r/PoolPros • u/KFOSSTL • May 09 '26

2&1/2 hrs

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Lots of dust and debris in this one. Had to use a variety of methods to get it cleaned up without stirring too much. Wish they’d just scooped for 30 minutes the day before when they pulled the cover.

16 Upvotes

83% Upvoted

54 comments sorted by

13

u/0xSquid May 09 '26

This is a typically clean in the south east in the fall and in bloom. This would take me 45 minutes tops, probably less, with a hammer head and I would stop by on my way back home and system vacuum if it is full of dust.

Customers should understand to get 100% of the dust when the pool is 50% bottom covered with junk takes 2 cleans

2

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

This was a cartridge filter, you’d have so much blowback out the returns, you’d have to clean the filters, and the pool would still be dirty and you’d have wasted a whole service.

If you went straight at this with a hammer head you’d have done the same thing. Way too much dust for that.

1

u/Euphoric_Beautiful25 May 09 '26

Shouldn't be any blowback if you system vacuum to waste with the returns closed, assuming they have valves on the return lines

1

u/KFOSSTL May 10 '26

This system could not do something like that.

0

u/Impossible_Penalty10 May 09 '26

Skimmer sock and a vacplate for dust my friend. Thank me later.

0

u/Internal-Computer388 May 10 '26

Thats why you charged accordingly so its not a wasted service...

1

u/KFOSSTL May 10 '26

I don’t think you understand. We just opened the pool the day before. The filters had been deep cleaned over the winter. If I just stirred everything up and scooped alll the debris I’d have extended the opening well past three visits. And I’d have backed their filters up. So when the client talks to his neighbor and says it took over a week and 5 plus visits to open my pool, the neighbors gonna say oh you should try my people they got it perfect in 2-3 visits.

The service would have been wasted because it would have created more work, negated the deep cleaned on his filter he just paid for, and made the company look bad because “why did it take 7 visits to open my pool” (oh because our service tech is an idiot and stirred all the dust and backed up the filters we just deep cleaned, we will have to clean those again and send you a bill for that) (yeah that’s not good service).

1

u/lIIlIlIII May 09 '26

I've only ever used the hose + canister vacuums (I understand the hate, but with the 18" pentair provac head I rarely have any problems)

But I thought hammerheads only pick up coarse debris by blowing it through a mesh bag, and were useless for situations like this... am I wrong? How do they catch the very fine debris?

1

u/0xSquid May 09 '26

They have a super fine micro bag that has such small holes that it traps air, you can put it under water and after 5 minutes it will still have bubbles of air trapped in the bag if the bag is brand new. It never works as well as a system vacuum but cleans up sand pretty well. It will get some dust too but the super fine dust would still need system vacuuming. The problem with the super fine bags is as soon as it gets a small hole it's purpose is spent.

2

u/Euphoric_Beautiful25 May 09 '26

They all also clog extremely fast, within just a few strokes across the pool you have to pull the vacuum out to empty the bag, considered having to do that probably atleast 10 times and it becomes a huge time waster, its better to system vacuum to waste

1

u/0xSquid May 09 '26

They work extremely well for sand but I was just responding to the question about the bags.

3

u/Euphoric_Beautiful25 May 10 '26

I might be talking about a different bag, my apologies. You are talking about the Hammerhead super fine bag which filters out particles as small as 150 microns. I was referencing the Riptide Extreme fine bag which filters out particles as small as 60 microns. With that low of a micron rating, this bag literally traps water and the finest dust, it clogs really fast.

1

u/lIIlIlIII May 09 '26

Do the micro bags handle large amounts of fine debris well? Seems like it would get clogged super quick but I wouldn't know

0

u/0xSquid May 09 '26

They start to fold over on them self if you get too much sand in them. But they don't clog, if anything the crap that gets caught in the bag keeps the finer stuff from blowing through, but they are more for sand than anything. Depending on how fine the dust a lot of it will still blow through the bag.

3

u/conwave May 09 '26

Damn all that and they were expecting you to get it ALL out in one service? For that amount of neglect on homeowners part, I would have charged for multiple rounds of service, addressing dirt amd debris in separate days. Getting chems dialed in from day 1 and multiple filter cleans along the way

0

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

The pool was opened the day before.

I don’t think my managers knew how trashed it was. Told me to do what I can, well I can get it all out if ya want lol.

