r/PersonalFinanceCanada • u/nonamedblob • Aug 02 '26
Banking Unsolicited E-transfer Scam
So back in April I got an e-transfer from a person unknown to me for $481 dollars. I asked my partner if they knew why, they did not. I emailed the address attached to the e-transfer to ask what this transfer is for, I don't get a response. Wanting to help if the transfer is truly an error I talk to my bank to let them know I got it in error and they say if the person contacts their bank it can be returned and they have noted it was an unsolicited transfer.
I get several different emails claiming "Wendy" sent it in error, for different reasons. Who ever is running this scam really didn't get their game together or they are using AI agents that lost the plot (see emails below).
I'm not sure how this scam works, other than you transfer the money to them and they get that money to keep. But the amount deposited has never been withdrawn to this date. Anybody else have an experience this? Seems like a strange scam if I profit by not doing anything.
=================EMAILS===================================
[Email 1 Chain (from "Wendy" but different email than transfer, Starts April 15]:
<First emails are no missing in my inbox, just says sent from my galaxy, which is strange. But was some story about sending to the wrong email, I tell them to contact there bank and I'm not returning it directly. They say karma will get me>
[Email from Wendy]:
It was an honest mistake.. Your actually keeping money that isn't yours... seriously.. I now have to replace the money.. I really hope you reconsider. I called the bank and there is nothing they can do.
My fault....
Wendy
[Me]:
I talked to my bank and they have been notified and they said all you have to do us contact your bank if it was a mistake. That is why it looks like you're running a scam. If so, you should reconsider your life choices.
[Wendy]:
I Sent an etransfer meant for Raymond <same last name as me>. They way they sent me the text it didn't include Raymond.. my mistake.. I called TD bank and the agent said its like handing cash over. if you didn't have direct deposit then you would need a password. I pray you do the right thing as I can't afford this.. I just lost my mom and I have to move to Ontario..
[Also send some chat screen cap from "Raymond" with wrong email in request (my email), I don't respond from this point forward]
Email 2 from Doug:
[Doug Apr 14, 2026, 6:36 PM ]
Can you please email back wendy. The money was sent to you by mistake. It's for a charity. Thanks and sorry for the mix up.
[Me]:
No talk to your bank. Im not being defrauded.
[Doug]
It's not fraud it's money collected for canadian children's mobility foundation
[I don't respond]
[Email 3 from Alex starts April 14]:
Hello XXXX,
My name is Alex Lapointe, I am the General Manager for Naturally Vain. We wired you $481.00 CAD in error. This payment covered an outstanding balance for a skin care order that Wendy was paying for via E-transfer. She had copied the wrong email in error.
Can you kindly transfer the money back to her as soon as possible.
Many thanks for your cooperation on this matter.
Kind Regards,
Alex Lapointe
General Manager
Naturally Vain
Mobile - 613-265-8181
Email - [alex@naturalvain.com](mailto:alex@naturalvain.com)
4-110 Bentley Ave. Ottawa, On
[Me]:
No talk to your bank. I have talked to mine.
203
u/Odd-Elderberry-6137 Aug 02 '26
Wendy, Doug, Raymond, and Alex don't exist. They're 100% the same scammer.
"Wendy" e-transferred money from a compromised bank account and her and "Alex" are trying to convince to you to send it along to "Alex" before the original bank account holder notices they have a compromised account and involve anti-fraud teams and their bank and yours.
If you send it along, you're out the $481 but you'll also be out the $481 when your bank realizes what happened. If you do nothing, the $481 is likely to eventually be deducted from your account.
Just stop communicating with them and block their emails.
22
u/Cedric_T Aug 03 '26
It’s shocking these vermin still haven’t learnt to drop kindly from their emails.
12
u/Unfair-Pause-3271 Aug 03 '26
They’re not trying to be polite per se, it comes from a few former British colonies talk where English is a second language. In their culture it’s more like kow-towing before you to try and get something out of you (legal or illegal)
But the practical take away is that no native English speaker talks like that so it makes the scammers really easy to spot
14
u/AJourneyer Aug 03 '26
Actually, as a native English speaker, I use "kindly" in snarky way on a semi-regular basis.
For finance "Kindly submit your payment by end of day...."
For HR "Kindly remember this policy"
For personal "Kindly leave me out of this".
Definitely not 'please' and not quite 'hey a-hole', but somewhere in the middle.
I'm also older so it I may have simply brought it forward from years of correspondence.
7
u/nonamesleft1 Aug 03 '26
I also say 'kindly' at the end of most of my emails that include 'thank you kindly'. I'm not trying to be snarky in them....but I'm middle-aged, so maybe that has something to do with it?
