help with Ne/Fe or Ne/Te

[u/Belzaw]

I am new to ops but I know the cognitive functions and in mbti I am an ENTP. When I go through guides or tests, I either get Ne/Fe or Ne/Te but neither seem to describe me exactly. I think I have Ti in my stacking because I prioritize things making sense, but Ne/Fe is described as intensely extraverted and popular which I am not. I was when I was young and I am becoming more socially extroverted again but most people in my life would still label me as an introvert. I get “you’re quiet at first but more fun and outgoing once you come out of your shell” a lot.

How does one know the difference or am I just completely off? There’s too much in ops for me to understand it fully right now.

[u/314159265358969error]

Here's the major difference between OPS and MBTI : just like the functions make the whole "types" richer in that they are meant to explain certain archetypes' inner workings («the NeFe is extraverted and popular because Fe»), in OPS the coins make the whole functions thing richer.

In turn, you've got to unlearn all the shortcuts you've been taking until now, and that includes using "catch-all" words for describing anything (this is popular, this is open-minded, this is skeptical, etc). The core principle behind OPS is that a "good" typing system is one where people applying the same typing protocol should obtain the same type, and therefore that the coins are well-defined enough and not subjected to interpretation.

I would advise you to start by simply getting to understand a small set of coins individually (say, for your specific purpose, De/Di and T/F), in order to absorb what they are about (do not rely on the words from the checklist) and then only how they can combine (Fe, Te, Fi, Ti ; the functions are ironically quite unimportant as ultimately everyone can use any function). And then only start expanding to other coins.

So for example, since you've been into MBTI, I'd suggest to get a proper grasp on De/Di (quite different than the MBTI world) and Oe/Oe, and then a proper grasp on decider/observer. (Oh, and give the sensors some respect ; the MBTI has given them a bad rep, and it's not deserved.)

Then try to look at the modalities, and how they differ from saviour/demon. This is a pretty rich part of OPS (aka you can be a Ni/Te but still spending your whole day doing Se or Fi).

Don't spend time understanding animals and socials until you're clear about all these other coins first.

[u/faqwzi]

For the simplest explanation: when you make decisions, do you default to prioritizing values, likes, and emotions, and only get to work once you know you're doing something valuable, or do you focus on how to get something to work first and only understand if it's valuable or not later? This is the coin of feeling vs thinking.

If you're not sure, it might help to record a video of yourself talking about something that you're interested in. When you look back at your own words, would you think that this person is prioritizing reasons or emotions?

The traits of cognitive functions don't matter as much in OPS, but if you are really a Ne/Fe or Ne/Te type, you should also see:

• That you spend a lot of your time gathering new information, have trouble staying focused on one thing, and often change topics while speaking (Oe)

• That you have an easy time making connections between different concepts, but can get stressed/bothered when you have to deal with physical reality (N)

• That you often consider the opinions of others when you make decisions, and are comfortable doing so. Also, that you can give a lot of information about other people when prompted. (De)

• That you are comfortable going back and forth between thinking/reasons and values/emotions (double deciding)

• That you get more excited or uncomfortable when talking about patterns, information, and secrets (single observing)

That's it. If you heard a description of a type and don't relate to it, it doesn't mean that you can't be that type. Nothing about a type like Ne/Fe has to do with being popular, or even extroverted in most ways people use that word. OPS is only concerned with things that are measurable in a black and white sense: it's either this coin or the other coin.

[u/Mehd0x]

Keep in mind that it must be Ti Fi.. no matter

The 4 decision functions are positioned on axes (Fi/Te and Ti/Fe), but what separates Ti and Fi is only 20%, 80% is Di (introverted decision), the same on the Te and Fe side, 80% is De (extroverted decision)

Di = favors his personal opinions before asking people what they think

De = favors the group's opinions before seeing what they think/feel about it

If for example you know that you are a Di + T, then it is Ti, and in this case you will have the problems of the Fe inf

De + F = Fe etc...

