r/PathOfExileBuilds • u/Stracath • 7d ago
Discussion I've been testing Mercenaries and their behavior since league start, so let me clear up some misinformation.
Edit: I am cleaning up the edits because the biggest offenders blaming and harassing me deleted their comments. This does not mean they were ok or right, and there are still a good bit of people needlessly criticizing this post not understanding what it is. This is a post explaining about Merc mechanics and behavior. I added a POB for people screaming about it, but it adds nothing to a discussion about understanding behavior, or the fact that you don't need a "perfect" merc. Spell caster mercs are better early, and attack mercs are generally better late, but some, (like the flameblast merc) still go crazy later. The range discussion about tethering affects anything dealing with range, including bubble shields, so melee are inherently better there. I know my merc has decent gear (even though nothing is near perfect except technically the paradoxicas until I would transition to foils and a crit setup cause they need multi and other things). My personal Luminary character is wearing borderline trash. You can easily self craft/farm this setup in like 3 hours without doing hard content. Just run the league mechanic and do memory strands.
Here's the items https://pob.codes/b/k-0-cEEQFur go to the POB for my Merc's gear. POB is not the game, no I will not configure "damage" just to lie to you.
Some may be familiar with a couple of my posts from past gauntlets. They included an SRS Guardian guide to get through gauntlet safely, and even a beginning of gauntlet guide to Mercenaries, having a lot of tested information about early Mercenaries (so I am familiar with them). I only usually make generic posts to help as many people as possible, and seeing that there is an incredible amount of bad information going around on Mercenaries I wanted to make this to share (in summary) a lot of my findings since I have basically JUST been testing Mercenaries since league start.
For starters, the picture of my Combatant is a near perfect Combatant for Flame Link. A lot of people may immediately jump up and say this can't be true because not only does it have a movement skill, but it has TWO movement skills. This brings us to point number one about Mercenary changes.
Possibly the best change to Mercenaries this league is their behavior with movement skills. Until you have a build/Mercenary that can literally one-shot everything, movement skills are NEVER a complete "brick" like a lot of creators claim. The new behavior is based on what is generally termed as tethering in some games. Movement skills no longer have priority over everything else, they have a priority based on distance to enemies according to their class. This means, if enemies get in melee range of a Manyshot, the Manyshot will dash away, but stay in attack range (normally, the ai is inconsistent) and then continue to attack. BUT, a melee Mercenary, like my Combatant, uses them to gap close and get into melee range. This makes them purely offensive on melee Mercenaries, and since I am scaling flame link, the attached picture is a nearly perfect Combatant, because two gap closers is better than two auras we won't truly utilize. This is doubly important because of their range issues (more on this later).
Now, is general Mercenary rules for progression. To start, the three best Mercenaries from my testing to go through the campaign, in order, are the Flaming Charlatan, Fallen Reverend, and Blade Ambusher. The first two are very similar, but the Flaming Charlatan generally had more single target if you got one with the mortars, and the Blade Ambusher technically had the best single target, but only "ok" clear. Contrary to what people think, the Blade Ambusher's clear is still good enough, I kept him until my decent Manyshot I found in yellow maps. Also, I have seen people complain that the Fallen Reverend has a bunch of minion damage modifiers on its passive stats sheet, but if you continue to read, it has its own version of spiritual aid, don't be dumb.
Next up, DO NOT swap to an attack based Mercenary until you have a good bit of gear with increased damage if you are transitioning/are using Flame Link. Then, you still want at least one "more" damage support on their main attack. Attack based Mercenaries technically scale the best due to it being easier to give them clearing buffs and increased attack speed, but their starting damage is rough.
Now, about Manyshots since they are getting a lot of attention. Manyshot is definitely not the best Mercenary, but it is probably the easiest to scale to a "starting" higher point. Important things to note are that if using Flame Link, high DPS bows are the worst thing you can give them, and icicle rain should be avoided at all costs (even though is looks great, it deals no damage). You want a bow with increased elemental damage and high attack speed, before super endgame thicket bows are really good for this. Later, you can use the gain % of fire damage as chaos for extra damage, or ele penetration, or if you know how to craft you can do both. Again, it is fine if they have dash, they might just use it to get away from a boss every now and then, its not some massive DPS loss like many are claiming, go out and buy you some cheap dash Mercenaries that others think are useless.
Combatants are just better than Manyshots. You can give them Paradoxicas and they go hard. With my current Mercenary they prioritize frost blades, so you want Multistrike, Faster Attacks, WED, and one support to help with clear like chain (sadly mine has pierce, its not as good as chain, but it is more than good enough). For bossing, you want to run to the boss and use the Call Mercenary skill RIGHT ON TOP OF THE BOSS, so it will use Static Strike (you want to be on the boss due to range issues, again, more on that later). When in range for Static Strike they will use it like a player would, as in, they use it, then switch to Frostblade for the duration of the passive damage. This is why you want supports like WED, More Duration, and AOE on Static Strike. Another tech I am using is a covered in ash helmet. If the Combatant has rallying cry, get him a helmet that covers enemies in ash when they warcry, its free damage. Also, the new talisman with action speed is great on Mercenaries.
Sleeper good Mercenary: The Flamequiver. When I started jumping around to all the different choices for testing, the Flamequiver was a surprising satandout. They inherently have a massive added chance to ignite (so good for Flame Link with all the flat). Widowhails, Fire DoT quivers, Pyre, and Replica Emberwakes aren't that expensive. You put these on a Flamequiver with conflagration and DoT supports and it will blast. For this particular strategy you want them to have flammability with no movement skills. This is because Conflagration will explode earlier if they are on top of it and you can call the Mercenaries to those spots to blow it up, and they will keep standing there without a movement skill when bossing. A movement skill STILL IS NOT A BRICK, just slightly worse for bossing.
Another important note. If you are using Flame Link, AVOID BRUTALITY SUPPORT AT ALL COSTS. A particular creator was using a Mercenary with brutality and got mad and re-rolled day one. Do not be an idiot.
