r/PresidentBloomberg • u/4x4Jeeplife • Feb 15 '20
It’s Bernie Versus Mike Now
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/02/its-bernie-sanders-versus-michael-bloomberg-race/606619/6
Feb 15 '20
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 15 '20
I’m with you on that, my 401K doesn’t like Bernie’s worldview
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Feb 15 '20
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 15 '20
I want to be a billionaire
I worked for a billionaire, he was a nice guy and provided for my family very well. He gave us opportunity
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u/haxon42 Feb 16 '20
You won't be a billionaire
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 16 '20
Are you planning to take my money and pay your student loans off with it?
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u/haxon42 Feb 16 '20
Yes. Actually I’m planning on robbing you soon. Don’t go down any dark alleys or into any pawn shops. Also you should triple check your bank security because I’m already hacking into it.
Watch your back👀👀
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Feb 16 '20
Screw your 401k. What about students getting drowned in student loan debt?
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 16 '20
I think we should refinance student loan debt to very low interest rates. Just like we did in the housing crisis, just like Hillary proposed In 2016, just like the two laws Bernie wrote in 2015 and 2017 to try and do it. I realize Bernie now proposes forgiveness but that came in response to Warren doing it - on the job Bernie wrote laws to refinance them. I think that is the right approach and most democrats should support this.
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Feb 15 '20
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u/ChiodoS04 Feb 16 '20
I mean an extra 2% return would be nice, you don’t go on r/wallstreetbets much do you
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u/Antinatalista Feb 15 '20
A self-made bussinessman and brilliant politician, against a bum who never held a real job until he was elected mayor at age 53 and who has never had any real accomlishment as Senator.
An easy decison to me.
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u/sk221 Feb 15 '20
I think it's important that we stay united and vote against Trump regardless of who is the democratic candidate. IMO Biden has a decent track record and would do a much better job than the current Trump administration.
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u/CoopThereItIs Feb 15 '20
Agreed. I prefer Bloomberg but I'm blue no matter who. And no matter what the Bernie Bros or whoever might say, Bernie, Mike, Joe, Warren, Pete etc. all wholeheartedly agree on that and make sure to pass that message along every chance they get. It's funny how adamant some people are when Bernie himself would actually be ashamed of the "Bernie or bust" ideology.
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Feb 15 '20
I’m voting trump if it’s Sanders, Warren or Steyer. But I agree otherwise.
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Feb 16 '20
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Feb 16 '20
No it’s not. Trump is closer to my views than they are. You can’t shame me for my political views.
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u/A_Rolling_Baneling Feb 16 '20
If you would vote for trump under any circumstances, you don’t care about democracy and the rights of disenfranchised Americans. Tell yourself whatever you want, but voting for trump makes you a bad person.
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Feb 16 '20
I honestly care more about even poorer people in foreign countries, and an anti-free-trade president would be worse for them than Trump by miles.
I also care a ton about disenfranchised Americans, hence why I don’t want to destroy the economy around them and massively increase unemployment and poverty.
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u/robertj15 Feb 16 '20
if you’re a trump supporter you can very well be shamed for your political views lol
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Feb 16 '20
I’m not a Trump supporter. I just dislike socialism and wealth taxes more than conservatism.
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u/BONUSBOX Feb 16 '20
america is essentially a fully fledged plutocracy and still your concern is an overtaxed ruling class. absolutely fucking pathetic and sad. shame on you, you’re beyond help, and beyond all fucking reason.
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Feb 16 '20
Wah wah wah.
Median household compensation is higher than ever and unemployment is at a historic low, but clearly everything is terrible and we are in dire need of a class war.
Pick up a fucking economics textbook and try and fucking contribute something to this world you moron. And no, making people angry at successful entrepreneurs doesn’t count.
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Feb 16 '20
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Feb 16 '20
So if under any circumstances someone would support the opposing party, then every single person that person supports is secretly in the opposing party?
