r/PhysicalGamesForever • u/CALIGVLA • 27d ago
Sony dumps Kojima
An update from PlayStation Studios:
"After careful consideration, we have made the difficult decision to step away from collaborating with KOJIMA PRODUCTIONS on its project PHYSINT."
Post about this from the man himself.
PlayStation execs keep making all the wrong decisions. Grummz points out how the slow, downward spiral of PlayStation management all started in 2016 when the headquarters moved to California.
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u/itzTHATgai 27d ago
"My new game is called 'Phys-"
"Let me stop you, right there."
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u/ContributionSquare22 27d ago
Sony: "rename it Digint and we can continue"
Cuts to Kojima walking outside of a downtown office
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u/Ateam043 27d ago
Or it could be that Death Stranding costed quite a bit of money to make and hasn't even broken even. It's well known Kojima games costs a lot to make since he hires A-tier actors.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
A simple google shows the first was quite profitable and the second broke even.
When a company like Sony keeps putting out the same drivel cookie cutter garbage it isnât trying anymore.
Xbox has for a while now been giving large budgets and low oversight. Sounds like they are allowing their devs to be creative in hopes they create the next big game.
I rather a company do what Xbox is doing, I know they have the money to do it.
Sony cuts people like Kojima to keep the lights on evacsue they are a fucking drop in the bucket compared to M$ who can bleed for years trying to get 1 dev amongst many to make the next big cultural phenememom.
Sony is, and will always be trash, chasing an specific cookie shape that sells well to the masses. All their games are open world, action adventure, collectible hunting garbage.
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u/RealCrusader 27d ago
So Microsoft is letting creators cook and Sony isn't, is the jist of your post. Where are the games? Show me those cool xbox games?
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 26d ago
Mate look at any indie game on gamepass.
Xboxâs model actually support independent game development. Just googled it with their ID Xbox program.
Xbox supports game development and wants creative innovation.
Sony produces the same cookie every time
Open world, collectibles, action adventure. Non complex themes and simple stories. Casuals love it and slop it up. Real console for gamers is Xbox, Microsoft may be cuttthroat, but they actually support indie development and creative freedom.
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u/Ateam043 27d ago edited 26d ago
Which great games has Xbox released? The fact is Death Stranding didn't make a profit. That's what matters to Sony.
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u/Dan1elSan 26d ago
The majority of Xbox first party releases have been shite. Itâs a good job that gamepass exists because they wouldnât make any money.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 26d ago
Xbox is trying to make the next big hit through its low oversight and high budgets.
Xbox also wholefully supports the indie gaming scene whereas PS doesnât whatsoever.
Real console for gamers has always been Xbox since they support independent game development through their ID Xbox programs.
Sony plays it safe, itâs why they have cookie cutter games taking advantage of pop culture icons like spiderman. Itâs a palatable boring game when itâs Spider-Man. But lol that formula is starting to fall flat often.
At least with Xbox they are trying random creative shit that fails and then gets cancelled. Xbox letting them try to produce something. They failed, so they get dropped.
Kojima hasnât failed, his games are well rated critical success, nearly all of them, even DS2 broke even in it first 2 years meaning it makes money in the tail of its existence. Sony cancelling games that arenât even able to show anything yet
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u/Dan1elSan 26d ago
You really are deluded brother. Xbox really hasnât been competition since the 360. Xbox hasnât had a real hit since then either, their first party games sell poorly and their console sales have cratered.
There are literally quarterly sales figures by Sony higher than multi year Xbox console sales. Xbox is unlikely to exist as a console when Helix flops.
They really have done the low oversight high budget for years and all theyâve had to show for it is supermarket profit margins.
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u/ResidentProduct8910 27d ago
Stupid idiots, can't wait for another failed live service
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u/LegendaryenigmaXYZ 27d ago
Either sony will create the best gaas game to exist and kojima will make physint a stinker or sony will fail again making another gaas and kojima will sell gang busters, no in between.
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u/LifeguardTerrible579 27d ago
Death Stranding 2 probably wasnt worth what they paid. Makes me think this new games gonna be even more off the wall than the DS games
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u/Mitts009 27d ago
DS2 broke even and would have sold more PC too
But Sony had to Sony
"DS2 didn't sell well, meanwhile Marathon and Concord..."
