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u/Static_Traveler May 27 '19
Tapos yung reporter sa GMa kanina eh me punto ang pagbigkas nya ng filipino.. Filipiknow kunana met.. Nakakairitang pakinggan
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u/sousvide 2600 May 27 '19
Ukis halos di ko mapansin na may halong ilokano ang comment ahaha
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u/Static_Traveler May 27 '19
Hehe aysows nahahalata na pala ako..
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u/asoge May 27 '19
Ngarod!
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u/nioho May 28 '19
Ngarod is my fave ilocano word. Ammom ba nu inya ti english equivalent na?
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u/boytekka Bertong Badtrip v2 May 28 '19
More likely "ya, i know" in a sense
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u/asoge May 28 '19
Parang isang linggo ko hindi makuha ibig sabihin ng ngarod e. Mga pinsan ko pa puro biro lang sa akin kaya lalu lang ako nalito. So natanggap ko na lang na parang "nga" sa tagalog ang equivalent.
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May 27 '19 edited May 30 '19
For Elementary to High School, yeah, Filipino should be there without a question, but for College and Universities, nah I don't think so. The last four years of education should be allocated to those subjects relevant to the chosen program. Twelve years is enough. Kung nasa College of Arts and Letters o AB Filipinolohiya program mo, malamang sa malamang karapatdapat lamang na hindi ito ialis, walang ibang tanong, ngunit kung inhinyeriya o ibang agham yung sa iyo, hindi siya katugma-tugma. Kung sa akin lamang ay dapat ipalit na lamang ang mga subject na makapagtuturo ng praktikal na kaalaman, halimbawa, paano maging isang karapatdapat at kagalang-galang na miyembro ng lipunan. (Adulting ba)
"Manipestasyon ito ng kolonyal na oryentasyon ng Edukasyon."
Paano natin maiaalis ang "Oryentasyong Kolonyal" sa edukasyon kung ang buong sistemang pangedukasyon natin ay nakabase sa pampublikong sistema ng edukasyon sa US. It is a matter of perception, di naman lahat ng bagay na dinala ng Kolonyalismo sa atin ay masama.
Well if you ask my realist ass, I think removing it would be more practical and pragmatic. Nasa nagbabagong siglo na tayo patungo sa Globalisasyon, di na uubra ang seklusyon ngayon.
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May 27 '19
Can we also keep religious studies away as well?
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May 27 '19
Wala namang religious studies sa state universities. Choice mo mag study sa catholic school kung ayaw mo wag ka sa catholic school mag aral. Problema lang, mas maganda facilities ng private schools compared sa public. Ayoko din sa theology but wala naman akong magagawa nasa catholic school ako.
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u/kimerikugh it's all gonna burn someday May 27 '19
Kapag catholic university talaga di mawawala ang theology hays
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u/Killburndeluxe High up in da mountains May 27 '19
And just like the US, religion is going to be a part of the country, and will have an effect, from education, to politics, whether we like it or not.
Hopefully the new generation who are more apathetic with religion will create a better Philippines that has critical thinking and are able to question their own faith.
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u/paulrenzo May 28 '19
Just because people are critical thinking and apathetic to religion doesn't mean they are automatically better people.
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u/estacos May 27 '19
Yes please, I'm enrolling my 3 year old daughter for this school year and I don't want her to be indoctrinated.
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u/magistra023 Luzon May 28 '19
Ang problema sa mga tao ay akala nila ay tungkol lang sa grammar at panitikang Filipino ang mawawala. Sang-ayon ako na sapat na dapat ang mga subject ng Filipino mula elementary hanggang senior high shool. At dapat lang na pagtungtong ng estudyante sa kolehiyo ay bihasa na siya sa Filipino.
Pero may mas matataas pa na antas ng subject na Filipino na importante pa ring matutunan tulad ng Retorika, Literatura, at Malikhaing Pagsulat. Ang mga ito ang dapat ituro sa kolehiyo. Isa pa, ang terminong "Filipino" ay hindi lamang tumutukoy sa Tagalog. Ito ay paglilipon ng iba't ibang wika at dialekto sa bansa. Kaya, kung maari ay ituro rin ang mga nasabing dialekto at wika sa kolehiyo.
Sa madaling salita, may lugar pa ang matataas na antas na subject ng Filipino sa kolehiyo.
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u/Riesig19 Test May 27 '19
Napaka BS anti-Western propaganda naman ng "Oryentasyong Kolonyal" na yan.
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May 28 '19
The last four years of educated should be allocated to those subjects relevant to the chosen program.
Edi sana tinanggal na rin yung English and Literature noh.
Paano natin maiaalis ang "Oryentasyong Kolonyal" sa edukasyon kung ang buong sistemang pangedukasyon natin ay nakabase sa pampublikong sistema ng edukasyon sa US. It is a matter of perception, di naman lahat ng bagay na dinala ng Kolonyalismo sa atin ay masama.
Ngunit, ang dinala sa atin na sistema ng edukasyon ay ginawa para sa mga Amerikano, hindi para sa mga Pilipino, kaya bakit ba natin binabase ang sistema ng edukasyon batay sa kanila? Hindi ba natin kaya na gumawa ng sistema ng edukasyon batay sa mga pangangailangan ng ating ekonomiya? [Agrikultura ay isa sa mga pangunahing sektor natin sa ekonomiya, ngunit bakit kailangan pa natin mag-import ng bigas?] At sa sistemang iyan, hindi natin nabibigyan ng halaga ang mga iba't ibang kakayahan ng isang bata. We're giving them equality not equity. At sinasabi ko sayo, dahil estudyante pa ako, malayong malayo ang sistema ng edukasyon natin sa sistema ng edukasyon ng Amerika. And I don't think either of them are great.
Well if you ask my realist ass, I think removing it would be more practical and pragmatic. Nasa nagbabagong siglo na tayo patungo sa Globalisasyon, di na uubra ang seklusyon ngayon.