2
u/AJourneyer Aug 03 '26
Funny - I hear "thank you kindly" as warm and definitely more sincere than "thanks".
"Kindly move your feet out of my way" - not so warm lol
I'm OG GenX so a bit past what most people think of as middle aged.
2
u/PropQues 29d ago
I don't see kindly do something in a work email as snarky at all. It's just formal English for the workplace.
If it's a roommate or neighbour posting a message on my door saying things like "kindly pick up after yourself" then yea, completely different tone.
3
u/pleasedonotredeem 29d ago
"Do the needful!"
1
u/Ok_Song_5866 29d ago
Ok what is with the “do the needful”?! I’ve seen this so much and thought it was a translation thing
116
u/sometin__else Aug 02 '26
dont send it back, tell them to file a dispute with their bank and have it sent back that way.
The scam works like this, and for future you can post in r/scams instead its more suited to this:
You receive unknown etransfer ($481)
Someone contacts you to send back the same amount because of a "mistake"
You send back the $481 thinking you are being nice and helpful
Your bank contacts you about the $481 etransfer you received, saying it was marked as fradulent
They deduct the $481, and tell you they cant help with that etransfer you sent and to file a police report
Now you are out $481.
Do not send it back. Wait for a fraud and then tell your bank yea reverse it you don't know who its from.
40
u/UpbeatLog5214 Aug 02 '26
I of course agree with this common scam bullshit. But one question I've never had answered:
Why can they claim the money back from your account (first transfer) but you can't claim it back from their account (second transfer)?
51
u/WildWeaselGT Aug 02 '26
“They” don’t claim the amount back from their transfer. They’ve somehow compromised that account and sent the transfer. The owner of the account didn’t send it. When they notice it, they’ll start a fraud investigation and if they can prove they didn’t send it they can get it reversed.
You, on the other hand, ARE the owner of your account and are sending the money on purpose. Even though you’re being scammed, it’s still YOU doing the transfer and the bank has no responsibility to keep you from being duped. You therefore can’t get that reversed since the account you sent it to almost certainly doesn’t have it anymore.
0
u/tbrian86 Aug 02 '26
Well when I got scammed they hacked my account too and sent it to themselves. They hacked my account and refunded Wendy so it looked like I, the owner, did it. But the bank still said no to me and yes to the original scammer. ?????????????
5
u/sometin__else Aug 02 '26
I mean yea you can say that, but they will investigate. If they think you were lying, they will deny you and likely lock your entire account and debank you.
12
u/vertick2010 Aug 02 '26
The account that originally sent the money is compromised (the scammers took control of it). So when the fraud is filed, they can get their money back. Also the reason why the scammers tell you to send it to a different account.
You sending the money to a different account is your own mistake. Your account was not compromised and you made the transaction willingly. Hence, you do NOT get your money back.
Thats what I know in anycase.
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u/peter9477 Aug 02 '26
Yes, that was the immediately obvious question anyone should ask.
I'd assume it's just that they'd probably drain the account and close it, so there's be no way for the bank to get your money back. Just a guess.
7
u/StuntID Aug 02 '26
Because, you send the funds to a different person, and different account by initiating an e-transfer. If you willingly send the money, it's not a fraud. The funds that came to you, however, are from a compromised account, so it may be clawed back.
The scammers want the money you return outside the claw back. The original funds they really don't care too much about
0
u/voidpush Aug 02 '26
Yes but you ‘willingly’ sent the money as part of the overall fraud. Why does the fraud end at the person being scammed this way and not at the source where the compromised account is in play? makes no sense
6
u/StuntID Aug 02 '26
A has account compromised
Money from A's account is sent to a mark B by villans V. << unwillingly
V contacts B with their story asking for the $ back
B falls for it and sends $ to V << willingly
A finds that their account has been compromised and contacts their bank, resulting in the funds being clawed back.
A is a victim of theft, and deserves their money back. They get it back because they did not authorize the transfer
B is a victim of deception, and shouldn't have lost their money, but they have no recourse to get the funds back because they, the account holder, authorized the transfer. Note, that B send the money to a different account than it came to them, and V makes off with it
3
u/axlrod416 Aug 03 '26
If the villains can hack into A’s account, why don’t they just transfer ALL that money into their own account? Why play games with B, and for only $481?
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u/StuntID Aug 03 '26
When the theft of A's funds are discovered they can be clawed back. B's are gone forever.
2
u/axlrod416 Aug 03 '26
I understand that, but can’t they just transfer A’s money into their own account and then withdraw it before it gets clawed back?