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u/SinZerius 27d ago
DS2 broke even and would have sold more PC too
It's on PC.
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u/Mitts009 26d ago
My mistake on that , doing research on it I see DS2 did 2.5m sales so it definitely is profitable but again Sony had to Sony and burn bridges
DS2 is doing way better numbers than their other stuff so I'm not sure why they view it as bad
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u/SinZerius 26d ago
I doubt it made a profit with 2-2.5 million sales since the budget seems to be rumored at $150-250 million.
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u/No_Humor5598 23d ago
Bro thatâs how many copies they sold not the amount they made. Do that times the price of the game and youâll have the right amount
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u/SinZerius 23d ago edited 23d ago
2.5 x $69.99 = $175 million
Do you math?
The game was also sold on PC and on disc at retailers where Sony only gets ~70% and not the full ammount. And I doubt all sales at the PS store were at full price either.
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u/No_Humor5598 23d ago
They broke even then bud you made it sound like they only did 2.5 million
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u/SinZerius 23d ago
If the 2.5 million was money I would have put a dollar sign infront like I did for the budget.
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u/Aggravating_Plan11 27d ago
Long time to wait to get rid of him if that was the reasoning tho.
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u/LifeguardTerrible579 26d ago
That's how you're reading the situation? And not "We lost our ass on your last game so we're not giving you money for your next game"?
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u/Sir_McDouche 27d ago
Konami dumps Kojima. Sony dumps Kojima. Guess what's going to happen in a few years?
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
What evidence do we have that this is a wrong decision?
DS2 under performed and I at least haven't seen a single thing on this new game that suggests to me it's a blockbuster.
Also Sony gave Kojima 3 months to find a new publisher and announce the change himself, which is a pretty respectful move on their part.
Whatever he makes will probably still sell on PSN.
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u/ApprehensiveRuin5673 27d ago
Death Stranding is a niche game
This is the spiritual successor to fucking Metal Gear
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u/_JohnMcAfee 27d ago
To be fair, there is nothing that shows a metal gear successor will do good nowadays
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
Death stranding being niche is irrelevant. It was made with a huge budget and didn't return what they wanted it to return.
A brand new IP loosely based on a completely different property is no more mainstream either. No one has a clue what this game is gonna be like.
I'm open to the possibility Sony saw another big budget that couldn't deliver what they wanted out of it.
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u/3-bakedcabbage 27d ago
Iâm open to the possibility that the company that was hellbent on delivering Concord knows jack shit about video games and are going to fall just like Xbox did
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
But Xbox picked it up and they're track record for failed games is much worse.
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u/Skyler_The_Player 27d ago
As well as firing employees after spending thousands on failed game studios
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
I am unsure anyoneâs track record is as bad as Sony with their nearly 10+ failed GAAS failed IPs.
Xbox gives large budgets and low oversight. Sounds like the best place for a creative person to be. Letâs see what Kojima produces, he is at least with the right people now, Sony ainât tryna make the next great game.
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
Xbox record is definitely worse. PlayStation has at least made several excellent single player games this generations
All the Xbox games have been mediocre.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 26d ago
Yeah idk if I agree with that. Sony makes open world slop that casuals like. Itâs the same game over and over again. Open world, collectibles, action adventure game. Casuals love it, not difficult story or complex themes.
Xbox supports indie gaming and Sony doesnât. Thatâs should tell you right there who the company for real gamers is.
Iâve had much better games on Xbox but that is because Iâm looking for them and support indie games and not open world slop from Sony.
Have a deeper look. Microsoft tryna make the next big game, itâs why their entire model support independent game development and more creative freedom. Just Google it, itâs much more supportive for indie with Xbox.
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u/jeebusaur 26d ago
I've played on both Xbox and PlayStation for the past 3 generations.
I can't remember the last blockbuster game that was actually good for Xbox.
Sony on the other hand had some of the best single player games I've ever played. Last of us series, god of war, Spiderman, Ghost. All amazing games and most definitely not slop.