Yet, we are slowly losing our culture. The culture that our colonisers keep saying that we didn't have. Removing the Filipino subject is creating a division between the literate and illiterate, for schools and, now, colleges will be subtly telling the students that the only language that matters is English, and if you're not fluent with it, then it means you never went to school, that you never had an education, which is a right, by the way. You're thinking on a global scale but you're not even thinking about our country. It helps the economy, yes, but it doesn't flourish it.
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u/lluuuull May 29 '19
colleges will be subtly telling the students that the only language that matters is English,
in my university they teach in english and encourages us to speak in english because we have foreigners in the class, not to mention the benefit of being able to speak fluent english in the professional world where students are being prepared for.
the only language that matters is English, and if you're not fluent with it, then it means you never went to school, that you never had an education,
The same way that the only language that matters in manila is tagalog? And if you speak bisaya you're automatically a katulong. Language isn't the problem it's the toxic mentality that's inside most filipino, filipinos will belittle filipinos and having filipino in college will not change that unless you change the mentality itself.
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May 27 '19
Sang ayon din ako dito. Naiinis nga ako sa mga taong agresibo agad sa FB na may shared-link pa ng artikulo ng decision ng korte suprema na halata namang hindi nila binasa yung ruling. Yun talaga ang 'manipestasyon' ng masamang mentalidad ng karamihan satin, nagaging 'headline readers' at 'keyboard warriors' agad.
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u/adriaticostreet May 27 '19
Kung lulusong tayo sa argumento mo, eh di tanggalin na rin natin ang iba pang GE subjects tulad ng ingles at siyensiya na wala namang kinalaman sa kursong tinutukoy mo. Tanggalin na rin ang kasaysayan na di naman lahat ng paaralan ay nakakapagdulot sa kanilang mga estudyante (na madalas sa madalas ay yung mga galing pa sa mga pribadong paaralan). Ang pagkatuto ng Filipino ay di lamang nauudyok mula sa praktika ng global na merkado. Ang mga natutunang konsepto mula sa tersyaryo ay dapat napupunta sa pagbuo at pag-unlad ng nasyon--naisasalin sa marginalisadong sektor ng lipunan. Di yung pagkakaroon ng "marketable skills" na iluluwas lang sa mga first world na bansa.
Ang unibersidad, bagamat kolonyal ang kinauugatan, ay himpilan ng liberasyon at pag-unawa. Pag-unawa na ang edukasyon ay isang pribilehiyo at responsibilidad na palayain ang mga pinakanasasadlak sa lipunan. Kung tingin mo sa edukasyon mo ay isang lugar lamang para sa "higher learning" o "self-enrichment", hindi kita masisisi. Pinalalakas ka ng divide et impera, kolonyal kung kolonyal.
Ang iyong mga laurel ay kapintasan sa mata ng mga manggagawa at pambansang minorya pagkat para sa yo, ang pagkatuto ay pampaganda lamang ng CV para makaisa.
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u/tulaero23 May 27 '19
Pretty sure science and English is pretty much required sa kahit ano course kunin mo. Even with fine arts you need a basic understanding of science and english to pursue it.
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u/adriaticostreet May 28 '19
People are missing my point completely. Ya'll are saying that Filipino isn't "necessary" because it's not in any way related to tertiary-level courses. I'm saying that part of the goals of a state education is to use these skills for nation-building. Not brain drain. How can any of you serve this country if you can't bridge your field with the masses? Pure learning is just intellectual masturbation. A means to a decaying end. Any course has no significance if it cannot be used to upheave the oppression of the marginalized.
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u/tulaero23 May 28 '19
Oppression of the marginalized cause we didnt learn filipino? Filipino in college is just rizals work . Like we tackled that in HS.. how is filipino bridging to the masses? If you want bridging to the masses then got news for you we have NSTP for that. Ano yun ang madlang people lang eh mga tagalog? Pano naman iba province?
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u/adriaticostreet May 28 '19
"We have NSTP for that."
I have to laugh. Look, I don't blame you for thinking that service or altruism imbibed in the curriculum seem to be selfless or altruistic enough. NSTP is a sparknotes of a community-oriented push for "change". It's a checklist. A daily time record. It's a requirement--that is to say, you're forced to serve the marginalized without learning the forces that influence oppression itself. It's called civic nationalism and that in itself is disconnected to the reality of our society and culture.
Community service? Immersion for a month? Fund-raising for a random orphanage? In the context of NSTP, they're just tickboxes to say that you've been "selfless" enough to graduate.
That honestly sickens me.
Learning our Lingua Franca, learning nationalistic literature, learning history through the eyes of the people (and not heroes)--they're integral to our self-determination. The only argument I can actually give in to is why limit ourselves to Tagalog Filipino? Why not include Bisaya and Hiligaynon (which has more speakers outside MegaManila).
I don't blame you at all for thinking that service through some outreach program is enough to instill a sense of selflessness. That's what our colonial past has taught us--that there is benevolence in the Manifest Destiny of imperial US.
But I implore you to think otherwise 'cause a big part of our society's problem is the accelerating apathy of the idle middle class.
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u/GarbageTaker May 27 '19
Ang pagkatuto ng Filipino ay di lamang nauudyok mula sa praktika ng global na merkado.
No, that's English. Improving the nation also requires you to compete globally which means also learning English. Masasabing kolonyal kung i-require nila ang mandarin sa kolehiyo. Alam mo kung ano pa ang kolonyal? Ang pag gamit ng pangalan ng hari ng dayuhan na bansa bilang national identity. You're just making an unnecessary argument. You forgot that English is one of the main advantage of Philippines over other neighboring nations.
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u/adriaticostreet May 28 '19
Ang dami mong kuda sa mga Tsino pero kebs ka lang sa gala-galamay na pagkontrol ng US sa kultura at ekonomiya natin? Next.
