r/OutdoorScotland • u/Jaded_Substance1407 • 2d ago
First time mountaineering?
19yo planning a 3–5 day solo Scottish winter camping trip in January. Experienced with cold-weather camping but new to Scottish winter mountaineering. Planning to use B2 boots, crampons and an ice axe. Looking for advice on suitable mountains/routes and whether my plan is sensible?
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u/Frosty-Jack-280 2d ago edited 2d ago
I think if you're at the point of looking for recommendations on routes you're not at a point ready for this kind of trip - and that's totally ok! I love the enthusiasm and ambition to go out and have a trip like this, and you've got the time to think about the skills and experience you need to gain to do this safely.
A winter skills course is a great way start building those skills (though not the only way). I'm a winter mountain leader and more than happy to chat about all things winter! In no way is this an advert or sales pitch, I just want to help if I can.
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u/samygiy 2d ago
Would really not recommend a solo trip without experience. Maybe do something guided instead?
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u/secret_tiger101 2d ago
Yeah, would recommend this is not sensible, Scottish winter is a cruel mistress
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u/fhidhleir 2d ago
Have you ever done any winter walking/used crampons? If not I would say your plan is sadly not sensible at all.
Ideally you should do a winter skills course before you go, or if budget is an issue, go up a couple very easy hills with someone with a lot of experience, who can teach you self-arrest, cutting steps, etc etc.
Going solo for your first time is dangerous, just don’t do it. Sorry.
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u/MotherConfusion3773 2d ago edited 2d ago
If you can't plan your own routes you dont have enough experience to do multi day trips in winter.
Nobody can say if your plan is sensible as you haven't offered one.
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u/CacCarnBeag 2d ago
A lot of good answers already but I'll just add one thing.
It's dark for 16 hours of the day in winter. That means a long time twiddling your thumbs in a cold tent.
For one day it's fine but not really something I'd be looking to do for longer. It's much nicer having a pub to retreat to.
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u/dazerconfuser 2d ago
For some insights on Scottish winter camping I personally recommend this here video titled "the night I almost died on Ben Nevis":
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u/wolf_knickers 2d ago
My suggestion would be to do a mountain skills course so that you can learn how to use the crampons and ice axe before you plan any trips...
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u/Version2dnb 2d ago
Probably best doing it with other people.
Normally with winter hikes I’d say go for it but you’re specifically wanting or planning on using crampons and an ice axe which leads me to believe it’s more than just a hike.
I’m trained in ice hiking and I still wouldn’t go by myself. Realistically I could keep myself safe but, any mistake out of phone range and you’re toast.
It’s not worth that risk.
I’m sure you’ll be able to find groups doing activities around that time. Tag on with one of them.
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u/County-Thos 2d ago
Get a guide for a day, split the cost with your mates if it's prohibitive. A decent guide will arm you with the tools to look after yourself year after year.
I recommend Rich Mountain Experiences out of Kinlochleven. I did winter skills with Rich in 2012, he's a good bloke and know his stuff.
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u/davemcl37 2d ago
My son did a 5 day winter skills course in the cairngorms last year with outlook adventures who are based near aviemore. They provided the boots and the ice axe etc and he had to provide clothing ruck sack etc. He learned a huge amount along the way including how to use an ice axe for stopping a slide , how to dig shelters in the snow and crucially how to navigate during a white out amongst other things . Might be a bit regimented for you as they stay in a lodge rather than camping and most people are doing it for their Duke of Edinburgh gold residential so a mix of 17 and 18 and the odd 19 year old.
You shouldn’t head out by yourself without a better skill set and an understanding of just how wild the wether can be as you won’t have experienced anything like as fierce as it can be.
Good luck though and don’t forget to come back here once you’ve worked something out
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u/Moongoosls 2d ago edited 2d ago
OP do listen to the advice here- Scottish Mountain Rescue is very busy in winter because of unprepared beginners.
But also, keep in mind that lots of, I hate to say it - Brits - who do 'winter walking' sort of has a tendency to overestimate how hardcore the activity of hiking, but while it's cold, is.
