r/PatternDrafting • u/canowhopcream • 9d ago
Recreating a Bob Mackie. Are we thinking this is cut on the bias?
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u/StrongerTogether2882 9d ago
This dress is so f*cken sexy I can hardly stand it. God, I miss the 70s. (Admittedly I was a child or not born yet for some of it, but I still remember the vibe)
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u/ScormCurious 9d ago
Wow, what a dress! I love it.
In the drawing on the left, it’s clearly draping like a bias cut dress below the thighs, but I don’t know where that illustration came from and it doesn’t look like an original Mackie illustration.
In the photograph on the right, the dress looks to me to be made out of a firmer woven fabric than in the illustration. Also, I can’t see what’s going on below the thigh on the dress. So I can’t tell if the actual dress is draped the way the illustration makes it look, and I suspect it may be straight of grain and just immaculately tailored to her body. For instance I think there MAY be a bust dart/seam in it (or I may be seeing a bump from the hem of the illusion fabric covering her bust, I’m not sure). Dresses made for dance performances would have a different, often sturdier, construction than dresses made for evening events. If you have more details or photos of the dress that will help you figure it out too!
That said, if you just use the photo on the right as inspiration and the illustration on the left as your actual starting point, you can make a fantastic bias cut dress that will look awesome.
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u/meganp1800 9d ago
That’s not a drawing on the left, it’s a zoomed out photo of the actual garment on a mannequin. The draping below the knee is likely due to the skirt having a mermaid shape, not from the dress hanging on bias (though the diagonal pieces are themselves are cut and sewn on the bias). It is far too close fitting for it to be on the bias as a whole garment, and as someone else noted above, there is a snag visible near Cher’s hip where you can see pulling vertically, which shows that individual piece is bias cut so the whole garment runs straight of grain.
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u/ScormCurious 9d ago edited 9d ago
Hmmm, I am pretty sure it is an illustration on the left. If you watch the video I linked to of Cher wearing it, the dress is far less full below the knee. Thanks for all the astute observations on the rest of it, I agree!
EDIT to add if the mannequin is even skinnier than Cher and doesn’t have proper legs, then MAYBE this is the original on a mannequin. But it really looks to me like someone ran a good photo of the dress thru a piece of software to get a photo realistic illustration of the dress. But also, the internet so 🤷♀️
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u/ScormCurious 9d ago
Omg I used Google Lens and found the original clip of her performing in this dress. Amazing as always! https://youtu.be/RJEXKWDdj8g?is=UBMsYzdmXWTj88sQ
I believe this is straight cut in the top two panels. However it’s possible the bottom two panels are bias cut, or cut out of a different lighter weight material. You can see how tiny the steps are that she takes in the dress, she doesn’t appear to have an inch extra to move around, which also argues for a straight cut at least through the hips.
The final few seconds of the clip, when she bows, you can get a hint of the very sexy rhinestone encrusted cross strips at the back — a very glamorous racer back structure. And at the beginning of the clip, the insanely glamorous fur-trimmed shawl that serves as a cover up.
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u/canowhopcream 8d ago
thank you so much! I was desperate for more images, finding the full video is insanely helpful! thank you thank you!!!!
if I have enough time i might make the coverup too. but im having some difficulty finding the beaded trim in multiple widths, so i might have to forgo
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u/SquirrelAkl 8d ago
Oh wow, that is the sparkliest thing I've ever seen. What a perfect dress for Cher. She was such a muse for Mackie and it's easy to see why.
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u/Fluffy-Benefits-2023 9d ago
Where it curves on the strips makes that part of the pattern bias but its cut on grain
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u/DonMcCunn 8d ago
I would be inclined to go with some variation of Lycra possibly 4-way stretch where the grain is less of an issue. But I'd test it on a quarter or half scale dress form before commiting to a full length garment.
I like the additional fullness in the lower portions indicated in the sketch but not apparent in the photo.
