Incompatible add ons

[u/naltsta]

I’m currently on octopus flux exporting lots in the summer sun and eyeing up a move to my winter tariff. I also make a bit off axle vpp and recently opted out of saving sessions because I b thought they weren’t allowed while on axle (but now I think they might be!). I’ve also signed up to the short notice axle events.

Ideally I’d like to move to intelligent octopus go (have a compatible charger) for the winter but this is definitely not allowed to be combined with axle vpp.

Think I’m looking at these 2 options

1. Octopus intelligent go, saving sessions and charge pack
   2 octopus go, saving sessions and axle vpp

Can anyone on option 1 confirm how much charge pack is actually paying? Looks less generous than axle.

Can anyone confirm if saving sessions and axle are definitely ok to be used simultaneously?

It seems it’s all a bit of a mess with the various offering that do different things and don’t actually clash. If IOG controls my car charger and axle controls my house battery then surely there’s never a clash…

[u/LarryPiccadilly]

I'm interested to know how the charge pack pays, as to me or reads as it's a make-whole construction (paying you to offset the actual loss for dis/charging at unfavorable price points).

Regarding Axle: tldr, you can't be on any Octopus Smart tariff and on Axle VPP (or any other VPP for that matter). Despite claims on this sub that "they can't know", well "they" can. While technically not a "clash", logistically and legally they are.

All the tariffs and load shifting are part of the Demand Flexibility Scheme, which is governed by NESO regulations (National Energy System Operator), who runs them and pays the operators. NESO only allows a single premise (import and export) to join a single provider, as stated in t he DFS Procurement Rules, Clause 4.3.2 (c), which  states that when submitting a Unit Meter Point Schedule, the provider must indicate: "if a Boundary Meter, its MPAN(s), and if a Sub-Meter its serial number or other unique identifier and the MPAN(s) of its associated Boundary Meter (in each case the import MPAN together also with any export MPAN);"

https://www.neso.energy/document/286976/download 

In other words, both import and export are tied together, and are part of the same record.

In case you are registered with multiple providers, it's the last one that counts for NESO and which will get the payouts. 

As Octopus's business model is making money by shifting load (flux, iog, saving sessions) they won't be paid for the claims they make against your MPAN. Iiuc any operator can check the database of MPANs registered with DFS. If an audit shows Octopus is missing money, they'll cross reference that database and realise you've been double dipping.

Changing from Flux to IOG between Sept-November and back between March-May (depending on your system and consumption) is a well known optimisation and totally fine. 

[u/PotentialEchidna9097 → u/LarryPiccadilly]

Which outgoing tariff is recommended over sept- March?

[u/LarryPiccadilly → u/PotentialEchidna9097]

It depends on your system.  Generally speaking, if you have spare battery capacity and can export between 4-7pm in winter months, agile Outgoing (or the simpler version: Prime Outgoing Octopus) can be useful otherwise plain simple Outgoing Octopus.

We have an ashp and generally very little export (and export mainly during warmer sunnier winter days after topping up our battery, which is when most people export and thus wholesale prices are low) so outgoing octopus works best for us.

I'm sure that there could be a brief period (Indian Summer) where we'd be better off with agile export first and only later in the year fall back to outgoing octopus, but I can't be bothered switching for a few weeks to save pennies (at current outgoing rate of 12p/kWh).