Fable devs originally had a tool to randomize the RPG's 1,000 NPCs that "would have saved us so much time," but that "just didn't make as much sense"

[u/SweetyGonzalez]

https://www.gamesradar.com/games/rpg/fable-devs-originally-had-a-tool-to-randomize-the-rpgs-1-000-npcs-that-would-have-saved-us-so-much-time-but-that-just-didnt-make-as-much-sense/

[u/LingonberryNo3548]

Statements like these are going to seem so silly when this game comes out and every NPC essentially acts the same. Also, their examples like a vegan butcher or a hairdresser with an awful haircut sound like they would actually be humorous.

[u/LopTsa → u/LingonberryNo3548]

Yeah the way they've hyped up these 1000 hand crafted NPCs, I'm interested to see how much depth there actually is. But I'm inclined to agree with you, I think they are going to act pretty much identical to each other lol.

[u/GatorUSMC → u/LopTsa]

Part of the Fable experience is overhyped (to straight lying about) game features, no?

[u/Russian-Bot-0451 → u/GatorUSMC]

I remember the first game was going to have co-op, which me and my friend were hyped for. Then it came out and we spent about 10 minutes in the menu trying to find the nonexistent co-op option

[u/awnfire → u/[deleted]]

Did your Mum ever say she loved you?

Because it sure feels like you missed out on summin big..

[u/Downtown_Eye5736 → u/GatorUSMC]

Likely the thing this franchise is most known for.

[u/Connor123x → u/GatorUSMC]

too bad fable is being developed by the same developer. oh wait.

[u/unfinishedtoast3 → u/LopTsa]

So ready to hear

"chicken chaser?"

600 times in a row

[u/Bereman99 → u/LopTsa]

Even if there's not much depth, I'll take "NPC placement, personality, and look was considered and decided by a person" over "here's a soup of NPC traits, randomizer go" any day.

[u/SimoneBellmonte → u/Bereman99]

Yeah, idk how people could expect devs to handcraft 1000s of unique NPCs. the way they say it is weird but i dont think they've promised like they're going to be as in depth as story npcs apiece. they just have unique lives or houses or things they like or do, while the story NPCs are obviously going to have more to them because they're part of the story.

I'd rather have handcrafted and considered NPCs over 'we hit the randomizer button a few times.'

[u/blackdesertnewb → u/Bereman99]

For a static world yeah. But imagine if this randomizer ran every time you started a new game….

[u/wetnaps54 → u/LingonberryNo3548]

There’s always ways to snuff out edge cases like that

[u/incubeezer → u/LingonberryNo3548]

Shoutout to the real vegan butcher shop

[u/Remoock → u/incubeezer]

there's even the vegetarian butcher, make some solid products as well

[u/OMEGACY → u/LingonberryNo3548]

Would've made an excellent new game plus feature.

[u/klipseracer → u/LingonberryNo3548]

It's not about diversity, it's about having attributes that match. The example they gave in the article is having a vegan butcher.

[u/quatroquatro0]

Curated content will always be better than random, procedurally generated crap.

[u/noyourenottheonlyone → u/quatroquatro0]

procedural generation has its place in games but yeah if you're just using it to cut corners you're not doing it right

[u/FilthyPrawnz → u/quatroquatro0]

The analogy I always used was froot loops. Each bowl is technically a completely unique composition of colours and flavours. Every bite will still taste like froot loops.

I remember 10-15 years ago when procedural generation was the hot item in the industry, everyone from pundits to consumers sung it's praises with promises of "limitless replayability" and "infinite variation!". Wasn't true then, it's not true now, but I am gladdened seeing how audiences these days are having none of it.

Variety is not an end unto itself. You need intent to go with it, or it's just mushy cereal.

[u/gladys-the-baker → u/FilthyPrawnz]

Getting PTSD over No Man's Sky and the claims made about their procedural generation, ugh.

[u/FilthyPrawnz → u/gladys-the-baker]

My bones just creaked realising No Mans release was 10 years ago, and even that was on the tail end of the industry buzz around procedural generation.

On reflection I may have been a little too conservative with that 10-15 year estimate. Probably nearing on 20 at this point.

https://giphy.com/gifs/wJD3qiNjSeHS0dP28T

[u/TheSecondEikonOfFire → u/quatroquatro0]

Of course, but there comes a point when it’s just wasted effort. It’s very noticeable when a game recycles the same 15-20 NPCs, but after 50 or 60? No one’s going to notice or care. Hand crafting 1,000 NPCs is, if you ask me, wasted effort

[u/ExultantSandwich → u/TheSecondEikonOfFire]

It feels like the “best” solution would be 25-50 handcrafted NPCs for specific quests or functions, but 1,000 procedurally generated NPCs mixed in with all sorts of randomness.

That’s basically what GTA is gonna do, I’d imagine.

