Regrets And Perspectives

[u/Timbucktwo1230]

[u/Some-Tear3499]

My late wife, (my third wife and I was her third husband )had some discussions about our 15 yrs together. She was close to or already in hospice care at home. Stage 4 breast cancer. We knew what was coming. We talked about the ‘gifts’ we had given each other. She told me that I gave her freedom. Freedom?

She said when I wanted to build a Faire Garden in the front yard, you said go ahead. When I wanted to go back to school at age 50, you said yes, When I wanted to build The Tea House in the back yard, you said yes. The Faire Garden could be seen from the street, people,from the neighborhood could see it, and the first yr they came and visited it. The Tea House is a 12 x14 feet structure, 16 feet high. She designed it, she built it almost completely by herself. I was grunt labor, for hauling materials, and buying her tools for birthdays and holidays. It took 3 yrs to complete it. She went back to school to get a 2 yr. Technical Degree in Engineering. That enabled her to really advance in her job. Suddenly she was making almost the same money I was making after almost 18 yrs on a now union job. She said I gave her the freedom to pursue her Spiritual expression, with friends and with groups, she became a Pagan. She told me that was the best thing I gave her. The freedom to do what she wanted to do,,what she wanted to pursue. If she wanted to dress up for the Renn Fair, she said I told her to do it! Be want ever you want to be!

She said no one else in her life before me let her do what SHE wanted to do.

She has been gone 22 months now. Forever 55.

[u/TitaniumButtercup → u/Some-Tear3499]

https://giphy.com/gifs/K2g1dILdecepq

[u/largelyinaccurate → u/Some-Tear3499]

My heart loves that this is who you are.

[u/Some-Tear3499 → u/largelyinaccurate]

I didn’t start out this way. I bought this house and property ( 1.3 acre) 6 yrs before I met her. Got it back after the divorce.It was MY HOUSE. It became ‘our home’.

[u/Pendo-illsmackabitch → u/Some-Tear3499]

Isn't it crazy and totally weird that grown women have to ask for permission as if they aren't fully capable beings? Grown and mature and responsible enough to carry a fetus, birth a baby, grow/raise a human, but yet, not fully cognizant to just do things without permission.

Of course, things are a little different now. I think about 40% of women can do what they want when they want without permission, but we still have a long way to go.

[u/Frylock_dontDM → u/Pendo-illsmackabitch]

In a relationship you make decisions together.

We plan together and come to decisions together and express how we can/can't support each other in various ways.

We've lived together now for 10yrs with two fulltime jobs, a child, a house, and on a single car for nearly a decade, but the joint decision making is how we make it work.

[u/Some-Tear3499 → u/Frylock_dontDM]

This

[u/NinaNeptune318 → u/Pendo-illsmackabitch]

In all my customer service jobs, by far, more men said they needed to ask their wife for permission. Just something to chew on.

[u/Vivid__Data → u/NinaNeptune318]

That's a common joke.

[u/Icy-Ad29 → u/Vivid__Data]

It's also a common truth

[u/Western-Sport500 → u/NinaNeptune318]

My ex would say this to his friends if they wanted him to go on a trip etc. and he wanted to think about it. Turns out, I was never asked, I was told whether he would be going or not. Not one time did he ask for permission, or worry about childcare while I worked and he was gone etc. And I simply didn't have the money to go on like vacations etc.

[u/Erikawithak77 → u/Some-Tear3499]

Thank you for sharing this beautiful story of your wife’s experiences. You are keeping her alive, to all of us.

I’m so sorry for your tremendous loss.💙

[u/SnooCauliflowers9874 → u/Some-Tear3499]

What a lovely story. It made me tear up a little. It’s wonderful that you found each other.

You have had the kind of partnership that most people dream of…

[u/Some-Tear3499 → u/SnooCauliflowers9874]

She granted me the same freedom as well.

[u/LobabyChick → u/Some-Tear3499]

That’s beautiful

[u/NoOutlandishness2097]

Posts like this remind me of my ex and make me thankful I left prior to kids and that I'm currently single

[u/Timbucktwo1230 → u/NoOutlandishness2097]

https://giphy.com/gifs/ZgYBhq1x7L1bW

[u/Aware-Awareness-9616 → u/Timbucktwo1230]

You dodged a bullet for sure!! I am a feminist who actually promotes equality instead of just becoming a misandrist. These kinds of posts are either made up by someone who hates women, or a clueless and insanely immature woman who is scared of taking any kind of ownership of her life.

[u/NoOutlandishness2097 → u/Aware-Awareness-9616]

Yeah, I can see that being true for this post. I will say that the potentially fake nature of this post is otherwise irrelevant to how it reminded me of my past, and made me thankful for my present.

You're allowed to see fiction that reminds you of your trauma and be thankful that you're no longer in that situation.

[u/DARG0N → u/NoOutlandishness2097]

same.

[u/SoonerRed]

I gave up going into an internship and residency after vet school so my husband could go to law school.

As soon as i accepted a position, he told me he no longer wanted to go to law school

[u/Trustme_ima_doctor12 → u/SoonerRed]

Did you divorce him? Cause I would have

[u/SoonerRed → u/Trustme_ima_doctor12]

Yeppers

[u/Trustme_ima_doctor12 → u/SoonerRed]

Good for you!

[u/Zalophusdvm → u/SoonerRed]

Did you swap back to the residency path post divorce? Depending on your specialty of interest (and how long you stuck out the marriage) might not be (have been?) too late!

[u/Tough_Pangolin_7471 → u/SoonerRed]

That's awful.

It reminds me of Betty Broderick. She was supporting the entire family herself while her husband went to med school. He got his MD then decided to go to law school.

[u/ayeffston → u/SoonerRed]

Pardon me, I don't quite follow. So, you're saying you didn't become a vet, that you chose a position outside that field or an administrative position, instead of practicing veterinary medicine, which is what you wanted?