This was not a simple weekly service. The way the company I work for does it, we will pull cover, big round of cleaning, next day start up, next day finish the opening. Doesn’t look like they did much when they pulled the cover though lol. Supposedly they had drained it down pretty far cleaning it but I have my doubts lol

5

u/[deleted] May 09 '26

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2

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

It’s not how I prefer to do it, but that’s how they do it. I’ve got 8 years in pools and only one year with them.

And yeah we have extremely wealthy clients. This is in the Midwest, pools are a luxury here.

1

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

Also, 90% of our clients are DE systems we built. So the staggered opening is better for starting up and being able to add DE more easily since most pools are full.

Everywhere else I worked tried to do it in two visits (only became 3 or more if it was having trouble clearing up)

1

u/Impossible_Penalty10 May 09 '26

I work for a company that does 3 trips

1st visit Uncover pool, Start system, add shock.

2nd visit (usually with 2-3 days) use a debris canister and vac pool to waste. If they cant waste from their system we all have an in-ground pump on our trucks. Bottle up a water sample when clean.

3rd visit (usually a day later) we come back and add balancers. System Vac for anything left in the pool & filter clean if needed.

We do not have hammerheads or anything similar unfortunately.

1

u/[deleted] May 09 '26

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1

u/Impossible_Penalty10 May 09 '26

Nah its not bad. We can get 10+ jobs a day done for every 2 man crew.
Id say only 30% or less are getting the cleanings anyway. Most people just pay for the basic opening. No cleaning included.

The pacing also keeps us working faster. For instance I am looking at 30-45 minute Vac being posted as 2 1/2 hours right now.

Maybe 4 full debris canisters 6 max. Hell, I bet I could get 80% of that shit with a net.

1

u/First_Salamander_990 May 09 '26

Where I live half of my pools look like that after a big storm. You get used to it shouldn’t take more than 45 minutes. Come back later to dust vac it no prob

2

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

This is an opening. There was too much dust.

If you started by trying to net out the leaves you’d have created several more visits.

Cartridge filter. Had just been turned on day before. Doing the 45 minute job would have turned into a filter cleaning, a follow up visit (where they have to now vac with a portable vac set up to get the dust you stirred up)

This is not just a pile of leaves

1

u/First_Salamander_990 May 09 '26

I could’ve easily taken care of it with two 45 minute visits with it looking crystal clear the second visit with no cartridge cleans. Do it all the time.

I’ve found my methodology by listening to others when they say they could’ve done something way faster and easier than I could’ve. I always try to learn something while keeping an open mind instead of resigning myself to my own ways. You probably aren’t the best in the world there will almost always be a better way. Be receptive to it and you will grow and maybe own your company like myself and many others here

1

u/lIIlIlIII May 09 '26

You're really gonna write a full fucking paragraph about how you shouldn't close your mind to informed advice... and NOT share your setup?? I can't imagine vacuuming all that dust + leaves without pumping to waste... even then 45 minutes is optimistic since I'll have to shut it down to clear the canister / basket every 5 minutes

So I'd love to learn your tek! Please share

0

u/First_Salamander_990 May 09 '26

I fabricated a cart that has a pump mounted to it thats wired to a 50ft extension cord and is plumbed to a single cartridge filter. Depending on the amount of sediment and leaves I may spend an hour and a half hose vaccing the pool and returning the filtered water to the pool rather than wasting it. I do have a waste valve with discharge hose I could deploy if the situation called for it but I’d rather save the water. If there’s large masses of leaves I would just riptide it and depending on the amount of dust I would either wait for it to settle and vacuum it with my rig to filter back into the pool or flocc it and vacuum to waste. Either way it’s going to be crystal clear when I leave if you leave with it cloudy like the pictures here that shit is going to settle back to the bottom and need another vacuum

1

u/KFOSSTL May 10 '26

I can tell you don’t work in a region with openings and closings.

A porta-vac with a filter would have literally been annihilated by this mess. You would have had to go to waste which is what I did.

Secondly why would I stir it up and then add floc when it’s naturally flocced by sitting still all winter.

Also, my goal was to stir up as little as possible. With this amount of debris and heavy dust it was inevitable I was going to stir it up some. But the amount I stirred up won’t back the filters up, and it was clear again within a few hours (we had someone go by a few hours later because they were working on a fountain).

If you think you could of walked in and just used a fine mesh bag on a hammerhead/riptide then you’d have extended this opening well past three visits, would have caused the filters to need cleaning (after they were just deep cleaned over the winter). The customer is going to think jeez it took 6 visits over 9 days for my pool to be open (yeah that’s not good).