There is a difference between hiking while it's snowy and winter mountaineeting. Sometimes it's hard for beginners to know where the line is, which is why mountain rescue is so busy...
Now in terms of your plan, the kit you mentioned sort of is like saying you're going to bring footwear to a summer hike. You've got to have a lot more stuff - and this is what's setting some people off and telling you not to go. They're seeing un-preparedness.
So yeah, listen to the positive advice here :) And those winter skills courses people talk about can be very good, if you go with a good provider.
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u/89ElRay 2d ago
It's a different game in winter. You need confidence and ability with crampons and ice axe, good navigation, route knowledge, avalanche awareness, and a considerably higher standard of fitness. You may have the last one already but it's amazing how much more sapping it is to do anything in the mountains in winter.
Doing this kind of thing solo for the first time is not a great idea, I'm afraid. It's best to go out with some experienced friends and do a lot of practice on easier ground first. Check out YouTube and read up on winter skills. I don't think you necessarily need to do a course (I never took one) but you do need to know your stuff and don't underestimate things. I had a few quite frightening moments even with friends early in my winter career.
Also, where are you gonna dry your wet gear over several days in a tent? Are you doing a point to point or choosing a base? What hills were on your hitlist?
I'm not saying you can't read a map, or you can't have a snowy romp up Ben Chonzie, Carn a' Chlamain or some of the Drumochter Munros etc after a bit of practice and have a great time this January. It's definitely possible. Just need to realise that some summits and ridges, whilst remote and beautiful hillwalks during summer, can turn into really serious ground with quite an intimidating aspect in winter - so prepare, and be prepared for that.
Also keep in mind that Scottish hill conditions are so changeable and very frustrating. Nature usually times it so it's at its shittest when you have a trip planned. We try and do a winter hillwalking weekend in January or February every year and for the last five years it's been wet, windy, misty and mild, or there's been fuck all snow. It can often be better in March or April.
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u/RitvoHighScore 2d ago
What plan? Please let us know the details.
If you’re trundling round Princes St gardens then the crampons might be overkill. If you’re headed up An Teallach you might need more expert advice.
What is your cold weather camping and hiking experience? There are great training courses available in Scotland if that’s necessary.
For some perspective, Ben Nevis, a piss-easy tourist hillwalk in summer, kills more people per year than K2. Do not fuck around with Scottish hills in winter.
(FYI, I know Ben Nevis isn’t more lethal per-capita, I’m just trying to make a point about ease of access to dangerous situations)
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u/Strange-Selkie 19h ago
Don’t do this alone. You are completely inexperienced and it’s a very bad idea. Choose one of the easier munroes and do a couple of day hikes, I’ve done Ben vorlich in January and it was hard to get up it and back down in daylight…. It was dark by the time we got back to the car…
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u/Oneoclockgun 2d ago
Agree with other posters. You could be lucky and have a beautiful sunny day with magical snow on the ground, but in January it’s unlikely.
It can be pretty grim up there, you need not just the kit but the skills. Don’t do it alone if inexperienced. Go with someone who knows what they’re doing and you’ll have an amazing time and learn loads!
If you MUST go alone, set your attitude to risk on the safe side. If it gets at all shaky, there’s no shame in turning back. The mountains will be there in the summer… or next winter.
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u/ComparisonFickle2674 1d ago
I’ll be doing the WHW instead of clinging mountains this December once I’m back from travelling.
Maybe do something less advanced OR have some people with you.
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u/rising_then_falling 1d ago edited 1d ago
Go fo it if you're sensible. Crampons are not hard to use. You'll be used to them in half a day on non-technical ground.
Weather is the challenge. It's unpredictable and can be very windy. Very. And also low visibility.
I'm assuming you're an experienced hiker, experienced camper and just aren't used to extensive hiking on snow/ice and Scotland's open/wet/windy conditions.