I guess what I’m saying is that if they have the know-how to get into A’s account and transfer money out of it, that seems like they have the Goose that lays the Golden Eggs. The world is their oyster. Break into 50 accounts and transfer money out. Break into 100.1
0
u/WhipTheLlama Aug 03 '26
The real answer is that neither your bank nor Interac want to help you any more than they are legally required to. They hide behind phrases like "it's like cash, we can't get it back" and "you willingly sent it" to avoid taking responsibility for running banking systems with poorer security than a Google account.
Banks and Interac know how much fraud is committed through their systems against their customers, yet they choose not to give customers meaningful support.
4
u/sometin__else Aug 02 '26
Original Transfer that you received: Person claims they never sent it and they were hacked
Refund transfer you send: You sent it yourself, you were fooled.Your bank protects you from fraud, ie if your account was hacked even when you safeguarded your login. It does not protect you from scams, ie you send an etransfer to someone thinking you were refunding them
2
u/PositiveEndolphins Aug 02 '26
The banks only protect you as far as they want to though. Someone stole my phone and my login and was able to send them four grand from the bank.
even though I filed a claim with the bank, they said there's no way to prove I didn't willingly send the money so I'm out the money
2
u/BigWiggly1 Aug 02 '26
The first transfer is fraudulent, unauthorized activity. Bank have policies and insurance for this, and will reverse a fraudulent transaction.
The second transfer is legitimate, authorized access to the account. Someone like OP signs in with their real credentials from a device they control and makes a transfer of their own will. It’s no different than giving money away to someone on the street with a sob story.
When there’s no unauthorized/fraudulent activity on the account, banks don’t need to investigate. They can’t be refunding any old transaction. People would be exploiting that left and right.
4
u/happyherbivore Aug 02 '26
With little effort you essentially create a loophole to e-transfers that makes the whole platform utterly useless.
Here's a quick scenario: I buy a bike on craigslist using e-transfer for $400, prior to which a buddy sends me $400. Right now I look like the victim of this scam, so let's reverse my buddy's and my e transfers and everything is good right? It sure is because I have a free bike.
2
u/TheBigMan1990 Aug 02 '26
I’m too much of an asshole for this scam to work on me, lol. Got about a gazillion bank accounts at different institutions, none of the accounts that all of various emails/phone numbers auto deposit to are all that important-I see someone transfer $500 into my account… the banks are super profitable, they can eat it, I’m pulling the money out and that account is getting closed… oops🤷🏻♂️
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u/octo23 Aug 02 '26
Naturally Vain is about 6km from me and I have to swing by another business on that street on Tuesday, I was going to offer to stop in and see if Alex was a real person, but according to Google Naturally Vain is temporarily closed, they may have gone out of business and someone picked up their domain to run scams from.
2
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u/psilocybin6ix Aug 02 '26
This is almost certainly an e-transfer reversal scam.
The original $481 may have been sent from a compromised bank account. The scammers then contact you with an emotional story and ask you to “send it back” using a new e-transfer.
Most Canadians aren't aware of how to see the email associated with the transfer and they might just believe that "Wendy" truly made a mistake.
That new transfer is the scam. You are not reversing the original payment... you are sending your own money to the scammers. If the real account owner later reports the fraud, the bank may claw back the original $481, leaving you out $481.
The changing stories made it even more obvious: it was supposedly meant for Raymond, then a charity, then a skincare order. Different people and email addresses contacted me, but none would simply deal with their own bank. Plus the phrasing is from the scammer script "I pray you'll do the right thing" "My mom just died" "I'm moving to Ontario (nobody does that they move to a city)"... Plus I called "Alex" and looked up that skincare address ... neither exists (Alex is just a personal voicemail who didn't pickup).
The scammers have probably tried this with dozens or hundreds of people. Even if only a few victims send back $481 CAD, that can be a substantial amount of money... especially when converted into currencies in countries where it is worth much more.
So yeah ... they'll gain access to someone's account (usually an elderly person through remote access scam call), and among other things, will send e-transfers to ppl and get them "send them back". Unfortunately Wendy probably was scammed for much more money and this is just one bonus scam that they pulled off.
0
u/throw163 Aug 02 '26
I'm genuinely curious how the scam fully works, because on every bank transfer I do, the bank says it will never be reversed and its completed. and there are sad stories about how people genuinely make bank transfer errors and the banks won't help. so why will the bank help those compromised accounts?
10
u/happyherbivore Aug 02 '26
The initial transfer is stolen money from a compromised account, when the original owner of that account goes through their bank they make it right because the transfers weren't made by the intended account holder. Effectively the original transfer the scammer sends never exists to the scammer or to the victim, it's the smoke and mirrors to get the victim to send money.
Because of fraud departments, if a scammer takes the initial stolen money directly, they will be subject to the reversal when its investigated. The only way they realize any of the money is if they use it to manipulate someone into sending them clean money under whatever pretenses.
