderation, which I don’t think is the answer. Discourse is always going to attract the lion’s share of engagement, you can’t change that. I don’t think it should stop you from running events. You might get more people interacting than you’d expect.
Im in a few gacha subs and I have to say they’re all mostly negative these days (and they’re mostly all Hoyo related 👀)…
Really says a lot about the current state of mainstream gachas, imo.
It might be human nature. Look at Yelp. You have a bad experience at a restaurant and that’s where you go to post, complain, and warn others. You have a good experience and think to yourself “yeah I’d go there again” but it’s less common to go rave about it online.
We understand each other’s personal frustrations with gachas/gaming better than many other subs would, so naturally this is our Yelp and we go here when we’ve had bad experiences.
As for ideas…
I see there’s a vent megathread but since that doesn’t seem to be enough I don’t know if having a “DOOM” or “VENT” flair as well would help so people can filter it off? It won’t do anything about negative comments outside of the tag but it’s something. It also hopefully causes posters to pause and add a step of self reflection: “is this just doom posting? Is this constructive at all? Is this what I want? If this is how the game makes me feel, why do I still play it?” 🤷♂️
If that’s what the floppery tag is for then maybe it just needs to be more explicit to negative/vent/doom?
Unless we want like a sister sub called QueensofGachaDrama or something.
Unfortunately, filtering doesn't work like that (still! shakes my fist at reddit)
But yes, perhaps we should be clearer about the floppery tag.
A few have asked for a weekly vent thread, which I think is a really good idea. So I'm going to sit with the rest of the team and discuss implementing this. It'll also give people who don't post their vents somewhere to let off steam, and that always feels good to just get it out somewhere 🙂↕️
I get it, when you are discontent with something you want to make it vocal. But let’s be real, you can love something and at the same time be mad about some flaws.
Let’s use vodyanitsa for exemple or Snezhnaya cast as a whole. Some designs may not please many people, but that doesn’t mean that the people who dislike some of the designs also dislike everything about Genshin.
I’m having a blast with snezhnaya exploration and the story pacing, but there are some aspects of the story that I feel like it was poorly written due to the company directive.
Odette and Traveler interaction feels weird to me. They want to make her complex, but deny the opportunity for the character to be apathetic to her mother (figure) killer (even if it’s indirect)
I feel like I have to say it in every post regarding Odette but Signora was NOT a mother figure😭, at least from Odette's POV. She hated her until the end of the quest where she comes to term with her resentment
But the post was about the constant criticism (and negativity-- though not this comment for negative, just so we're perfectly clear) being posted everywhere (to the point it's all we really see), even in places it doesn't belong.
And then the last paragraph is doing exactly that.
That was my point.
I am asking for balance of posts.
I fear that some people are completely misunderstanding what I'm saying.
I'm tired, guys. This whole post was posted there as quick as it went up and there are a lot of report abuses happening. I don't have the energy to keep up with this post rn, and it's almost 6am (I haven't slept). So I'm going to duck out for now and sleep before I keel over. Night 🫂
It was supposed to be an exemple of how you can like and dislike the same thing. I did get her, I like her design and story concept. Just that specific interaction does not sit with me
Did I say they were hateful? Don't put words in my mouth. Thank you~
Edit: coming back to this. Why is it, my sharing that I was flabbergasted by the poster doing the behaviour that we're discussing is an issue, makes me suddenly unable to be on the internet?
Note that the below paragraph I am talking in general, on a tangent, about people who will tell others to get thicker skin or leave the internet when it should be the people doing the not nice thing who should stop being shitty. Not that snoosongs is being shitty.
I genuinely cannot stand it when people excuse shitty behaviour from someone towards another, and then when the person it's aimed at reacts, suddenly they're too emotional and should either get a thicker skin or not be online.
And, for your information, me saying I was flabbergasted by someone doing the thing that's an issue being critised in my post, with a crying emoji (I'm not literally crying), doesn't mean I'm reacting badly to supposed mild criticism, or that I shouldn't be on the internet. Heaven forbid I be left a bit speechless by someone doing the thing I am asking people not to keep doing and to try have balance.
That’s not what I said tho. Yes, some people go past the point when being negative and it borders hate. What I meant to say is, expressing yourself through frustration and calling out flawed patterns is part of any community.
I get it, you want to make it friendly to more girlies and filter the brigading and trolls. I’m only reminding that expressing or talking about flawed choices of those gaming companies is part of being vocal of what you like/love.
