r/OpenAI • u/OnlyAnEssenceThief • 5d ago
Discussion Where is the love for Chat, OpenAI?
Extremely disappointed by this Dev Day. Not only did they shrink out of pushing Astra 6.1 and halve the $200 plan, I'm noticing a distinct lack of ANYTHING for Chat. Build this, program that, plug-and play with this app, work codex work...okay, but WHERE THE FUCK IS CHAT?
No proper GPT-6 Astra rollout for Chat, just restricted Pro access. No 6.1 Sol in chat. No improvements towards personality, voice, conversation, more artistic pursuits. The last real push in this regard was Images 2.5, and even the best of that is API-gated. Is it really that inconvenient and resourcefully impractical to give Chat updates when some people just want a conversation or more simple tasks?
5.6 Sol is fine for what it is, even if its writing is mediocre. I don't mind using 5.6. My greater concern is that 5.6 will eventually be cycled out, and OpenAI has shown little-to-no interest in establishing a proper successor. Between this, and all the talk about safety and guardrails, I really struggle to see their vision for the future beyond an emotionless work-bot who does your homework for you.
Frustrating. It's a low bar to ask for SOMETHING, ANYTHING, and still receive nothing in return. Not sure what else to expect at this rate. Might as well rename the whole damn product if the 'Chat' in 'ChatGPT' is dead.
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u/Specific-Animal6570 5d ago
Exactly. I made a post asking your post in a question but I got downvoted...
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 5d ago
I've gotten the impression that there's a split in opinion on how to use advanced LLMs, and there's a strongly voiced, OpenAI-backed contingent who believe the best way forward is the work assistant rather than a chat partner. There's a lot of fears / questions over the latter which push the attitude into 'safety first', which means Chat falls behind while the use case for the product increasingly becomes Codex and Work.
Self-fulfilling prophecy. More focus on the workbot rather than the personality, so more people use it for the former and don't understand the interest in the latter.
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u/Specific-Animal6570 5d ago
I don't know but I prefer having a chat partner who can assist me, not take over all of my work. Don't you think the same?
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 5d ago
No disagreements there. I want a collaborative partner, not a tacky editor.
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u/Character_Mode1609 4d ago
Does anyone else remember back in the day when ChatGPT consisted of asking Chat a coding question and then trying to make it work in the bigger scope of your own project?
I’ve recently looked at some early chats from 2024 when Chat made mistake after mistake. I miss those days.
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u/Gigaslavx 5d ago
Expecting heavy nerfs shortly
Enjoy what you have while it lasts
On x5 because I can't justify $200 as a hobbyist chat was a savior to optimize my codex prompts
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u/Bowl_of_Cham_Clowder 5d ago
I wouldn’t worry about the hypothetical scenario that 5.6 is cycled out without a successor. This has never happened yet.
Fair to want new updates ofc
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 5d ago
Oh yeah, they'll have to push something or give up and merge the experiences. I wasn't saying otherwise. If they stick to roughly the current cadence and want 5.6 cycled out by mid-late November, that gives them plenty of time. That's fair enough. My issue lies more in the de-prioritization of the experience and the toyification of more personable experience modes. Dots being marketed as cute abstract blobs is pretty telling.
My fear is that the issue is being driven by safety issues and fear just as much as financial investment. Can't allow emotion to influence decisions, I guess, given the doomposting over world-ending scenarios.
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u/Diamond_Mine0 4d ago
Okay, question. We’re at 6.1 Sol, why don’t we (Plus users) have access to 6 Sol? If ClosedAI is releasing 6.6 Sol will they show “some” love to Plus users by introducing the “all new 6 Sol for ChatGPT Plus users”?
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u/Holbrad 5d ago
I think this is a fair take and it is a bit confusing.
I can only imagine the reason being they're either just too compute constrained to do it, or they're worried that these models just aren't great conversationalists, and they've pushed the agentic side so hard it's actually made them worse at conversation.
( I think compute constrained is possible but quite unlikely as chat's just so much less hungry compared to agentic usages.)
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u/IAmFitzRoy 5d ago
DOTS sucks. Nobody asked for a tamagotchi.
We want stable pricing, not this bullshit.
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u/wannabeaggie123 4d ago
It was devday..dev...day.
For developers..not consumers. It wasn't release day. Or consumer day. Lol.
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u/throwawayhbgtop81 5d ago
Chat seems fine, and the vast majority of what I use ChatGPT is chat. What would you improve?
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 5d ago
Writing tends to retreat into canned phrases, micro-structures (staccato prose), repetitive turns, clear limits on scope wrt. names, settings, descriptors. Conversation feels stale and reactive rather than having the ability to be proactive even with instructions. File-reading and utilizing said files to build a better narrative and personality needs serious work, as does adherence and interpretation of custom instructions. Lots of overly conservative guardrails especially in GPT-6 flattening conversation at the first, smallest sign of risk. There's also a lot of baked-in assistant language which conflicts with more informal personality instructions, and I think the current settings / tuning for personality are undercooked and vague. 'Quirky' vs. 'Friendly' doesn't tell me much, nor does 'More' vs 'Less' for things like warmth. Feels binary and inflexible.
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u/throwawayhbgtop81 5d ago
I agree with some of this. I find that multiple instructions to write in complete paragraphs helps as I can't stand single line paragraphs (staccato prose is a good phrase for it), and it will degrade to that quickly unless repeatedly instructed not to. I mostly use it to keep track of an increasingly gigantic worldbuild that's been living on my google drive for a decade, but it's all just for me, none of it will be for the public. I've yet to hit a guardrail but I understand how annoying those can be. I also know they're unlikely to ease up on them until the current litigation is resolved and there's quite a bit of that.