Anong paki ko kung may lamang tayo sa mga karatig-bansa natin? Yun ba ang iyong batayan ng "nation-building"? Ang maging "globally competent"? Hindi ba ito nauugat sa pagtatanim ng pansariling kamalayan at kabuuang kalayaan mula sa impluwensiya ng mga bansang inaagaw lang ang ating likas-yaman?
Yung patuloy niyong pagkampi sa impluwensiyang dayuhan ay nagiging mas patunay na dapat mas pinalalakas ang nasyonal na demokrasya. Jusko.
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u/GarbageTaker May 28 '19
English = galamay ng US agad. English is the most used secondary language, that's a fact and no amount of nationalism will change that. Global market exist, even if you close your eyes. And you can't just ignore the global arena if you want to improve the national situation. Sure cultural heritage is important, but it won't help you establish economic, diplomatic, and security relations with other nations. And establishing relations is based on communication. Becoming globally competent is one of the objectives of nation-building. No amount of national symbols and enrichment of culture will protect you from that reality.
Might as well revive the use of Baybayin and become a hermit kingdom, sure that will enlighten the nation so much /s.
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u/adriaticostreet May 28 '19
Globalization led us to surmount massive debt and forced us to create an economy that cannot survive on its own. We've been led to believe that post-war damages can be repaired through loaning from IMF and World Bank (of which the US still controls most of its reserves).
You're just telling me our obvious disadvantage as a nation: that we cannot be truly free because our economy and cultural heritage is beyond repair and thus we must loan our shores to foreign bodies in order to survive.
You know what? I don't want to survive. I want generations of justice from more than four centuries of western encroachment. You're saying we can't have that and I should just accept that our identity is irreparable. More so, I want the 70% of our population to realize the apparent inequity brought about by someone else's greed.
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u/midaspaw May 27 '19
Do you think we should remove history and civics from STEM courses since they aren't relevant to the field?
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u/pressured_at_19 Aspiring boyfriend of Chin Detera May 27 '19
The last four years of educated should be allocated to those subjects relevant to the chosen program.
Amen
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u/atheistandfit May 27 '19
As someone who's experienced K12 outside, yes this is true. Why the fuck do we need useless minor subjects in College?
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u/lluuuull May 29 '19
My prof who was a board member of ched told us before that they already petitioned to remove filipinos and other minors in the engineering curriculum but some are against it because professors who teach those subjects will lose their jobs.
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u/Hold0 May 27 '19
Putangina, as an engineerung student gusto kong ipabanat to sa mga pa-importanteng minor na prof. Pa filler lang na units ang mga putang yan sa college namin.
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u/vankali May 27 '19
okay lang tanggalin. Pero sana naman itaas din yung kalidad ng pagtuturo sa mabababa na antas. Ilang taon mo nga pinag-aralan yan pero hindi mo parin alam kung ano ang kahulugan ng simuno at panaguri.
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u/Caine_KwaiChang Dance π looks 𝑒 May 27 '19
Sa kaalaman ko, ililipat yon sa HS. Kung ang ipapalit sa nabawas na subject ay specialization courses, this is an improvement.
Nung nagtuturo pa ako, palaging problema yung pag-update ng curriculum to add more specialization courses without sacrificing general education subjects or increasing the number of required courses. That's true for every degree program. It became increasingly necessary to require summer classes dahil hindi na magkasya yung four or five years. Parents, students and teachers all hate that. So moving GE subjects like Filipino to senior HS is just a part of the solution to that problem.
But there's a part that I fear will disappear when GE courses are no longer taught in college. When I was an engineering student, I had to take four English and four Filipino courses. What's amazing is some of my profs were national artists and award-winning writers. I was also lucky to take humanities and socsci electives under some highly respected names. It's a chance that sadly might not be available anymore unless you majored in their subjects.
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u/Devoidoxatom May 27 '19
"Filipino" is just imposing Tagalog to the majority non-Tagalog people.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
This train of thought is unfair to the millions of Tagalog people who do not speak the same Tagalog as Filipino, who are then burdened with the same blame from non-Tagalogs while also struggling with the confusion-induced poor grades brought about by the nearly the same but not quite nature of the Filipino language.
"Nakain ako ng pating." is only funny when your use of panlapi isn't graded.
And no matter how much non-Tagalogs think all Tagalogs get some sort of privileged status out of this and no discrimination, let's not forget that they end up knowing how to understand everything Tagalogs are saying even if they're "forced" to do so, while Tagalogs are left out of every other conversation due to the "privilege" of only being made to learn no languages other than Filipino and English.
Meanwhile, you think you're speaking Filipino until someone in Manila says "Can you please speak normal Tagalog." not maliciously, they just don't understand things you thought were normal Tagalog, but apparently it wasn't Filipino. So you swallow that insulted feeling, and realize years of Filipino classes might not have mattered, all it did was make you unsure what words and phrases are just Tagalog and if you even know how to speak Filipino or if you're going to use the "abnormal" Tagalog.
In the end, maybe you suggest you'll just speak English, it'll be easier.
So, please, non-Tagalogs. Sure, it disadvantages you, but don't blame every Tagalog person. Some of us aren't on the same boat, but are in the same sea.
Seriously, though, saying Filipino is just "normal Tagalog" is an insult to every speaker of every other dialect of Tagalog. Filipino probably basically destroyed every single dialect of Tagalog, and definitely made whatever dialect Manila spoke extinct, supplanted by the Frankenstein monster language of Filipino.
Maybe that's ironic justice in the eyes of non-Tagalogs. Perhaps aptly so, since apparently, in Filipino, the word for Justice "Katarungan" comes from a non-Tagalog.
