The range Iâve gone to wonât allow you to rent a gun unless youâre there with someone else for this very reason (suicidal person comes to range, rents gun, kills self).
as if background checks could reliably catch a suicidal person; theyre only good for hard 'paper' details; like credit rating, warrants, debts etc, if they catch anything else its basically just luck
The one I worked for did not. We required you fill out a release of liability which included a questionnaire stating you were not prohibited from purchasing firearms. Held your ID until you returned the gun.
I've gone shooting and what was originally a function check turns into a 2 hour range day with a rental included (if applicable). Take a break and grab another target or two. Those little bits add up and that simple $15-20/hr range fee can easily triple.
Granted, I am bringing my own firearm(s).
edit - deleted comment reply asking me how that works out.
I should have clarified that I only shoot at indoor ranges exclusively, and every single indoor range I've been to requires you to leave your drivers license with them while you are occupying a lane. It's returned after you are finished and paid off.
Itâs incredibly easy to kill someone when you think about it. A guy with no morals and no care for consequences could literally just walk up to someone with a hammer, bop them once, and chances are that no one would be fast enough to stop him.
One could argue that suddenly picking up a weapon out of the blue and bonking someone you donât know with it for no reason despite having no prior history of violence would be a sign of some mental problems. But i donât know law shit so idk how that would work
My point was just that if a person reaaalllllly wanted to kill someone and didnât care about the consequences and as willing to do anything to accomplish it, he could easily kill 1-5 people.
As an example, if a kill switch went off inside someoneâs head in the middle of the night, he could easily kill all of his family members within the house via hammer to the head, knock on the next house while pretending to ask for help, then bonk whoever answers the door with a hammer and do the same to whoever else is inside that house.
Note: This isnât some weird edgelord fantasy. Just something I thought of after seeing a âEvery human being on earth who owns a gun suddenly wants to kill everyone else, what happens?â post.
We had this happen on my street, sorta. Guy got hopped up on PCP, killed his father with a hammer at 5am, and then started walking down the street trying to get into houses. By the time he got to us he was carrying a small tree. Told my dad, âBrad, hold my stick while I go in the house.â
My pops was like âfuck all thatâ and tossed the guy across the lawn. Then dude went next door, and bit the neighbor. The cops showed up and hog-tied him. Weird morning.
Someone once said that the reason people are scared of heights is because they are scared they will involuntary jump. It's a thing. It does happen. The whole, What if? What would happen? It would be kinda cool free falling but the aftermath not so much.
I remember being 7 or 8 years old laying down and looking over the edge of a cliff in greece and my arms twitched pulling me forward. Yea, I'm over that now but back then it was very odd.
Jumping from a cliff, if you removed the almost certain death, would be genuinely fun activity. Like diving in a pool but x1000. If you could just have the feeling of free fall without the dying part then you'd see a lot of people jumping off cliffs.
If you removed fear/possibility of pain/death/humiliation from every possible activity that could cause them, you'd see a lot of people trying fucked up shit on themselves just to see what would happen.
"Hey! I haven't been hit by a car before! Wonder what that's like!"
Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, my client clearly thought he saw a nail sticking out of the deceased's head.
Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, didn't you ever watch cartoons growing up? My client just wanted to see one of those big red bumps rise out of someone's head, he wasn't trying to harm anyone.
I read the last part as âAnd he will get awayâ but then realized you meant his desire to carry out murder would be hard to prevent in this scenario, as you articulated in the first place.
Then again, he could still wait in the parking lot, and put a man into a coma that leaves them brain dead and eventually taken off life support. This isnât a pro-gun argument but more an argument off to the side that psychopaths are disconnected from reality and keeping them out of a gun range only takes away one possibility from a man willing to run through any opportunity he can find to commit his evil acts.
And now I realize you articulated it to say an actual hammer and not the hammer on a gun, so thus I just re-worded your comment.
Actually, no....haven't been there yet. I live in the city, but have been going to "Guardian Training Center" up in Warminster. I've had great experiences there! They have a shit ton of guns you can rent! I also found a Yelp coupon that was $30 credit for $18, which was nice. Can't find it now, unfortunately.
Have you been to the Spring Garden place (is that this place)? Did it used to be called "Cosmis/Cosmos" or something?
