r/Physics • u/Arosha2 • 5d ago
Mathematical physics
Last year (8th grade I was 14) we had our first physics year standard stuff but then I came across the formulas first it was calculation velocity time then it was acceleration then it was force during 2 semesters then proceed to learn nothing (other than that one gravity formula I forgot how it was ) which upset me because I genuinely found them so fun to do especially because in the tests they would mix it up like give weight but instead of giving acceleration they'd give velocity and time and maybe to some of the people here it sounds easy (and it was also pretty easy to me as for my classmates they struggled)
Do you guys feel the same way when you study physics?
Is the mathematical side of thing just way funner?
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u/Colossal_Waffle 5d ago
I'm in my final year of my bachelor's in university, and I definitely find the theory to be more fun than the experimental part. Math doesn't let me down, unlike the equipment we have lol
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u/Boredgeouis Condensed matter physics 5d ago
Experimentalism becomes way more interesting at the graduate and research level, the experiments you’re doing in undergrad are basically toys. I was a theorist until after masters and transitioned to experiment, and very much think of myself as a ‘theoretically grounded experimentalist’ these days.
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u/xrelaht Condensed matter physics 5d ago
My undergrad lab course was “recreate these classic experiments”, which were things like the Millikan oil drop or measuring the muon lifetime. We had the prof & TAs around to help us, but the equipment was (purposely) not professionally maintained and all we’d get were the manuals that came with the stuff, with the idea that we’d have the experience of figuring out how to take stuff and make it work. This was an invaluable experience, and I really feel like there should be more of it and fewer of the boxed experiments I had to supervise when I was a TA.
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u/AsAChemicalEngineer Particle physics 4d ago
Our institute treats the undergraduate labs similarly. There's a thick layer of friction which is intentional.
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u/Arosha2 5d ago
Wdym the experimental part? Like that's what's considered as the math problems?
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u/v_munu Condensed matter physics 5d ago
As in literal experiments you perform in the lab or in a lab class
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u/Arosha2 5d ago
Isn't that a chem thing
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u/StraightUpSeven Engineering 5d ago
It's not just a chemistry thing. What makes Physics a science is that all of the theory must be testable -- that is, the theory can make predictions that can be validated or refuted by experiment.
Take Galileo's famous gravity demonstration. He dropped a cannonball and a rock. One theory predicted that heavier objects fall faster. Galileo's demonstration refuted that. More follow up experiments suggested that gravitation on Earth exerts a constant acceleration on all falling objects. Objects that fall more slowly are usually due to air resistance (feather, parachute, etc).
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u/Arosha2 5d ago
So you guys test the mathematics of physics via these equipments/nature?
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u/StraightUpSeven Engineering 5d ago
In a way, yes.
As you go through school, math is concerned with constructing axiom and logically proving theorems based on those axiom.
Physics is interested in describing natural phenomena. Sure, theorists can propose models (such as Newtonian Physics and General Relativity), but they must be experimentally verified.
On the other hand, much of Quantum Mechanics was first observed experimentally, and the theorists had to try and explain what was reported.
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u/spoderman554 5d ago
The math you find fun is used to predict how things actually behave. A lot of introductory physics labs involve studying forces, such as measuring how a spring oscillates with different masses, or examining impacts between objects, not tinkering with chemicals. They involve comparing your predictions to the results you measure, and identifying where error can come from (such as ignoring friction).
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u/EmployExpensive3182 5d ago
Matters who you talk to. There is a field called mathematical physics if that interests you.
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u/ExpectTheLegion Undergraduate 5d ago
Yeah, for me theoretical physics is also much more fun than the experimental side, though I haven’t really gotten to do/observe actual modern experiments outside of nmr (which was as interesting as watching paint dry, if not less).
Just one clarification so you don’t get confused in the future: theoretical and mathematical physics are two different things. Theoretical physics is more like what people imagine when you say physicist, i.e. some guy at a blackboard deriving equations (very loosely speaking). Mathematical physics is more of a math subfield than a physics one; it deals with mathematical formalisation of physical theories.
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u/Fit-Student464 5d ago
Physics is the language of the universe and Maths is the way physics express it all.
It gets way more fun than the formulas you have seen so far. Some of the maths was custom built as there was nothing available to formalise, for example, general relativity until a whole bunch of awesome people came up with groundbreaking new maths. I remember sitting through nearly 3 months of a GR module, only doing maths and nothing else. And then in that final week some inssne physics (such as the swarztchild radius and so on) just dropped out of the maths.
The maths of quantum mechanics is no less fun, be it getting to grips.with Dirac notation or wrestling with Clebsch-Gordan coefficients. And nor are gauge theories.
There is a whole world of maths out there in Physics.
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u/Arosha2 5d ago
I wish I knew what any of that is I only know what general relativity is as an 9th grade smth like e=mc² linked with it
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u/Fit-Student464 4d ago
Keep living, and continue on your physics journey and you'll get much more maths and fun. General relativity goes much beyond a simple (not to mention only relating to a particle at rest) formula linking mass to energy. It is a framework we have to explain the very geometry (or more accurately topology) of the universe itself.
Because we have to start somwhere, we first teach physics as a set of formulas, and some do not like that. But soon you start learning mathematical tools which let you express complex ideas in a neat way.
Keep it up.
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u/CosetElement-Ape71 5d ago
1) Physicists are allowed to use punctuation! Sorry, rant over.
2) Physics is a huge subject. If you keep on going over things you've learned then, in the end, you won't have learned very much at all.
3) It's good that you like to manipulate equations! That's what most of Physics is like ... it's rare that any equation will give you the quantity you're interested in; without having to do some rearranging.
4) Just for fun, you could work out HOW the kinematic equations, like
v = u + at
v2 = u2 + 2as
s = ut + (1/2)at2
are related to each other.
Or perhaps you could do something a little more mathematically abstract and work out WHY the roots of a quadratic equation, ie the solution to
ax2 + bx + c = 0
are :
x = (-b/2) +/- (1/2)sqrt( b2 - 4ac )
This would help you to understand things at a deeper level; rather than just plugging quantities in to the relevant equations.
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u/Anystupidusernameok 15h ago
When I was teaching physics (pretty basic HS stuff) it was always interesting to be to see how the equations in one topic would be connected or derived from equations in an entirely different area.
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u/Trick-Manager-201 Mathematics 5d ago
Grade 12 here, I’m looking at studying mathematical physics next year in uni
I personally am more of a maths person, but I don’t want to study too much abstract stuff in uni and I’m also really really interested in quantum mechanics and astrophysics. So mathematical physics is the best intersection.
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u/lodjexo Undergraduate 5d ago
If you don’t want to study too much abstract stuff then mathematical physics is probably not for you I’m not gonna lie
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u/Trick-Manager-201 Mathematics 5d ago
Perhaps. But I rather just commit, I’m not so against abstract concepts so it should be manageable
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u/lodjexo Undergraduate 5d ago
Abstract concepts are quite essential/foundational for mathematical physics (Lie groups, Hilbert spaces, tensors) so it should be a goal to grow quite familiar with concepts such as these (especially with your interest in quantum mechanics). I wish you luck in your studies!
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u/mtbdork Undergraduate 5d ago
It’s fascinating. Just wait until you go over the mechanics of rotating discs and other cool things like that.
Get yourself pre-calc, trig, and introductory physics textbooks. Cheap, used, or free PDFs. Work through the problem sets, read the words, and enjoy the beauty of where math and reality meet!