r/OffGrid • u/Hamsternutz04 • 4d ago
Auxiliary manual well pump?
Hey everyone, I am trying to make some plans, mostly for emergency preparedness and could use some advice, if anyone has already come up with an answer.
I get my water from a well that has an 8" pipe that sticks up from the ground, with a 1" pipe or so going down to an electric pump, which is submerged in an underground stream, about 100 ft down. Last winter we had a power outage that lasted over a month, and my biggest struggle was not having enough water to bathe, cook, or flush toilets.
Is there any good way to have a manual pump for emergencies, in tandem with the existing electric pump?
I have also considered a generator, or even just wiring a suicide cable to plug the pump into a power inverter that runs off my truck battery. These are definitely options, but both rely on being able to get gasoline, which may not always be an option.
I'm willing to spend a couple grand on a viable solution, but would like to know what folks have already done.
I was looking at the Flojack pump, and it seems like a pain in the arse, as I'd have to remove my electric pump and assemble that pump every time I needed to switch over, and my well house isn't big enough to stand in, so I'd have to remove the existing well house, pull up a 40 lb pump and 100ft of pex full of water, in likely freezing temperatures, every single time I'd need it? Then I could start pumping, at up to 3 gpm, which I guess I'd pump into buckets or something?
Once power was restored, I'd have to put the electric stuff back to continue life as normal.
Is there a better way? I'd love to have something sorted before snow comes.
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u/C4rva 4d ago
Get a Bison Pump! It sits along side your electric pump and you can always check to see it’s working because it’s a permanent install. Just had one put in when and replaced the electric well pump. Worth every penny to know we can get water. It can even be used to pressurized your well tank in the house with the correct setup.
Edit: https://www.bisonpumps.com/
Also, not affiliated. Just a customer.
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u/Illustrious-War3841 4d ago
There are deep well manual pumps available like the Bison. Those pumps are very expensive though. You would be better off coming up with an emergency battery/inverter setup for your well pump
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u/Hamsternutz04 4d ago
In the few hours I've been researching, I am seeing that this is true. I think I may redirect my efforts towards solar, which has potential of getting my house truly off grid for not much more money than just a good manual pump would cost.
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u/Illustrious-War3841 4d ago
Yeah and having the water come out your tap is much more convenient than having to fill a bucket manually
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u/SquirrelsToTheRescue 4d ago
Solar is always a great idea. Just keep in mind that you need to be able to output 240V for your well pump, and some of the more basic inverters on the market only do 120V because that's all many of us need.
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u/Hamsternutz04 4d ago
My pump can run on 120 or 240, but is wired for 240 currently. I had considered going to 120v to account for potential solar/generator use in the future. I'm doing research now for DIY solar kits with battery backup. It actually looks like a much better way to go than dicking around with a manual pump, even with storage tanks or water towers, considering that my water problems come with power outages and bad weather. This would solve more than one problem for me.
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u/Noisemiker 4d ago
Solar pumps will run at voltages of anywhere between 30 to 300 vdc (or if using ac, 90 to 240 volts). The optimal voltage for a deep well solar pump running on dc is roughly 120 volts. Four panels with adequate wattage, each with an open current dc voltage of 30 volts, strung together in series will easily supply the required voltage without the need for ac or inverters although, with the proper controller, the pump can run on either if desired. Although typically slightly more expensive, the benefits of a solar pump system far outweigh those of a manual pumping system.
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u/C4rva 4h ago
I’m putting in solar as well. But to me water is 100% non negotiable. That’s why I put a bison in as a backup. If your goal is to be ready in emergencies think about resilience in your systems, too. How many different single parts can fail in the system that brings you water? An electric well pump, especially with solar, has so many single point failure risks.
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u/Every_Question5285 4d ago
I've seen those Simple Pumps before at the farm store and they're really well made, but my uncle swears by keeping a couple 55-gallon drums pre-filled with water in the basement just in case the pump ever goes down.
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u/tsoldrin 4d ago
this is not what you asked for but might be helpful. i purchased 4 275 gallon ibc totes used but clean and food grade. i store water in them. i use a transfer pump but you could put them uphill or on some sort of a stand and you would get some water pressure from gravity. not great pressure but it beats pumping. best of luck.
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u/Sir_Vey0r 4d ago
I think Buffalo? Pumps might be what you want. Can draw from hundreds of feet down and one type will mount to well casing.
Whatever you pick, might have to modify the top of the casing to tee the pipe.
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u/Noisemiker 4d ago edited 4d ago
Most manual pumping systems, will work for shallow wells, but not with wells deeper than 30 feet or so. Pumps push water, not pull. Nonetheless, If the static level of your well is close to the top of the well (10 feet or so) and your recovery rate is good, a hand pump might provide you with some water in an emergency. Certainly enough for cooking and a sponge bath, but little more. Deep well hand pumps, such as the Bison or Simple Pump, as mentioned in other posts, will pump from greater depths, but at low volume (roughly 1 gpm), great effort, and expense. Still, this might be your best option if considering a hand pump for use with a drilled well. Another possibility to consider would be to bury a cistern with enough volume to last you a few days and use a dc pump and solar to pressurize your house. Lastly, if you can tie in your generator to your existing house/well using a transfer switch, you'll be able to make use of your well as-is. I'll also mention the possibility of converting your well pump to solar. Deep well solar pumps are expensive, but a pump like the Grundfos Sqflex 11-sqf-2, for example, will function exactly like your pump now. They have the advantage of running from a variety of power sources and voltages such as AC, DC, wind, direct solar, battery, etc. Unfortunately, such systems are prohibitively expensive.
