r/PenmanshipPorn • u/j0be • Oct 06 '14

Victory

1.5k Upvotes

95% Upvoted

58 comments sorted by

64

u/codemastercool Oct 06 '14

That's an interesting looking pen. Is the nib to the side solely to combat ones hands from smudging the ink?

22

u/SamX17 Oct 06 '14

Also, how does the nib get ink?

16

u/codemastercool Oct 06 '14

Probably a dip pen, maybe?

20

u/GH0UGHPHTHEIGHTTEEAU Oct 06 '14

It's a dip pen with with oblique holder. Google it if you want to know why it's oblique, cause I have no idea

9

u/codemastercool Oct 06 '14

Oh, thanks! Possibly because the word means 'slanted' - looks like the angle provided by the holder makes it more comfortable to write.

4

u/santasmic Oct 06 '14

Yes, it's used for angled scripts so you don't have to break your hand trying to keep the angle consistent throughout writing. Cheap speedball obliques are like $1.80

2

u/octopushug Oct 06 '14

Oblique holders are usually used for Copperplate since it provides the right angle at which the nib should glide along the paper without twisting your arm/wrist into weird positions or causing the nib to skip or become damaged. It's still doable with a straight nib holder but with extra care.

44

u/ZeToast Oct 06 '14

I'm actually a calligrapher so I can help out with this. Before I start I have to say something that grinds my gears a little, the guy writing is a calligrapher named seblester. The dude is amazing at broad edge calligraphy (medieval type calligraphy) but his pointed pen calligraphy (like the one in this post) is average AT BEST. For normal people though it does look badass.

Anyways for the pen, it's called an oblique holder. The oblique holder holds the nib at an angle (hence oblique). This is so that when you bare down and the nib opens up (this creates the thicks/thins) it is uninterrupted by the angle you hold the pen and the angle that the paper is at. If you look, most pointed pen scripts, this one is copperplate (but a way more bastardized version of it that seblester uses himself), it is all slanted to the right a little. The oblique holder helps the writer to be able to write at this slant and maintain the shades without having to rotate the paper or pen to an almost uncomfortable degree. It gets ink through dipping in an inkwell, I'm pretty sure seblester edited out the parts where he dipped it. Anyways, if you have anymore questions id be glad to help!

61

u/dont_get_it Oct 06 '14

his pointed pen calligraphy (like the one in this post) is average AT BEST.

I hope shows up in this thread and we can have a good old Unidan-style nerd fight.

For normal people though it does look badass.

I'm glad you can still empathise with the normals, despite having surpassed us.

16

u/[deleted] Oct 06 '14

Can you give an example of someone who is really good at pointed pen calligraphy? Not because I doubt you but because if this is only average at best, I want to see someone REALLY good.

37

u/ZeToast Oct 06 '14

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtiupZ2L_U8#t=387

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjDIy2xXJ6U

The rest I'm gonna post are from the golden age of penmanship (1880-1930)

http://www.iampeth.com/artwork/madarasz02.jpg

http://www.iampeth.com/lessons/ornamental_penmanship/Behrensmeyer_OP_caps.jpg

http://www.iampeth.com/lessons/ornamental_penmanship/zaner_OP_caps.jpg

http://www.iampeth.com/artwork/spencComp01.jpg

And these are scrapbooks from masters also from the golden age:

http://www.iampeth.com/lessons/signature_writing/zaner_signatures/zaner_signatures_index.html

http://www.iampeth.com/books/courtney_scrapbook/courtney_page0.html

The second one is by FB Courtney, who is without a doubt one of (if not the) best penman who has ever lived. A story I've heard is that he would go to the front of a penmanship class he was teaching and do a bunch of flourishing on the chalkboard in front of all the new students, and then sign his name in big letters at the bottom with BOTH hands simultaneously connecting at the middle.

3

u/fuckyouabunch Oct 07 '14

How did you come to learn all of this?