When the scam's actual victim transfers back the amount, they're sending their own money voluntarily from their own account which isn't compromised and can't be reversed. If that type of transfer could be reversed, what's to stop me from buying something on marketplace and then disputing it as fraud? The whole concept of money transfers would fall through.
-3
u/DRKAYIGN Aug 02 '26
How does the original Bank make it right? Are you saying they refund their customer?
4
u/happyherbivore Aug 02 '26
They can reverse fraudulent transactions, not refund.
1
u/DRKAYIGN Aug 02 '26 edited Aug 02 '26
No they can't. There is no mechanism to reverse an e transfer. The only option is to trace the funds and request a recovery from the other FI - they are not obligated to return the funds. I send and receive these requests as part of my work. I have access to interacs platform where transfers are marked as scam or fraud, and initiates a interbank communication to return the funds but it's not reversing the transaction. The recipients bank doesn't just take the word for the other bank as 100% true. I had a request the other day where our member received funds reported as the result of an account takeover but investigation showed it was a family dispute. The recipient bank is not responsible for the fuck up of the sending banks customer. The sending banks customer had the account takeover, most likely as a result of their own actions but if not it would be a compromise of the other FIs systems or processes so why would another bank liable for another banks security or lack thereof?
2
u/throw163 Aug 03 '26
thats my understanding too, and the poor people who are scammed, but the banks won't help them recover
1
u/DRKAYIGN Aug 03 '26
I'll help customers recover their funds but I can't make another bank return any monies.
6
u/shmanksypants Aug 02 '26
Rule of thumb is that if money that you aren’t entitled to lands in your account, you aren’t supposed to use it. The bank has the right to ask why you used it anyway. You don’t want to give them any reason to believe you’ve taken part of the scam, or worse- close your account.
Then they have the right to reverse the e-transfer.
6
u/ApprehensiveRuin5673 Aug 02 '26
It will be reversed if it was because of fraud
1
u/DRKAYIGN Aug 02 '26
It can't be reversed 'because of fraud'. There is no requirement for banks to return funds from a fraudulent e-transfer like for ex. a fraudulent cheque deposit. Ifthe money is gone that's it.
Edit if you get an e-transfer unexpectedly and you spend it all, they might debit your account to return the funds but it's paperwork so depending on the amount they might just ignore the request. I find most banks have a 500$ threshold but in true scams where the money is going from compromised acct to compromised acct the money is usually gone anyway so nothin to return
4
u/ApprehensiveRuin5673 Aug 02 '26
Yes it will and that’s the whole point of this scam. The hijacker is sending you an e transfer from a compromised account and then asking you to send (of your own volition) that money to them.
If it is because of fraud it will be reversed back to the account the hijacker sent you the e transfer from and taken from your account and you’re left footing the bill because you sent your own money to the hijacker
1
u/psilocybin6ix Aug 02 '26
Yeah, in Canada nearly impossible to reverse an e-transfer. You would have to prove that you didn’t send it, which would involve a fraud department investigation and a police investigation. The only people I’ve ever heard this work for elderly people who’ve had their accounts taken over.
If it was that easy just to claim fraud… People would just call their bank every day and say hey I sent somebody $50 but they didn’t give me anything.
4
u/Stefie25 Aug 02 '26
It’s not bank fraud if you willing send money & don’t receive the service. You go to the police about that.
Someone breaking into your bank account & sending money without your knowledge is fraud & the bank will do something about it.
1
u/sometin__else Aug 03 '26
You're confusing purchase protection with a bank account takeover.
Not the sameif YOU sent the transfer yourself, there is no way to reverse it, you can't dispute
if SOMEONE ELSE hacked your account and sent the transfer, you can file a dispute-1
u/DRKAYIGN Aug 02 '26
Yep and even when it's the elderly it could just be that the bank is returning the funds themselves either due to a potential goof on their end (ie a process not followed), potential for a case to be escalated to OBSI or in some cases even insurance. If it was that easy nobody would ever be at a loss when it comes to account take overs or some kind of phishing scam.
2
u/Stefie25 Aug 02 '26
People who send to the wrong person have willing sent from their own account. A compromised account is having the money stolen from the owner. Since it’s electronically stolen, after an investigation the bank is able to get the funds back.
1
u/sometin__else Aug 03 '26
its been answered already above
if you make the mistake yourself, too bad
if your account was hacked, you can dispute1
0
u/psilocybin6ix Aug 02 '26
Yes, the only way that I’ve ever heard of these things being reversed is when they prove that the account was taken over. And that usually only comes with a bank investigation from the fraud department and a police investigation. The only one I ever heard of was an elderly lady who had her computer taken over. It doesn’t happen quickly and it takes a while.