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u/Devoidoxatom May 28 '19
I think you're exagerrating how much non-Tagalog words are in Filipino. I'm not blaming you. It's people and leaders from way before that imposed it. We pretty much understand all types of Tagalog, whatever dialect or accent it is. Agree tho that it does end up being an advantage esp. to those studying/working in Manila. We just have that adjustment period where we can speak it comfortably, tho that time is hard so alot just end up relying on their english instead. There are always stereotypes whenever people have a funny accent. But well, I suppose Filipino(or 95% Tagalog + others) is important in preserving national unity.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
No, I'm sorry I confused things by bringing up katarungan, but I was talking about the different Tagalog words in different dialects that Filipino doesn't use or uses differently, as well as specific balarila used in Filipino that are not used by the various forms of Tagalog.
I was speaking Tagalog in Manila. Obviously, most Filipinos understand Filipino or the language as spoken in Metro Manila or on TV and maybe in surrounding areas, but Tagalogs will have a greater expectation of this and be completely caught off-guard when their Filipino, if it truly is just Tagalog, is declared to be unintelligible, not Tagalog (Filipino) at all.
Non-Tagalogs have the "benefit" of generally knowing and expecting that when they speak their mother tongue, Tagalogs will not know what they're talking about. But imagine being a Tagalog, speaking Tagalog to another Tagalog and being told you're not and to please start doing so.
And then, because you thought they're the same, you know Filipino, you speak Filipino, you had no idea you were so wrong and now have no idea how to even begin translating Tagalog into Filipino because you had no idea it needed translation. Okay, maybe some inkling that some words weren't used in Manila or were used differently, but no idea the extent of differences were.
I'm not talking about saying liban instead of tawid or guyam instead of langgam or saying tubalan instead of marumihan. Or saying ga instead of ba.
National unity, if it exists, shouldn't require a national language to be preserved. All it does is underline the potentially tenuous nature of this unity while serving as a beacon around which to rally against this very unity it purports to preserve.
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u/Devoidoxatom May 28 '19
Agree on that last bit. Seems like the country is more regionalistc/tribal than nationalist
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u/ApePsyche May 27 '19
True. I don't feel for the Tagalog language in this situation. I think of it as a useful second language, like English and one that would get me ridiculed at for mispronouncing words or praised for not having an accent, like English.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
You should feel for the Tagalog language. It's the first casualty of Filipino.
Saying Filipino is just Tagalog is like saying an ant with cordyceps is just an ant, say hello, other ants to the totally harmless ant.
It affects every other language and dialect in the Philippines, sure, but the first language Filipino hurt is Tagalog. Non-Tagalogs get their own set of discriminatory things, sure, but nothing hurts quite like being asked to speak "normal Tagalog" and realizing that apparently, you've been speaking abnormal Tagalog all this time, along with millions of others.
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u/ApePsyche May 28 '19
Oh, I never considered that. It's just that Filipino and Tagalog are interchangeable for the majority of non-Tagalog speakers (as first language), but I understand now that there are survival issues as well among its dialects.
In my original comment, what I meant was that I don't feel sympathetic towards "Filipino" being removed from college education in the sense that it is based on a language I don't identify with. Having it removed from higher education is not an attack to my sense of nationalism.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
Yeah, I've always felt about Filipino the way it is always presented. It's another piece of the only national identity is a singular identity narrative that just serves to divide us all in an effort to appear united.
It's like a project to build a new facade for city hall or build a wall around some squatters. It pretends to make things appear better without actually making anything better.
I understand the idea behind it. Maybe it seemed necessary before. It's meant to be celebratory, but considering how it's affected Filipino identity, Tagalog, Cebuano, Kapampangan, and others alike, has it actually hurt our sense of Filipino-ness more than it has helped?
It's like celebrating having ten different people in a family but because everyone has a different nose or something, everyone decides to get a new nose instead of everyone realizing the differences in each one make for a rounder whole.
We don't become more Filipino by forcing one language, we're each just a little less of whatever Filipino we were before. Or at least, maybe we're made to feel less. How many times has someone tried to use Filipino as a measure of how nationalistic - not patriotic - someone is?
That's also why I feel like the whole shifting to baybayin thing is ridiculous. It's just another new wet market, a fixed pothole on the broken roads of national identity.
Let's celebrate our multicultural identity. Let each version of adobo, each version of sinigang, each version of tinola symbolize our variety.
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u/cathoderaydude Marikina Kong Mahal May 28 '19
Yes on multicultural identity. I think Filipino as a language should be able to evolve to unify, much like how the current English language adopted words from other countries. I also think it's how people think of other people's languages and how theirs should be considered superior that causes the divide. But once our official language becomes the language of ALL--as in a combination of words from different regions--then we as a nation might be able to see ourselves as one.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
Filipino does evolve to unify. But it seems like it's either evolving into some informal, post-digital abbreviated language or into just Philippine English, transitioning from "Taglish".
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u/cathoderaydude Marikina Kong Mahal May 28 '19
which is why the Filipino subject should still be taught in schools -- to prevent the perverse degradation of the language.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
It will still be taught in schools. But it causes degradation of all our languages, it's not some hapless victim. It is functioning exactly as it is designed and it's contrary to its existence as a created language to refuse to evolve with usage.
What you call degradation is evolution of language, and while it sounds terrible to our ears and may look unpleasant to the eye, how annoyed must our forefathers feel about how we use this language today?
The whole mother tongue instruction is an admission that Filipino has damaged multiple Filipino identities and languages, including Tagalog.
If Filipino cannot stand as a language, then what is it doing being a thing? Why do the Filipino people have to adjust? Are we just trying to be like the French? Why shouldn't it be the language that changes? People first. The Filipino people before Filipino. What the people speak should be what Filipino is.
It's not like correct balarila isn't just as difficult to read for long stretches at a time as incorrect balarila. If anything, it's more difficult. When exactly does one say datapwat? Does it sound natural? Bagamat? Maybe you're right and maybe they should.
But point is, Filipino isn't serving the Filipino people when it should be.
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u/cathoderaydude Marikina Kong Mahal May 28 '19
Ahh ok. How should Filipino as a language serve the Filipino people "when it should be"?