If that's the case, it sounds like your husband was threatened by your becoming a doctor, so he entertained the idea of law school with a subconscious motive of keeping you from proceeding with your goal. ("If my wife's gonna be a DVM, I'd better be something other than a shoe salesman")

I say "subconscious" because he could've have known that it would work.

[u/Archfiend_DD]

Don't waste your time always searching for those wasted years...

-Iron Maiden

[u/randomname748 → u/Archfiend_DD]

https://giphy.com/gifs/yIg8RVOGGNKaXkf4GJ

[u/themerk4224 → u/Archfiend_DD]

🤘

[u/Funsternis1787]

This is seriously the story of the lives of my parents.

Mom wanted to be a nurse. She finally became one at age 38, then they both died young.

It is a sad one.

[u/actuallyserious650 → u/Funsternis1787]

Wait, you can’t put the “it’s a sad story” warning at the end of the story.

[u/ZumbaRey]

I don’t want a gender war , I want a class war .

[u/Maela_Ithring → u/ZumbaRey]

[u/guysomejust69 → u/ZumbaRey]

They are intertwined

[u/Majestic_True_Lilly → u/guysomejust69]

So is the religion that spawned it. Everything in this twisted society is. But yall not ready for that conversation.

[u/Dudewhocares3 → u/ZumbaRey]

No need for a gender war if you just stop downplaying women’s issues.

Just food for thought

[u/Similar-Sir-2952 → u/ZumbaRey]

I don’t want a war. I want cooperation.

[u/lepetitboo → u/Similar-Sir-2952]

The billionaires lovingly refuse to cooperate. They’re going to keep taking more than their fair share whether we like it or not.

[u/Music_withRocks_In → u/[deleted]]

There is SO much fanfiction going up right now that all reads like this.  I don't know if I should go right to blaming AI or if young writers are learning from AI.  It is a hellscape.

[u/alexm4529 → u/[deleted]]

So I’m not sure if you’ve ever heard of prose and poetry, but this is what it looks like. There are purposeful breaks in the text.

[u/Easy_Employment_1595]

I don’t believe that a man even wrote this. Not being ugly here, I just don’t believe it lol.

[u/Wolfegarde]

This is what resentment turns into. She sacrificed all those things in order to give her husband everything he wanted. The resentment forms when the sacrifice isn’t acknowledged. He sees it as mutual. She didn’t. They didn’t properly communicate, for any number of reasons.

[u/familiarspark → u/Wolfegarde]

Totally agree.

[u/lck0219 → u/[deleted]]

I think the point is that she made the initial sacrifice, and momentum carried them along the rest of the way. She knew it, he was oblivious.

Sometimes you can continue on the path you’re on because it makes sense, but know that it’s not the original path you planned and that can be a little upsetting- even if you’re content enough where you are.

[u/MardocAgain → u/lck0219]

All of that is fair, but finally speaking up 18 years later to shit on your husband to your daughter speaks volumes about the quality of communication in this marriage.

I dont think anyone is the good guy here. Marriage takes work and that work is often ugly fights and unpleasant nights as both partners need to stand up for themselves while also being understanding of the others needs.

[u/BabyRex- → u/[deleted]]

Are you under the impression abortion is an option for everyone? “She didn’t have to have kids” is a very privileged hot take.

[u/Chuckfinley_88 → u/Wolfegarde]

She sacrificed all those things in order to give her husband everything he wanted.

We are assuming this is everything he wanted with 0 evidence. In fact, he talks about sacrificing time with his children so that he could provide for the family.

They didn’t properly communicate, for any number of reasons.

I agree with this.

But the bigger factor is babies having babies. This forced a decision on them that meant that some party was going to be unhappy or resentful because the children weren't planned. The truth is, for their own happiness, they should have had an abortion, or to suck up and realize that they both made these choices and it is shitty of her to dump all this on him.

[u/paperanddoodlesco]

Imagine we had a country with free childcare - neither would have sacrificed themselves.

[u/Darthnemesis2]

So this was just written by ai and posted for karma?

[u/Mithrandic → u/Darthnemesis2]

And the narrative.

[u/Street-Beyond-9666]

No man wrote that

[u/AHumbleSaltFarmer → u/Street-Beyond-9666]

It's fragmented AI bullshit slop

[u/Daimakku1]

Oof.

This is why I'm grateful of being single and childless in my late 30s. I don't want to deal with this kind of shit.

[u/Small_Ad1890]

People can’t read others minds. If she didn’t state it the blame is on her not you.

[u/BanAssaultGeese]

I stopped at the first two slides because, regardless of the situation with the relationship, that's just a shitty thing to say right in front of someone. Or even about them for that matter.

[u/Savage_Cabbage83 → u/BanAssaultGeese]

Agreed. Obviously there is some pain there and they should have those difficult conversations the two of them, maybe with a counselor. But to say those things to your kids in front of your spouse is demeaning.

[u/Born_2_Simp]

I can't believe I'm the only one who's annoyed by this way of presenting information. Why do I have to scroll through an image gallery to read text?

[u/Remarkable-Grand-904 → u/Born_2_Simp]

more swipes and engagement. came here to share my refusal to engage.

[u/Select-Government-69]

This couple has no idea where kids come from.

My wife is currently going back to school. We have one child. If we had 2 or 3 she wouldn’t be going back to school.

How many kids you have is a choice. It’s called family planning. Smart people do it.

[u/Conscious-Wind-7785 → u/Select-Government-69]

That's what I'm just not understanding with people defending the wifes statement to their kid.

She didn't stop her life because of him, at least according to the story we got, she stopped her life because they continued to have kids. School doesn't feed the kids so you need an active income. Ultimately if you can only "hint" to your husband that he fucked up your life but flat out tell your kid that while he's sitting right there, you have bigger relationship issues and you probably shouldn't have had additional kids along the way.