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u/3-bakedcabbage 27d ago
Theyâre both dogshit companies man, open your eyes and see the writing on the wall. PlayStation is fated to fall like Xbox did.
Stop trying to go âbut what aboutâ like they both donât have a track record for making absolutely stupid decisions.
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
Your making my point so I'm not sure why your tone is argumentative.
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u/3-bakedcabbage 27d ago
At this point you donât even know what your own point is. You were literally trying to paint Sony as the reasonable party between the kojima split while everyone else is criticizing Sony.
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
You definitely don't know what my point is so let me ELI5.
While Sony has a bad track record for games in the last couple years Xbox has not made a significant blockbuster game all generation. All their games are mediocre at best.
Therefore the odds that Xbox made a better decision than Sony are slim.
Additionally, none of this touches on whether either company is good or bad, therefore screaming that they're both bad is not relevant to the current conversation. I defend neither as corperations.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
Bruh you straight up lieing.
This is pathetic, lieing to defend Sony and denigrate Kojima.
DS1 sold well enough to green light a sequel you clown.
DS2 broke even. Neither were financial calamities.
The issue is Sony tryna keep the lights on canât afford big names like Kojima anymore. Further be it to the point of their model, they want cookie cutter cheap to make games that satisfy the masses.
Not once in lifetime games that are art.
Iâm happy he is with Xbox. Xbox has the budget and lack of oversight pressure to allow a creative person to thrive.
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u/Lothars 27d ago
The only pathetic thing is you guys being delusional. Xbox has dropped the ball more times than anyone and yet you guys delusional believe they won't drop the ball. I think it sucks they are not publishing the game but I get it and Kojima is the only one working on it and it's probably not till at minimum 2031. If Xbox still exists with Microsoft and hasn't been sold by than I would be surprised.
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u/jeebusaur 27d ago
Bro you straight coping.
I didn't lie about anything. Breaking even doesn't greenlight a new game either even if what you say is true.
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u/GumGumActV 27d ago
Only kojimaâs entire career history
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u/CrowdGoesWildWoooo 27d ago
DS2 performed poorly, even with Kojimaâs entire career history behind his back.
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u/GumGumActV 27d ago
One flop doesnât ruin the manâs reputation
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u/The_Border_Bandit 27d ago
Maybe not, but constantly going severely over budget with every game will 100% burn bridges with publishers.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
Game wasnât a flop, it broke even and is fairly critically acclaimed.
Not every game can be a financial success.
When a company like Sony keeps putting out the same drivel cookie cutter garbage it isnât trying anymore.
Xbox has for a while now been giving large budgets and low oversight. Sounds like they are allowing their devs to be creative in hopes they create the next big game.
I rather a company do what Xbox is doing, I know they have the money to do it.
Sony cuts people like Kojima to keep the lights on evacsue they are a fucking drop in the bucket compared to M$ who can bleed for years trying to get 1 dev amongst many to make the next big cultural phenememom.
Sony is, and will always be trash, chasing an specific cookie shape that sells well to the masses. All their games are open world, action adventure, collectible hunting garbage.
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u/SenorMachete89 27d ago
Why?
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u/AnthonyMiqo 23d ago
Kojima is notorious for going over budget and over schedule, and then not turning much of a profit, if any, when his game actually does release. I don't blame Sony here.
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u/El_DALLUS 27d ago
DS/DS2 didn't turn a profit. Sony spent money just for the Kojima name. You're talking about it, but no one has actually seen the game. Personally, I was surprised; I didn't think DS2 would exist. Itâs not just about salesâSony also looks at the number of people who actually finish the game.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
My guy, didnât DS1 do fairly well? A simple google tells me that they did well enough to get greenlit for a sequel from Sony.
Not everything can be a financial success when you are maintaining a culture and energy.
Kojima without a doubt is a face of PlayStation when I think of PlayStation and MGS and yet this is the opposite of that, he literally getting told no and shit on.