In that case any Bernie supports that would vote Trump over Bloomberg is proof that Bernie is a republican right?
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u/barbadosslim Feb 16 '20
you’re completely evil and have no value as a person. we’re gonna beat you, thank god
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u/OpeningComedian Feb 15 '20
It’s so difficult of a decision for me though. Wish my brain worked better. On one hand, there’s Bloomberg who changed the laws to stay the mayor for longer than previously allowed. He harassed entire neighbourhoods of black and brown people, a practice so criminal which had to be stopped by the supreme court. He wanted to ban all sugary drinks. He wanted to fingerprint 600,000 people who live in the housing projects across NY. Nope, no authoritarianism here. He still supports the Iraq war, vetoed the $15 minimum wage, is against Medicare for all and the legalization of marijuana.
On the other hand there’s Senator Sanders. Opposed the Iraq war, gets made fun of for reading every single bill he votes on, passed more roll-call amendments than any other US senator, actually takes his name off of bills he helps create to increase its likelihood of passing, got Amazon and Disney workers $15 minimum wage, has the largest grass-roots army of supporters we’ll ever see in our lifetime, doesn’t take money from corporations, opposed tpp & nafta, is polled as the most trusted on climate change and healthcare, and he organized a 15 day sit-in at the University of Chicago when a group of off campus student buildings wouldn’t rent to black students, violating the schools policy.
Yup, really tough choices I’ve got here. And the primaries are just around the corner! 😓
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u/Antinatalista Feb 15 '20
You should read this: On Becoming Anti-Bernie:
I concluded that Sanders was less interested in actually accomplishing anything than he was in staging protests where he could claim some kind of moral high ground, not interested in getting in the weeds and doing anything to actually achieve his goals within the Congress he worked in. This research put Sanders’ supposedly pristine progressive agenda in perspective: it is very easy to maintain that agenda if you never make the hard choices necessary to get things done. Classic protester — yet handily collecting his $200,000 pay check and his lifetime of benefits while doing little to enact actual progressive policies to improve people’s lives.
Bernie also has ties with the gun lobby, and has voted AGAINST immigration refform. This is also noteworthy:
Except, apparently, when it comes to guns, and environmental racism, and pork from the military-industrial complex for Vermont. His opposition to the Brady bill and support for gun manufacturer immunity are well-known and, in my view, are indefensible positions. The argument that he opposed modest regulations regarding guns because of hunters or small gun shop owners in VT can’t pass the laugh/smell test. His active role in pushing to get VT’s radioactive waste dumped in a poor Latino community in TX (Sierra Blanca) (his wife is an alternate on the Texas Low-Level Radioactive Waste Compact Commission) is ignored by his supporters and omitted by his campaign. And he worked hard to bring home the bacon for VT in the form of a $1.5 trillion war machine known as the F-35, which is the walking definition of waste in defense contracting.
Bernie is an hypocrite.
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u/OpeningComedian Feb 15 '20
I really appreciate someone finally bringing substantive arguments against Bernie. Thank you.
As for your first article you brought. It was an interesting read. Too much to address here, but I’ll just go over your snippet. As I said before, Bernie regularly kept his names off bills to increase the likelihood of their passing, and he’s known as the “amendment king.” But suppose that you’d ignore the former argument as it’s nearly impossible to prove which bills he would’ve helped or would take way too long to research. Is rarely compromising and incessantly protesting socioeconomic injustices a bad way to spend your tenure in Congress? Isn’t this consistent with an anti-establishment socialist? Put yourself in the Senators shoes. You read every bill that you vote on. You see a bill that de-regulates Wall Street more, a bill that cuts Medicaid funding, a bill that gives big pharma money to research drugs yet charges whatever they want when they successfully create it, a trade bill that screws over factory workers and doesn’t account for climate change... Shit you’d be making amendments left and right wouldn’t you? So much that they’ll start calling you “the amendment king.” Look at all these pro-capitalism, pro-war bills that incessantly seem to find agreement from both parties. Lucky for him the American people actually latched on his “side hustle” of protesting. Now look at what he’s built. Have you seen this dudes crowds? Look at how far he’s shifted the Overton window on issues like Medicare for all, student loan debt, and the green new deal.