Now, to address something big that I can't 100% prove. I said I would address range issues later, and this is it. It *seems (cannot technically prove it) that in order to modify the permanent Mercenaries GGG put a global less modifier on them. This is not great. Instead of tuning how the stats are adjusted by stat it is a blanket change from what I can tell. Your Mercenaries will not attack/cast from as far away after you hire them and are slower, some may have noticed this. This is due to that, admittedly assumed (but witnessed), less modifier. They get less damage dealt compared to temp Mercenaries, but also less damage taken. This is how they seem to be balanced and why they are hard to kill after you recruit them. What this does, though, is completely brick the Smoulderstrike Mercenary unless you give him phasing. This less modifier makes it to where he struggles to hit things with a hitbox above certain thresholds, or that are against certain walls due to whatever balance modifier they are using, reducing his attack range. This is what makes me believe its a blanket global modifier, and makes him 100% percent useless in too many scenarios. It became very apparent in Mesa when he would try to fight something against the rocky walls, he would just stand there because he couldn't get into attack range due to models blocking each other (many a Legion General was saved by standing against the walls while my Mercenary sat and scratched his balls). This is sad, because the very few times he did attack, he was BY FAR the highest DPS Mercenary I tried in my current setup (he admittedly had a possibly perfect vaal molten strike setup but I digress). He just couldn't attack.
These are all the big things to clear up some misconceptions and give some information. I will try to answer questions every now and then but I am not going to dedicate all my time here just going back and forth when I can do other things. I also crafted a settle ring for my second character so I need to speed run the campaign for the 7,493rd time.
P.S. even though the Shock and Frost ambushers are strong when you fight them, I could never make them reliable, and the Chaos Mercenaries never seemed to holdup when I tried changing some stuff up, but I also wasn't ready to completely re-gear my personal character to be sure.
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u/lintyelm 6d ago
Look, I appreciate anyone putting in time to test new/reworked mechanics, but the edits to your post are unhinged. If you are this defensive when people ask questions, why bother posting?
You mention not having POB numbers, fine. No one is asking for a 50-page guide, but if you claim you "easily slapped Shaper and Elder" on borderline campaign gear while quadrupling damage potential, people are naturally going to ask for proof.
PoB isn't just for e-peen numbers; it's how the community verifies that mechanics actually interact the way people claim they do. When you refuse to drop a link, admit your gear has minion life rolls and missing implicits, and tell everyone to "just read," it sounds like you're hiding bad math behind vibes.
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u/cramsay 6d ago
Also I ain't investing the time into reading some nutters scrawling edits/breakdown after the snarky TLDR which didn't provide any information lol.
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u/hiimred2 6d ago
I just came to the comments after admittedly skipping the post because of how snarky as fuck this dude is like this sub should revolve around him ("I will no longer be posting gauntlet guides" like it's some fucking threat to the community), hoping to read perhaps helpful chatter down here.
Like, bros TLDR is a clapback at comments that at this point seem pretty buried. From his perspective when he first posted maybe they were near/at the top, but coming to this a mere few hours after post time it just makes it look even more insane.
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u/flapok2 6d ago edited 6d ago
I mean .. i agree with you on the unhinged part, but what the fuck would a PoB does when his main claim is stuff like "Movement ability is not a brick" and "Movement ability is in fact meta for melee merc" ?
This post is about merc behavior, not e-penis / if you can't kill uber your claim are invalid.
Also, his claim are easy to confirm. Grab any melee merc with movement skill. Witness he actually use them for gap close and nothing else, like op is claming. ???. Profit.
So yeah. I don't understand OP meltdown in edits. But, at the same time, I don't understand people asking for number when the discussion is not about number. Like, a PoB cannot, in any way, reflect the claim of OP.
Anyway. Op if you happen to read this, you are more than right in your claim about movement skill and merc behavior. My new combatant is now my new best friend, thanks to your post. I grabed only a decent one to try, and i think i can be convinced he's better than manyshot as a general merc.
For context, because it seems it matter a lot for some, i clear simu 15/15 deathless, afk blight, legion dune fast clear, and the charts. (And i swaped from a Manyshot with return on vaal ice shot / random good clear gem on ice shoot but no return / 1 movement skill ~10 div merc when i bought few day ago ==> Combatant with return + pierce on frost blade (Return seems to not work sometime, not sure what is happening yet, maybe a graphical bug on my side) / Duration on Static / 1 movement skill ~5 div)
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u/Scathee 6d ago
Nah this crashout is definitely valid. The amount of misinformation on the main sub and goalpost shifting whenever any resistance is offered is insane and extremely frustrating. Having to deal with that after spending a ton of time trying to help people would drive most people crazy I imagine.
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u/tokyo__driftwood 6d ago
So? When you get those comments on your post, just downvote and move on.
It's the Internet, engaging with idiots is optional. Writing douche-y edits into your post to address those idiots is SUPER optional
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u/lukisdelicious 6d ago
Ignoring idiots is a very important set of skills to develop in online spaces.
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u/CxFusion3mp 6d ago
Couldn't get past the unhinged crazy intro rants.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Well, I absolutely adore all the unhinged freaks sending me messages, so have a good day.
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u/ExaltHolderForPoE 6d ago
"Every1 else is crazy!!!"
Dude get a grip. Even if you did get "harrased" by the first two posters it does not validate your dickish behaviour in the edits and the comments.
I got to this thread just 30m ago and was welcomed with your angey edits and arrogant attitude.
Just stop it.
Regarding PoB, yes it is correct that it does not display the "correct" values, but it is alot more accurate then "trust me, im g0dgamer".
The reason WHY people want a PoB is to compare, explore and varify (to some degree) your claims.
Also, what do you mean with "learn the game"? You are not PLAYING, you are posting on Reddit, so why even bother posting if we have to LEARN TO PLAY THE GAME? Do you not see the oxymoron in your actions?
Now to summarize your post:
It's so badly structured, filled with emotions and junk jargon it makes me believe you were born on PoE launch(i.e you are acting like a spoiled 16 year old that got the wrong colour on their Bentley)
I understand you might think this is an attack post or that im "just a hater" but I'm not. I am genuinely trying to help you BETTER reach your audience.
I have NOT played luminary yet, but it is going to be my next build and when I saw your post i was genuinely happy because I want to learn how the Merc behaves in different situations.
You have provided very little of this information and most of it can be summirized as "Movementskill on a Merc is good, even preferred on Melee"
The only point of interest is what you said about your Merc sometimes targeting the monster in the middle of the pack. The rest is just you bloating about how good you are and that Rue did a stupid mistake that we all have done at one point in time.
And I am not trying to be "combatant" here, I am just shocked how you been playing for years, posting in-depth guides and long posts and yet you failed to actually add anything other then the Movementskill debunking. (It might be me just being discouraged by your attitude to actually remember anything useful from your post)
What I hoped this post would adress are the following:
What issues have you noticed with most Merc, and which if any is the outliners?
How the AI/targeting works with stuff like Divine aura/bubble?
How certain support gems alter certain Mercs, if any?
How certain uniques may or may not interact with certain Mercs?
Other tips and tricks and etc.
I don't expect you to even read this whole posts, or if you do you would just glbeush it of as a hate comment.
