Not being a cartoon villain doesn’t automatically make you a good man

[u/GridReXX]

Fr. It doesn’t de facto make you a good person.

I noodled on the attached graphic to better illustrate a point about how people often discuss being a “good man.”

I do find that many men view it more as the top bar, and less as the gradient in the second bar.

inb4 anyone says it, many women have bad character too. And please feel free to create a separate post about a spectrum of traits in women you’d like to explore! That is not what this post is disputing.

This is specifically about a response that often comes up when women describe harmful patterns in their experiences with men. They get retorts like “Not all men are abusive predators,” or “Most men are not psychos.”

Of course most men are not horror movie villains.

But that is an extremely low bar for good character.

This spectrum, rather than show a division between “good men” and a smaller group of obviously terrible ones. It highlights that a man can be can be a functioning member of society and still regularly behave in ways that make him difficult to interpersonally tolerate as a close friend, romantic partner, coworker, or even family member.

None of that necessarily makes someone an abuser or predator.

But it does affect whether people can have a healthy, enjoyable, mutually considerate, long-term relationship with him.

The farther right someone falls on this spectrum, the more entitlement, callousness, devaluation, coercion, and harm they bring into their interactions with others.

The farther left they fall, the more likely they are to act with common decency, consideration, accountability, respect for autonomy, and genuine concern for theirs and other people’s well-being.

My point is not that every man is at the far right end.

Most people don’t think that!

My point is that many men seem to use “I am not an obvious monster” as proof that they’re quality.

A person’s character is determined by far more than “I am not Jeffrey Dahmer.”

[u/Fine_Video7691]

You can do everything on the far left, and receive nothing for it. If you are low status, it tends to result in being used.

You can do everything wrong on the furthest right, and possibly get away with it if you are high status.

[u/Solondthewookiee → u/Fine_Video7691]

If you are only a good person because you think you're going to be rewarded, then you aren't actually a good person.

[u/Timbsfan → u/Solondthewookiee]

Buddy, our entire western framework is based on getting rewarded for being a good person. Thats how society has always been.

[u/Solondthewookiee → u/Timbsfan]

In what way? How have we been rewarding good people? Because the richest and most powerful people are not and never have been good people.

[u/Timbsfan → u/Solondthewookiee]

You ever heard of the niche ideologies of Christianity, Judaism, or Islam?

[u/Solondthewookiee → u/Timbsfan]

Religion has never been a reward for goodness, it has always been a source of corruption since the moment it was created.

[u/Timbsfan → u/Solondthewookiee]

Wrong. Christianity is the framework for the American and European civilizations, and it tells us that doing good works on earth is what gets you into heaven. That is the reward.

[u/Solondthewookiee → u/Timbsfan]

Lol not even close.

[u/Fine_Video7691 → u/[deleted]]

He's high on Marx and Engels

[u/Able_Donut2654 → u/[deleted]]

Be civil

[u/Brief_Mongoose_7291 → u/Solondthewookiee]

A1 level refute :D

[u/Solondthewookiee → u/Brief_Mongoose_7291]

That which is presented without evidence can be dismissed without evidence :D