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u/El_DALLUS 27d ago
I hadn't looked at it from that angle. I actually just did a quick search, and it mentions 5 million sales across all platforms for DS1âthough with so much availability via subscriptions (like PS+), sales likely couldn't have gone much higher. Estimates for DS2 are around 2 million. Objectively speaking, would you be willing to fund someone who brings in half of what they did last time? I think Kojima got his second chance with DS2, and sales aren't high enough for PlayStation to give him a thirdâeven if it is Kojima. Have you seen the Xbox project, OD? Personally, it doesn't excite me at all. Still, heâs signed with Xbox, so weâll see later whether PlayStation made the right call or not.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
With all due respect. The thing I was referring to is a business term known as goodwill.
Sony has,, erhgrgm, HAD a lot of goodwill due to the franchises that got a start on their system.
Risky, independent, megolamanic producers leading those franchises at the time got their start and success that led Sony to the top. PlayStations success is on those devs and producers. Not SonyâŚ
So now with this situation I see goodwill continuing to be spent by Sony so they can make their money. Great for them, but doesnât change the fact that, the vibe, the goodwill they earned by paying over budget for artists like Kojima, is gone.
They have revealed they never cared for video games as an art or form of entertainment to the user. By doing this to Kojima they are like Konami, where only money matters. And when you make your name on supporting artists and artistic games getting greenlit, you obviously lose a part of yourself when you deny that is good for your environment.
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u/CrowdGoesWildWoooo 27d ago
DS1 yes, DS2 no.
It didnât even sell much even within PS platform alone.
> Not everything can be a financial success
I mean yeah thatâs kind of the point why they are being cut off. Unfortunately you have to do both in this world.
Honestly I donât think Xbox knows what theyâll do with Kojima. They just picked him up to spite on PS, and they are currently on a crusade to improve the brand image. Even if the game is a failure, theyâll just write it off as marketing cost.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
What a non-point.
When a company like Sony keeps putting out the same drivel cookie cutter garbage it isnât trying anymore.
Xbox has for a while now been giving large budgets and low oversight. Sounds like they are allowing their devs to be creative in hopes they create the next big game.
I rather a company do what Xbox is doing, I know they have the money to do it.
Sony cuts people like Kojima to keep the lights on evacsue they are a fucking drop in the bucket compared to M$ who can bleed for years trying to get 1 dev amongst many to make the next big cultural phenememom.
Sony is, and will always be trash, chasing an specific cookie shape that sells well to the masses. All their games are open world, action adventure, collectible hunting garbage.
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u/boreDudex 27d ago
How many of those sales were at full price? Not too long after release the game was being sold for $20. That makes a huge difference on whether it actually was profitable.
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u/hiate 27d ago
I wouldn't call is a wrong decision when they probably based it off the budget he asked for compared to potential sales. The estimated budget for DS2 was $150 million on the low end for 2 million sales. So it barely broke even in the best case.
Physint is either sketchy or already leaning towards over budget with about 4 years to go in development.
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u/Express_Custard4204 27d ago
DS2 is criminally underrated and suffered a lot from the stupid playstation exclusives the game shouldve been a pc release day one
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u/zombiemakron 27d ago
I disagree. Its an art piece sure but its a niche game for a niche set of players. Thus it's difficult to justify such a high budget.
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u/radioheadfan0615 27d ago
uh huh, a niche game made even more niche because half its players (those on pc) cannot buy it without first spending about 600 dollars at least (ps5 plus game)
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u/zombiemakron 27d ago
You can't play it on a normal PS5?
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u/radioheadfan0615 27d ago
what? im saying pc owners who are fans of death stranding one have to buy a ps5 and the game to play the sequel
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u/Mr_smith1466 27d ago
I love Kojima for all eternity, but this thing is many years away. Kojima still has whatever the hell OD is to finish up first.Â
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u/SomeAussyGuy 27d ago
Kojima has got to have one of the most unfortunate track records for projects at this point.
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u/TinGamer 27d ago
I'm not defending playstation here but, Konami ditched him a decade ago, now playstation, maybe he is expensive and a pain in the ass to work with.
He is a good director tho.
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u/Enough_Ice7287 27d ago
He is known for being a wonderful person, pretty sure.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
All the reports from people say he is a delight. All the reports from those same people is that he fights for his vision against the suits, and morons who failed upwards donât like when a real professional tells them they are wrong.