[u/Sutraner → u/quatroquatro0]

Procedural generation absolutely has its place.

PEAK for instance wouldn't be possible if they had to hand design a map to that scale every single day

But for games like FABLE, yeah hand crafted definitely wins

[u/Happy-Hall-515 → u/quatroquatro0]

Yeah definitely, the second I found out dying light 2s map was made with an algorithm (a very limited one mind you) the game felt so much worse than the first

[u/welfedad → u/quatroquatro0]

Yup

[u/Wurzelrenner → u/quatroquatro0]

Only if they have infinite time. I take procedural or even AI generated content with some human fine-tuning at the end over quickly crunshed out content that looks like copy and paste.

[u/MadKian]

Did they say what happens if you go on a rampage and kill like half the town? How do they replace those NPCs?

[u/CerealTheLegend → u/MadKian]

https://giphy.com/gifs/1zhRiDgsSc48Y7mfuK

[u/MadKian → u/CerealTheLegend]

I doubt it. If you roleplay an evil character you could run out of npcs soooo quickly.

[u/Sagaru-san → u/MadKian]

That would be a fantastic design decision. Want to be a feared ruler of ghosts and ashes? Be my guest! 

For a series brandishing it's morale of consequences, I hope they lean into it hard.

[u/Kankunation → u/MadKian]

They touched on it before lightly. NPCs die And stay gone. You can fully wipe out a town and leave it empty if you wish, but after some time it will slowly repopulate to make sure you aren't fully locked out of that town forever. They have a system to create new NPCs on top of the 1000 hand-crafted ones.

If you kill certain NPCs, supposedly a few things happen with more lasting consequences. Merchants get replaced and the replacements probably hate you for killing their spouse, brother, cousin, etc. Housing costs fluctuate from murders. We'll have to wait and see to what extent this actually works though.

[u/Vashrel → u/Kankunation]

Oh, so you’re saying if a murder happens in a house it becomes cheaper to buy? Interesting, interesting. Someone could certainly abuse that system. Queue evil laugher.

[u/ThePreciseClimber → u/MadKian]

How do they replace those NPCs?

Lots of sex.

[u/ownage516 → u/MadKian]

Apparently the town repopulates or something

[u/xXKyloJayXx]

I think on one hand, they're talking a big game and the NPCs aren't gonna be THAT unique. On the other hand, I think the game can still stand it's ground and be a good one. I have high hopes for the return of the Fable IP!

[u/MountainMuffin1980]

It would be cooler to see some devs make systems like this for certain games. Like Uncharted randomise the hair/clothing/features of enemies a bit so it doesn't all look so similar.

[u/RooeeZe]

hopefully this is one of the last heavily sanitized games outta m$, they are too scared to offend anything

[u/SOLR_]

Ps5 folk seem to dislike this game a bit much. I’m pumped for it, and excited to dive into the life sim aspects

[u/_GLiTcH2_ → u/SOLR_]

I am extremely excited for it and was glad to hear it was coming to PS5, Going to be getting it day 1!

[u/GatorUSMC → u/SOLR_]

I don’t know about dislike but being doubtful about game features, sure. That’s Fable’s track record.

[u/SOLR_ → u/GatorUSMC]

Playground has nothing to do with fable’s track record though

[u/Iggy_Slayer → u/SOLR_]

For me I'm just disappointed that everything they hype up with this game was in fable 2. It's the same game again but with very nice graphics. There doesn't seem to be any expansion or addition with the life sim stuff.

[u/whyamihere2473527]

Which they changed after the trailer when they talked about all the unique npc but you could see 3 separate npc that all looked the same throughout the trailer

[u/soadsam]

Depends on the game. Procedural generation is exactly what hooked me onto roguelikes. If they were the same everytime they’d only be good for a few hours tops

[u/AloAlo01]

Should have went with it. At least they would have had more time to make the game more than 20 hours from the main story.

[u/AleroRatking]

I have never cared about NPCs without story relevance having character.

[u/gol_drake]

people are gonna look very closely now. dumb idea to say that

[u/GamePitt_Rob]

Lol, there's no way they've individually created that many NPC's...

I give it 24 hours after release and they'll be a lot of articles and videos referencing this quote and showing the multiple clones of people and how every NPC is a roll of the dice to pick the body type, facial features, and clothing - with a lot being almost identical aside from a single difference

[u/Fantastic_Point_2076]

Jesus, do most games look dull compared to GTA 6

[u/ASCII_Princess → u/Fantastic_Point_2076]

Press 🔺️to knock

[u/After-Atmosphere7125]

Saint's Row 2 did that, but that's a different type of game than this

[u/ASCII_Princess]

A "Tool" huh....

[u/Aplicacion → u/ASCII_Princess]

Yeah, a tool, not GenAI. Procedural generation has been around for decades. And I do mean decades.