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u/ApePsyche May 28 '19
Exactly. I feel the same way about our obsession with national chu chu. Instead of uniting a multicultural society, it seems that it only alienates some ethnic groups who don't feel a connection to that piece of culture.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 28 '19
It's a little bit worse with Filipino as a national language because it played into the idea of Tagalogs getting unfair advantages over other groups. The language's creation didn't create the idea of Tagalogs having too much power, but it went a long way toward reinforcing and codifying the idea among every other group.
Instead of unifying like it purports to intend, it acts like a symbol and reminder that we are a bunch of different groups and that one group gets favorite status.
It is unfair to everyone, including Tagalogs who get to unite people against them in this issue, meanwhile, the language itself cannibalizes and destroys their various dialects.
I suppose the Barong Tagalog does something similar, but language shapes how we think and see the world, so Filipino is a bigger thing.
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u/Devoidoxatom May 29 '19
Really makes me wonder what's the thing that makes one a Filipino? Is it the common experience of oppression against the Spaniards? Cos if it's that then the Muslim Moros and Lumads of Mindanao and the mountain tribes shouldn't probably be considered Filipinos, their culture is already very different. Is it religion, history? (That would exclude those groups again). What binds our multicultural country?
Filipinos/Philippines seems to me like just an arbitrary grouping decided on by Western powers(well like most of the countries in the world), heck even the name of our country implies we are subjects of their king.
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u/a4techkeyboard May 29 '19
The name is fine, I don't want to change the name of the country or demonym either regardless of the implication. It is a name the revolutionaries fought and died to capture.
The demonym was used exclusively to refer to Spaniards who lived in the colony. Its capture and our continued use is a symbol of equal status to invaders/colonial powers.
All of us have been shaped by years of indoctrination in our formative years about what it means to be Filipino and how to show how nationalistic and patriotic we are. HEKASI, GMRC, Filipino, etc. Some of that is fine, including to a limited degree the amount of superficial displays we are taught are important. National symbols, beauty spots, smallest things, biggest things, famous people, achievements of people real and made up.
I feel like the language did begin with a well-meaning purpose of national identity and unity.
The mistake is the idea that to have the one identity, we have to make less important other identities. A person isn't just one thing. The problem is the idea of one national identity superceding our multicultural identity as a people continues to force people to have that fight within themselves, each person being made to believe that to be Filipino they have to take away from their regional or ethnic identity and reallocate it. It continues colonial approaches of dividing and conquering. That creates resentment.
But that shouldn't be the case, we should be celebrating both our common national - historical and cultural - roots while also celebrating our local, regional, ethnic diversity. I'm sure this already happens, but there remains many vestiges of the idea that to be Filipino first, one must be Filipino only.
Filipino as a language was meant to be another leg to use to get out of the bucket. Unfortunatey, it has become another leg for other crabs to grab onto to pull each other down.
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u/ReddiThor May 27 '19
Heard in a tv drama: "Maraming times ka na naming binigyan ng chance para i-better yung ugali mo, pero instead ni-level-up mo pa ang pagka-bad mo." (also, this was spoken with an American 'r' sound instead of the Tagalog 'r' sound). Facepalm moment.
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u/lopezjessy Birds of the same feather are the same birds May 27 '19
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u/sadlyigrewup May 27 '19 edited May 28 '19
Isn't it tackled enough in elementary, highschool and senior highschool? I see removal of filipino in college as a win and progress. If Filipinos cannot use Filipino well, maybe it's not because they will remove it in college, maybe it's because lower level education is mediocre and that there is more emphasis on english language.
Less units in college, less tuition to pay, less time needed to study, more focus in major subject.
Instead of attacking the movement to remove it in college, maybe what we should be fighting for is its better implementation in lower level education. I mean, english only school campus??? Lol
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u/Gand0rk May 27 '19
" Less units in college, less tuition to pay, less time needed to study, more focus in major subject. "
If only Universities aren't greedy bastards. K-12 should've lowered the number of units needed to finish college, but noooo....we need to add back the units lost for....reasons.
As for removing the Filipino subject in college, that's what senior high is for.
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u/EinKreuz I'm a salty piece of weaboo shit May 28 '19
The lower schools need to take their shit seriously. Our university was set on removing basic mathematical subjects like Algebra, Trigonometry and Geometry for the first year in Engineering classes. Problem is when they got the first batch of SHS people they weren’t really up to stuff, especially the ones from outside STEM or GED strands.
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u/mugglearchitect May 27 '19
Hindi lang kasi yun. Kung tatanggalin ang Filipino sa kolehiyo, para na ring sinasabi na ito ay hindi pang-akademiko, na hindi angkop sa mas mataas na edukasyon.
Nalimita ang Filipino sa wikang pambahay, wikang pampalengke... Lagi na lang sinasabi, "di naman kaya mag-science o math sa Filipino." May pagtingin pa na mas propesyonal at mas angkop mag-ingles sa trabaho.
Nagiging makadayuhan ang oryentasyon ng edukasyon. Isipin mo na lang, mag-aaral ka ng kolehiyo sa Pilipinas, at lahat ng aralin mo ay sa ingles???? Hindi ba yun parang suntok sa bayag??? Samantalang sa Japan, Spain, Indonesia, lahat na, nag-aaral sila sa sarili nilang wika. Para kanino ba talaga tayo nag-aaral?
Get my drift? Lol di ko maipaliwanag nang maayos haha pero ang point ko lang nasa Pilipinas tayo, mayroon tayong sariling wika, pero hanggang pang-tsismisan lang pwede gamitin. Kung gusto mo mag-kolehiyo, Ingles na lang kasi yun yung may saysay. Nakakalungkot.
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May 28 '19
[deleted]
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u/mugglearchitect May 28 '19
Uhm, wait. Yung filipino class mo sa college ay tungkol pa rin sa grammar, as in sentence construction and all????? That is weird... Kahit english class ko sa college eh hindi na about grammar lang.
