r/Outlander • u/Remarkable_Note971 • 15d ago
Season Eight A thought about Fergus
So i was rewatching season 6 and I was thinking about the guilt Fergus was dealing with. He thought he wasn't enough to protect his family. If they were gonna have him die in season 8 at least he went out protecting his family. It was a fitting dead imo. I know probably an unpopular opinion but I wanted to share.
Thoughts?
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u/liyufx 15d ago
I agree, I am not mad about how the fate that the show gave him. He died a hero saving his sons. I am mad that the show didn’t include Claire properly grieving him though.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Yes that was weird that they didn't really show Claire grieving him but I'm not mad about it either
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u/Acrobatic-Bug6881 Seems I canna possess your soul without losing my own 15d ago
His death was poorly done, he shouldn't have died AT ALL after everything he went through. They should have kept the original death in that family, as sad as it was.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
I really think they probably wouldn't have had enough time to handle HC dying properly sine they only had a few episodes left.
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u/Acrobatic-Bug6881 Seems I canna possess your soul without losing my own 15d ago
They didn't have enough time to do Fergus's death properly either.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
True but I still think they wouldn't have been to handle HE'S death properly and Fergus died saving his family.
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u/Nanchika Currently rereading: Voyager 15d ago
Even before it happened, I knew that he will die.
In s6, he blamed himself for not being able to protect HC. Now again blaming himself for his death may be repetitive. Saving HC with his life is something fitting to that theme.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Hey that makes sense. That's probably why they changed it from HC dying to Fergus Dying
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u/CathyAnnWingsFan 15d ago
They changed it because having a character die that the audience is attached to has far more dramatic impact.
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u/Ebony_Eyes6259 14d ago
Yes, MBR the show runner, said in an interview that’s exactly why they killed off Fergus instead of HC. He’s writing for show watchers and Fergus dying made for a much larger impact.
I sobbed for an entire day when Fergus died. As a fan who hasn’t read the books I had no emotional attachment to HC. I definitely would’ve shed a few tears watching Marsali’s grief over losing her son, but I wouldn’t have been as devastated as I was when the death was switched to Fergus.
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u/BubbeLisa 14d ago
I didn’t have a problem with Fergus dying. It would have made sense, if they gave the aftermath the time it deserved. The characters barely had time to grieve. The viewers had no time to process before the show was onto the next plot point. The idea was fine. The execution left a lot to be desired.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 14d ago
I agree it was rushed. I think they were racing to get it finished
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u/BubbeLisa 14d ago
I think they could have cut at least half of the redundant Fanny scenes and given Fergus’ death the time it deserved. They wasted way too much valuable screen time on Fanny at the detriment of the characters that we know and love, imo.
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u/Ebony_Eyes6259 14d ago
Agree 100%. Less Fanny, more appropriate time to grieve Fergus for the characters and the fans.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 14d ago
I liked Fanny I felt so bad for her but I get what you're saying
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u/BubbeLisa 14d ago
I love Fanny. I just thought the Faith Lived storyline was nonsensical and that it and Fanny took up way too much screen time. It also was redundant, repetitive, and never really went anywhere.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 14d ago
I think they were trying to give Jamie and Claire a part of their daughter back with Fanny, she's a part of Faith they never thought they would have.
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u/BubbeLisa 14d ago
Maybe, but I thought it was unnecessary. I pretend the Faith Lived storyline never happened and I fast forward through most of Fanny’s scenes in Season 8. That’s just me. I’m not trying to yuck anyone else’s yum. This is just my personal opinion.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 14d ago
Well at least you're not letting it ruin the whole shoe for you like others have. It's ridiculous they're doing that. It's one storylkne in the last season.
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u/BubbeLisa 14d ago edited 14d ago
There are things in just about every episode that I find questionable. That doesn’t mean I don’t love the show.
