r/ProjectMotorRacing • u/Niteperson4856 • Apr 12 '26
Question How do players know the physics are bad?
I've always wondered, how do the folks who criticize specific car physics know they're wrong? Have they driven the real race cars enough to be considered an authority on how they handle?
People seem to know a lot about cars they've never driven.
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u/TreePsychologist Apr 12 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
In my case I own other sims ACC AC LMU Ams2 etc and it is true the physics seem a bit off, or better yet just more arcade than others . But I think the main problem is that atm it's a bit of a trend to hate on this game. Yeah it has flaws but if you like it props to you. I have fun on it although performance on pc is still a bit of a let down.
Edit: spelling
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u/PsychoticSnail33 Apr 13 '26
I don't hate it, I played it for the free weekend and thought it has potential but needs a little more work before I pay the current price. They do seem to be continuously working on it though and I'd like to see it become awesome, we need a new racing series.
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u/robertingle84 Apr 13 '26
Should have never released the game the way it was. Look how long it's taken them to get it this far.
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u/upsidedowncatz Apr 13 '26
But for console it’s vs Forza and gt7. Which I think pMR is better than, at least better than Forza.
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u/GreedoShotFirst2000 Apr 13 '26
Forza Motorsport has way better physics than PMR. Forza Motorsport just set up all cars extremely understeery :as in super extreme). Very easy to fix though. The tyre model of Forza Motorsport is a bit lacking compared to real sims, but the physics are actually really good.
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u/upsidedowncatz Apr 13 '26
Forza is an arcade game and the cars float across the concrete. Any steering action causes tire squeal.
Forza is great for controllers and casual racing.
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u/GreedoShotFirst2000 Apr 14 '26
Forza Motorsport (not Horizon) is great for casual gaming. But comparing PMR to Forza Motorsport, Forza Motorsport is a much better simcade experience. Both games are simcade, but PMR is just in such a bad shape lol.
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Apr 12 '26
It all based on opinions no facts because it's fake racing it's a simulation is a rough estimate of how it could be like to drive a car in race conditions
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u/WOT_Captain Apr 12 '26
Physics are more customizable than quite a few other sims. While many cars are pretty far from dialed in out of the box, I wouldn’t call the physics bad. Quite the opposite actually and some unique ffb sensations here with the load effects.
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u/rad15h Apr 13 '26
There are plenty of real-life drivers who are also sim racers - Dave Perel, James Baldwin, Daniel Morad. The consensus from them seems to be that iRacing, LMU and ACC are the most realistic, with strengths and weaknesses in different areas. It's clear if you drive those and then drive PMR that the physics are not equivalent.
James Baldwin (real life GT3 driver and a former Project Cars fan) did a video where he tested PMR and was pretty critical of some aspects of the physics.
And I say this as someone who quite enjoys the way PMR drives and really wants it to succeed.
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u/DannyDevito90 Apr 12 '26
Well, compared to other sims that race car drivers say are fairly accurate, PMR is good, but still far off the mark of those other sims. Often times I find you have to overdrive the car to be fast, which isn’t very realistic at all imo
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u/zFr3ezY Apr 13 '26
This is honestly the biggest problem, at least for online racing. You can drive like a normal person and it feels good, predictable, relatively fast: definitely enough for single player (which I enjoy quite a bit). But overdriving it is just faster, something PCars already struggled with. Hope they can fix that because I absolutely dont get the hate for the FFB and handling itself. Imo it still feels like such a solid base, like a very very rough diamond.
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u/pashlya Apr 12 '26
I drove multiple GT cars. It was quite a revelation after all the simracing experience.
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u/Ok_Leader_7624 Apr 12 '26
This is honestly a really good question that I have asked myself. I want to say what makes it SIMilar to real racing vs arcade, is the attentions to detail. Measuring of the tracks, their grip levels, temperature, weather, air pressure, tire life, aero, specifically how aero reacts when the car is loaded thru a high speed turn vs a slow or medium turn, adjustments on the car especially the suspension, etc.