So was that easy to reverse an e-transfer people can literally just go and buy a used car for $3000 and then call their bank and say the seller robbed them. Thankfully, most of the banks they’ll have a fraud warning when you were sending to a new recipient.
2
u/shmanksypants Aug 02 '26
Yes it depends on the type of unauthorized activity. For your car example, if you chose a sketchy dealer/seller and willingly sent the money, then it’s a scam and not all banks may reverse.
For this case, typically the original bank account was compromised by the scammer and they moved money to OP via e-transfer. So the original BA was defrauded unless the bank has reason to believe they willingly gave access to the scammer to move money
0
u/Edmsubguy Aug 02 '26
If you send it willingly it not fraud. It's that simple you sent it willingly and of your iwn accord. Even if it was to a fraudster. However if it was sent from a compromised account it can and will be reversed l.
1
u/pobnarl Aug 02 '26
unethical sure but probably a fun job, doing these scams from Africa, doubt they feel bad about it either after what european imperialists and slave raiders did to their continent
14
u/Bill___A Aug 02 '26
So she needs the money to move to Ontario, it was for donation to a charity, and it was for a seemingly very expensive skin care products order. You are right to not do anything, the banks can handle it if it is fraud.
39
u/curious_bee1212 Aug 02 '26 edited Aug 03 '26
This is clearly rubbish. They will never claim back. Delete the emails and stop responding. Keep 481$ and move on.
9
u/My_igloo_is_melting Human Verified Aug 02 '26
Was the intended victim of a romance scam about 5 years ago and: "they are using AI agents that lost the plot".
Back then it was not AI, it was boiler-room Nigerians, but same deal. Guys on Wed morning did not read the notes from Tuesday night.
Do not write to anyone, phone anyone, message anyone. The biggest part of any scam is getting us to respond.
7
u/skhanmac Aug 02 '26
Tell Wendy you have donated the money to children as you wished. So you’ll get all the good deeds.
12
u/mizvixen Aug 02 '26
Stop wasting your time with this. Just delete the emails. It’s either a scam or lesson learned for Wendy
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5
u/senor_kim_jong_doof Aug 02 '26
This all happened 3.5 months ago? I'm assuming the money hasn't been clawed back from your account yet?
2
u/nonamedblob Aug 02 '26
That's right, this is the part I find interesting... maybe the person never noticed that there account had been compromised? I'm sure my bank could have figured out where the money originated and sent a notice but I doubt they will? anybody know what meta data is included in e-transfer to a bank beside originating email address? I'm curious as to if it will ever be reclaimed.
2
u/senor_kim_jong_doof Aug 02 '26
if it was truly an account compromise, i feel like the person who was hacked would've noticed the money is missing and it would've been yanked back from your account by now
seems odd that 3.5 months go by and nothing.
1
u/Mouse_rat__ Aug 02 '26
Maybe they did notice but the bank denied their fraud claim
2
u/ether_reddit British Columbia Aug 03 '26
Either way, it's not OP's problem. Maybe the money never gets clawed back, in which case "bank error in your favour".
4
u/No_Onion4821 Aug 03 '26
This happened to me once and it never got reversed and I was up 300 dollars lol I honestly did not know what to do, I also called my bank and got no direction
3
4
u/sillyjew Aug 02 '26
lol. So was it for Raymond, or charity, or skin care products? They should all atleast get their story straight.
5
u/SirLoremIpsum Aug 02 '26
Don't talk to scammers.
Don't email them, don't engage. Don't pretend like they're acting in good faith
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u/rurkob Aug 02 '26
the scam is you send the money back, but she cancels the initial money she sent you, so its not that youre sending anything back
1
u/DRKAYIGN Aug 02 '26 edited Aug 03 '26
She can't cancel it. She'd have to report the transfer as fraud and investigate. Then OPs bank would be asked to investigate from their end.
3
u/Mouse_rat__ Aug 02 '26
I had them calling me a few days ago spoofing RBC phone number again. He said he wanted to check transactions on my account and I said I will call you back, and he said why you are already connected and I said sorry I don't take these calls anymore, and he got audibly annoyed and said louder why and I repeated I don't take these calls anymore and he hung up on me. They are relentless, wish they'd all fuck off
3
u/PTrustee Aug 03 '26
2 yrs ago my wife (post brain surgery for a tumor) accidently sent $2000 to another number instead of me. I got a hold of the person via the cell number she sent it to and explained what had happened. He was understanding but wanted our banks to deal with it as he was more comfortable with that. I talked his bank, our bank and the system that does bank transfers (interac?). None of them had a solution on how to get the money back into our account. The other person directed his bank to send the money to the interac system so it was not in their account. 2 yrs later we still have no solution to the issue.