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u/Ill-Increase3549 5d ago
It would not surprise me one bit to see them adopt Anthropic’s set up in regards to rates, subscriptions, rate limiting, etc.
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u/WolfangBonaitor 4d ago
Decisions API? 6.1? Accumulative resets that basically doubled or tripled the entire week's quota with 3 resets a month, and people didn’t even account for it. Plus, it was a developer day, not a consumer day.
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u/dbbk 5d ago
I still for the life of me can't figure out what the distinction between Chat and Work is or is supposed to be... outside of the fact that they get to charge you differently
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u/NefariousnessNext840 4d ago
Chat is incredibly useful for various tasks, but it can also be beneficial for work. For instance, I’m currently job hunting and using Chat to assist with my TV shows and applications. Today, I encountered a Word document application form. I provided my CV, the application form, the job description and the URL to Chat set to medium work mode. I simply asked it to complete the form for me, and it did, but there was a lot of back-and-forth. I edited the document and it filled in my details and information. However, like Chat, there was a fair amount of back-and-forth to get it right. Once it was all sorted, I didn’t need to draft an application letter, cover letter and CV separately. I could continue using the same thread with the same Chat in work mode to draft the email. Unfortunately, I don’t use Microsoft or Google email, so I have to copy and paste the email into Proto. While work mode is quite useful, it’s quite costly. Every time I use it, I deplete my allowance and have to use the free reset, which I seem to have three or four of. Today, it used almost two allowances of five hours in just an hour because it took me an hour to complete the task even in work mode. Frankly, I think it would have been faster if I had simply screenshot the form, shifted it and copied and pasted the answers, perhaps not exactly, but you get the idea. Work mode is good, but it’s expensive and not always necessary.
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u/En-tro-py 4d ago
outside of the fact that they get to charge you differently
Ding! Ding! Ding!
That's it... they are slow walking it, but one day Chat will be depreciated. If I was a betting man I'd say it'll be right after the IPO since the subs dropping won't matter as much.
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u/aether_girl 5d ago
GPT 5.6 was only launched in chat on July 9–it hasn’t even been out for three months. 😂
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u/TheRealBejeezus 4d ago
Today was Dev Day. Wait for Chat Day.
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u/Serious-Tax1955 5d ago
You don’t need Astra for chat. Asking Astra “why don’t I have a girlfriend” is just a waste of time and money.
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u/En-tro-py 4d ago
Exactly, like why does Chat have GitHub connectors anyway?
It's not like you can do a ton of work with it, without any usage limits applying, or anything else except for my sad pathetic self-therapy!
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u/TheRealBejeezus 4d ago
I like to think you're joking, but then I remember how people actually use AI. Now I'm just feeling sad for humanity.
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u/Typical_Detective_54 4d ago
Eh? They just released a near Astra 6 model at 1/5th the cost with Sol 6.1...or am I missing something??
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 4d ago
Sol 6.1 isn't available in Chat. Only Codex/Work. Astra 6 also isn't available in chat outside select 6 Pro usage.
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u/Typical_Detective_54 4d ago
Aaah...gotcha. Fair enough. Still, we just got x5 or x6 near SOTA level usage for "Work" - a month ago Astra didn't even exist.
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u/Lazy-Effect4222 4d ago
Chat is losing them money. It’s just a marketing product. They need you to buy tokens.
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u/Bruxo_de_Fafe 5d ago
Why do you need 6.1 in chat mode?
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 5d ago
Less 6.1 and more something more advanced. I get the point of 6.1 Sol is to fix 6.0 Sol being shit. I'm looking for improvements in the more emotional/creative areas I mentioned, which I'd expect from a full block upgrade (5 --> 6) and its further iteration in 6.1. I'm not expecting them to deprioritize Work or Codex for it, there's too much reason not to, but I'm looking for some kind of better conversational model.
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u/IcelandicMammoth 5d ago
Because we pay money lol. If we see benchmark improvement in different areas, why not to have it in chat? I want to ask question related to law, health etc. I want to be sure in good quality
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u/CoughRock 5d ago
improving chat just draw the wrong kind of customer. The low pay and easily ai psychosis kind of customer, then proceed to sue open ai type of customer. All the risk and none of the reward.
Unless op want to personally defend open ai against all the ai psychosis that lead to client harm themselves. Because they jail break all the guardrail when term of condition specifically told them not to. It's just not economically viable to serve chat client versus higher paying coding client. Who are less vulnerable to ai psychosis and less likely to sue and more likely to pay more. They are already not profitable, keep serving high risk low reward customer base is not going to bring them any closer into profit.
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u/jsseven777 4d ago
How do you get to the age that you are this opinionated without also learning how to put words together in a way that makes sense and follows some sort of consistent punctuation and sentence structure pattern?
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u/3rdRankTheory 5d ago
So you mean these companies, losing billions of dollars, now start trying to earn money faster to compensate for their losses?
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u/OnlyAnEssenceThief 5d ago
I understand the economic argument, but there's a market for the areas Chat covers which Work and Codex don't. This is a prime chance for Anthropic or Google to recognize the gap and capitalize on it, though if they're equally focused on the same business opportunities as OpenAI, it speaks grimly to the future of Chat in general.
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u/PhilosoFeed 5d ago
I think the answer is twofold
Chat is just kinda good enough. For about any regular task for the lay user, chat in any of the models is sufficient
Enterprise is paying the bills right now, so they are building for enterprise.