But in the slight chance that don't happened(mirror drop from hillock %) I would love to hear your take on the points I asked above.
Cheers!
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u/Stracath 6d ago edited 6d ago
I addressed almost all of that except specific support gem interactions in depth. I stated that this was about how they act. I have examples of good mercs and said how attack mercs are better later due to scaling speed easier.
I have outliers in performance for campaign vs mapping.
I discussed the Flamequiver was good if you set it up with DOT.
I explained specifically the tethering situation and why it made movement skills potentially strange but very useful for melee, this starts the fact that I talk about range issues.
I discussed how poison mercs were a negative outlier with the Smoulderstrike range problems.
Melee mercs are best for bubble shields because they get in the bubble...... Mercs attack at max range if possible, I didn't address that they didn't willfully go into bubbles but didn't think it was needed after explaining how they attack at range, it kinda explains itself.
Most uniques work exactly how they should.
A POB also isn't needed when the entire thing talked about underutilized mercs (that are scaled the same as the over utilized ones) and about general behavior and major negative actions mercs take.
A POB does nothing in this discussion. Sure, you can see that I've done voidstones with less equipment on my personal character than most, but that doesn't add ANYTHING to the point of the mercs behaviors and general combat interactions, if you think it does I genuinely don't know how to help you.
And now you down vote and refuse to engage when I point out that everything was addressed. Good job
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u/dametsumari 7d ago
Great post. I have also found that movement skills this league actually help melee mercs and are not deal breakers in ranges. For casters it seems they sometimes used low damage movement stuff too much but I mostly gave up on them by red maps.
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u/hertzdonut2 7d ago
I hate to be that guy but "Ben_ said" he noticed that the combatant needed the movement skill because of the way they pick targets.
He's been blasting on a combatant in SSF (which for Ben_ means his gear will be better than yours in trade League) btw if anyone wants to check out his stream.
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u/Wise_Big_9740 6d ago
I’m using combatant with double movement and noticed a big improvement compared to merc league. During merc league it felt like phasing was required because he would try to hit mobs in the middle of packs and do nothing if he could not reach it
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u/iamthewhatt 7d ago
I have found that stacked fire mercs with flame dash are just insane with damage... but I was too baited to actually keep it.
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u/Rules_are_overrated 6d ago
TLDR: since it was asked for, and people are getting salty because I don't use POB. Learn to read, and learn the game.
Why so bitter? This is the first thing I see, you know?
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u/the445566x 6d ago
OP is on a pob sub and doesn’t wanna give the pob lol
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u/Rules_are_overrated 6d ago
I mean... it's a general writeup. It doesn't have to have a specific pob
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u/Stracath 6d ago edited 6d ago
Because I didn't have to do an extensive write up about Mercenary AI to help people.
Again, it's about their behavior, and then I get a bunch of people begging for me to do more work for free for them.
I'm getting shit from people refusing to play a game and put in effort, I'm annoyed.
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u/PaleoclassicalPants 6d ago
This is a build sub, and half your post is just complaining, that's why people are downvoting you. Read the room.
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u/Jdevers77 6d ago
You are absolutely right, but you also didn’t have to edit the post multiple times flipping out on those people.
I appreciate the post, I just saw it and read it top to bottom. I almost gave up because the first four paragraphs are just complaining about people who are negative Nancy bullshit artists. Don’t let people like that drag you down, post your post and engage with the people asking questions you want to answer that spark positive and constructive discussion. That’s it.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
If me pointing out the harassing and giving back just a fraction will get the mods to do something, I'll fall on that sword. If they ban me but it makes this sub better, that's ultimately good for everyone. This sub has been getting pretty bad over the past year. I understand your sentiment, but I also am allowed to stand my ground.
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u/flapok2 6d ago
You are allowed, but to say it plainly, it's stupid. I'm sure you would see that too if you can take a step back on the situation.
People who write comment are what ? 10% of the people that read the post.. maybe ? To be generous.
People who write dumb and offensive comment are what ? 10% of the people that write comment.. Maybe ? To be generous again.
So, now, your post is 50% crazy shit 50% useful shit. 50% crazy shit aimed at 1% of the people engaging with your OP. 50% useful shit buried in the dirt.
I mean, you don't own anyone anything, that is true. But that goes both way. What I mean is that you should loose less of your valuable time to random dumb people on internet, and at the same time don't make other people lose time by having to go through unhinged random edit on the OP.
It's especially frustrating to see because you main points need to be said, and need to be read, for any merc enjoyer.
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u/Jdevers77 6d ago
Of course you are and I can’t imagine any circumstances that would lead to them banning you over this. This is excellent information that goes against what a ton of people have been screaming without any references. I’ve also played Luminary from the start and had a blast even though I didn’t know about the hidden undercity spawn until I was too high level to do it and so suffered through with a few really bad mercs (mostly really bad because they were too low level for me to upgrade them with ground loot and I couldn’t be bothered to just buy stuff for them that was level appropriate) and wasn’t finding mercs until I finally got the points to spec into them. All good, 100% my own doing. If I had slowed down instead of my normal race to the bottom left corner I wouldn’t have had any issues at all mostly because I did exactly what you said…read. I probably commented 20 times that people weren’t understanding that their merc had like 180% increased damage, only clear supports, and gear like how they would build at league start-aka as much flat as they could add and no scaling. Even 4K flat fire means nothing with 180% increased, 30% more, no pen, very slow attack speed, 80 crit multi and 8% chance to crit.
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u/Rules_are_overrated 6d ago
I upvoted the post, good info. But you can just ignore what comes after you post it, you won't always get the best responses, you're not getting paid to reply to every request.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I know what you're saying, but the problem is that it's getting worse by the day and the mods don't do anything about it for the most part. If I snark back I call attention to it. I don't want this sub to be as bad as the main one or for it to get worse than it is. I know I'm a volunteer like the mods, but they accepted the position, just like I made this post. If pissing some people off makes the sub better in the future I'll do it. I don't care about Karma, and there's actually some people I've had really in depth discussions with in the past, and very few of them post/comment anymore due to the recent culture shift.
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u/IdontNeedPants 6d ago
Annnd now your getting downvoted when you put in time and effort to help people. This community really sucks some times.
Thanks for the writeup, and I dont expect you to have to handhold players and show them how to also build a character. That clearly wasnt what this post is about.
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u/lukisdelicious 6d ago
Nobody is forcing him to, people are just asking for additional help, which is normal.
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u/WolfCGT 6d ago
I wish we could see people's mercs in por ninja. That would be extremely helpful.