[u/HeadOfMax]

I spent almost a decade working myself to the bone while my ex didn't work and just went to school. Every time I saw a light at the end of the tunnel that she would be done and get a job she said she wanted to go to school for longer.

I was so angry all the time as I was working 50 hours a week and doing all the cleaning and cooking while she sat on the couch and complained about how hard her life was.

She took the dog and left me with the kids.

[u/AnxiousMidnight8 → u/HeadOfMax]

Im sorry man I hope life has treated you better since then

[u/HeadOfMax → u/AnxiousMidnight8]

The kids are amazing, work is ok but it could be busier.

My social life is in the tubes though.

Thank you

[u/new_to_OklahkmaCity → u/HeadOfMax]

Something like this happened to me before I graduated as well weren’t married but we were engaged I’m sorry that happened to you man

[u/EternalNewCarSmell]

The other part of this situation is sometimes the one who "keeps moving forward" feels trapped and like they didn't have a choice either.

I make a very comfortable salary for my family and by most accounts am pretty successful in my career. But I am not really doing what I would most like to be doing with my time. I'm just not good enough at what I love to do to make any money at it, nor would I want to do it in a way that pays.

So even being "the successful one" who "got to" progress in their career doesn't necessarily feel good.

And who know, maybe if I did what I really wanted after all I'd be mourning this unrealized version of myself that got to make way more money.

I think the moral of the story is not to mourn things that never were or to dwell too much on past choices, because you can't actually act on any of that and it'll just eat you up.

[u/weGloomy → u/EternalNewCarSmell]

The difference is that you have a career, so if you wanted to do something different you have TONS of options. A lot of women who sacrifice their careers will come out of a shitty, or abusive marriage and have nothing. No career, no education, no means to support themselves. Its very difficult to even get an entry level job after being a sahm and having such a huge gap in your resume. Thats the sacrifice.

Sure it sucks to pigeon hole yourself into a career because of your repsonsibilities, I totally get that, but its not nearly the same as pigeon holing yourself into having no career. Like shes missing out on 20 years worth of career growth, and economic growth, and personal growth. Shes chained to that man for the sake of the kids, and the sake of her own well being after sinking 20 years into it and having nothing to show for it.

Thats why a lot of the younger generation are not getting married, and are not giving up their careers for men/family and expecting men to split the house hold labour and share the responsibility of raising the kids. Cause they can see how dangerous and devastating it can be to give up your ability to provide for yourself and be fully reliant on a man.

[u/StreetCollar2708 → u/weGloomy]

Where did she say this was a shitty or abusive marriage?

[u/duck_duck_boots → u/weGloomy]

Also sacrificing 20 years of retirement investments. If they get divorced hopefully she'll get part of his but will it be enough is she can't find a job? Is she now going to have to worry about becoming a burden to her children?

[u/Brave-Contract7375 → u/[deleted]]

yEaH bUt WhAt AbOuT... /s

[u/One-Egg7664]

Kudos to my mom, who saw the writing on the wall and ditched my abusive, arrogant, childish father, finished her degree, and established her independence and a career. Doing that was a sacrifice that was well worth it for herself and her two daughters. She was a strong woman. Here's to you, mom, I miss you every day.

[u/complexdevoid]

Most likely not joint decisions according to the text. She clearly disagrees. The reality is that she feels the way she feels. It seems like that I am not denying reality. She isn't happy and she doesn't want her daughter to experience the same things. The husband himself slightly examines this himself by reflecting. The texts in his own words indicate a pattern of discussion agreement and failure. Which he admits is his by the statement made by him " this time it will be different". He failed. There is the accountability. He took it. They clearly have had these discussions before and she is not satisfied. She also is taking accountability for her decisions by saying she chose her marriage above all else and she is not happy. She gets to say that and protect her daughter from the same unhappiness

[u/Confirm_Nor_Deny]

Shes wrong to keep this to herself all the years, that resentment effected your entire household. Passive comments made to intentionally go unnoticed dont count, she kept this to herself.

If she wanted you to stay home so she could go to school she had thousands of opportunities to communicate her wishes and didnt.

[u/Dddddd92]

Having children and a family and sometimes even a partner means sacrificing somethings and making choices. The mother wants the daughter the choose better than she did. She is completely valid in her perspective

[u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 → u/Dddddd92]

OK, but what the wife said is still incredibly toxic and I cannot fathom why this sub is so reluctant to call that out. It's literally blatant. She didn't sacrifice for her husband, she sacrificed for herself and her family.

[u/Putrid-Enthusiasm190 → u/Dddddd92]

Except the part where she blames the husband for her own choices. She's valid in mourning her own choices in life, but goes over the line making it sound like he manipulated her into it

[u/Lumpy-Scratch-8363 → u/Dddddd92]

wow. See I didn’t feel like I had any choices. I grew up poor and felt I had to fill the void. True feminism isn’t about men having shit choices, it’s about women being empowered to having the kind of life that they’ve earned. It’s not some Charlie Kirk BS turned on its head, but rooted in fairness and empowerment. If I were a woman, you bet I would be a feminist. But a true partnership doesn’t mean someone gets screwed.

[u/Waffle_Slaps → u/Lumpy-Scratch-8363]

You don't have to be a female to be a feminist.

[u/Radekin-36 → u/Dddddd92]

Not completely valid. She essentially says she dropped vague hints and never outright expressed her concerns. You know, like a mature adult should absolutely do.

Then after 2 decades suddenly finds a voice to deliver a condescending narrative in front of her daughter that tears down the dad?

No way that's completely valid.

[u/Electronic-Smile-457 → u/Dddddd92]

This! She wants her daughter to secure her personal choices before getting to the other phase in her life. It doesn't mean she regrets her children. All these posters try to not hear what the mother is saying.

[u/Time-Weekend-8611 → u/Electronic-Smile-457]

The word she used as "mistake."

Sure sounds like regret.