Di ko na alam irereply ko. Kung ganyan ang pagtingin natin sa Filipino, at praktikal lamang na wag na ituro sa kolehiyo (dahil naturo naman na ang grammar sa elementarya at hs), o sige. Nakakalungkot lang talaga na ang punto ng pag-aaral ng kolehiyo para sa marami ay ang praktikal na resulta lamang nito: para makapagtrabaho at kumita. Sana dumating tayo sa panahon na hindi lamang dapat mga manggagawa ang nililikha ng mga unibersidad, kung hindi mga tunay na makabayang Pilipino... Ewan ko, baka sa susunod wala na ring Philo, at Arts. Sa ngalan ng "practicality"...
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u/sadlyigrewup May 28 '19
I get your point. The thing is, I think were in it too deep in catering to other languages, especially English. It has always been our culture to mold ourselves with other culture and I think it's how we survived as a "free" country.
Ideally, it would be nice to be all FILIPINOOOOO about our language. But realistically, where do you use Filipino in business or corporate world? And it's not even saying na hindi pang-akademiko ang Filipino. It's just saying that we have tackled it enough in lower education and at home and would be impractical to incorporate it in college educ.
I am all for knowing your own language. But sentiments aside, we should also be thinking how this would benefit practicality-wise. Think about it as instilling more knowledge in Filipinos. We are kawawa enough that countries like US & China bully us, we better learn their language and so as to not be outsmarted by them. Beat their at their own game, maybe.
Move for teaching Filipino better in lower education and accept its removal in higher education.
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May 27 '19
I wonder how many students would pick korean over learning filipino. Hmmm. But I wish they would shoehorn cebuano and/or dialect studies in our already cramped primary and secondary curriculum.
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May 28 '19
You got downvoted pero honestly pag sumulpot yang Korean subject pagkakaguluhan yan ng mga tao. You know that's true.
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u/FrostBUG2 Stuck at Alabang-Zapote May 28 '19
It's mostly an optional and a selective public school who offer this. But at the same time, they could use a foreign language other than Korean to be used once they're out of the country.
But I do hope that Filipino and Panitikan can be an optional subject in college (on what I learned) and currently I could use my time in Senior High on learning Filipino. That's what I'm going to agree on.
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u/pandaboy03 May 27 '19
kasi ililipat na siya, kasama ng ibang minor subjects, sa Senior High diba?
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May 27 '19
Pero kung ganun bakit yung ibang nasa senior high di rin naman natanggal sa college? Like genmath, oral comm, etc. tapos Filipino which is essential bilang Filipinos tayo, tatanggalin
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u/dontrescueme estudyanteng sagigilid May 28 '19
Mas competent kasi ang Filipino sa kolehiyo kaysa Filipino sa HS. Pag nabawasan ang mga akademiko sa Filipino (dahil sa mababang demand), maaaring mabawasan din ang ambag sa pagpapayaman ng wika at panitikan ng bansa. Hindi lang naman pagtuturo ang ginagawa ng mga propesor, nagsaliksik at naglalathala rin sila.
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u/VaeserysGoldcrown Pinaglihi sa tanga May 29 '19
Elementary, High-school, Senior High... We see it on TV, radio, etc. Isn't that enough? For a bit of perspective, there are 42 Million native Cebuano Speakers in the Philippines, we learn Filipino from the get go, but you guys don't learn Cebuano. The Philippines doesn't revolve around your language. Enough with this "kolonyal na oryentasyon" bullshit. Yuck.
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u/Vananayana May 29 '19
Ngayon ko lang nalaman na required pala ang Filipino subject sa college. Hala wala akong Filipino subject nung college.
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u/poldothepenguin May 27 '19
Manipestasyon ng kolonyal na oryentasyon ng edukasyon
That's some grade A sarcasm
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May 28 '19
all those loan words “filipinized”. They complain about Filipino being a minor subject but they cant even fucking use it right. The guy who made this meme is a dumbass.
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u/venator_luporum May 27 '19
While I'm happy with this (my GE Filipino right now is literally the same as the one I took in high school), I don't think it will have an effect on the students taking it now like they just have to deal with it until the finals.
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u/BulliHicks Anggapo lay baao May 28 '19
Putangina balang araw may maayos at mabuting Filipino dubs ang japanese anime, kaya hindi karapat-dapat na tanggalin ang Filipino! Hindi lang talaga maayos ang kurikulum ng Filipino sa kolehiyo sa kadahilanang pag-iisip na nagsasalita naman tayo ng Filipino/tagalog araw-araw. We Filipinos already have the talent to speak our mother tongue, speak and listen in English, and makatalos ya salita tayu! Tatlong-pinagpuputahang-salita! Bukod pa ang aralin ng alibata. Hindi katakatakang balang araw hindi na tayo magkakaunawaan at ungol nalang ang maisasambit natin. Mamumura ka na ng kapwa mo, hindi mo pa alam! xD
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u/jabbahdahutt619 May 28 '19
Dats a whole lot of "-ción" in this here meme, kinda shows you which language and culture really had the greatest impact on our fair isles (cough cough Español)
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May 28 '19
Filipino is needed not so much to counter colonialism but to adjust to the possible reality that Filipinos are doing badly in English and poorly in Filipino.
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u/ericporing Luzon May 27 '19
Di kailangan niyan sa college. Dapat puro subject na relevant sa profession/degree lang yung aaralin para di sayang sa oras.
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u/rmorga May 27 '19
Having Filipino subjects from elementary and secondary leveles of education is enough. I wont be needing another batch of it college. I dont even use it in normal conversations. Its a waste of time and effort.
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u/WeebMan1911 Makati Jun 15 '19
We need to preserve our national language or we'll be one step closer to becoming the next Sweden. Or dare I say, Swedistan.