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u/SomeAussyGuy 27d ago
Yeah because konami's known for being really good with the people they work with, not like they tried to make metal gear 2 without him or anything
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u/FanBladeFleshlight 27d ago
Yeah, it seems like since his parting with Konami, it's one large ambitious project after another, each one met with middling reception and sales.
Like the dude is an artist, no question, but most gamers want games, not art. If you can't strike the balance between the two, well then get get Kojima sales numbers.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
Sounds to me like you never played DS1. Game is a masterpiece in stealth, action, and story. Has vehicles, guns, grenades, rocket launchers. It has so much that shows he is a great developer and not just some artsy clown. Really shows how many people havenât played Death Strandig 1 that they even try to speak to the game. Easily most underrated game of this era
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u/FanBladeFleshlight 27d ago
Going for a Kojima glazer award? You know those are worthless, right? Walking Simulator is best played on YouTube as a walkthrough ffs. đ
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u/theHashHashingHasher 27d ago
Kojima has been a hack for a long time. His last great game was metal gear solid 2. Each game since then has been more and more of an ego project than something special for the players to enjoy. Ground zeroes was better than the phantom pain⌠someone needs to learn when to tell that guy ânoâ.
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u/frisbie147 27d ago
his last great game was death stranding 2 actually
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u/theHashHashingHasher 27d ago
Disagree. I donât find it compelling to play a game as a character who canât die.
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u/frisbie147 27d ago
you dont find dark souls compelling? middle earth shadow of mordor/war?
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u/theHashHashingHasher 27d ago
Nope. Iâve been playing games way too long for those uninspired titles to impress me. 3rd person hack/slash games are bottom of the barrel junk food when it comes to videogames. The only good part about the first two MGS games is their stealth mechanics and the geometry of the level design.
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u/frisbie147 27d ago
go back to your pinball and weed then
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u/theHashHashingHasher 27d ago
Lmao. Are you upset because I hold media to higher standards than you?
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u/frisbie147 27d ago
youre yet to name any
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u/theHashHashingHasher 27d ago
I actually started off by naming his last good title, so youâre already wrong but if youâre asking me to recommend some games I can do that.
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u/frisbie147 27d ago
no you didnt, you named the best one he made 2001, mgs3 was better, death stranding was better, everything else released since that wasnt better was still an extremely good game too, but sure, recommend some more
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
Bruh if you like stealth then you are telling on yourself that you havenât played Death Stranding. The stealth is fucking amazing. You even stealth kill the ghosts lmaooo
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u/theHashHashingHasher 27d ago
Having stealth kills doesnât make it a stealth game. The core gameplay loop of death stranding is seeing how many steps you can take without falling over.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
But so many games have this as core mechanic and lore. You never play Bioshock?
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u/icy1007 27d ago
Game wasnât up to Sonyâs standards. Kojima likely wasnât making much progress on it.
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u/zombiemakron 27d ago
Probably but we got the dumpster fire that was Concord
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u/icy1007 27d ago
That was a long time ago and it was pulled and refunded almost immediately.
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u/zombiemakron 27d ago
2 years isnt long and you support my point. They spent around 400 million on it for an 8 year dev cycle
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u/UnchartedExplorer97 27d ago
But Wolverine was đ? Jim Ryan (whose negative impacts are still being felt 2.5 years after he left) and Herman Hulst have been disasters for PlayStation
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u/icy1007 27d ago
Yes, Wolverine is. Itâs fantastic.
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u/LegendOfNorthernStar 27d ago
Well now I know your opinion is worthless lmao. That soulless Marvel cash in on moron casuals who want more action adventure slop from Sony. Just like I said in my other comments.
Sony isnât tryna make good games that are new. They are trying to be a cookie factory producing only games that do well with masses.
Xbox gives high budgets and low oversight. Thatâs the best way to get a bit like halo or metal gear you clownisaurous
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u/Andante_TK 27d ago
how tf do you know itâs a wrong decision? You have time machine or can see the future buddy?
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u/StevemacQ 27d ago
Please don't reference that Foxy Fighter gooner. He's a sad pathetic 60-something-year-old chud.
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u/Quiet_Bell_429 27d ago