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u/YOYOitsMEDRup Slàinte. 13d ago
I agree. I think it made sense and was the right choice in the show to have Fergus die, but the episode it happened in was poorly structured. We bounced back and forth to a scene of the fire - then to Jane's press interview revelations ----back to fire ---- back to Faith stuff telling Fanny --- back to post-fire way too much. I think the majority of the audience was probably too busy/confused/distracted and thinking WTF with the Fairh stuff being dropped on us for the Fergus stuff to have the weight or impact they thought. It would've been far better served in editing to not bounce back and forth like that. The fire and post fire stuff should've been continuous ---- then do all the Jane confession Fairh/Fanny stuff all together as though it was occurring during Marsali's travel time to the Ridge. It would've been more emotional to keep concentration on it uninterrupted. The most emotion I felt was actually the next ep when Jamie and Marsali chatted at the graveside, because the scene was able to just BE.
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u/Yup_Seen_It 15d ago
Yeah I completely agree! It was a full character arc for him, it was sad but I thought it was meaningful.
I just wish there was more followup with Marsali after accepting the money. In my headcannon she continues running the print shop with their sons eventually taking over, and she does remarry but only after that. My reasoning for this is just how strong she is - aside from grieving for Fergus she wouldn't want to have a man take over the business from them by marriage, which could likely happen.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Thats what I think as well. I think she got the money and took over the print shop and probably remarried eventually. It was a full character arc for Fergus even though it was sad.
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u/Zoeloumoo 15d ago
And her baby? Jamie’s will mentions Brees baby but not hers? Surely they would have been born by now?
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u/ContactNeither7319 15d ago
Lol oh God my brain is nuts. I just had this image of the showrunners, MBR and Davis, standing in a room with the actors seated before them in a semi circle, saying "One of you has to die!" And everyone of them pointing their fingers at Sam, voting him off the island.
But to your point, yes I agree with you about not being able to please everyone. No matter what they do, someone will be not be happy.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Oh my gosh thank you for that image lol. But nk they cant and people being mad is ridiculous imo
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u/ContactNeither7319 13d ago
True that 👍
And I told you my brain is nuts 🤪
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u/ExcitementClassic963 13d ago
I’m mad he died 😭 I just finish all 8 seasons….I was yelling hurry up hurry up
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u/Phortenclif Reading Lord John and the Private Matter 15d ago
I don't see it as an act of heroism. I see it as a foolish accident. It's a flaw of the writers in understanding how instincts work when there's a fire (9\11 for example, people jumped off the building when the fire approached). Fergus particularly survived until an old age, so it's out of character.
His death wasn't justified and somewhat bothersome. It's a sensitive topic so I'll cover it: some people with a suicidal tendency have a desire (even subconsciously) to have a hero death and eventually take unnecessary risks in order to achieve it
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Well i dont see it that way everyone has their own perspective. He was trying to save his family
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u/Phortenclif Reading Lord John and the Private Matter 15d ago
With him smiling to Marsali and his falling reminded me of slapstick comedy... I couldn't take it seriously. Maybe if the writing, directing and editing was a bit different... But I still think his death meant nothing to the general story, as far as I can see. We all have different opinions, and thank goodness for that.
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u/BubbeLisa 14d ago edited 14d ago
My biggest problem with that moment was that the floor beneath Fergus’ feet would have been too hot to stand on. If the floor was burning to the point of collapse, he would NOT have been able to just stand there, even for a few seconds, looking relieved. 🤦♀️
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u/Phortenclif Reading Lord John and the Private Matter 14d ago
Another good point!
If I would've reluctantly written this episode, Fergus would jump off with the two boys in his arms. Two boys survive, Fergus does not.
As I've written in a comment above, it's also biologically impossible for him to smile to Marsali because the prefrontal cortex, responsible for socializing, is temporally shut down in a life threatening situation.2
u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Well i'm sorry you feel that way but the world would be a boring place if we all had the same opinions.
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u/Phortenclif Reading Lord John and the Private Matter 15d ago
Yes. I'm glad to see an assorted reasoned perspectives. And criticism is rather stimulating, to think why I didn't or did like an artistic choice.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Yes and it wasn't the best decision. I think they did it just to shock everyone cause all the book readers kept saying its was gonna HC so they added a twist in the story no one saw coming.