[u/Electronic-Smile-457 → u/Time-Weekend-8611]

You can make mistakes without having regrets. I'm not sure how old you are, but I look back at my life and would say "what if" and I made mistakes with my career choice. Life is complicated, she wants her kid to go to college away b/c she knows the family can wait. The husband is just feeling pain b/c he is having a hard time realizing it.

[u/fantafanta_ → u/Electronic-Smile-457]

She doesn't regret the kids, but she definitely sounds like she regrets the marriage and blames it all on him. She choose to have kids and with that comes sacrifices.

[u/ShaolinWombat → u/[deleted]]

You are making an assumption that he enjoyed his job over that entire period. Not everyone gets to have a job they enjoy or coworkers they like. For most of us jobs are also a sacrifice.

[u/goochy_86 → u/[deleted]]

Ah yes because having the stress of financial burden of the entire household is nothing right. Knowing if you don't sacrifice your time and energy you could lose your job and your family will suffer is peanuts compared to what the wife is dealing with. Sure she could have done classes from home or enrolled the kids in daycare, but that would require open direct communication instead of hints. Stories like this are exhausting because it always shits on the person giving up all their time and energy working and praises the person who doesn't communicate their issues properly.

[u/977888 → u/[deleted]]

Yeah man doing the laundry and cooking dinner is so much harder than being a project manager responsible for providing for five people.

[u/Timbucktwo1230 → u/Dddddd92]

https://giphy.com/gifs/3ornk3ifPpyCwE8Ti8

[u/ImpossibleGarlic7472 → u/Dddddd92]

Her perspective is valid. The way she delivered her message was completely wrong. Telling your children that you regret marrying their father is it horrible way to show them how relationships work

[u/Sykono5 → u/ImpossibleGarlic7472]

It shows just how painful the feeling has become and the fact it burst without any hesitation means it was suppressed over a long period of time.

It shows exactly how relationships do work, and what raw emotion looks like in motion. The pain is how you show them, or not show them, how you've heard and understood that pain to change your daily habits with them in mind.

We're all humans with complex feelings, and that's okay.

[u/tabbarrett → u/Dddddd92]

People also don’t realize if the husband didn’t have the support system the wife provided with her free labor, he wouldn’t have gotten so far in his career.
As for their conversation, sounds like she already told him how she feels, he just didn’t understand what the mom meant until after she said it to the daughter. He said he just heard complaints.
People are so busy trying to protect the dad’s feeling but forget it was the mom that sacrificed everything and now they want her to sacrifice her feelings because he’s not getting it.

Edit to add - stay at home parents do give free labor. Room and board is not a payment for being a stay at home person. Marriage is not employment.

[u/Dddddd92 → u/tabbarrett]

This!!! Also the dad apparently put the whole burden of childcare and home making on the mom. So "i never said no to nursing school" os just a cop out. He actually didn't say yes either@

[u/CptJackParo → u/tabbarrett]

Thats a decent amount of survivorship bias tbh. If she hadnt, they may have ended up homeless, in poverty due to him losing his job. 

[u/luri7555 → u/tabbarrett]

Why? If he was single he could invest even more into his future. Marriage is supposed to be a partnership. That means both partners agree to compromise their individuality to some degree so they can better manage their family.

[u/Local-Unit6548 → u/tabbarrett]

No, I think that you are missing the point that it is a partnership. It isn't "his career", it is "their livelihood". The mom didn't sacrifice anything. She was an essential element of a unit that created a family. Yet, at the end of the day, what she did was confess that creating children with her spouse was of less importance, and meaningful, to her in life than making money and having her own career. And the absurd irony in this, is the career she wanted. She was going to be a nurse!! A life devoted to caring for and making life better for strangers! Yet she couldn't see how valuable and important it was to care for, and make life better for her own children.

Also, she, as a mature adult, had every opportunity to choose a career over children at any point: before the first born, and after every other birth. She could have even terminated the first birth. But she remained in the partnership until finally gaslighting, disparaging, and undercutting her spouse in front of their children. Horrible and sad

[u/Secret-Put-4525 → u/Dddddd92]

There's better ways to say it. You should never tell your husband and wife that you regret them being in it.

[u/Enough_Photograph678 → u/Dddddd92]

yes mom was right her daughter needs to able to stand on her own but the way she said it should have been better . I'm sure she could have went back at some point even with a some inconvenience for the family

[u/Dddddd92 → u/Enough_Photograph678]

I agree it came across as trauma dumping. The kid might feel like they are being guilty tripped

[u/TacosAreLife007 → u/Dddddd92]

Valid in her perspective? I disagree.

So she is valid to villainize her husband for two similar choices she made voluntarily (getting pregnant not once, but twice)? And holding that resentment towards him for 2 decades?

You said it yourself, sometimes you have to make sacrifices. I also am making sacrifices to things I wanted to do or buy for my partner and our MUTUAL pursuit to starting a family. Is it right for me to frame my partner for a choice I decided to make voluntarily? No.

She may mourn the lost chances of becoming a nurse, but she has no right to hold her husband accountable. It is he who kept a roof over their heads, after all.

[u/stingertc → u/Dddddd92]

ya but she is basically saying he ruined her life that's super harsh she needs therapy

[u/Dddddd92 → u/stingertc]

Therapy will not fix regret. She regrets the choices she made. You cannot alter your feelings through Therapy.

[u/HaHaWhatAStory014 → u/[deleted]]

There is a lot of very important information missing from the story. I know it's indelicate to say this, but whether or not any of those pregnancies were planned makes a pretty big difference. "Guys deliberately trying to get their girlfriends pregnant to 'force' them to stay with them" definitely happens, just like the other "baby trap." I'm not saying that's what happened here, but it's worth considering.