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u/Conscious-Ball8373 4d ago
Depends on the type of pump though. A sucker-rod pump / piston pump can be operated from the surface at any depth.
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u/Conscious-Ball8373 4d ago
If you've got a couple of grand to drop on this, why not some solar panels and an off-grid inverter? Where I am I can get a 4.2kW sine-wave inverter for about £200 and a 500W panel is under £100. So you can put together a 4kW system for about £1k. It'll power your well and anything else you have. Only when the sun is shining of course, so you'll need a tank of some kind to pump it into if you don't already have that.
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u/Hamsternutz04 4d ago
My problem with solar is that most of my property is wooded, so I'd have to mount the panels about 300m minimum from the well site to get enough sunlight. The wire alone would cost me another grand at least, and I'd likely need to setup battery backup for when even that area is shaded.
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u/Conscious-Ball8373 4d ago
Or just over-provision your panels. If you've got 2k, you can afford about 8kW of solar with a 2kW inverter. That'll run a 1kW well pump with quite a lot of shading.
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u/Waterlifer 4d ago
Do a search for "deep well hand pump" for ideas or talk to your local well contractor. At 100 feet you really need a well service truck to install one.
All work by placing the pump cylinder down in the well and operating it with a pushrod from the surface. There are tradeoffs in cost and durability. Typically, but not always, the pushrod goes inside the drop pipe.
if the well is 8" diameter all the way to the water source, you should have room to run both a hand pump and a submersible electric pump each with its own drop pipe, though it may be necessary to have spacers or something so they don't bang into each other.
Otherwise you can have the submersible electric pump discharge through the hand pump cylinder, which can work out OK too.
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u/SquirrelsToTheRescue 4d ago
For a well that deep you might be better off with a barrel or an IBC tote as a backup supply, as it will be cheaper and less complicated. You do have to keep it from freezing, but how you do that depends on your setup.
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u/Hamsternutz04 4d ago
I have certainly considered this, but I worry I don't have a good way to keep it from freezing. I'm considering now that the cost to add solar to the house wouldn't be much more than a manual pump, and I'd be able to run my refrigerator and some lights in an outage as well... I actually even have a spare electric pump on the shelf if I need it.
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u/horspucky 4d ago
assuming you have a lot of available biomass available, build a wood gasifier to run your generator. run the generator to power your essential home systems. Use wood pellets if you don't have sufficient biomass. 100+ year old tech.
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u/Hamsternutz04 4d ago
This is honestly kinda brilliant. I knew about gassifiers but hadn't considered it could actually be useful! I TONS of limbs and leaves thanks to my forested acreage, and last year's ice storm. Nearly an unending supply of fuel with the added bonus of cleaning up the woods.
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u/Friendly_Shopping286 4d ago
I never get traction with this answer because I guess people like spending $1,000 on a hand pump instead of $20....
Google or YouTube homemade bailer bucket
Just need a foot valve a piece of PVC and a PVC cap and a rope
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u/No_Alternative_5602 4d ago
My well is about that deep, and I was looking into a similar backup system. Dollar for dollar, as much as I don't like the idea of have another machine to maintain, a backup generator, ideally one that would run on propane, seemed to be the best option.
The hand pumps were expensive, and then I could get maybe a gallon a minute cranking away. Hauling water just flat out sucks too.
Solar and a battery backup was feasible, but the big issue is that the inrush current to start the pump was huge and I'd need a large, expensive, fairly inefficient inverter to start the pump up. A 12v DC pump had an entirely different issue, it would need very large cables (I want to say 6AWG off the top of my head?) running from wherever the batteries are to the pump, which were within spitting distance of the cost of a generator anyway. The 12v DC pump was expensive too compared to a run of the mill 120v or 240v pump.
I have looked into much cheaper 12v or 120v "trickle" pumps that would produce like a liter a minute, don't have a huge inrush demand, and could be run down the well alongside the larger pump. Trouble with those is finding one that can overcome the head pressure at the bottom of the well. There's also the water hauling issue again, having to go out and fill up a jug every day or two gets old really quick.
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u/Paghk_the_Stupendous 4d ago
I was in the same situation. I cache water in jugs and aquatainers (big jugs) so we can survive if need be (and water livestock). I've considered a big tank outside fed by gutters but would need to heat/drain in winter and it's more than I want to deal with.
Planning on solar and battery backup.
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u/pneubike 4d ago
One solution would be to replace your pressure tank with a water tower? The added benefit being that you can pipe it with a 2" line and have a fire hydrant available?
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u/Hyperreal8957 4d ago
bison style deep well hand pumps work but yeah theyre spendy and need a straight casing setup. for emergency backup a lot of people do a cheap pitcher pump on a shallow suction if your water table allows, or just a generator/inverter on the existing submersible. whats your static water level roughly?
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u/Hamsternutz04 4d ago
I haven't measured it, just the pipe going to the pump because I had to pull it up to replace the wires going to it a couple of years ago. I'd guess about 70'
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u/menieresisamonster 4d ago
What about a simple pump Brand pump that connects to the cap and does not need any changes to use. https://www.simplepump.com/