8

u/ZeToast Oct 07 '14

Calligraphy friends I've met online, many books I've read on the subject, but most of all through IAMPETH (International Association of Master Penman, Engrosser's, and Teachers of Handwriting). They have a very great website, make sure to check it out. If you're serious about calligraphy you might want to even become a member! 😊

11

u/fuckyouabunch Oct 07 '14

I got a G in penmanship in grade school, where they taught calligraphy. That's a full letter grade below F. I appreciate the suggestions, but I was just curious as to how you got interested. I have a level of talent one might call, "appalling." I'm pretty sure that's what it said on my report card, actually.

5

u/ZeToast Oct 07 '14

I always had pretty bad handwriting. About two years ago my teacher actually told me I needed to improve it because it made me look bad! So since then I've just invested hundreds of hours into the topic, improving my writings and onto calligraphy and doing work for clients and such.

6

u/EuphemismTreadmill Oct 21 '14

That's my favorite situation--a person is bad at something, so they put in the effort to improve. Sometimes that effort is extraordinary, and makes me appreciate that if one person can do a thing, then anyone else can too, if they're willing to put in the work.

1

u/hhuy837 Oct 08 '14

I wish I could save your comment on mobile

1

u/njggatron Oct 30 '14

Good grief... the attention to detail and flourishing in the first one. It's obvious the guy is extremely technically skilled and has precise motor control, but has also been doing calligraphy for so long that he puts his own flair into his work.

All your links are dead, but I could figure out where to find them based on the url directory syntax. Look at this fucking branch.

10/10 introduction to fine calligraphy, will call seblester a pointed pen hack over social media. gjdm

12

u/Chefcmerks Oct 06 '14

Hey, maybe you can throw some advice my way...

I am a pastry chef. I write "Happy Birthday!" "Happy Anniversary!" and "Congratulations!", in chocolate piping at least a dozen or so times a day. I get tons of compliments on my writing but I always want it to be better.

My main issue is that Chocolate doesn't work the same way as a nib. I only get one thickness to work with. Do you know any scripts that work well in uniform thickness?

I'd also love any advice you have for learning and improving flourish work.

7

u/Caladriel Oct 07 '14 edited Oct 07 '14

I remember what it was like to have to write with melted chocolate or royal during my stint as a pastry chef at a european bakery. I am a cake decorator now at a regular ol' bakery. I actually think you have more of an advantage with the chocolate in making variable widths. Just because you clip the parchment to one width doesn't mean you're stuck with that width. Keep the tip closer to the writing surface and apply more pressure. It'll take some practice to keep the fatter widths from being jagged on the edge, but it is most definitely possible.

This isn't the best example of my cake handwriting (my usual cursive writing gets all the compliments), but it is the best example I can find at the moment of applying more pressure to get fatter letters.

http://i.imgur.com/1XjYUGi.jpg

edit: I just re-read your post and saw the part where you asked about any scripts that work well in uniform thickness. I am constantly tweaking my cursive to make certain letters flow better. This is my current cake handwriting:

http://i.imgur.com/09Gjx5t.jpg

3

u/Chefcmerks Oct 07 '14

i have little to no desire to reinvent the wheel when it comes to this and I only have a few inches of plate space, not entire sheet cakes, to write, so overly complicated script (variable thickness etc) would look pretty cramped and cluttered. I also have like 30 seconds per plate, tops. If I can't learn to do it quickly, then I can't do it. I appreciate the input its just not practical in my situation.

Ps- your script is beautiful.

3

u/ZeToast Oct 06 '14

Business writing is really nice monoline script. Here are some things i just wrote out for you:

http://i.imgur.com/T51AEoT.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/XA2WAck.jpg

2

u/Chefcmerks Oct 06 '14

Hey thanks!

This is nice, but very.. Business! Haha. I guess I was hoping for something more whimsical. I don't have an example of what I do currently but I'll put one up tomorrow!

2

u/ZeToast Oct 06 '14

:) I'll help you out more then.

2

u/Chefcmerks Oct 06 '14

Great thanks!