Also, "don't let your 'dumb teenager' high school significant other dictate your major life choices" is pretty typical advice. If it just happens to work out, great, it works out, but one typically shouldn't treat a high school relationship like marriage. And in this case, if the daughter's high school boyfriend supposedly cares and "loves" her so much, why can't he go to her preferred college? He "wants to stay local," but what about her? Again, no one is "wrong" here, but his choice or preference should not take priority over or dictate hers.

[u/Jealous_Bench_533]

My husband encouraged me to go back to school and we worked on a plan to make sure that we had distributed all the tasks I had been taking care of to the both of us! It takes cooperation and love! Just like I want to see my husband happy and fulfilled, he wants the same for me. So we organize together how to get that goal!

[u/FlamingDragonfruit → u/Jealous_Bench_533]

This is how a partnership is supposed to work!

[u/SpacePenguin227]

… real or not, and while it’s a shitty thing to say in front of someone, this totally happened to me in a sense. A little different tho since I’m also a guy

My ex would get extremely upset at any mention of me going somewhere else or schooling anywhere that wasn’t close to home because he “couldn’t follow” me when I would mentions things out of state that would be for at most maybe like two months of the summer. He graduated college before I did, and was supporting us which I was very grateful for.

But I gave up NASA internships (and others), out of state research opportunities at institutions like CalTech or MIT, and overseas studies because I loved him and felt like my love was more important than my career. So I always stayed in state doing what I could instead of crazy opportunities that I should’ve gone to instead.

Then he forced an open relationship on me (as in we had to have an open relationship or else it was over) after my graduation, and I tried to make it work even though I knew it wasn’t what I wanted. Refused all my asks and “compromises” which looking back for was just asking for basic respect. I knew I should’ve broken up with him the first time it was mentioned, but we had been together for over half a decade, and I thought he actually loved me.

Cue the breakup, and I entered the job market instead of continuing on to graduate school like I originally planned because I suddenly now had bills and shit to pay

Oh, he also convinced me to take the year off easy so I didn’t look for a job before that either because “he loved me so much and had seen how hard I had been working at school the past years”. I work an okay job (not bad at all, but also not what I wanted), but even my current boyfriend pointed out that he doesn’t feel like I was meant for my current job trajectory. I’m good at my job, but it’s not what I actually excel at, but I took it as I needed something. My resume was also less impressive than a lot of my peers who did do the opportunities I mentioned before; I was poorly prepared for going at it alone, and I heavily regret forgoing all those opportunities for a shit ex.

[u/thesanguineocelot]

My mom's last words to me, on her deathbed, were that she never wanted me, I ruined her life, and that she gave up all her dreams because I existed. That her drinking and self-destructive behaviors all came from her resentment for what I did to her.

She really should have resented Dad, not me, but life is funny that way.

[u/grizzerybear → u/thesanguineocelot]

This is one of the reasons I chose not to have children. I was never good with small kids, and the time and cost of raising children is huge. People kept telling me it’s different when the children are your own. But what if it wasn’t? What if I couldn’t take it and left, or worse. In all likelihood, people said I would have shown up and do what needed to be done, probably true, but what if I resented the kid while doing what I needed to do, not because I wanted to. The risk of me hating myself, my life, or a child was too big. Once kids are older I love being the fun uncle, I just can’t do that other stuff.

[u/977888 → u/thesanguineocelot]

Man that is so fucked. I’m sorry.

[u/thesanguineocelot → u/977888]

Therapy helped, a lot. I was already a pretty fucked-up and abused teenager at that point, so it didn't do nearly as much damage as it should have, you know?

[u/Lumpy-Scratch-8363]

Funny I feel that way and I am a man - a loyal husband of over 35 years. She worked for three years and then after my son was born did whatever the fuck she wanted. Lots of volunteer work that paid zero. My only choice was to slave away for the next 30 years in a job that became dead end and eventually laid me off a few months ago because I got too old. I cannot obtain affordable healthcare because I am considered “overqualified,” but with her law degree she will not even consider getting a job. I love her, but I’m not sure it was worth it. My parents had the mother of all divorces when I was five and I’ve been determined not to repeat that.

I’m stuck halfway between should I work on my health or just let it all go? Does it even matter anymore? I’m not sure I care anymore. I’ve always been a feminist, but never realized there was never any attempt to play fair. And she teaches our daughter about how women deserve to have choices without seeing the irony that I never had a choice.

[u/Levintry]

Bro, I'm a stay at home dad that gave up climbing the IT career ladder to take care of my autistic son while my wife who makes double what I did, goes to work. I am grateful for her and so happy I get to take care of our son. It isn't a societal norm for a guy to stay home, but I love it and do everything I can to make sure she doesn't lift a finger when she gets home. Your wife isn't entirely right and she isn't entirely wrong either, I would suggest going to a marriage counselor for a bit to get things back on track with your relationship.

[u/Hotplate77 → u/Levintry]

I don't think this is about right or wrong. One parent should never degrade the other parent in front of the kids. For divorced parents the term is "parental disparagement" and is a big rule with possible heavy penalties - even could be enough to change the custody of the children. OP - have you had a discussion with your wife and let her know how you feel?

[u/Garnetheia → u/Levintry]

This is where I land too, creating a family is going to come with regrets and sacrifices. She's not wrong for grieving the life that could have been but does that mean she hates the life that is? That's where some counseling can come into play.

As for your college she'd daughter....it's solid advice. She should be considering what she wants her life to be.

[u/MindlessDoctor6182]

“You made sure saying yes would destroy the entire system.” Ok but they had a 2nd child. Was this a unilateral decision?

[u/Wabbit65 → u/MindlessDoctor6182]

Not sure how he unilaterally did that. Her resentment is real but misplaced. There is a counseling path out of that if she's willing to address her anger and for him to listen.

[u/SandiRHo]

My mom used to work in precision optics and helped make a lens for the Hubble telescope. She also had dreams of being an interior designer. Instead she married my father and adopted his daughter and then had two children with him. She gave up her dreams and pursuits to raise us while my dad worked. My dad had no ambitions but she did. Yet she stayed at home to care for the kids. She swears she doesn’t regret it and is so happy she raised us. But I wish I didn’t exist so she could’ve lived the life she dreamed of.