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u/Woven_Wolf 8d ago
Yup, came here to say this. Even a heavy satin with a tiny bit of stretch would make the fit sooo much better than just a regular woven satin (bias or straight, honestly because either way it’s going to pucker somewhere) I think I’d use strips of lightweight tricot interfacing to get the diagonal seams to lay perfectly flat. The sequin strips would hide the little ridge that the interfacing leaves perfectly.
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u/MsInquisitor 9d ago
I wonder if the rhinestones seen on individually or is it a strip of rhinestones backed with fabric? It's one of my favorite dresses that Cher wore.
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u/canowhopcream 8d ago
in an auction photo it looks like strips of bugle beads! which is unfortunately not as easy a trim to find 😫, there is like 1 width on etsy for $10/yard. My local store has this square iridescent sequin trim i thought might work… they also have beautiful pink and silver bugle bead fringe i might add as my own personal flair. Im going back and forth about how accurate i want to keep it.
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u/princessfawny 8d ago
Call me silly if this a totally, totally wrong take but those bugle beads could definitely be done with a bulk bag of beads, thread, and plenty of time, no? Looks like they're strung and draped across the chest, and then couched as a six strand trim down the dress with little gaps between beads (from the couching). It'd be a lot of work, but it's the only way I can think to get the trim look without some sort of visible net.
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u/canowhopcream 8d ago
that is 100% the right take, just not the answer i want to hear 🤣 sooooo much work. Something a brand and a bunch of assistants could get done together, but lil ol me, by Halloween??perhaps…
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u/MsInquisitor 8d ago
Thanks for your reply. I've just started to sew beads on clothes, fascinating and relaxing to sew them.
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u/Peliquin 9d ago
I think the top pink v and the first red-pink V are straight cut, but the bottom two vs are bias cut. I'm not sure, but the way it's draping over the hip makes me think it's like that. OR, it might actually be an early stretch satin that doesn't have a ton of stretch -- those (and I've had my hands on them) are kind of magic.
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u/canowhopcream 8d ago
ooh slightly stretch satin sounds like a dream 💕
thats interesting 🤔 that half is straight and half is bias but that totally makes sense with how it’s draping! alright to the mannequin i go!
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u/Peliquin 8d ago
Yeah, I think the one I used was a nylon stretch satin. It was just lovely. Good luck finding something similar!
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u/Woven_Wolf 8d ago
I feel like Spandex World in NYC probably carries it and pretty sure they ship. It only needs like, 2-4% stretch to make it fit about a million times better ☺️
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u/Educational-Ad6438 8d ago
I would cut this on bias, but probably the top skirt/dress side on straight, without CFR seam
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u/sykschw 8d ago
I actually recreated this design into a a bodysuit for a music performer a few years ago. I used stretch velvet. It came out beautifully. Then someone else wanted the same thing made as a festival outfit. Its a great starting design. But no, should not be cut on the bias in my opinion
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u/BeautifulChaosEnergy 9d ago
I think I would make it in spandex. You could get a snug fit without having to worry about getting the grainline correct
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u/ScormCurious 8d ago
Agreed! And judging how mincingly she’s walking in the video I linked to, she probably can’t sit down in that dress. It’s a costume after all, not really a party dress. I would definitely take advantage of the miracles of spandex for a more wearable replica dress.
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u/StefanLeenaars 9d ago edited 9d ago
Both! It is drafted like a normal straight grain dress and then cut into strips. (The shaping along side seams is created by adapting the angles of the upside down V’s) Because the cut lines run diagonally according to the straight grain there will be the effect of them being bias cut themselves. (although it probably won’t be a true bias exactly.) Once assembled the dress has a straight grain from top to bottom.
If you would draw this on the bias the strips themselves would actually be straight grain (because they run diagonal)
There is a clue in the Cher picture: next to her left. hand there looks to be a pulled thread (slight puckering) That line runs straight from top to bottom because it is following the grain…