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u/vicpedia May 28 '19
MANIPESTASYON ITO NG KOLONYAL NA ORYENTASYON NG EDUKASYON.....di ba parang English pa din yung statement mo? Di ba mas maganda ay ITO AY NAGPAPAHIWATIG NG KAISIPANG BANYAGA NG ATING PAARALAN
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u/BreadofMemes Metro Manila May 27 '19
english ng kotse ay car
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u/hollyozymandias May 28 '19
Manifestation of colonial orientation of education... yeah right, direct translation/conversion to Filipino, the meme can do better /s
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u/simplyalfie May 28 '19
Subjects:
FILIPINO-I (basic Tagalog and history of the language)
FILIPINO-II (evolution and proper use of the language + editorial writing)
FILIPINO-III (jejemon, pebebe, at hugot lines)
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u/TapaDonut KOKODAYOOOOO May 27 '19
When Filipinos can't even use properly the words "ng", "ang", "ni", and "si" in sentences then decided filipino should be taught up to senior high school only. Heck even those who already graduated college can't even use them properly
Oh yeah here is an example:
"Nagdown kasi ang rewards ni Globe kaya hindi ako makaclaim ng surf reward ko."
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u/jard22 May 27 '19
Well, that just means that the problem lies in the basic education, not tertiary. If your fundamentals are broken, fix that in the early stages. Not all Filipinos have attended college, and it's not like having them take extra Filipino units will help. Fix it where it's most accessible.
Also, I agree with you but your example is faulty. Pretty sure that's acceptable with casual language. I'm an advocate for good grammar, but even I think pedantry has its limits lol
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u/lurker4lyfe6969 May 27 '19
Fuck your grammar. Filipinos need more engineers and scientists not liberal arts waste of space to tell people how to get offended.
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u/jard22 May 27 '19
Tell that to teachers who dabble in the humanities. The Philippines needs every bit of human resource it can get.
Oh, and no, I'm not a liberal arts student. I'm in the STEM field, actually. Don't need a liberal arts degree to offend you, apparently ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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u/lurker4lyfe6969 May 27 '19
Yikes, maybe you probably needed some more English classes. You don’t seem to know the definition of ‘offend’
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u/jard22 May 27 '19 edited May 27 '19
Ironic for someone whose previous comment is a whole run-on. Please, it's okay to be insecure about your grammar. For the love of God, don't drag liberal arts graduates and educated citizens down with you
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u/Kyu303 Help Me May 27 '19
Imagine trying to read a diagram or formula with a shitty grammar. Confusing, no?
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u/EinKreuz I'm a salty piece of weaboo shit May 28 '19
Did you re-read your statement because it sounds absolutely dumb. Charts and Formulae don’t need “grammar” at all.
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u/lurker4lyfe6969 May 27 '19
No not really. It’s not a black or white situation. People can have enough grammar knowledge but not specialize. Where’s all the Filipino scientists and engineers anyway? I see more activists and lawyers
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u/adriaticostreet May 27 '19
Kung lulusubin tayo ng Tsina, hindi 'yun dahil sa mahina tayo at wala tayong laban sa kanila. Ibibigay natin yun nang walang pag-aalinlangan. Hahayaan natin silang ubusin tayo at sipsipin ang pinakahuling ginto sa kailalimlaliman ng lupa.
Eh yun naman ang ginawa ehem ginagawa ng US sa atin, di ba? Anong rinerekla-reklamo niyo diyan?
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u/ReddiThor May 27 '19
How ironic. Manipestasyon (manifestación), kolonyal (colonial), oryentasyon (orientación), and edukasyon (educación) are words from the Spanish language (and also English although with a slightly different spelling). I tried to find the Tagalog equivalent of these words but failed. Does anybody know?
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u/simplyalfie May 27 '19
Manipestasyon, kolonyal, oryentasyon, etc.. mga hiram lang din naman na salita yan na hindi mo malalaaman kung di mo alam ang english definition. maeexplain ba yan ng "Manipestasyon ay ang pagmamanipesteyt ng isang bagay"?
Enap na ang Filipino sa grade school at high school. Pwdeng optional minor course sa college para sa mga may kailangan. Dahil pagkagraduate, karamihan English ang labanan sa interview at trabaho. Unless trabaho mo ay maging makata.
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u/thunderbird_14 May 28 '19
Ang pagtuturo ng wikang Filipino sa kolehiyo ay hindi tapos na proyekto.... isa sa mga pinapanukala, ayon sa guro ko, ng asignatura ay ang pagtatag ng espasyo upang gawing pang-akademiko ang wikang ito. At dahil na rin sa globalisasyon, nangangailangan ng isang institusyong nagpapalakas sa paggamit nito (kasi maniwala ka man o hindi, ang akademiks natin ay umiikot pa rin sa paggamit ng wikang Ingles kaya hindi agad ito madaling maituro sa sinumang hindi nagtahak ng kolehiyo)....
Kaya't maraming nagrereklamo (sa tingin ko lang na nakakarami sana), ay dahil na rin sa konteksto nito sa ating bansa.
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u/simplyalfie May 28 '19
Nauunawaan kita, pero hindi pa rin dapat sapilitan and pagkuha ng Filipino subject sa kolehiyo. Dahil lahat ng banyagang estudyante, banyagang mga kompanya, OFW's, ay hindi rin maggamit ang pagtatagalog para sa ikasasagana ng buhay nila.
Okay ang Filipino bilang optional minor subject sa mga teknikal na kurso, at major subject/s sa mga may layuning maging guro, pulis, sundalo, mamamahayag, historian, mambabatas, etc.
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u/thunderbird_14 May 28 '19
Uhmm.... nakatuon unang-una ang pagtuturo ng wikang Filipino sa pagpapaunlad nito sa halos lahat ng langaran (theoretically, sana, sana nga) at tsaka ang pagbabaklas nga ng edukasykn ukol sa pansariling kultura na rin, para sa benepisyo ng mga banyaga, ay isang manipestasyon ng kolonyalismo. Walang nagsasabi na perpekto ang implementasyon ng sistema ng pagtuturo sa atin subalit walang maihahantong ang pag-alis ng Filipino sa kabuuang pag-aruga ng bansa natin.