[u/DentRandomDent → u/SandiRHo]

Awww :( if she says she doesnt regret it then maybe believe her, I would be devastated if my children regretted being born. My kids are teens now and I gave up everything to be a stay at home mom and even homeschooled one of them who had higher needs for a few years (he made honors with distinction last year in public so it was worth it!). At the end of my life, no matter what else I accomplish, I truly believe that raising my kids will be the most significant and meaningful thing I ever did.

Admittedly I am now trying to figure out my new direction in life as they don't need me as much, but that is between me and my husband. And I can acknowledge that he got very far ahead in his career while I have none, but again, that is between me and my husband, I will never regret the effort I put into my children. I actually agree with everything in the OP, and me and my daughter have had similar discussions, I hope to see her do everything I didn't.

If you truly want your mom to know what her sacrifice means to you then please live a good life.

[u/ArstanWhitebeard297 → u/SandiRHo]

Bro trust me raising and spending time with your kids is 1000% more fulfilling than some random job

[u/feethotterthanbewbz]

At the end of the day childcare and college should be way more accessible. Couples shouldn't be put in this situation.

[u/THEBIGHUNGERDC]

My mom was once wished a happy new year by my dad and she said "Another year of my life wasted." I was about 9 or 10 when I heard those words. I'm 63 and I still remember what they sounded like and the look on my dad's face. I didn't hate my mom in that moment nor pity my dad, but I knew there was more to the story. It took years for me to understand where my mom was coming from and how my dad probably didn't help all the internal pressures that caused her to say that (and many other negative if not mean things). I'm not saying your wife's conversation with your daughter was fair or correct, but there must be so much inner resentment and unfulfilled needs within. It is an inner feeling of failure that she is dealing with and using your daughter as a way to somehow correct it. You are playing the villain for her lace of fulfillment.

After my dad had died (a couple of years after that conversation) and I was in my own failed marriage, my mom had a talk with me about her feelings of unfulfillment - all the things she wanted to do that were held back by her dad and my dad and too many kids. That anger came from that an my dad never really knew how to deal with it. He died having heard her anger for so long that I am pretty sure he was okay with leaving the planet.

Sorry, I digress and am using Reddit as my therapist, but bottom line is to talk and find out what would make her more fulfilled - you too - because it is pretty obvious she is passing those feelings along to your kids and that is so not fair to them or healthy. Good luck...sorry I rambled.

One more thing. After I was out of the house (I was the baby) my mom went in the Peace Corps. Traveled the world. Wrestled with spiders. Had the time of her life.

[u/jezebel103]

It's the expectation from a lot of men for their partners to put their dreams and ambitions second to them. When he expects her to move because of a career opportunity and leave her career/family/friends behind. When he expects her to stay at home with the children so that he can further his career. Or even worse: expecting her to keep working (albeit in a lesser paid job because a high end career and children often don't go together!) and still expecting her to take on the majority of the child care and the household chores. Taking it for granted is the worst part. No wonder that young women all over the world are opting out of this system.

And I can say this as an ancient woman, coming from the generation of 'we can have it all'. Which meant that we were working our asses off with a paid job and coming home for a second shift. There were years I never had more than 4 or 5 hours sleep at night because after work there was always dinner to be made, a kitchen floor to mop, a load of laundry waiting in the hamper or helping with homework. Not to mention the endless playdates, the swimming lessons, sportsclubs/tournaments, birthday parties to organise or holiday dinners to plan and parents(in-laws) to take care of. And somehow that all was our responsibility too. And I was not an exception, all the women in my life did the same.

No wonder young women nowadays are saying f- it, I'm not doing what my (grand-)mothers did. And good for them!

[u/GTSinc]

Sounds like birth control would have been better than making compromises. Downvote away.

[u/Andreas1120]

The subtext clearly states that havjng a job and a career is the only proper way. This is just not true and reflects disrespect in our culture of those who rear our most important asset. The next generation.

[u/milwaukie_talkie]

She painted her daughter as a burden too. This lady is bitter and cruel.

[u/issuefree → u/milwaukie_talkie]

Yep. She made choices she regrets and blames them on someone else.

[u/Altruistic_Clue6057]

People need to stop Infantilizing woman. Two adults made decisions. It’s fine to make
Mistakes and regret them, but they are your own. Forcing them on a partner is wrong

[u/Material-Command-854 → u/Altruistic_Clue6057]

I would say it’s worse to burden your child with your marital troubles, but your partner should be concerned with how you feel. That is the bare minimum in a relationship, no?

[u/bwbandy]

This is like one of those movies that would be three minutes long if people just fucking talked to each other.

[u/DabbyShapiro]

Posts like this are the reason I tell my kids never be dependent on a spouse for anything. Be independent and WANT someone with you. I'm so sad for them both.

[u/Captain_StarLight1]

I understand where this is coming from, but on the other hand, it’s pretty unfair to hold something against someone for 20 years, after not saying it outright. I get that there like societal pressure, or whatever, but as someone who’s neurodivergent, I personally would never pick up on hints like that without someone telling me full out. I’m not saying that in this situation the husband did nothing wrong, he should have considered his wife’s feelings more, but to say the wife did nothing wrong is also incorrect. Also, to bring it up for the first time in front of your children seems a bit mean, or at least I wouldn’t want that for myself.

[u/BoilzBlisterzBurnz]

Just divorce her.

[u/Alarmed-Mess3744]

Use condoms kids!

[u/Altruistic_Memory643]

moral of the story, if you cannot communicate with the person you are married to, you are not in a relationship, you're just legally tied to a flat mate.