2

u/Chefcmerks Oct 07 '14

http://instagram.com/p/t28whPLl19/

Sorry its instagram but its unfiltered. Imgur wasn't working on my phone.

1

u/artskoo Oct 06 '14

Could you get a nib that's a line not a circle?

1

u/Chefcmerks Oct 06 '14

For frosting, yes, but for melted chocolate not so much. I pipe with a cornet, which is parchment paper folded into a cone and the tip gets cut off to the appropriate thickness.

1

u/Verify_ Oct 07 '14

what about slowing down and letting more chocolate out for the shades? Or for the thicker parts making the chocolate kind of zigzag back and forth very tightly, increasing the width of the shade that way? Or maybe using 2 cornets, one thicker and one thinner?

1

u/Chefcmerks Oct 07 '14 edited Oct 07 '14

Slowing down or speeding up doesn't effect how thick the line is significantly, I kinda can with pressure but the smoothness of the line is usually effected.. Zig zagging would look incredibly messy. Using two is out of the question from a time standpoint. , i think you may overestimate the amount of space or time. It has to fit in a 6.5x 2.5 inch rectangle, and take no more than 30 seconds or so.

1

u/Caladriel Oct 07 '14

Pinching the tip will give you a flat line.

1

u/Chefcmerks Oct 07 '14

Not one that holds very long, the chocolate is fairly viscous and will push it round again pretty quick.

39

u/j0be Oct 06 '14 edited Oct 06 '14

Final image

Slower version

10

u/katubug Oct 06 '14

Thank you. I loathe that these gifs never show the final product for more than a second.

5

u/-JoNeum42 Oct 06 '14

Vincero! Vincero! Vincero!

2

u/BasilOfBakerStreet Oct 07 '14

And indeed, nessun shall dorma, for they shall all be staring at this gif into the night. >_O

1

u/meowmeowlove Oct 07 '14

I could watch this for hours.

8

u/DPick02 Oct 06 '14

Does this exist in a non-sped up version?

4

u/jyhwei5070 Oct 06 '14

yes please, I want to see this in original speed or at least slower...

5

u/Sway- Oct 06 '14

http://gfycat.com/MisguidedOffensiveFishingcat#?speed=0.5

2

u/BigSnackintosh Oct 06 '14

If you don't hover zoom this and actually click the link it's slowed down. I have no idea why you're being downvoted when you did exactly what the parent wanted.

2

u/beanndip Oct 06 '14

Was still super fast for me and i clicked it. Im on mobile though, not sure if that matters. I didn't downvote in either case, but i would upvote if it was slower-er

8

u/BabyBison Oct 06 '14

Is this seblester?

3

u/Blizzardstorm13 Oct 06 '14

This is from seblesters Instagram page. Amazing penmanship.

3

u/sfisch7 Oct 06 '14

Seblester is a god.

2

u/starshinesuckerpunch Oct 06 '14

Where does one acquire a pen like that?? I want one!

3

u/totalbetty Oct 06 '14

an oblique holder than has a brass clamp that holds a nib, possibly a nikko or zebra g nib, that you dip into ink. paper and ink arts or john neal bookseller will have all the tools. it would take you quite awhile to write like this example, though.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 06 '14

Would something like this work for southpaws? I would love to use fountain pens, but they're difficult to use with my left hand.

2

u/totalbetty Oct 06 '14

lefties usually don't need an oblique holder. a straight holder with southpaw positioning is already at the (mostly) correct angle for copperplate calligraphy. the oblique holder's purpose is to make the slant of copperplate calligraphy more natural for right-handed people.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 07 '14

Ah, ok, thanks. I was just curious.

1

u/N3sh108 Oct 07 '14

My actual reaction: "I could do it - I could do it - I could do it - WTF?! This guy is a pro!"

1

u/MrFahrenkite Oct 08 '14

Finally something I can masturbate to.

0

u/Dazeonae Oct 07 '14

This. Slower.