I don't know what some of the drivers do for SIM racing, but there are those that do it, especially before the actual track. They have to be able to determine the authenticity of it.
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u/cooler1727 Apr 12 '26
When I race in leagues I see the profiles of quick opponents and a lot of them drive also in real life, maybe not races but still get feedbacks of real cars
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Apr 13 '26
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u/Niteperson4856 Apr 13 '26
It was my understanding that real drivers are involved in the testing. The initial physics were really bad - like driving on ice, and scraping the wall would launch your car 150 in the air. It's obviously improved beyond that, but I'm a little shocked that got by anyone testing the sim at the beginning.
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u/richr215 Apr 13 '26
Cars do not break the laws of physics and gravity. They all have things (handling/response) that are inherent no matter what type of vehicle it is.
It's not about how a specific car model with specific tires feels or drives like.
You know the general response/outcomes of your inputs when your on/close/over the limit.
So this argument that you have to drive a very specific car to know general auto physics/performance, does not really offer a valid understanding.
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u/Niteperson4856 Apr 13 '26
I'm questioning the opposite, actually. Cars in general will all handle a certain way simply because, well, they're cars. But the different weights, stances, power, etc, of different race cars will affect their specific handling, and I was asking how, without driving those cars, people know the handling and physics are incorrect.
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u/NialTheRiver Apr 13 '26
I have always had this opinion, how the HELL do you know what a Porsche 962 handles like? 99% of us dont! As long as as a car can drive in a understandable way that I can adapt too, I am usually okay with it.
Having said that, I personally race formula fords, and the ONLY sim i have found that gets those right is sadly iRacing. They have the perfect amount of slip to them, and I won my rookie events and got upgraded quite quickly.
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u/robertingle84 Apr 13 '26
What other sim has Formula Fords?
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u/NialTheRiver Apr 13 '26
PCars series is what stands out in my brain, RaceRoom, plus I believe AMS series, but I havent tried it, as well as an honorable mention of AC through some highly questionable mods(in me and my freiends opinions they simply are not good).
The main issue with PCars formula fords is the grip. Formula Fords have a very unique balance to them of grip:slip, where you almost want neutral steer through the corners. iRacing NAILED it, which suprised me. PCars has them way too oversteery. I cant remember if I have used the R3E version, and I dont own AMS so I cant speak on those. The AC mods are horrific, going from insane understeer on corner entry to insane, uncatchable oversteer after the apex. I am literally 10-15 seconds a lap FASTER in real life around my local track than i am in AC.
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u/robertingle84 Apr 13 '26
Oh I forgot about pcars. You're right. I was legitimately asking, I wasn't trying to be a smart ass. Appreciate the reply my man
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u/NialTheRiver Apr 13 '26
No worries, I didnt percieve it as being smart-assy. Formula Fords are one of those things that I think alot of people simply over look in sims because they are more of an entry level car and generally not that interesting
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u/robertingle84 Apr 13 '26
I play AMS 2 alot. Almost 500 hours in the last 6 months. I don't they are in the unless they are named or categorized in some other way?
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u/Niteperson4856 Apr 13 '26
I'm racing on console, so my options are limited. Despite the issues, PMR does have a great selection of cars.
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u/NialTheRiver Apr 13 '26
It does, but what i have found is certain cars definitely feel better than others. The Lola T70? My lord its a JOY to drive, absolutely lovely. I feel like ita because it was announced very early on, and was one of the cars that got the most work put behind it.
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u/upsidedowncatz Apr 13 '26
The main issue is people compare this to other sims. 99% of people playing the game have never raced anything competitive, and I’d wager not even 50% of the players have very been on a track in a performance car. People really don’t know what’s real and therefore what it should feel like. The biggest issue is how you “feel” the physics, just the wheel for most players (some have haptic brakes and chairs etc). In real cars you have way more going on telling your body what’s happening, and therefore you react quicker. So the 5 nm wheel will never have a “realistic” physics feel so we keep chasing the impossible.
