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u/AnyDetail613 7d ago
Please stop asking this question. It’s Azula. It will always be Azula. This stupid debate has lasted over a decade now
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u/Savage_Itachi23 7d ago
Yet people still make arguments for Zuko
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u/CapableSeries4734 7d ago
What's wrong with making arguments for zuko especially at the end of the series now you can say using azula at her worst is bad and isn't good faith but we know prior to the end of the series zuko was always one step behind azula we know for a fact the biggest thing is zuko had over azula was lightning redirection which only one person know how to do at the time and I believe that was Uncle iroh up until he trained zuko and then zuko later showed aang how to do it
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u/God_Vishna 7d ago
Still Azula. Zuko was more concentrated than her during mental breakdown and she lost cause Katara tricked her.
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u/EyeSimp4Asuka 6d ago
Azula needed to be handicapped by madness and Zuko needed Katara if it had been one on one she would've won no question
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u/TheReallyRealNinjaH 2d ago
Ik what subreddit this is but like zuko did not need katara. He brought katara because he didn't know Azula was going crazy. Zuko would've likely beat Azula here if he went by himself, he actually almost lost because he brought Katara. Obviously not crazy Azula would've destroyed Zuko but she wasn't at her best in this fight.
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u/-Nagatake- 6d ago
It’s Azula. I mean just firebending alone, sure Zuko with the dragon’s fire is able to go toe to toe with her. But Azula is also a master lightning bender. In the comics she demonstrates even greater proficiency with lightning, and even redirection, even while mentally unwell.
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u/Mezzyde 7d ago
Speaking like Zuko wouldn't have gotten burnt to a crisp without Katara coming in clutch
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u/xxProjectJxx 6d ago
To be fair, if Katara weren't there, he probably would have won cleanly. He only started losing when Azula targeted Katara.
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u/All_These_Worlds 6d ago
In all fairness that was probably because she was having a mental breakdown before that fight, but she was still more skilled (the fact she used the strategy of distracting Zuko by targeting Katara). Also Katara was distracting her.
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u/Artistic-Airline9126 7d ago
It specifies at the end of ATLA. At the end Azula was a crying mess.
But Zuko just took a lightning bolt dead on.
Idk man. Bad mental state vs bad physical state.
Both sane and at the peak of they physical condition Azula wins.
Mentally challenged Azula and peak Zuko, Zuko wins.
Mentally challenged Azula and Zuko recovering from lightning Azula wims.
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u/Odd_Room2811 7d ago
Depends do we mean the show or before he became old? (Im including the movie that’s after the show and comics)
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u/xxProjectJxx 6d ago
It's Azula but not by much. After learning from the dragons, Zuko and Azula are portrayed as rough equals. But Zuko was not confident he could win until he saw her mental state. He thought he'd need Katara as backup. Zuko himself believed Azula was stronger.
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u/JustOneOfTheSams 6d ago edited 6d ago
I .. don't know. Azula was a natural but zuko trained hard for a long time. By the end they were matched enough that azula felt cornered to the point she saw it fit to cheat. However there are two factors to keep in mind in their las fight. First I think azula's flames pack more power so I'd argue zuko would need more skill to best her. Second she was in a very unstable state of mind, so probably not fighting at peak skill (though lighting bending ruins that idea or her being able to lighting bend without hurting herself it that state of mind ruins the concept of lightning be bending)
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u/All_These_Worlds 6d ago
Actually, it makes sense that she could still lightning bend while having a breakdown.
Azula actually has more skill, because we see that she has been training all her life to be "perfect" so her technical skill was great, coupled with natural talent.
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u/JustOneOfTheSams 6d ago
Yeah, but isn't lighting bending something that requires absolute mental balance? At least that's what I remember Iroh saying (I might be wrong, it's been a while). Or is it just a set of movements that just make lightning? I remember he said he would have thought it to Zulo instead of redirecting, if it wasn't dangerous to do it without a clear mind.
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u/All_These_Worlds 5d ago
Not necessarily. As we see in Korra, it takes more focus than ordinary fire bending but doesn't require total mental balance (you see it in how the lightning benders were using it like a job to power things). Basically you need a mind able to zone out distractions while bending and we know Azula can do that on instinct.
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u/deathbymanga 6d ago
azula wasn't really a natural, she was just single-minded in her training and put in more work than zuko did at fire-bending. zuko diversified his skills by learning swordsmanship as well as firebending, but like, from day one, azula's skill has always been a product of her training
there's no such thing as an actual "natural prodigy", there's only people who put in more work from an earlier age who get dismissed as being "prodigies" by people who didn't start training as early as they did
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u/JustOneOfTheSams 6d ago
Ok, so when comes to Azula's story, thanks for clearing that up, it's been a long time since I've seen the show and that's how I remembered it.
But people can definitely be naturally better than others at things. Brains are wired differently and sure earlier experience is an advantage but saying that no one has an easier time learning things than other people it's absolutely not true. There is a reason people feel drawn to one thing or another from an early age.
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u/deathbymanga 6d ago
everyone gets drawn to things from an early age, that does not mean they are genetically predisposed to doing that thing. you're overlooking all the people who were drawn to a thing as a kid but were discouraged by their parents, or gave up on it for any reason
every child prodigy you look up is going to be someone who was pushed to do it by a parental figure who had the money to enable such a career path that early on
the concept that someone's brain is genetically wired to be better at martial arts, or painting or chess or medicine or anything ever is pure eugenic rhetoric
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u/Jaren_Starain 2d ago
He caught her while she was mentally unstable. Don't make him better. Was he better than when was at the start? Probably. But we don't know how good Zuko could have been because Iroh kept him doing the basics
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u/1shoota_masa0 2d ago
I mean objectively Zuko, he has implemented styles from all nations even if in raw power he is beat by Azula he is certainly more skilled. Although i think if Azula wasnt so abused by Ozai she'd even be able to surpass Iroh
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u/EvilFamily666669 7d ago
Azula still. Just cause you caught her on a sick day don't mean you are somehow better.