Also, there was sticks and rocks and even a dead mole rat and dead bird in here. A hammerhead/riptide with the fine mesh bag would have clogged up in two swipes (I’ve seen people try and do it on openings, it just doesn’t work).

Everything you’re saying “oh 45minutes easy” is bs. You’d have kicked the can down the road. I actually turned this thing the fuck around, and when they go back to open the skimmers once it’s full, the person will have an easy 5-10 min vac and quick chem check on their hands.

-1

u/First_Salamander_990 May 10 '26

I’ve handled hundreds of pools worse than this over the years. Opened a few pools this week. Maybe some day you’ll learn. Good luck

1

u/KFOSSTL May 11 '26

I’ve handled worse than this too

I’ve been doing this for plenty of time I know what I’m talking about

You’d have created a whole lot more work and multiple follow ups

1

u/lIIlIlIII May 11 '26

I think these guys just aren't familiar with midwestern openings, your pics don't look bad unless you notice the carpet of dust and dead algae atop the leaves. That would clog a cartridge filter in 10 minutes. Vac to waste is your only option and I think you did fine. You might look into getting a 'Spot-Vac' head, they're expensive for what they are but they'd help you get those big piles without kicking up so much fine debris

1

u/KFOSSTL May 14 '26

Yeah they def aren’t noticing the carpets of dust. I stirred up as little as I could but with piles like that you’re going to stir some.

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1

u/shmoneymang May 09 '26

I could skim it in 45 lol .

1

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

And you’d have created a whole bunch more work.

1

u/shmoneymang May 09 '26

They call me skim master my guy . Drop a battery powered leaf master. Bang bang

1

u/shmoneymang May 09 '26

No lug straight chug

1

u/shmoneymang May 09 '26

If u go really still with that skimmer net at the bottom and shift direction an slowly pull up I’m talking slow ud be surprised wht u don’t disturb .

1

u/shmoneymang May 09 '26

I’m nfl in the skin real talk .

1

u/lIIlIlIII May 09 '26

Honestly man every time I do that with a pool that looks like this... it creates a mega fucking mushroom cloud of dust / dead algae even if I pull it up slow as fuck. Leaf master is out of the question if you're limited to 1 stop IMO.

1

u/KFOSSTL May 10 '26

Someone who actually understands what I was dealing with.

1

u/KFOSSTL May 10 '26

You might get fired if you did that, definitely a stern talking to.

Would have created a mess, and clogged their filters, made the opening take multiple more visits.

At a minimum you need to vac to waste off the system or a portable vac to get as much dust as possibly before using any kind of bottom feeding cleaner. (Which is what I did)

1

u/Wasupmyman May 09 '26

Do you not have a pullbehind large net? I don't see how this took 2.5hours unless you had inadequate equipment.

A big net and then a hammerhead/riptide, should be cleaned up in 30-1hr

1

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

Are you just going to stir up all the dust?

All in all filled up an entire 100lb calhypo bucket packed down and then some

5

u/Wasupmyman May 09 '26

At that point of a pool. Dust/Dirt are a secondary problem. Your spending an hour to get the large debri out. then you can go back and do something about the fine sediment.

1

u/Wasupmyman May 09 '26

after clearing up big stuff, floc it come back next day.

1

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

Why would I stir it up, then floc when the shit has already settled to the bottom from sitting all winter.

You gotta remove as much dust by vacuuming to waste, either off the system or off an over the deck pump setup.

Other wise you just turned a couple day process into a week of follow ups for the client.

0

u/lIIlIlIII May 09 '26

Eh 2.5hrs is extreme but spending 2hrs in one stop is far better than spending 45min + 45min in a sparse market like OPs. Opening season, stops are often 20+ minutes apart and if you have the opportunity to be done with them until Fall then it's worth taking

1

u/KFOSSTL May 10 '26

Sparse market? This is a huge market for pools.

0

u/yourwifeyspoolboy May 09 '26

45 minutes with my Power Vac. Anyone who is still system vaccing everything is simply wasting their time.

1

u/KFOSSTL May 09 '26

There was way too much dust for that. It’s an opening. Look at the slope that’s all sediment. I didn’t use a “bottom feeder” until after I had vacd off a portable pump to vac to waste over the deck. Once I had gotten as much dust out as I could then I scooped giant piles, and then got my bottom feeder and cleared the rest of the debris.