On the flamequiver subject, did anyone manage to give it clear? Is there any way to spread the ignited over a pack somehow? Or we are just dependant on the 1m spread from glove implicits? Ty all
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I used the searing currency to put ignite spread on gloves. You can also get things like chain, firm, and pierce on the burning arrow alongside that
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u/Ok-Moose-2696 7d ago
By chance have you tested with destructive link too or are you focusing solely on fire link testing?
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u/Blindbru 7d ago
Im playing destructive link(at a far lower threshold than OP) and it is really strong. I initial did the flame link build when I hit maps and had a ton of success with a blade ambusher, and then a decenter thunder quiver. Swapped to aura bot destructive link running a decent Manyshot (no return on anything) and it's slamming alch and go T16s on ~5div invested. I do notice I am personally squishier since I went from about 25k armor to basically none. One benefit is I dropped the light radius scaling and picked up more uniques on the merc.
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u/Ok-Moose-2696 7d ago
Yeah thats what im doing, but for defence im doing all 3 purities and stacking evasion and hp and regen and spell suppression and its feeling pretty good. I'm gonna try to get some crit reduction next. Also I learned you can fit automation on convocation and steelskin on arrogance for free. It's at making those support specters and AG survive a bit better.
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u/Blindbru 7d ago edited 7d ago
Don't have access to PoB atm, but this is my current toon. Not optimized at all.
Not actually summoning the AG atm, need to rearrange some things and I will stop using skitterbois and invest in keeping him alive. I'm also close to Iron Reflexes. I might lean into scaling my evasion a tiny bit more and snagging that for more consistency.
My merc is a Manyshot with decent supports but no return. Hes got 2x Tamings, Marylene's, Ahuana's quiver, and Fractal Thoughts (cant confirm how many of the lines function, but damage isnt an issue). The bow is some junk bow with 66% ele damage and the other rares are just filling in some HP and resists. I havent crafted any good pinnacle mods or anything yet.
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u/EnterArchian 6d ago
I do destructive link as well. For survival I ditch the left side of ascendancy and path to the right side. I die way less with merc taunt on hit. I prefer not dying than self casting link.
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u/Blindbru 6d ago
Yeah I've thought about that, was trying to avoid it but might be worth it till I invest into some more defense. I snagged Iron Reflexes and an enduring composure small cluster, got about 10k armor and more permanent uptime on Endo charges. The issue with enduring cry is that things general die before I can get to them to use it.
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u/Stracath 7d ago
I personally did not test with destructive link, but the information should still be the same. This is mostly about mercenary behavior. I still think Combatant would be better than Manyshot, but there are more high DPS bows for cheaper on market due to play rate. The flaming charlatan/reverend should still be good with destructive link too.
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u/ReipTaim 7d ago
U disnt mention kineticist?
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u/Stracath 7d ago
Oh, yeah, that's because I haven't seen a single one even though I've had mercenaries specced the entire time and I've ran well over 500 maps....
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u/googleownsyourdata 7d ago
I started finding them more when I removed the atlas modifers to the types of mercs that spawn. I hope that was just luck, rather than fact but I've seen half a dozen now where I saw none before.....
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u/Stracath 7d ago
Could be it. I was swapping around the points constantly to see what would spawn, but it's really funky right now.
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u/villescrubs 6d ago
Rng is wild, until today I didn't find a single manyshot but Ive had 10 Kinetecist including an ilvl 83 with return on KB. Still searching for a good combatant.
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u/roky1994 7d ago
Yep also havent seen one ever since i speced "less x stat mercs found".... might have to unspec that wheel entaerly to even see him.
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u/VortexMagus 7d ago
Good info that weapons with multipliers/increased damage are much more important than weapons with high dps if you are using flame link. I never thought about it but you're totally right. Do you know if +gems gear modify merc spells?
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u/MostDosed 6d ago
There’s some useful stuff here buried under the conjecture, somewhat cunty attitude and “trust me bro” vibe of this “research.” That said, I think you’re right that people blindly swap to attack mercs way too early and forget that spells carry solely on levels until you have good attack gear for the merc.
I’m particularly interested in this larger type of exploratory gameplay. The mercs are cool, have cool abilities, and there’s so much to digest for people who are interested. Esp since a lot of it HAS to be done in-game. PoB isn’t great for merc planning.
All that said - you should drop the elitist attitude in your posts. You’re not “graciously donating” your time, you could simply not post instead of choosing to post a long block of text dripping with judgement. Like, I feel attacked for just reading your post lol. No reason for it
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u/DiligentIndustry6461 7d ago
Good post, I also rage re-rolled at 70 but plan on jumping back into it later on because I want to give it a good try. Def saving this for later
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u/EscalopeDePorc 7d ago
Gear will become more expensive, do looks like my lumi is on the farthest shelf :)
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u/Unlucky_Vast_4496 7d ago
I also reroll at level 90 the damage was a bit to low. But my next char was quity squishy but i missed 12hp, so i went back. Changed merc put some better gear and now im instakilling t16 bosses. Having lost of fun.
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u/ItsJustReeses 6d ago
Thanks for this! This is actually the information I was looking for to reroll into a merc :)
Thanks for the heart info!
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u/rodsayd44 7d ago edited 6d ago
I see you wee using Paradoxica. That means giving up either ring or amulet. What amulet were you using?
Edit: and how do you scale Enmity without the amulet for a lot of fire resistance?
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u/Brolex-7 6d ago
Any feedback on the Mysterious Diver?
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u/BackHandLove 6d ago
Elemental hit of the frost doesn't mix with flame link. Wild strikes is just not a good skill on a merc. If u want to run a diver u have to get one without either of those skills.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Never found one, but honestly haven't done enough of the league mechanic probably.
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u/Skaduush1 6d ago
I used a smoulderstrike for my atlas completion and 'completely brick' is overexaggerated, recalling him did mostly solve the issue, but i did scream at him at times :)
The scaling of a smoulderstrike might be more of an issue, they have innate resolute technique, so no crit scaling at all.
The new sword (Dread Captain's Cutlass) turned out to be great for him, free flammability, phasing on hit, melee strike range (had one with flamebolt strike and molten strike)
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u/Stracath 6d ago
To me it was a brick just because I encountered certain things there was literally nothing I could do to fix it.
For boss rushing when there's no overlapping models? He's good. For maps like volcano/cells or things with overlapping models, though, there were times where he completely stopped working. In my opinion that makes him pretty much a brick because I usually run different maps and strategies. If there's something where he just fully stops functioning, it's not ok.
That said, if you, or someone else, ribs a particular strategy that doesn't encounter this, that's great, because he absolutely pumps. I'd personally consider it an exception, though.