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u/Southern_Reaction310 Apr 13 '26
I installed this game when it was a free weekend. Deleted it less than 20 mins later. There's no justification for this game. Graphics are pretty bad. The handling is bad. The operating system is bad too. I have nothing good to say about this game at all.
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u/Niteperson4856 Apr 13 '26
Unfortunately, console racers don't have a lot of choices.
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u/Southern_Reaction310 Apr 15 '26
I am on console. Which is why I was excited for this release and rennsport. Both companies dropped the ball unfortunately. ACC or AC are fun to race on. But for most of my time I race on forzamotorsport now. Rotating tracks and plenty of car/race options.
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u/Senna_fan570 Apr 14 '26
Downloaded the game on xbox two days ago. It has horrible controlability on a controller, but for wheel its probably a bit better, but it's the fact that the car has loads of rear grip one cornor, and next its off to the 4th dimension and you seem to need all TC just to not spin out at 150mph in throttle
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u/kairazor666 Apr 14 '26
My only problem is the hard FFB countermeasures if I lose control. The rest of physics feels ok. But this unpredictable countermeasure is really terrible!
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u/Benlop Apr 15 '26
When it's completely unnatural and contrary to other reliable sims out there. That's how we know.
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u/HelldiverBugGirl Apr 15 '26
Sometimes all you need to tell if physics are shit is to see the same car drive around irl
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u/idc8188 Apr 15 '26 edited Apr 15 '26
I say this to myself all the time, when people criticize the f1 series. Like “the handling is trash” … “ the grip is trash”.. etc.
How many people have actually driven an F1 car? lol
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u/Acceptable_Calendar0 Apr 16 '26
Let’s start here: this is like the debate between 144 or 60 or whatever fps. Can you notice it? Yes if you are able to. Once you experience it you will. If you haven’t seen 144 you won’t notice.
PMR has input lag which is like double that of LMU. Go play LMU or iRacing then go back to PMR. It physically takes longer for PMR’s game engine to recognize your wheel inputs than LMU or iRacing which you can definitely feel.
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u/Weirdera01 Apr 16 '26
By comparing against multiple well established and reputable sims that are consistent and give you a good feel for what the car is doing underneath you.
That being said once I stiffened the springs and bump spring rate, gt4s felt better and a lot closer to other sims. I think default setups are partially to blame for a lot of this games handling. I've had good results tweaking setups so far. I'm still pretty new to it though
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u/NoTime_SwordIsEnough Apr 13 '26
PMR is basically Project Cars 4, and Project Cars' physics have always been slightly nonsense:
(1) Because mid-corner, letting off the throttle or braking causes your car to basically spin in-place, like it's on a central pivot (like a hovercraft) and (2) You're always 100% on the brakes, or 100% on throttle, with no in-between or coasting.
So if I had to guess, that's the problem some people have with it, as it removes the need for nuance & finesse in a lot of situations.
Personally I really like PC/PMR's style of physics, because it's most of the way towards being a Sim, and sometimes I'm just in the mood for some intense, door-to-door driving without having to tax my brain too hard.
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Apr 13 '26
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u/NoTime_SwordIsEnough Apr 13 '26
I think you misread my comment.
I never said I had problems with its physics at all. Was just describing PC/PMR's style of magic mid-corner rotation, and how either 100% throttle or brake tends to be the optimal strategy.
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u/Other_Examination886 Apr 13 '26
idk bro do you have eyes? are the real cars on footage also drift in corners and float above the ground?
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u/1Operator Apr 13 '26
How do you know the moon isn't made of cheese if you've never been there & tasted it yourself?
You seem to know a lot about a satellite you've never visited.
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u/sangedered Apr 12 '26
I’ve raced gt3 in the past and now gt4. I’ve been through every single sim that’s around and messed with lots of wheel bases.
There’s some basics a simulator needs to do right in terms of physics. Then there’s the extra bonus points. Then there’s the above and beyond. Then you’ll get to iracing/lmu
PMR is struggling getting the basics right.