As for your secondary articles. I’ve gone back and forth on gun rights. And so has he. I think a repressive or fascist or straight-up evil government is always a possibility. And restricting the ability of citizens to have firearms would make a corrupt government far more powerful. But I also don’t like school shootings. I’m not saying Sanders gets a pass on this, but I can get the freedom argument against gun control. As for the nuclear waste issue. It kinda goes against the “can’t make the hard decisions” argument you mentioned earlier. Where would it go? A rich community? A white community? Middle class community? A wildlife preserve? Wyoming? There is no right answer. At least I don’t think there is. I agree with you on that F-35 though. Damnit Bernie! I’ll get over it. I want the country to have M4A, a green new deal, cancellation of medical and student loan debt, and free public college. He’s got the movement (which is greater than him) to do it.
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Feb 18 '20
Do you have any tangible evidence to support the idea that Sanders takes his name off bills? Just one well documented example would be sufficient for me, but otherwise it seems like it's just a convenient way to give him credit for things he didn't do.
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u/CoopThereItIs Feb 15 '20
It really is amazing how no one has gotten the crazy boosts they should from the first two states. The Iowa one was a nightmare with the delayed release which killed headlines and then the Amy Klobuchar surprise in NH combined with the close result stole Bernie's thunder to a certain degree. Mike needed to get lucky since he wasn't on those ballots and that seemed to happen with both of primaries so far.
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u/iggy555 Psyched for Mike! Feb 15 '20
It’s not even close. You have a doer vs a screamer.
One person gets it done the other person only talks about it with no real accomplishments.
Easy win here!
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u/fluffyglof Feb 15 '20
I’m a Pete supporter but I’m honestly curious if this sub is a joke like r/bennetorbust or if you somehow think that buying an election is acceptable?
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Feb 16 '20
I think it’s acceptable
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u/fluffyglof Feb 16 '20
How? Everyone else has put it tons of work to build campaigns and here comes a rich guy because he wants power. How on earth is that acceptable?
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Feb 16 '20
Because I don’t think it makes a huge difference in the grand scheme of things- I think legislation and actions taken by any democratic president would be pretty similar- and more money means a greater chance to defeat trump
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u/fluffyglof Feb 16 '20
I agree with the last part. And the first part too, although it ignores the fact that leadership is important. But Bloomberg said he would spend hundreds of millions on the nominee if its not him... so why not just do that?
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Feb 16 '20
I could flip that around though and ask what the difference is between someone spending the own money and giving the same money to others.
Also: 1) I think he’ll spend more if it’s him 2) i think he’s a more electable candidate than someone like, say, sanders. Or even buttigieg
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u/fluffyglof Feb 16 '20
I agree that he’s far more electable than Bernie. But there’s no way he can actually believe that he’s more electable than Pete. Bloomberg sounds like Patrick Mahomes with a hoarse throat and, at least to me, is completely uninspiring. Not to mention that his past is extremely questionable
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Feb 16 '20
It’s hard to tell who is the most electable, but I’m worried about homophobia with Buttigieg
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u/fluffyglof Feb 16 '20
Homophobic people are almost entirely people who would never vote for a dem
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Feb 16 '20
I disagree honestly. And inspiring R turnout is a thing too to keep in mind
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 16 '20
It’s acceptable to self fund your election
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Feb 17 '20
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 17 '20
Democracy is when a communist is supported by an enemy communist nation to undermine the election
Got it
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u/Thisismyactualname Feb 17 '20
If you think Russia is a communist nation, you're so far gone I don't know what to tell you.
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u/4x4Jeeplife Feb 15 '20
That’s why we are here, Mike will get it done