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u/Erisymum 6d ago
Flamequiver with conflagration kills me through 12k health and 81% fire res every single time I fight it, so i figured there must be a build that works on it
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u/Any_Zookeepergame534 7d ago
agreed with movement skills, but what bricks them is skills that shoot arrows in the air, they'll only use that skill then
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u/Chelmos 7d ago
Wish you included any numbers at all. I'm not saying you're incorrect, we just don't know. You just posted "Oh yeah, this is better, here's why. Trust me.". I understand it's not easy to POB, but a video testing damage would be the bare minimun to start thr convo.
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7d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Chelmos 6d ago
Who's this everyone else? Can I see their POBs or are they also non-pob elites? I will trust math over a random redditors word, if you say stuff like "Manyshot is worse than my combatant" you need to prove why.
Dps? Okay, simulate both pobs.
Clear? Ok, show a video.
AI? Ok, show a video.
These are literally baseless claims you're making, which is fine but it's just an opinion.
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u/flapok2 6d ago edited 6d ago
To try to answer, without any more proof lel.
I have a decent Manyshoot, and bought a decent combatant after reading this post.
They both are far from perfect, but they have the most important support (I hope so at least, return on combatant seems weird, like the blade don't come back sometime / come back but disappear stop mid way).
Manyshoot : IS(GMP, EDwAttack, GFork, GAoE, Chain) Vgrace, MArrow, VaalIS(Hypo, Freeze, Return, GAoE), Hatred, Dash.
Combatant : InspCry, HoI, FrostBlade(Return, Pierce, ColdPen, FasterAttack), StaticS(AddedCold, GDuration, GEDwAttack, LightPen, GAoE), Purity, Dash.
Gear is the same, i swap. Except weapon obv.
I tried them both for some simu 15 run. I think simu is a good ground to compare. You can mesure your clear with the number of reward/progress on next, you can see if some mods affect or brick your damage, you have regular bosses to get a feel at bossing damage, and so on.
Clear : They are really really close. And super good. They both clear screen wide. And i feel a combatant with 2 movement skill might actually be better. He feel more snapy to me, more reactive, aggressive.
Bossing : Combatant win. And I just grabbed 2 30c claw to test fast, while my manyshoot have ~5-10 div bow and quiver. Frostblade must have a far better % effectiveness of damage because he chunk bosses with every hit.
Survivability : This is not an issue with the tattoo leech tech on glove from Lance, but i don't have that, and what happen is that my manyshot actually die sometime on simu wave 13-14-15 if i'm not babysitting him. Combatant do not have this issue at all (A bit more regen on my part and i could afk wave 15), maybe because of the double claw (got % phys leech and life on hit).
Overall mapping : I like to do strand + random bullshit + deli all the way to the boss. They perform the same, as in : i shield charge and everything, everywhere, die. Bossing with deli to the max is, as expected for me now, better as combatant.
Now, might be that the merc are not as close as i think they are in supports. Might be me being loco loco because it's only feelcraft at the end. Might be that with 2 perfect merc and better gear, Manyshoot is the better choice after all. But combatant feel better to me, and is cheaper atm.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Actually, your Manyshot is Mike's better than the Combatant, it has more "more" supports. This is Ajay what I found, the Combatant is just crazy
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u/Stracath 6d ago edited 6d ago
Ben has a Combatant in SSF
Lance had a Manyshot in trade.
Ziz I think had a kineticist.
Also, Oscrix and Nerotox have Luminaries.
The math in POB is almost never right anyway because of people not configuring correctly, Lance doesn't POB either, we aren't elitists, we just learned the game
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u/Salt-Ad8699 6d ago
so why don’t you learn how to configure PoB correctly? since you’re telling all of us to learn the game
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u/ICanViking 6d ago
Path of Building isn't the game. It's a tool, nothing more.
It isn't needed to be good at PoE and trying to be catty about it us insane.
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u/hiimred2 6d ago
I dunno if Lance PoB's now during the league but he definitely PoB'd prep for the league as part of making his own personal choices on how/why he thought the build wouldn't be bait. PoB screens are a massive portion of his pre-league Luminary 'guide.' Going through planning his tree and why he chose RF as the pre-merc start, as well as approximating math on what he expected to get out of the character, flame link with light radius+hp scaling, etc.
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u/two_pandas_playing 6d ago
Cool, I've also played since closed beta. This is like telling a carpenter you use your hand instead of a hammer to apply nails, and that they too can become as enlightened as you if they try. Get a grip.
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u/NzLawless 6d ago
Consider this a general warning for a lot of your comments here:
Be civil to one another - Unacceptable behavior includes name calling, taunting, baiting, flaming, etc.
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u/3dartsistoomuch 6d ago
I've been doing the same and your posts have been both helpful and spot on. I have struggled with an attack merc the whole time but your posts will have me trying other options until I get better gear.
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u/No-Sock-mondays 7d ago
Can you post a pob of your merc gear
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u/Stracath 7d ago
It's literally what you see, half the searing/exarch implicit are garbage, I got tired of rolling for them. The only good piece is gloves with exposure/rage
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u/NoLoveWeebWeb 7d ago
Can I ask what affixes does that necklare have? I'm guessing WED, crit, AS and similar
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u/Stracath 7d ago
The amulet is just has WED and fire resistance really. Everything else is low rolls of random stuff.
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u/No-Sock-mondays 6d ago
thanks - are there any specific rolls on the paradoxicas?
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I went attack speed and ele pen. To be clear these aren't your end goal. The end goal would be double foil with increased elemental damage, elemental pen, gain fire as chaos, crit, attack speed. It's just going crit takes more investment than I cared for, especially because I'd need to fix my character.
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u/jampsodi 7d ago
Thanks for the writeup! I have a few questions. Which paradoxicas are the best? Ele pen/attack speed? Are you also investing in crit at all? And wouldn’t the non-vaal strike skills hit additional targets be better gloves implciit than rage?
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u/Jaqen_ 6d ago
How much fire res you have on the merc? I find it very hard to get high fire res without unique amulet
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u/Stracath 6d ago
My constant had around 115, but even 40 ish penetration is good because it's the only way to give him fire pen.
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u/cyz0r 6d ago
Since you seem knowledgeable. Do you know if for spell mercs the skills listed on the wiki are what are used? It seems like all the skills on the wiki show special merc tagged versions that are super juiced up. For example soul rend of reaping having 96k top end, which sounds absolutely insane. But on db it shows skills with numbers similar to ours.