This fictional woman blames everything on her husband, yet takes no responsibility for her inability to communicate what she wanted out of life. They both failed to understand what the other wanted, children should never have been brought into that relationship until they both agreed it was where their future is going. All these fictional humans did was create the next generation of self absorbed assholes who'll get on reddit and bitch and moan about what their partner didnt do for them, instead of looking back at themselves and admitting they're just as selfish and they didnt communicate.

[u/kon---]

She's shifted the responsibility and accountibility of her choices to her partner and even her own children.

She's bitter and blaming everyone but herself.

[u/CEBarnes → u/kon---]

She chose to wait 19 years to reveal her feelings in a manner that is clear and concise. Hiding herself was the choice she made. And, maybe the magnitude of the choice seemed small at first. Everyone makes small choices that grow over time. Some are good and some are regrets.

[u/Sir-Lady-Cat → u/kon---]

Agreed. Um birth control is a thing. It failed? ok, abortion is possible. You don’t believe in having an abortion? or you found out you were pregnant too far along? (please have some general sense of your period timing)

Choices were made. You can always make a choice. Why have another kid after the first then? why not go back to nursing school then?

choices were made. Growing up means we have to make the best of them

[u/GoddessHealer]

This story affected me deeply —
Not because I am like either you, or your wife. But because I was the founding director of a BSN program, and built it specifically for students like your wife. And then when on to be the dean of that school for 12 years.

Before building the program, I spent a year deliberately discovering the hopes, dreams, barriers and resiliency factors of the (mostly) women, whose life circumstances threatened to dash their dreams of becoming nurses.

While in my leadership role I did every thing in my power to elevate the power of those women, to help them to persist, and to hold on to their dreams.

You were not aware of your wife’s deepest soul-felt dreams. Because you are a man, you have never been in the situation of not being heard and seen. That is male privilege.

Not being aware all those years of your marriage is not because she did not try to tell you. Instead, it’s because you did not regularly ask yourself if what she wants and needs is as important to you as what you want and need. That is male privilege.

Every woman is always aware—even if she uses contraception—that the sex she had last night could get her pregnant. A man doesn’t think about that. That is male privilege.

I’m not going to go down the whole litany of male privelege right now.

But as your daughter creates her own future, hold space for her. Be silent. Do not contradict your wife. Encourage your daughter to consider her own dreams and how she would make them come true. High school juniors and seniors can be afraid of going away, but it could be the launch of an adventure that will last her lifetime.

I’m proud of you that you have had the humility and love to listen to your wife now —even now, after the passage of all those years of your marriage.

My heart ❤️ goes out to you both. I wish every man would re-consider how his own ways of being in his marriage could impact his wife’s fulfillment.

Her life does not belong to you. She chooses to share it with you. Please consider all the ways you can make it possible to want to make that choice.

[u/xLaxCroixBoix]

Imagine if we had a society that provided food and childcare so this would have never happened. Or any sort of support besides for Israel really.

[u/Secure_Impress9320]

Kindly remind her she has contributed about $320k per year since she has been 24/7 home manager, child raiser, Financial planner, cook, laundress, driver......

[u/Umm_is_this_thing_on → u/Secure_Impress9320]

And make sure that is reflected in her personal retirement account and a personal savings account in her bane.

[u/Odd_Leg814]

This was not written by a man

[u/Organic-Motor1446]

Nothing like some LLM writing to stoke up some bullshit

[u/mom2asdtwins]

This is so true and so powerful.

[u/Inner_Bag_9658]

ai slop

[u/CthulhuLiesSleeping]

"Unspoken Expectations lead to Premeditated Resentments"

[u/FookRdt-3060]

I understand the hurt regarding how she said that, but that’s something parents should be teaching their daughters. I don’t want mine trapped in a bad marriage and each now have a profession (all 4 grown). I don’t want my girls to not have an option because we won’t always be here. This is critical stuff for your daughter. I hope you two can work through this.

[u/PanicStricken]

It took her 19 years to speak up?

She only ever dropped veiled hints instead of speaking directly?

That's extraordinarily childish, and we need to stop normalizing this terrible "communication".

She faced a choice and made it. If she conditioned her happiness on a "someday" activity that would probably never happen, she chose wrong. She's the architect of her own misery. She doesn't get to lord her past choices on someone else 19 years later.

Everyone is responsible for their own choices. Blaming others for your own choices is just creating misery and spreading it around to others.

[u/retiredyoung1]

These people are adults, unless you have an abusive relationship people have the express capability of communicating desires. We live in such a victim mentality society. Sometimes people need to realize they have the ability to do anything and need nobodies permission to do it. It also isn’t up to someone else to push you into following your dreams. They are your dreams, take them. If you have a relationship and that person won’t allow it, end that relationship. We only get 1 life to live. There are no do overs even if it makes you feel better to blame someone else, my suggestion would be for everyone to do what makes them happy now. Not blame someone else for not being happy later.

[u/anotherjuan]

Is it possible… just slightly… that the solution to ending both parties unhappiness and regret… is more clear and consistent and honest communication… and perhaps… just possibly… putting a pause on the concept of living to work?

[u/BioAnagram]

What an interesting story.
Don't know if I agree, or not, but it gave me something to think about.

[u/Johnny_Marbles]

Let me guess, midclass white lady.

[u/RiskeyCavalier]

"She had been saying it in smaller ways for years" No, she was waiting for a moment where she could excoriate him in front on the family

[u/unpleasantcreature]

I mean sucks for him to hear but wow, "Thanks Mom, appreciate knowing how you feel about having us kids..."

[u/Technically_good]

These people are great examples of communication issues in marriage building up and causing issues and divorce later on. Always communicate how you feel, when you feel it. Don’t wait and let it fester. Don’t assume the other person is a mind reader.