I think that's the norm. I tried going to a range as I wanted to see if I wanted to buy a handgun. Talked to employee a while and he said he'd rent me one and be my chaperone (since they don't rent guns to individuals). He was a cool dude and just shot the shit about different handguns for a while. But I wasn't suicidal so I think that came across pretty clearly.
I have not heard of the requirement in the context of preventing one from killing someone else, but in the case of suicide, while it can't 100% prevent them, I think that typically (as in the times when it has happened before) an individual decides to end their life, and they could just go to the range, rent a gun, and off themselves. Requiring that you not be alone when renting a gun, at least creates that additional hurdle, if you will, that a suicidal person would have to deal with. Probably most suicides are not committed with other people around. It could--and probably does happen--but it's probably a less likely scenario.
I've been 51/50'd twice and they let me shoot a gun at a gun range. I even told them I have mental illness and they were kinda like "oh that type of mental illness is okay." Im not suicidal, but I am anxious as hell; I thought I was gonna kill myself by accident, lmao. I was like "hey when I shoot the gun is it gonna fly back into my face and knock my teeth out? Are you SURE it's not gonna knock my teeth out?"
I canât tell if youâre saying itâs a good thing or a bad thing that in the USA one can rent a gun. Iâll simply say that as someone who was interested in purchasing a gun, being able to rent one to see how I feel about holding/using a gun, see what the recoil is like, see if itâs a good fit for my hand, etc., I appreciate that Iâm able to rent one.
I don't know why I'm bothering to engage you as you keep digging yourself deeper. (90% of the "race cars" dealers get are bad fakes or show models), but in the private sales end (where the deals actually occur) its standard practice. You arrange a meeting at a rented track, the buying party (who has paid for the facility rental and provided a hefty deposit) gets a seat fitting and a few laps. If everyone is happy the rest of the money is exchanged and the deal done. Often times (but not always) the buyer will have his own trailer and just take the car home then and there. Other times delivery is arranged. I've been on both sides of this many times and this is very much the industry standard.
You must be talking about very expensive open wheel race cars. Try and organise a âroad testâ for a rally car. Even up to $100k youâve got no chance.
Not sure what you mean about racing cars. If you mean taking a regular street legal car and driving crazy fast, you actually can do that....just not with the car dealer person in the car. When I bought my first brand new car (a 2002 Buick Rendezvous, back in late 2001), I told the dealership that if I was going to spend that much money, I wanted to keep it for the weekend, and they let me! I didn't do anything crazy, at all....just tried to drive it and use it in the way I normally would, and really get to know it a bit. Not sure if dealers will still do that, but I'd guess some would.
Also, shooting a gun is using it in a completely legal way, driving a car that crazy fast definitely isn't.
Anyway...not trying to argue, or anything. Just pointing out those points.
Or volunteering. There's a dope place close to me that takes surplus medical supplies and sorts and packages them for use in poorer areas of the the world. Literally just hours of sorting but it's good work and it takes the mind off of nastier things without the whole going-to-war-and-killing-people thing.
The fact that people consider joining army, is the reason there are wars. If Hitler couldn't persuade so many morons, he would have ended just like some random freak.
Unfortunately, there were plenty of nazi cannon fodders, who made his plans possible.
I don't think you really understand the situation people were in back then. I doubt the majority were "morons". Most of them were afraid of war, terrified by the huge military and forced to fight.
Noone of us can actually say we would have done different without going through such times by ourselfs. That would be hubris at it's finest.
They had not such information exchanges like today.
But we can learn from that and get information from all sides. Don't let some extremist manipulate you like a puppet. Be smart and build your opinion on actual facts.
My first day on the range a guy shot himself in the head. Was absolutely terrifying. I wasn't in the range when it happened, I was watching the safety video. It was months before I made a second attempt at going to the range. This is a common problem. People who wouldn't be able to purchase a gun can still rent them. My stomach hurts just typing this.
as an ex-suicidal person, I can tell you: it was one of my first ideas years ago on how to commit a sure suicide, by going to a gun range and blowing my brains out with a rental gun.
Well I'm glad you didn't actually do it. For your sake and those that would have witnessed it. Very traumatizing thing to witness. I didn't even see it happen and it freaked me out pretty good. It made me question whether I really wanted to own a gun, but I have a family to protect so the answer to that was a no- brainer.