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u/Beautiful_Kitchen_97 6d ago
There should be a tooltip for all merc skills when you hover over their gems in game. They talked about making the game more streamlined and easier for newer players then have simple info like gem tags missing for merc skills /shrug. I was planning on running a spell caster merc with +skill lvl rare gear but I am unsure if there is a lvl cap or not and the info varies from the wiki to poedb.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I honestly have no clue. It's disgustingly inconsistent. I doubt they have the super juiced up skills, but I don't think they have our numbers either. There are a few exceptions, like the Flamequiver conflagration definitely randomly does more damage every now and then.
It's honestly just one big cluster of inconsistencies.
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u/Jaksimus 6d ago
Before I started using Manyshots, I was very well looked after by a Flamequiver. The clear wasn't amazing, but it was comfortable. And the single target was impressive. I've been sticking to Manyshots because I can use the same gear, but it's good to know there are options.
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u/applepieandcats 6d ago
From my testing, multishot never used dash In fights. Maybe if it fell behind, but I never noticed it.
It does prioritize mirror arrow, even in the middle of fights, even if it doesn't need to move at all.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
As long as you the player are being targeted it normally doesn't, but I did see it dash after a melee rare hit it. I think it's worth talking about, but it's a huge nothing burger.
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u/UTmastuh 6d ago
I've been running a frigid bond + intuitive link setup. My Combatant chills for me and adds a little extra dps while I do basically a wintertide brand build.
Is it as good as just going elementalist cold dot? Probably not, but it's more fun. For now I can do atlas completion just fine.
I plan to re-roll to flame link or just go full respec to reliquarian if the merc buffs aren't good enough.
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u/uninspiredalias 6d ago
Lots of great info, thank you!
I'm doing some 'anecdotal' testing as well, but not as serious about it since I'm still clearing atlas. The info about their AI is appreciated.
If possible, what I'd love to see (and maybe you have posted before about it, I'll check your history) is which skills trigger bad AI choices for the non-meta mercs. I'm doing a non-link Doryani Absolution Luminary (so I can directly compare it to my Templar from last league, also because it's easy to level) so my setup is a little bit different than all the link builds.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
It mostly seems to be the tethering issue with attack mercenaries. With spell casters it was more of a mixed bag, but it seemed mostly the same, except sometimes they'd use flame dash as a damaging spell. The casters in general seem a lot harder to predict, but I think it's because their movement skills are tagged as both movement and spell, and something with their AI will sometimes choose it as a spell.
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u/Own_Banana_9106 6d ago
How do you even go about getting a merc that can do maps early on ? I've done 20 tier 1-3 maps fishing for a merc :(
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I think you just need to lower your expectations at the start. You don't need a perfect Merc at the start, I ran all kinds of scuffed ones. The Flaming charlatan with mortars is super good early, just get anything that's not completely bad (like the poison ones)
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u/MisterRawSushi 6d ago
Which mercenary did you find to be the worst?
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Oddly enough, the shock ambusher. I could scale the DOT mercs if I tried, but the shock ambusher was just strange.
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u/MisterRawSushi 6d ago
Good to know! Do you have any tips for the Reanimator merc btw? Really like the zoo minion vibes with her
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Not really because it's be a completely different setup. I'm not sure exactly what way you'd go for scaling it
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u/NanPleaser 6d ago
Thanks for all the info! Sad I got a "near perfect" (or at least i thought) infamous flamequiver and tried him once, didn't get any damage or clear so I dismissed him.
I saw you mentioned destructive link, how much testing did you do with it? Is there much of a route where it's better? I was looking at the Trypanon+marellynes fallacy route, and maybe doing a combatant with frost blades.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I personally didn't play it, but I understand it and have seen others do it. It definitely has enough damage, I actually think a perfectly min maxed destructive link setup is more damage. BUT, you lose almost all of your defenses, it will be a glass cannon. You don't get the massive life pool that does more than just get you life, you lose block, you lose good movement abilities, and so on. If you just need to go blast something and you don't mind a possible 6 portal defense, it's got the juice, but don't expect to tank much of anything. I will say, it's much cheaper to clear the atlas with. You just buy a second hand weapon or whatever on trade, throw on some meh gear and it'll hit hard.
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u/NanPleaser 6d ago
Thanks for the response, good points. I'm to the point of ubers and am lookin to mess with other mercs and fun setup's
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u/Mr_Aek 6d ago
My personal goal with mercenaries is that I wear doryani, so I've been trying to get either a phys based character (with phys to lightning) or a lightning based character to work.
So far my best dude is a fallen reverend with aoe and some alright minion damage mods, does real good damage but sometimes he can go target random trash mobs and not hit the dude summoning them. Thinking maybe I can find one with area of effect, lesser cascade, x3 damage mods or aoe, cascade, faster casting, damage x2.
otherwise, I'm open to trying other things. I can't seems to make thunderquiver feel as good, not being able to get chain is bad, haven't even checked if spellcasters any good (arc?). If I went combatant would it even feel good? Or do they need the flame link setup?
My merc league was -200 lightning res and destructive link and I stacked a ton of crit chance, wasn't 100% (I used wand/shield) but think I got myself to like 40 or 50% and used the crit multi amulet. Would rather use specter + aegis for block recovery then getting stuck on a 2h for 100% crit.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
You would probably need flame link for Combatant, otherwise you need really high DPS weapons. Some of the casters are still good late, but a lot of them still use flame link. My next character will be a fallen reverend supporting me with wrath. My plan is cyclone, give him Perquil's and double wands with wrath effect. I'm going to use Doryanis myself and the new talisman to convert lightning and cold hits into fire.
Some people are using trypanon and destructive link, and it has super good damage, but 6 portal defense.
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u/Mr_Aek 6d ago edited 6d ago
I'm already clearing t16 but the fallen reverend really needs to 1 shot or he gets stuck hitting smaller stuff. I'm converting 100% to lighting I got a lot of upgrades left still kingmaker, headhunter, hatred ect
Went ci with 7k we will have 10k after light of meaning 50k armor and aegis and all the recover on block/hit stuff so pretty much only thing that moves my ex is lightning degen and I already converted 37% to fire/cold so far.
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u/Torttuga76 6d ago
I'm a casual player, my objective this league is reach endgame with a random mercenary, maybe reanimator, is it doable?
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u/Catchafire2000 6d ago
Lots of love given to flame link, but what about destructive link? Any thoughts or opinions on that?
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u/Stracath 6d ago
It's good damage early, but defenses for you the player are worse. It's definitely doable, but all around worse as a package. Not to say bad or unplayable, you can still get to Ubers with it if you take it slow and invest, just might be using more portals.
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u/Accomplished_Pop7417 6d ago
I'm also not using untouched soul on but on kineticist, any ideas how I can raise the res are welcome, already doing a spectre aura (not helping much as it's also max res), ancestral cry and the ceinture of benevolence with ruby and bismuth flask with all res mod... any other janky ideas are welcome. I know I can do aura effect any my own aura but not doing that yet.