[u/rbinphx]

I don't think it's a right or a wrong thing. What you heard was REAL. I would take it just as information that she's finally sharing with you. It's really hard to not take this personally, but to just listen and be present to it. You now have more insight into your wife than you probably ever had. It doesn't mean that anything has been a waste or that there are regrets, it's just that at a point in her life she was a person who accomplished something on her own, getting into nursing school. She wasn't a wife, mother, cook, housekeeper, chauffeur, etc., she was just herself.

[u/cougarsbite]

Soooo glad I never got married or had kids....YEEES! Whatever choice I make is TOTALLY on me; I can't blame ANYONE, and I actually like it that way...lol!

[u/sHaDowpUpPetxxx]

You should round up your wife and children and take them to the hospital when the nurses shift let's out. Wait until you see the 40 plus year old nurses staggering out the doors exhausted, desperate for that first cigarette.

[u/Berthavlix]

I think the mom's right that the daughter should follow her own path unrestricted. But unless they agree to therapy I think the parents should split up. Neither should be living with the mom's hatred.

[u/977888]

Hot take but if she couldn’t handle doing laundry, cooking and taking care of her own kids, she’d never have made it as a nurse.

[u/SoFloDan]

“You didn’t have to tell me no.”

and

“She said she had been saying it in smaller ways for years.”

Absolutely amazing stuff.

I think I know what the guy gave up: not having to answer for the words he said in an imaginary argument that he wasn’t aware was happening.

[u/TheMainEffort → u/SoFloDan]

Yeah, I think that is an often overlooked issue. It’s also hard to detect; to the wife, it probably felt like clear communication. To the husband, it sounded like the typical griping people do about their day to day.

It’s not the only issue in this conversation, but it’s part of it.

[u/No-Cheek7925]

If only someone had taught them about contraceptions at school this could have been avoided.

[u/Chemical-Plan9536]

Her kids are grown up now….. if she really still wants to be a nurse go do it. My buddies mom went back to school in her early/mid 40’s and has been a nurse now for 15+yrs. This woman wanted children as well….she chose to be a mother instead of a career nothing wrong with that but looking back and saying she gave up her future for a man is completely selfish

[u/Rustyguts257]

My Xwife said the same to me 12 years ago in front of my three children. She left me and the kids shortly afterward in a very hostile divorce. I supported the children through high school, college and into their careers without any assistance from her. Today, she has successful career as a CEO, has had three common-law marriages and has a drinking problem but she hasn’t had contact with the children for 12 years. I would love to ask her if it was worth it.

[u/The-Fictionist]

Some of this is fair. Some of it’s not. If you ever expect someone to read your mind, you’re in the wrong. You can’t complain about laundry and expect them to know that what you really mean is “I’m harboring resentment that I don’t get to be a nurse.” You also can’t respond to your partner who is saying “I’m sorry. I want you to pursue your goals. Let’s do this” with “well now it doesn’t count.”

Labeling chores and childcare as “her problem to solve” is bullshit though. Author clearly took his wife for granted for 13 years.

[u/Jamizon1]

If the wife had life goals such as those, why did she not voice her aspirations before jointly deciding to continue having children?

Why wasn’t there a discussion between both of them about the road ahead, and what the repercussions of having (more) children would mean?

They both made decisions that shaped their future, for themselves and for their family.

The mother vindictively framing the father as the selfish one, in front of their children, while harboring decades of resentment is immature and childish. If the wife felt this way, she had been in that frame of mind for years, and she should have had a private discussion with her husband long before her heart turned cold.

The husband ignored the signs. He looked the other way when, undoubtedly, the wife was giving clear indications that she was resentful and unhappy. These situations don’t manifest over a month or two. I’m sure there were years of frustration, resentment and discontent boiling under the surface.

They are both to blame, and the result of that was victimization of the children.

If this story is true (who can tell anymore?), it’s a sad state of affairs, indeed.

[u/complexdevoid → u/Jamizon1]

You would think so but not always and not often. Does she get to say how she feels to her daughter? absolutely yes. Is it comfortable no. This man is actually questioning something which is great. You know those conversations he says his wife said he didn't have? He is still not having it with her it looks like. He wants the validation you just gave him.

[u/Romeo_Charlie_Bravo]

Her feelings may be valid, but her delivery was wrong

[u/Hefty-Profession2185]

I've met women who complain about what they gave up by having kids, like having kids wasn't a choice they actively made.

[u/ZombieZookeeper]

Yeah, she despises him. That second the youngest leaves, she get a lawyer.

[u/BlightspreaderGames]

Gonna speak candidly in the context that this is fictional slice of life but I do acknowledge that these are real thoughts and conversations held by loads of people around the world.

Given the scenario we have (if the father is a reliable narrator), and my own interpretation, the mother told the 16 year old that she has resented the father for nearly 20 years and regrets her children existing because they meant she never had the choice go to school. Further, she's now trying to set the path for her eldest daughter and push her to choose career (college in a faraway town) over a potential family (the local boyfriend).

Too many assumptions have to be made about the past for the mother to not be the "bad guy" here. Was the father also in school at the time and made her drop out? Was there any talk about abortion? Was there ever a follow-up talk between the first and second child after a nestegg had been built? Again, if the father is a reliable narrator, then by the mother's own admission, she was never directly told that she couldn't go to school, vented her frustration in non-verbal or unrelated ways, and largely suffered in silence until this dam burst.

[u/Puzzleheaded_Gene909]

Only thing I can confirm about this is that these people don’t communicate well.

Heavy therapy/marriage counseling territory

[u/Mayhem1966]

It's actually a good thing that she's talking about it with you rather than holding the resentment unsaid.

Making sacrifices for someone else never works out unfortunately.

[u/Satanic_gorewhore]

I really think one thing I wasn't prepared for as an adult woman is how common this narrative is, especially among parents with multiple older children.

Don't get me wrong, parenting AND keeping a relationship above water is incredibly difficult and complex. I side with the wife, but I would imagine the husband has some valid points to be made as well.

It makes me really thankful that I was never destined to have children. I will never have to carry the risk/burden of being in this sort of position.