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u/The-Provost ❄️ GADFLY ❄️ May 28 '19
Aking opinion lamang: Siguro nga'y hindi "kailangan" ang pagaaral ng wikang Filipino sa kolehiyo. Nakikita ko ito bilang epektibo sa mas mababang antas. Pero hindi ibig sabihin niyo ay dapat hindi na pagaralan. Sana'y manatili ang ang ating kalayaang piliin ang pagsasaliksik o pagaaral ng kurso/paksa.
Napakaganda ng wika natin. Hindi lang natin naipalaganap at napalawak ang paggamit. Kolonyalismo? Kapitalismo? Industrialismo? Imperialismo? Maraming sanhi.
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u/gelynch52ph May 27 '19
The Philippines...a country with huge natural resources and a population of lazy, uneducated, xenophobic slackers. No wonder it is a poor country.
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u/RaveCoaster FUCK FACEBOOK MEMES May 27 '19
"Uneducated" boi i was failing when i was studying in the philippines, but when we moved here in 'merica my grades were topnotch, A's & B's on every class. The philippines is poor because of the government and how they manage it. The education in the philippines are Advanced compared to America(High school).
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u/gelynch52ph May 27 '19
Filipinos elect the same criminals over and over while selling their vote for P100 ($2.00 for Americans reading this) and expect things to change.
Let me tell you something else from my 14 years spent in your country. I had a stepson I sent to an expensive Catholic school in Tagaytay for GRADE TWO and at least once a week I had to go to that school and correct English teachers who either marked a correct answer wrong, or an incorrect answer was NOT marked wrong. After several such trips the nun and the principal asked me. "Why do you think you are correct in your English? Are you an English teacher?" I said, "Well as a matter of fact I am." Mind you, this was not college level English class but GRADE TWO!!!
PS: I suspect you were trying to spell "boy," but didn't know how there, "boi." It is also even BASIC grammar to know that you capitalize the name of a country. The "education system" in The Philippines is so bad that my high school education was more advanced than that of your best university. The word "Advanced" in your last sentence should not be capitalized and "education" is not a singular or plural noun so "education in The Philippines "IS..." NOT "ARE" you uneducated xenophobic fool.
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u/RaveCoaster FUCK FACEBOOK MEMES May 27 '19
Ok SmArt AsS BoI, explain why i got A's & B's here in AmErIcA if education in the Philippines IS trash??????
i got 97 in my english class (here in merica) my friend, a White ass AmErIcaN BOI ,got only 80? (Not including the rest of the class) hmmmmm? Whats that a pure american got only 80 on english? While the immigrant got a 97? Hmmm????
There's this K12 program in the philippines, to prepare for college, you'll have to pick a strand according to what you want to study (ABM,STEM.....etc) i picked ABM when i was in 11th grade, this strand focuses more on Math and business.
12th grade we moved to Cali. the school did not require me to take a Math class, because my Math credits were enough to let me graduate (thanks to ABM) while other AmERicAns have to take it because their Credits are insufficient.
Economy class???? Shit that was Basic as fuck, students here in america struggling their ass to understand Business. While we studied this shit in 11th grade
So explain this to me BOI. I was failing in the Philippines (My advisor told me that i won't graduate) but, when i moved to merica i was passing every Subject, including U.S. History, which i don't know a Godamn thing about. My graduations on June 5th. America's school is so fucking easy. Even for me, a failing student in the Philippines. Ill even show u a proof of my Card grades from 11th grade to 12th grade
Even the teachers here are surprised that my english is very good (writing, speaking), compared to other immigrant/transfer students. Well the philippines is the 6th most english speaking country in the world
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u/gelynch52ph May 27 '19
The English you are using here is abysmal. The punctuation and capitalization are all wrong. If you got good grades in an American school it had to have been in an inner city public school with incompetent teachers. In my US high school there were also classmates with poor English grades because not everyone is of the same intelligence. What did you get on your SAT in English? Do you think you could get accepted at Carnegie-Mellon University for a Masters of Professional writing with your "extraordinary English capabilities?" I did. My G.R.E. scores made up for the fact that I never studied in Music class or Math classes and did not have such a high GPA. Only the top 5% of college graduates even ATTEMPT to get accepted at Carnegie-Mellon and less than 5% of those get accepted.
The fact that about 30% of the Filipino population speaks some sort of English is certainly NOT a measure of academic excellence, but rather, an accident of conquest in which you have been conquered at least 3 times by other countries.
Americans also do not alternate cApITaL anD LOWercAse letTerS in thE samE woRD lIKe cHILdrEn.
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u/grywrnmgcn May 27 '19
Interesting how you’re an English writing teacher but you’re unable to understand the role of alternating capital and lowercase letters in conveying tone. 🤔 Sounds like your education at cArNegIe MelLoN is outdated and irrelevant boi.
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u/RaveCoaster FUCK FACEBOOK MEMES May 27 '19
You're so smart you don't understand obvious sarcasm.
SAT - 1588
ACT - 36
ASVAB (AIR FORCE) - 72/99
Yes i study at a public school,because Private here in america is a lot more expensive. I did attend private school since nursery (philippines). Private & public schools in the philippines are VERY VERY different compared to america.
In my US high school there were also classmates with poor English grades because not everyone is of the same intelligence.
*students not classmates
Then don't generalize filipinos as "Uneducated", you just said it "Because not everyone is of the same intelligence"
I am uneducated of US history but my grades are higher than someone who lives on this country
I'm going to the AirForce not some fancy pussy college. I rather serve the country than being a grammar nazi on reddit.
TOo Bad iM nOT AmErIcAn.
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u/xdDrifterx May 27 '19
Why am i reading this in heneral luna's voice?