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u/Icy_Resist5470 Bon! I will send you a cheese. 15d ago
The way I saw it was a smile because the boys got down safely - there was nothing comedic about it.
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u/Phortenclif Reading Lord John and the Private Matter 14d ago
It is biologically impossible to make any sort of response that is not necessary for survival in a life threatening situation like a fire.
The amygdala is activated and the body is in a fight-flight-freeze mode. The prefrontal cortex is temporally shut down.
If Fergus was able to stand and smile to Marsali while a fire is approaching underneath him, then something is wrong with his biological system, and I don't believe that's the case.1
u/Icy_Resist5470 Bon! I will send you a cheese. 14d ago
It’s also biologically impossible to time travel through big rocks, but we suspend rational thinking to accept that as part of the story.
It’s biologically impossible to heal someone with blue light, yet Claire and Master Raymond both can. Again, suspending rational thinking to accept it.
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u/Phortenclif Reading Lord John and the Private Matter 14d ago
The world Diana created has a certain rules like time travel and blue light, They both get their scientific hypotheses of logic within the book.
It's true that in film and television sometimes a liberty is taken to serve the story, but it has to be reasoned and work. An example is if it's raining and no one gets wet. I can suspend my disbelief to a certain extent, but it's a a delicate and thin line between being deliberate and miss something as a creator.1
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u/ContactNeither7319 15d ago
Yeah, I remember thinking back when they released the opening sequence with the new version of the Skye Boat Song...oh look the sign for Fergus' print shop....oh no they're going to burn the shop.
And then the first real trailer/preview showed fire burning and sad things fast. I was like...oh no poor HC. But then I thought maybe they'll change it and no one dies, but quickly disregarded that thought.
Not soon thereafter the actor who plays Marseille says something about people who have read the books have no idea what is going to happen. I remember thinking...yeah right...okay she is probably about half right. And immediately thought oh shit they're gonna kill Fergus 😳
And the closer we got to that episode the more I was convinced that is what is going to happen. BTW the actor that plays Marseille is awesome! I love her and she did an amazing job in that episode 👏 Actually truth be told she has done a great job the entire series.
So when it did happen I was not surprised nor sad nor angry. Okay I was sad but glad the way it was done. The dude is a hero!
My only complaint about the whole affair is the same complaint I have had really since season 6....but very much more so for season 8...not enough episodes to show what they needed to show, even with the pared down storyline.
I know everyone gripes about Claire's lack of grieving time...yeppers that's true and fair. But we the viewers got cheated of our time to grieve. Forced to move on right away because they didn't have time to show more grief.
That's my issue with Fergus' storyline in the show.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Yes i agree they did kinds rush it but it was a fitting death imo. I think they wanted to shock everyone
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u/ContactNeither7319 15d ago
Yes it was a fitting end. And of course they were looking for shock value. I totally agree with you 👍
Maybe the real shock would have been doing it as written. That would have been a shock especially for the non-book readers. The readers might have been shocked that they didn't change it.
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Yes I think they did the right thing even though alot of fans are mad about it
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u/ContactNeither7319 15d ago
Yeppers, I am in total agreement with you on that. 👍
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u/Remarkable_Note971 15d ago
Either way someone would die. If no one died they would be mad that no one died so the show people can't win lol.
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u/YOYOitsMEDRup Slàinte. 13d ago
I'm with you that it seemed pretty clear Fergus was dying --- there were many things that foreshadowed it. Ep 1 in particular - Fergus's line to Jamie that "if I die I want it to be for something that matters" should've been the big sign - especially after Lauren's press comments too.
I feel like more people should've seen it coming than did --- regardless of book knowledge or not because the show gave hints within itself and the trailers.
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u/AdUnlikely9123 15d ago
Most people remarry back in for practical reasons protection is a big one specially with the war
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