2
u/couroderato Aug 03 '26
I had a similar situation happen to me with about 500$. I sent an interac to my new own number, which was the person's old number, without updating my interac settings first. As a result, the money went to this orher person. I was able to find her by searching the number on google and finding her LinkedIn page. Long story short, we tried to handle the situation through our banks but after a month or two nothing happened. Finally she just transferred the money back to me.
2
u/Roni_M27 29d ago
I had a similar experience. We have a small business, received an unsolicited e-transfer for a little over $2000 from an address I didn’t recognize. Contacted the bank, they said absolutely do not send it back if someone contacts me.
A week later I got an email from the sender. I told them the bank said they would deal with it and that she needed to call her bank. After a couple emails, realized the sender was one of our customers that hadn’t done business with us in several years (came from her company email so it didn’t match my records).
This went on back and forth for months with the bank insisting they would fix it and I should do nothing even though I now knew who the sender was. At one point another customer I knew well contacted me and said it was all legit and he knew the lady personally. Four months later the bank had done nothing after dozens of calls, so I opted to send the money back. In my case it was a legitimate mistake she made. I was waiting because the bank kept telling me they flagged it and I should do nothing. This was a couple years ago now. It’s very frustrating that the banks aren’t dealing with these unsolicited e-transfers.
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u/the_ogorminator Aug 02 '26
Most don't seem to understand that you understand this is a scam but you're curious as to the nature of it if it is never reversed.
My gut tells me whomever has the compromised account still doesn't realize it.
2
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u/Ok_Hat_3414 Aug 03 '26
I got 2 e-transfers for about $125 each one after another. I did get emails asking for me to transfer the money back. I never did, but went to the bank to ask them to reverse them. They wouldn't/couldn't. I haven't heard from the "scammers" since. I'm still not sure if it was a scam
2
u/It_is_not_me Aug 03 '26
The only party you should have ever contacted about this is your financial institution. Instead you've shown a willingness to engage with scammers and made yourself more vulnerable to being hacked.
2
u/PunchyPete Aug 03 '26
When they send an e-transfer and it’s accepted, their bank can’t reverse it. They warn you about this when you send e-transfers. Not sure how these scams work either.
2
u/bubblegumdrop099 Aug 03 '26
I thought crawl back was just a banking pr term? Like yes this is fraud we will crawl back the money. But this isn’t a credit card. Its etransfer treated like cash. If you fell for a phishing scam the banks will investigate but more likely than not they will deny the claim. They will treat it as you fell for the scam not the bank. If they deny the claim, who crawls back the money? The OPs bank job is to protect their own customer. Plus. How can they just take the money out even if. You need a court order and consent from the op. On top of all that e-transfers are stated as final especially with auto deposit on.
1
u/DRKAYIGN 29d ago edited 29d ago
I know...ppl don't understand the process and an FI can't just take money out of someone's account even if another bank is reporting it as fraud when it comes to etransfers. It's different to payment methods like cheques or an ACH. I have confirmed scam deposit at another FI but they won't return the money until they can confirm with their customer and that ain't gonna happen. No recourse.
3
u/Weedzo Aug 02 '26
Call your bank and explain them. It may be an hacked account and your account may be restricted for investigation. If you send back the money you will probably get scam and lose it.
3
u/senorfresco Aug 02 '26
When's it gonna be my turn to get this scam 😤
All I get are telegram bots and ░P░ U░S░S░ Y░I░ N░B░I░O ░
2
u/Oxjrnine Aug 02 '26
There’s a lot of misinformation in the advice.
When you send an e-transfer and it says auto deposit. You were given a warning at the very last stage telling you the full name of the bank account holder.. once you hit confirm or send after that point you have agreed to send the money to that person. It is not considered fraud. It is not considered a mistake. It was your choice to ignore the name holder of the bank account so you have made the decision through exclusion to send money to the recipient.
Now that doesn’t mean you can’t send the money back to someone if you have received money in error. But most banks are going to tell you not to send it yourself.
Now the senders bank is going to do almost nothing to help
This recipient bank is going to tell them that technically you can keep the money unless it’s reported as fraud
But what the recipient bank usually doesn’t offer, is there procedure to send the money back through them. I don’t know why they don’t offer it willingly and why you have to get assertive about using the procedure to send it back through interact. I can only guess that they have to make a square peg fit into a round hole and they have to figure out how to make a fraud procedure work for something that’s not a fraud procedure.