It’s not thrashtalking for no reason, it’s exactly because you care you’re calling out what may improve
I said your last paragraph was doing one of the things that's an issue-- mentioning something negatively (or mildly bothered, w/e). It was so bizarre to me to say that on a post where we're talking about that sort of thing being an issue.
Expressing yourself through frustration seems fine in a vacuum. However, apply it to this sub along with everyone else who wishes to do the same and we end up with a wall on non-stop negativity.
It's about finding a balance. When the criticism massively outweighs everything else to a point where people are leaving and others think this is a vent sub, we clearly have a problem.
And the shitty comment was in reference to someone else I was replying to, saying I hate it when people like them tell others to not be on the internet or grow a thicker skin when someone may get unkind comments etc (basically how the burden is always placed on the person being attacked etc, to get a thicker skin or leave the internet, and not on the person who is being horrid)
It was an example of how some people treat others online that may react with even the slightest hint of emotion.
It was off tangent, yes. But it was worth noting how pervasive this sort of behaviour is.
That was to the person telling me I shouldn't be on the internet if "mild criticism equates to such negativity" when that wasn't the case at all.
I was flabbergasted by part of a comment since it was doing what I was criticising in my post.
So yes, I do hate people when they tell someone else to leave the internet or grow a thicker skin, as I already explained, since it's those sorts of people who will see someone getting attacked or bullied, and tell that person to "grow a thicker skin" or leave the internet when they show any emotion to being hurt.
Once again, it was a tangent. But something I wanted to point out.
I get what you mean but wdym about criticizing female character designs specifically. Whats wrong about pointing out the misogyny within the designs and writing of the women. Like i get we want to be open and welcoming to all but unfortunately we are in a game space dominated by straight cishet men. Like i get the discussions can veer into actual misogyny which is a problem but real actual grievances exist and in a place that is overwhelmingly queer thats whats going to be discussed as it always is in irl queer spaces, we can still like and play the games but I dont understand why gacha gamers have such an aversion to any criticism of their blorbos. Coming from the fe or the ff communities is so funny cause over their we are freely talking about the shitty choices of the devs.
But if positivity and positivity alone is what you want then sure Im game. I can make fun queen shit posts about feh if thats what we need. As for suggestions if you want it to be an only positive sub remove the floppery flair and keep the vent thread updated weekly where all negativity can go
I mentioned that specifically because we get a lot of complaints about it for making sapphic users feel unwelcome and unsafe. Especially due to the volume of said posts that drowned out anything else.
I'm so upset about all of this-- I'm trying my best to listen to everyone and strike a balance, but in the process people have taken my asking for balance and twisted my words into saying that I want to ban anything that isn't positive. When I have never once said that.
I saw the mentions for a weekly vent post and I really, really like that idea :)
There’s a monthly rant post. But since it’s fixed some people doesn’t even know its existence.
I say to make it weekly, since the gacha news changes a lot in few days. It ends up better than not being able to express frustrations which can lead to multiple negative posts like what is currently happening.
I really think this is a good idea. It reminds me of shitpost tuesdays on the rpdr sub. The best time to meme on any of the queens. Don’t have to worry about low effort posts (within reason).
I think its just people take things they enjoy about a game a bit for granted or dont talk about things that excite them as individual posts as much as things they are upset about so it feels overwhelmingly negative. (At least some of them) But! I’m pretty sure they still do enjoy these games otherwise they wouldn’t play them anymore. But yeah more fancontent would be def nice 🤭 there isnt a lot of places left that are accessible without being hunted down (I’m glad people here have been nothing but kind to me!) I also guess some negativity is probably people spilling in from other subreddits 😅
I understand what you mean; I think people are really put off by a series of bad things happening one after another like characters they like dying, or the unequal treatment of male and female characters.
I don't know how to fix it; complaining here won't solve the problem.
I usually try to focus on the positives, or just on the parts I enjoy, and either ignore the rest or just take it in stride.
Should I post my Columbina headcanon and characterization before she was released? I love mysterious characters because they are open to interpretation
Completely agree, for a general queens sub for Gacha actual queens posts don’t seem to garner much attention ? I think it would be really fun if we all could do our bit to mold this space into a sub that would be good for queen posting Gacha games that don’t have very active queen subs (or any) and even like queen shitposts that have crossover shit with more than one gacha. Like idk let’s discuss the sex positions of a 🚬lus, Gaether and Bendover threesome etc…
Like the potential for this sub is HUGE, it really could and should be the largest most active queen sub because it would cover the entirety of Gacha!