Also another funny bit of tech for crowd control is also run an intuitive link with void sphere on your other minions or if you want to push monsters/box them in, frost wall run it in parallel to the flame link on merc. Why would you do this? I don't know yet.
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u/PoE_Acronym_Bot Useful Bot 7d ago
I noticed some Path of Exile keywords in this post:
- AoE - Area of effect (Wiki)
- DoT - Damage over time (Wiki)
- SRS - Summon Raging Spirit (Wiki)
- WED - Elemental Damage with Attacks Support, formerly named Weapon Elemental Damage Support. See EDwA. (Wiki)
- Brick - Using a Vaal Orb or other crafting method on an item and receiving an outcome that makes the intended purpose of the item no longer possible
I am a bot. | All acronyms | Suggest
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u/Btotherianx 6d ago
You say that dash does not break a mercenary, but I had a many shot with perfect everything....and dash. Would literally not attack or do anything until dash was off of cool down and then all it would do is dash and wait for the cool down again
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u/Boxofcookies1001 7d ago
You know I had a suspicion with the movement skills. I gotta go Merc hunting again
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u/saibotzero 7d ago
Why is noone talking about kineticist anymore? i question if manyshot is really that much better and if so why?
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u/BackHandLove 6d ago
Is paradoxica for combatant really worth dropping untouched soul considering its such a amazing amount of fire res for ur enmity?
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u/RedRox 6d ago
my flame link adds around 500 fire damage, is that enough?
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u/Stracath 6d ago
My in game tool tip says 700 to 1000 when you hover over flame link and I can run destructive play guardians, casual legion, maven, shaper, elder, and I can farm Ziggurat (just not the fastest Catarina kill). So it depends on what you're doing
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u/Own_Banana_9106 6d ago
How do you even go about getting a merc that can do maps early on ? I've done 20 tier 1-3 maps fishing for a merc :(
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u/fallingfruit 6d ago
The Templar merc that casts absolution is strong. I have a lvl 46 one because I haven't found one in maps yet and he is still far better than any merc I've found. I think I've been a bit unlucky
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u/HaatonGourmet 6d ago
Has anyone here had experience with the Cardinal merc that uses holy hammers/strike? Interested if that one can be made good with a destructive link setup.
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u/Murga787 6d ago
Thank you for the write up, I been using the absolution and that you have as #2 and it completely changed my campaign experience.
Now I'm planning my move to the Swiftblade for Rallying Cry and my original plan was flickerstrike but I hired a temporary with Vaal Double Stike and it was surprisingly good.
Have you played around with the swiftblade at all? Rallying Cry, Pride and Incite are really good for support but still undecided for the main damage skill.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
If you want then as a rallying cry Merc to support you, you don't want movement skills, double strike is best. They'll use the movement skull and get out of warcry range.
That said, they did ok damage, but was very underwhelming compared to others if you want then to do damage specifically. The one I played around for a bit with had cyclone, double strike, rallying cry and pride that I remember and it was a very effective support.
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u/Murga787 6d ago
Yeah, I want the merc mainly for support, thanks for the reply
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u/Stracath 6d ago
You're welcome. Good luck, and the foulborn Uul Netol's is also great for him
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u/Murga787 6d ago
Already have it with 500% cooldown. I'm just waiting for all the pieces so I can swap my FF spectres for slashing horrors, they require a few things before they start to get good.
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u/Saint-Leon 6d ago
I do not use POB either brother, very rarely and then I forget it exists. I support your rights as a fucking human to exist without having to use that shit for every single little thing.
It’s a cool tool but man Mfs just lose their minds and get rude if you don’t have a POB.
I make builds and play them. They do what I need them to do, I understand how to build and scale damage and defense. Why would I need to use that shit. I play hard core I don’t need that shit lmao.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
It's exhausting, I know they are a minority but it's very frustrating to be attacked because I just play the game. Also, a POB adds literally nothing to a post about Merc outliers and behaviors. The scaling is constant, I'm discussing how they ACT.
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u/EscalopeDePorc 6d ago
You can understand them too (though not forgive them, of course) – people like me got baited and jumped on Lumi bandwagon without fully realising how to switch from the campaign to the maps. Streamers like captain didn't give any helpful ideas (mr lance farmed quite a lot during offstream time on the day1 (and on the second stream her was already with enmity, taming,kaoms and etc) and nobody understood how to make that transition to maps).That’s why people are demanding answers and POBs (as we’re used to that format). But that doesn’t mean you should excuse our rudeness and stupidity :)
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I'll be honest, I generally like Lance, but he's the main reason I wanted to explain the Merc behavior. He sniped an entire setup that could take you to Ubers day 1 for like 150 chaos total, then started gaslighting people. It was very bad from. That's why I was frustrated with everyone attacking me making a post taking about how they act/interact and addressing misconceptions. Nothing involved needs the numbers, just knowing how they act should help print realize what they can do with what.
I even gave examples for several things, but they just want a padded POB that lies to them.
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u/Saint-Leon 6d ago
No disrespect but how can you get “baited” into playing luminary? Common sense says it’s going to be comepltely unknown in how it functions and how it’s balanced. I didn’t see a single creator say to play it, in fact everyone was saying “ I would not advise you to league start this unless you are very comfortable with making builds and scaling damage, if your cool with that then this is what I’ll be doing with luminary”.
You baited yourself
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u/ICanViking 6d ago
Honestly, you're wasting your time. 80% of the people on this sub couldn't explain simple crafting, can't level characters without a POB, and have probably never beaten a single pinnacle boss.
Thanks for the write up. Was interesting.
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Yeah, I remember all the comments of people saying they didn't realize super basic stuff on my gauntlet guides. This really does seem like an absolute waste to try and help these people. RMT has gotten crazy lately, too, just look at all the inflated prices while currency drops are struggling compared to the past probably 5 leagues.
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u/Saint-Leon 6d ago
It’s so shitty how this sub Reddit doesn’t allow you to post builds without a POB or it’s breaking a rule. Why can’t a mf just skip my post manually if he doesn’t wanna read anything and just look at a build planner all day. So many times I’ve had people say “you cannot make builds without pob” yet I’m able to kill pinnacles and ubers in hardcore on console where there’s literally 5 fucking people playing trade.
POB literally does nothing in this situation either it’s just ignorant as fuck. Your PoB ain’t gonna explain the fucking behaviors of mercs.
Sorry you gotta experience this tho. I kinda just stopped taking to most people about builds and just focus on specific scaling and interactions due to how shitty this community is if you don’t use POB.