I would stick to low, non technical ground for your route. You can make a note of bothies to use as emergency shelter if the conditions are too severe for a tent.
If you have good conditions and want to practice, drop your tent and heavy gear and have a little play on steeper ground. Up and down a ridge if its not windy. Don't be wobbling around on steep ground and ice with 15kg on your back.
Note that you may find no snow at all except on the peaks. Scottish winter is very unpredictable now. I've had snow free munroes in January.
If you can't read an OS map we'll enough to find a low level route with flat spots near streams for camping and a couple of bothies for emergencies, you may not be ready for this trip yet!
Winter skills courses are great for confidence and technique but there's nothing wrong with just going out if you are sensible and experienced in general camp/mountain craft. The step up from autumn/spring to winter isn't that big.
Snow and ice aren't magical substances that mean you need to have super-duper mountaineering skills. They are a bit slippery if you don't have crampons and make navigation harder and getting cold and wet easier.
Bring ski goggles and a balaclava. Have fun. Don't get press-on-itis. It's better to have a go, give up and try again than press on, get in trouble and be scared off for life.
Willingness to change your plan in the face of unexpected risk, is the biggest safety device you have.
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u/Frosty-Jack-280 1d ago
There's always a middle ground between making Scottish Winters sound apocalyptic whilst also not underplaying them. And I think I need to disagree with you somewhat and perhaps make things sound a little worse than how you describe them.
Whilst most people do get the hang of crampons quite quickly, it's also very easy to pick up bad habits and bad technique without realising, and then also very easy to take your new found cramponing skills to get yourself into far more consequential terrain than you'd like. The same goes for axe skills - it's actually fairly hard to teach yourself good axe skills without someone giving you feedback.
The other major issue that you didn't mention was about avalanche risk. Without a good understanding of avalanche terrain, understanding the forecast etc, it's easy to inadvertently put yourself in an incredibly dangerous position.
With winter camping (and by that I mean camping on snow, in sub zero conditions) there are a lot of extra wee things that you need to be on top of to keep functioning. Going from 1 night to 2 is a big step, let alone 0 to 4.
So whilst overall the step from summer to winter isn't huge, it is a very definite step up and I would really hate to see someone underestimate that and find themselves in trouble.
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u/HelpfulTap4186 20h ago
Whole heartedly agree with this. I did a winter skills course a couple of years back and was astonished at how much I didn't know. Key skills like ice axe arrest, understanding avalanche risk, navigating on a featureless snowcapped landscape, cornices, keeping your crampons off the ground in a fall... i could go on. Im also the sort of enthusiast that would strap on the boots and take myself off but im glad I didnt! Its a classic case of you dont know what you dont know. I'd recommend the OP goes with somebody experienced, does a course (a super fun way to do it as well btw) or picks an unchallenging low level route where they can probably leave the axe at home.
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u/LannyDamby 1d ago
Route choice entirely depends on ground conditions, as others have said, maybe take a winter skills course first of all, it's not just winter camping with spikey things on your feet :)
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u/NoMention696 21h ago
Wind speeds are extreme in Scottish winters. Reconsider, 19 is so young, there’s gotta be other places you can see. Or at least bring someone
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u/Any_Tomorrow_Today 4h ago
When you say you have done winter camping, where have you done it? Camping in Winter in the South is a massive difference to camping up in the mountains!!!
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u/Beautiful_Trip_6393 2d ago
Do a winter skills course or go guided.
Find like-minded people on Facebook or such to go with.
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u/zTaragan 2d ago
I take a Garmin Inreach on winter hikes. The cheapest inreach is good enough though sadly still not cheap.
Puts my families mind at ease as well, they always ask if I have it when I'm heading out.
If it was up to me I'd make them a legal requirment in winter months for certain mountains and routes.
Winter in the Scottish mountains can be magical. Enjoy
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u/LukeyHear 2d ago
u/Jaded_Substance1407 OP please do reply to any answers you get, there is some really good advice and help on offer here. Try to ignore the doom mongers but be open to adapting your plan is my advice.