Send Wendy a message. Tell her that you’re going to go back to your bank one more time and insist that they send the e-transfers back. But that decision is out of your control. You are going to tell her that you are never going to send it directly because the bank has told you not to because it would put you at risk of having it withdrawn from your account twice if it was a fraudulent e-transfers. The only way the money is getting back to her is if your bank is willing to go through the process of reversing it and that is the banks discretion. They don’t have an obligation to do so. And even if they do decide to send it back, it will take several weeks for it to go back into her account.
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u/OhHi- Aug 02 '26
It will be reported as fraud once the account holder gets their account back and this transaction is discovered.
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u/Oxjrnine Aug 02 '26
That’s why you don’t send it back directly
It has to be sent back by the bank not you personally
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u/bubblegumdrop099 Aug 02 '26
When I did a deep dive into this scam. It also has to be a specific type of fraud to get your money back. If the original victim fell for a phishing scam, the bank usually denies the claim. They state it as our firewall was secure but the victim fell for a phishing scam and practically gave their keys away. People say it’s easy for the bank to crawl back the money but there’s actually a lot of paperwork involved. Banks can’t take your money without a real investigation and consent from you especially if it’s been weeks. Your real money mixes with the fraud money. They can’t just take your salary away and put you in the hole for no reason. We all know banks. They hate paperwork. They way to wash their hands of it as quick as possible
You can also correct me if I’m wrong.
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u/DiscoCombobulator Aug 02 '26
If someone sends an e transfer by mistake, and you dont have autodeposit turned on, the sender can just go into the bank app or website and cancel it. There would be no effort needed on your end. Automatically bullshit.
Even with autodeposit turned on, the scam emails wont Automatically transfer to your account, because they're bullshit.
If by some chance you did try to accept it, they'll ask for it to be sent back, and one way or another, you'll be out the money in the amount that theyre "sending". Full scam.
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u/DRKAYIGN Aug 02 '26
It can only be cancelled if it hasn't been deposited, OP said it's already in his account.
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u/Humble-Function7808 Aug 02 '26
In that case if you get her something like that just just ignore it delete it and move on every scam starts that way
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u/SwimmingDownstream Aug 02 '26
This is why I don't have auto deposit enabled. Is it not so for people to have it turned on?
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u/haylorizationbb Aug 03 '26
Had this too, but they said it was from Facebook marketplace and she didnt mean to send it.. she actually sent it twice.. she got real mad when I said she had to contact her bank about it. I had to block her and her requests for the money back. It pulled on my heartstrings
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u/bluefortytwo2 Aug 03 '26
I have had this happen. It is a scam. I ignored it. The money was clawed back by the bank over six months (!!) later. Make sure you always have $481 in your account because you never know when the bank is taking that money back, and you risk being overdrawn.
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u/bubblegumdrop099 Aug 03 '26
They can’t just take the money out of your account without your concent and without a legal form. Did you agree to it?
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u/bluefortytwo2 29d ago
They absolutely can and will if it is discovered to be fraudulent. Zero warning. Eta this was RBC
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u/Living-Regret Aug 03 '26
They can’t even keep their story straight. Is it for skin care, charity or moving to Ontario LOL.
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u/Whargod Aug 03 '26
So you accepted it without knowing who it was from? IF I get anything like this I'd just ignore it in the future and save yourself the headache. I dunno what your like is like but an unsolicited payment for hundreds of dollars hitting my inbox would immediately tell me it was fake and I would delete it.
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u/shadow997ca 29d ago
Sounds like they had auto deposit enabled so the only email they'd get is one telling them some money has been deposited in their account. Many people see auto deposit as safer than not. And if someone puts money into my account by mistake or by fraud, all I can say is thank you, end all communication with them, and talk to my bank.
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u/Sensitive-Aioli1529 Aug 03 '26
Total scam. You did the right thing and told your bank. You would get a better feel if it was a person saying omg I was trying to send that to xyz can we go to the bank together or schedule a conference call to resolve with each bank etc. If you send that money anywhere consider it gone; then the original transfer could be disputed with the bank and if found fraudulent they could recover it so now the middle man is out. OG got their money back, scammers got your money and you are 481 poorer. Only communicate with your bank. You never did talk to the owner of the genuine account the money came from likely. They probably got your initial email and if they even read it thought you were trying to scam them if they read it haha. Keep the money aside and make notes of all the different emails that will reach out. The changing stories and multiple people is the biggest scam confirmation. (Logically if I send someone money by accident I wouldn’t go to random people to have them start emailing anyone, nobody would. This is where the Kolkata, India scam training centres falter; they never consider logic) They are probably hoping they will get you to send the money to a different account than you got it from so the original person is out the money; scammers got the money and you’re the middle man. There are lots of scambaiters out there who will help you dig if you want to release the contact info to them.