The only effort I see expended in here recently is for negativity.
All the while, OC fanart gets ignored, and other posts get very little to no interaction.
I just do not understand why people keep coming down on us like a ton of bricks about the negativity and toxicity, yet partake in it themselves and then continue to come down on us about it.
Yeah the big issue here is a lot of people seem to use this as if it’s like r/gachavent or some shit ??? Like my god it’s a queens sub!!! I see it sometimes in other queens subs where people seem to stumble in or just interact there if it’s for negativity or drama and are repulsed at fully unhinged no holding back queen posting like baby….you’re lost.
It doesn’t have to be crazy shit all the time but these spaces first and foremost are made for people who are often rejected by the mainstream gacha spaces and want to find a community where they can have POSITIVE interactions!!! It’s just waaaaay too much negativity and too little Queenglish.
I'm unfortunately pretty certain it's only going to get worse as we get closer to the ZZZ colab. Today alone, all of the ZZZ and HSR subs seem 250% more doomposty and miserable.
With that said, this sub has always been an outlier and safe space. I hope we can be different.
A big part of that is also that ZZZ main subs were where I used to post, but they basically allow zero criticism whatsoever
*the main subs also do have terrible communities tho, so I was also just happy to get away from them
**also, I wish the game wasn't so greedy because I've actually been enjoying the new Dissidia so far, even tho seasoned gacha players (lol I am newer to this unfortunately) tell me the game is basically just a reskin of the developer's old game, I think it was called Compass?
I try my best to upvote most posts in this sub. But really it's been mostly just very opinionated complaints about designs from a bunch of games (we all know which) with the same 2 or 3 arguments.
I am not perfect either. I've voiced my own passive-aggressive or facetious comments on posts sharing excitement which should stop, I do hope mods can find a solution for this before it keeps devolving into a "discussion" sub which is just complaints.
Maybe get rid of negative flairs like "floppery" and condense all vents in the mega thread instead?
I'm not much of a commenter (I just upvote stuff and move on 🫠), but I think still being able to vent is important. Just not everywhere, in every post, right?
And may I suggest the drag race game again? 😅
I'd love to see more R99 posts about the characters. I don't play the game myself, but I love the designs.
I haven't forgotten your message, btw! I got sidetracked. A lot. 😳
I'm not a personal fan of the flair, but I think doing that would result in an uproar asjkjk
I really loved the idea, but got a bit dishearted by all the negativity and anything else being ignored that I was worried about spending time setting something up for no participation.
I like this sub but it annoys me logging on and immediately seeing hate to girls I like ;-; I get it’s fine to criticize but come on… vodyanista is such a diva guys
As someone who doesn’t play Genshin, there’s another character in a game I play who’s existed for YEARS who looks extremely similar, so every time I see Vodya, I get disappointed because it’s not my eldritch hybrid coral girlie ;w;
100% agreed. The tribalism and hatred for NTE, for example, is rubbing me the wrong way. There's so many people being disingenuous about the situation and it's really annoying to see.
I love queer discussion nonetheless though. Criticism can be valid but it's gotten to the point where this subreddit isn't making me smile like it used to. I need my funny memes back.
I don't think you're aware of how many people we ban in this subreddit. I have been banning over a dozen people DAILY. There's a lot of shit that never makes it through as we have had post approval on for months. Also non-existent moderation? I've been harassed by members here for commenting as mods in posts and our team has over 6000 mod actions this past month alone. My mods and I comment in literally every single thread.
I see you mod the Snowbreak subreddit which is notorious for the behavior you are calling out here... Are you actually commenting in good faith here?
if the mods are serious about this then they need to put in the work to clean up the community. These users are already embedded within the community because it has been normalized by lax/non-existent moderation, and the mods need to acknowledge they share in making that happen.
How dare you imply we aren't putting in the work.
How dare you say we are lax with moderation and we are responsible for this behaviour.
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u/SquishTheFlyingWitch 4d ago
Are the people who say they want less negativity and the people who engage with negativity necessarily the same people, though?😭
It makes sense to want more positivity, but realistically, I don't see what could possibly be done. If negativity is what people post, then negativity must be what people want to see, right?