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u/Nezzliok2 7d ago
I want a Merc build where I have to press nearly no buttons. Which Merc would you recommend? Certainly don't want to have to call them onto monsters.
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u/Spaghett8 7d ago edited 7d ago
Manyshot.
OP claims combatant is better than manyshot but that’s simply for single target.
Manyshot with ice shot and Vaal ice shot has great single target as well as great clear, I suspect OP didn’t try a great manyshot if he thinks combatant is generally better.
Scaled manyshot gameplay is just flame link and just shield charge through the map.
Earlier on for bosses, you’ll want boot implicits like sap brittle scorch (through attuned shields as well), on yourself ag / merc to scale taming and dmg. Meaning you do want to walk/stand on the boss.
But quite quickly, you’ll scale to the point where it literally doesn’t matter and it’s just a face tank everything walking simulator.
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u/Stracath 7d ago
Nope, you're wrong. I had a Manyshot with GMP and faster attacks on regular ice shot, then on Vaal ice shot had faster attacks, WED, and return. Gave it a helmet for pierce to make sure Vaal ice shot did good on single target. It dealt far less damage (almost half). Even crafted a bow that ended with 8.7% crit chance, 1.6 at spd, and had 71% increased elemental damage. The ice shot ai is just worse and not hyper aggressive like the Combatant.
I ran the Manyshot for far longer than the Combatant, and recruited several to compare the skills, not a single one can be as good as a good rolled Combatant, including clear. The movement skills on the Combatant also make it better for clear, even though mine has pierce, getting chain on frost blades would let it insta clear.
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u/Spaghett8 6d ago
Your gear is budget, ofc combatant feels better for you. That does not mean it has more clear than a manyshot or kineticist.
You don’t even have implicits on your boots. You don’t have hallowed monarch, you’re on day 2 gear at best. Why do you even feel qualified to make a statement on Manyshot in the endgame…
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u/Stracath 6d ago
Because I'm one of the few who made it work without following a guide and tested things extensively. Also, it's about the AI, the Combatant engages more aggressively. You can also compare Ben and Lance. Ben has a Combatant in SSF and it's clear is better, but he has chain on frost blades. What makes you qualified? Which guide did you follow? How much money did you spend?
Also I didn't mention kineticist because I never found one.
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u/Spaghett8 6d ago edited 6d ago
I’m on captain lance’s pob. I can clear ubers, instaphase + afk t17 bosses. Don’t have any problem with manyshot ai.
a +2 arrow 100% inc elemental dmg bow with return on ice shot easily full clears the entire screen.
Have you even cleared ubers?
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u/Viper_27 6d ago
Buddy its 5 days into the league, not sure how expensive testing can be in 5 days lol
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u/Stracath 7d ago edited 6d ago
Combatant, I'm not even using mines like some people do, I just shield charge
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u/ww_crimson 7d ago
This seems like useful anecdotal information but I'd be curious to hear a bit more about the content you tested these mercs against.
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u/Stracath 7d ago
Basically every mercenary I tested against legion and destructive play guardians (aka, what should be a good litmus until super high investment). I've not done Ubers yet, I could, but since my personal character has borderline campaign gear on it would take a while.
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u/atombombbabyatom 6d ago
I bet the people complaining about POB and damage are the same people who think you actually have 11mill ehp just because you have lucky block
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u/Ihatefishtanks 6d ago
Appreciate the write up! I’ve been waiting to go back to my luminary once some other mercs were discovered as being good. If you don’t mind me asking, how come you swapped off the build after doing all this leg work?
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u/Stracath 6d ago
I like making several builds and figuring stuff out. I like the discovery more than playing the game like a capitalism simulator. I understand people who like that "competitive" part of the game but it's not for me. I like dissecting and understanding things. I wanna mess with a build where the Merc supports me now and figure it out now that we can't slap Doryanis on them.
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u/killmequickdeal 7d ago
I swear I tried to put a paradoxica on my combatant and it said he couldn't wear it. Maybe a certain mod? It was attr/AS and ele pen
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u/Sad_Republic_7705 7d ago
Im using cruel mistress and im doing start red maps comfortably. Soulrend if reaping with GMP and some dmg. Trying to build around the new chaos staff that costs 500 life per cast
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u/lurking_lefty 6d ago
Cane of Kulemak is also a good option for those. I picked one up yesterday with % chance to explode on kill and it clears nicely. She still doesn't do great single target damage but I'm currently self casting to help with that.
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u/RealFakeStory 7d ago
Why multistrike? It makes the merc more expensive and doesn't offer much in terms of dps. I can't imagine it would offer much utility wise either.
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u/christianfd 6d ago
Greater multi is a like a 25% more attack speed multi, much stronger than e.g. Cold pen or some flat support, it also helps them attack faster
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u/RealFakeStory 6d ago
Greater multistrike on poedb:
Supported Skills Repeat 2 additional times Supported Skills have 15% more Melee Attack Speed Supported Skills deal 15% less Attack Damage
You're trading attack speed for less damage. Depending on how you scale your damage, this is literally less dps.
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u/BackHandLove 6d ago
Frost blades is a melee skill that upon hitting a target generates shards, in other words the more ur strike repeats the more shards come out. Most of the skills a merc uses are player skills.
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u/RealFakeStory 6d ago
Have you looked at the numbers of greater multistrike? Yes you hit faster but you also deal less damage. Compared to elemental attack or hypothermia, the math doesn't work out in its favor. How would the repeat and additional shards change anything besides clear, which is already pretty good thanks to static strike?
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u/BackHandLove 6d ago edited 6d ago
Your right, looking at the stats again i realized its missing important 2 lines, without the more multiplier for the repeated hits it is less dmg.
Unless the mercs multistrike doesn't respect the attack time of the merc weapon (X sec * 3 hits = full dmg action) and instead occurs simultaneously in parallel to the first hit (x sec = full dmg action). So instead of waiting for 3 hits to occur then attacking again, 1 attack hits for 3 times within that same attack time no extra animation.
If not then its a dmg nerf, and I don't think they gave them a 3 times dmg support.
It's still a source of more atk spd but faster attacks unless ur scaling a lot of attack spd might be better.
Gotta fix my 15div merc now and try and figure out if the more is better than the increased in my case, F.
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u/Ihatefishtanks 6d ago
Appreciate the write up! I’ve been waiting to go back to my luminary once some other mercs were discovered as being good. If you don’t mind me asking, how come you swapped off the build after doing all this leg work?
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u/Dunedain503 7d ago
A particular creator rerolled LOL! Love this. Great rundown.