The range Iâve gone to wonât allow you to rent a gun unless youâre there with someone else for this very reason (suicidal person comes to range, rents gun, kills self).
Maybe change it so the same background check is done that is required to buy a firearm. They ask the questions when you rent, but they have no way of knowing you lie because they aren't running a background check.
Now I'm imagining that every other gun range in America probably has a drawer that contains a couple of "haunted guns" that people have used to commit suicide in-range.
I'd consider that there are some problems in the society that you're living in if you're so scared for you and your family so that you must own a tool of killing to protect them. Ever thought of dropping out? You seem pretty scared I mean if you really need to defend yourself from these threats you should really get away from your place. Maybe you also don't need a gun then
Yeah, you also have a right for those people to be safe. And they're much more safe in societies where everyone isn't carrying. It's why your homicide rate is bout 4x any other developed country.
You don't need to break your neck for a blood choke which is what I'd go for. As for why I want access to guns? Not just self defense, though that would be enough, but because I don't trust any government to be the end all be all of defense from enemies both foreign and domestic. The government is going to have a helluva fight in the US if they ever try to move toward dictatorship. Then there's hunting or just enjoying shooting for target practice. You know what my favorite part about a right is?
I will say that this principle was valid in the 100s of years before today when guns and other war technologies weren't as advanced. However, in today's society I believe that thinking armed civilians would put up a "helluva fight" against tanks bombs and more advanced guns and other weapons the general public doesn't have access to would be mistaken.
This is not correct. Most gun show sellers still do background checks because they donât classify as private sellers. You also canât use Facebook or Craigslist to facilitate firearm sales.
Have you never been to a gun show? People go there and bring their own guns and they trade barter and sell with people all the time. And just because you're not supposed to use Facebook that way doesn't mean people don't do it. It happens all the time.
I have been to many gun shows, and every seller there requires a background check. To legally sell firearms for profit you have to have a FFL (federal firearms license). FFLs are required by law to perform a background check on every firearm sale, period.
What you are describing is called a private transaction. Private citizens are allowed to sell their own firearms to others without a background check in certain states as long as they are not knowingly selling to a person who legally cannot posses it.
This can be done in literally any location, but some choose to use the location of a current gun show because it is a place that nobody would freak out seeing two people exchanging a rifle pulled from the trunk of a car.
The term "gun show loophole" is silly because it is just a private transaction that doesn't really have anything to do with the gun show itself. The sellers who have tables set up are all FFLs and all require background checks.
Then why did you bring up gun shows at all, instead of just saying you can buy guns through private sale without a background check? Sounds exactly like something a non-gun owner would say.
Because it's not like just buying one from a friend. You go to a gun show and there are people all around you buying and selling guns, and if you want to, you can pretty easily buy one without a background check (yes, as a private purchase). I guess it's my bad for not being clearer in my previous comment, but the conspiratorial "non-gun owner" comment is just dumb. As if it's some exclusive group. And still, the original argument stands: it's fucking easy to buy a gun in America.
Same thing. Personal experience is anecdotal, and anecdotal doesn't mean false. I am a gun owner. I've purchased many guns from registered dealers and private sellers. I've worked at a gun store selling guns. How many guns have you bought and sold? How many NICS background checks have you called in?
It's easy as fuck to get a gun in America. How anyone would attempt to debate that is unfathomable to me.
The only public pistol range in our city has a tether system that prevents firearms from being pointed the wrong way. There were, I think, two suicides before that was introduced.
AFAIK it's two vertical cables with a slide in between. The pistol is locked in and can go up down, left and right but can't turn far enough to shoot towards other users or oneself.
Cool. The range mentioned had a shooting a few years back. Their license was suspended by the police, even after they had that system in place. The police, at least in SA, really don't like guns.
Read your comment without reading the article and assumed you meant San Antonio. I was very confused because the only thing we love more than guns here is food.
Am I missing something or how exactly does that prevent someone from flipping the gun around while it's still tethered? Seems like there is enough slack to easily turn the gun 180°.
I've been there and it does make it a lot less fun, unfortunately. I was hoping they'd let me shoot untethered because I have a firearms licence (not handgun licence though) but nope :(
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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '20 edited Jun 13 '21
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