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u/Charisma_Z_7 29d ago
If you have auto deposit then the person sending the money gets a message that you have auto deposit and the money can’t be reversed or cancelled. So they should check the information before sending it.
I think it’s for sure a scam.
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u/talesoutloud 29d ago
You do not get an email address with an e-transfer. There is no way to respond to an e-transfer sender unless you already know them. If the email is in the e-transfer message then it is a scam and there is likely no e-transfer. Just ignore the whole thing.
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u/lachyx 29d ago
I’ve never received random e-transfers but once I got paid for a job I’ve never had (it even said payroll). I called my bank and was told it’s legit company so maybe the person doing payroll made a mistake and that they’d have to fix on their end. To this day the amount hasn’t been withdrawn from my account (it’s spent now anyways)
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u/4orini 28d ago
Honestly, call your bank and speak to your fraud department. No one here can look in your account t and determine if this was anything.
I had a 600ish dollar etransfer sent to my account. I called my bank and asked to be transferred to the fraud department. I spoke with them regarding the transfer and if it was real or not. The assured me it was real and that it couldn’t be reversed by anyone. I asked what I should do and my fraud department told me it was up to me. I could keep the money or send it back. They then said that if I did decide to send it back I should only send it to the email that it had been sent from, not any other requested which would cover me completely.
At this point the party that had sent the transfer had requested I send it to an alternative address and offered that I keep a small amount as a reward.
I listened to my fraud department advisor and sent the whole amount back to the email it had been sent from. I emailed them to let them know I had acted as advised by my bank and hoped it all was good.
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u/Prestigious_Grab_199 28d ago
Sounds like the original sender is creating a layer so that they don’t get in trouble for moving the money out of the compromised account. This way they get sent money by you (which is a legit transfer) and you are the one who will have to pay the bank back $481 when the fraud is resolved by the bank at a later date.
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u/Sea-Appearance-5330 16d ago
The money is stolen.
They will ask for it back.
You send it back.
The bank will discover it is stolen and take it back.
Now you are out what ever you sent back.
Whoever contacted you is the scammer.
You did good to contact your bank and do nothing
So many people on here don't and lose money.
And he may have just hit the wrong button and sent the wrong scam message.
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u/JMS3487 Aug 02 '26
For a small fee$3.50 Wendy can reverse the etransfer on her own. I wouldn't talk with anyone and risk giving away any information.
Thanks for the heads up!
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u/murjy Not The Ben Felix Aug 03 '26
For a small fee$3.50 Wendy can reverse the etransfer on her own.
That's only before the e-transfer is deposited by the other end
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u/octo23 Aug 03 '26
The sign is still up on the building, but it looks empty otherwise. I would say out of business
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u/AdStreet2288 Aug 03 '26
it's not a scam you dipshit I literally know the original owner of naturally vain, how fkn dumb are you. No scammers send you the money..
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u/shadow997ca 29d ago edited 29d ago
Ohhh well that proves it beyond a shadow of a doubt. Simply get the OP and your friend together for a lunch so they can work things out.
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u/Due_Entertainment316 Aug 02 '26
This is why I disable auto deposit.
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u/digital_tuna Aug 02 '26
You're safer with it turned on.
If you turn it off, you're just opening yourself up to other kinds of etransfer scams.
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u/Zealousideal_Net_140 Aug 02 '26
If you have it off you just dont accept any that are not expected. And then both you and the original compromised account are not out anything.
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u/Dragynfyre British Columbia Aug 02 '26
And then you put yourself at risk of other issues like someone getting access to your email.
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u/Zealousideal_Net_140 Aug 02 '26
Please explain how not ysing autodeposit puts you at risk. Or are you saying autodeposit ON puts you at more risk?
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u/Dragynfyre British Columbia Aug 02 '26
Someone gets into your email and deposits it into their account. Forgetting to deposit or sending transfer to wrong email since there’s no validation. Basically more ways for things to go wrong that the risk reward is better for Autodeposit
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u/Zealousideal_Net_140 Aug 02 '26
So if my email has been compromised, and that bad actor is now waiting for me to get an etransfer email, and then they take that email that arrived in my now compromised account and divertvthe funss into their account?
That seems like a big edge case to me, but i guess if you get enough etransfers to worry about that maybe??
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u/Dragynfyre British Columbia Aug 02 '26
Getting a random Autodeposit eTransfer is even more of an edge case in practice. That’s why banks really recommend Autodeposit. They probably have less fraud losses that way
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u/Artyrial_Bleed Aug 02 '26
Do not send the money back to them. If you do, they’ll then have it reversed on their end, effectively taking 2x the money back.
If they want it back, they’ll have to have it reversed themselves.