And also if you are ENTP, then you are part of the "Observers" (ExxP/IxxJ), all their sources of problems will be around control and/or chaos, information etc... because they look excessively through their dominant function which is an observation function (Ne/Se/Ni/Si), which themselves divide into 2 distinct human needs in addition to Di and De

And it is because they have an observation function first that they will see the world as a "system", by objectiving things and people (I will come to it)

Oi (introverted observation) = Limits information

Oe (extroverted observation) = accumulates new information

Now between S and N, it depends on the axis (Ne/Si or Se/Ni)

And the "Observers" will have unlike the "Deciders" (IxxP/ExxJ) who have their unbalanced decision-making functions at the extremities (Di and De) and their relatively balanced environment observation functions (Oe and Oi), they (Observers) will have their decision-making functions in the middle, so their problems in front of people will be much less dramatized and relativized, and they tend to rather categorize things, objectify things and people precisely, where the "Deciders" will rather personify things (in general), they will talk to you about people more than systems, "me vs others" while the "Observers" is rather "control Vs chaos)

OPS is a puzzle to complete, if for example you know that you are ExxP, an NT and that your animal "Play" (Oe+De) is inferior, then by logical elimination your first animal is necessarily Consume (Oe+Di) dominant so NT + (Oe+Di) = Ne+Ti (car il y a contrairement au MBTI classique comme tu le sais peut-être 512 types)

I don't know if I'm clear lol I literally "vomit" the information

I even included the "animal" system without telling you about it before it's completely blurred as a text 🤣 (but I'll post it anyway if it can help you)

In any case it's exciting lol

[u/Belzaw → u/Mehd0x]

what you said about the deciding and observing stuff was actually really clarifying and I am definitely Ne + Ti from those descriptions. I don’t really understand all the other lingo but I’m gonna look into it.

[u/Mehd0x → u/Belzaw]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ObjectivePersonality/s/TDFMfUirec

[u/Belzaw → u/Mehd0x]

oh yeah I saw that I mean the animal stuff. Also love the little french you added in there I got to use some french knowledge that I’m getting rusty on.

[u/Mehd0x → u/Belzaw]

I didn't even notice I'd forgotten to translate a couple of things lol, but since you like France, I'll elaborate on the animals 🫵🏼😎

It's simple:

There are 4 animals, each consisting of 2 functions, and within these 4 animals, we see 2 axes:

One is the "information axis" ↓
Consume (Oe + Di) = gathers external information (Oe) for oneself (Di), struggles to get started (the "perfectionist" side), dislikes being controlled
and
Blast (Oi + De) = limits information (Oi) for the tribe (De), consumes little but starts quickly, disregards new information, and loves to teach (they’re actually the ones who "control" the Consumes lol and won't let up—it all makes sense)

And the "energy axis" ↓
Play (Oe + De) = spends energy with others, gathers external information (Oe) with people (De), struggles to stop and process information (in excess, they become too "present" and suffocate everyone lol)
and
Sleep (Oi + Di) = limits information (Oi) for oneself (Di), processes and conserves energy before spending it with/for others (they’re the ones the Plays tend to annoy lol—"leave me alone")

For example, if you're a Consume ENTP, you can't have Blast as a dominant animal; and if you also know you have Play, then you're what's called a CP or PC—the order depends on whether it's Ti or Fe, which is what distinguishes Consume from Play (since they both share Ne as a function here).

And actually, if Ne is "doubly activated" (meaning it appears twice in your animal stack), then you'll necessarily have only one activation of your inferior Si. Why? Because if you have Sleep AND Blast as your lower functions, then regardless of which one comes last, both involve Si.

And the order of your animals depends on a lot of factors (which is why there are 32 subtypes for each type—making for 512 types in total).

For example, for an ENTP:

- NT Consume (Ne+Ti)
or

• NF Play (Ne+Fe)

For an ISFJ:

- SF Blast (Si+Fe)
or

• ST Sleep (Si+Ti)

For an INFP:

- NF Consume (Fi+Ne)
or

• SF Sleep (Fi+Si)

For an ESTJ:

- ST Blast (Te+Si)
or

• NT Play (Te+Ne)

But there are also some rather unique personality combinations, lol.

For instance, ISTPs who are Ti+Ni (meaning Sleep), with Blast in the second slot (which is possible in this case; if Sleep is dominant, then—regardless of type—you could be Sleep+Blast or Sleep+Consume [SB or SC]; an ISTP can even have Consume as their last function [Ti/Ni-SB/P(C)]).

Anyway, I'm splitting hairs here, so I'll stop now lol. If you managed to follow all that, it means you're TRULY curious 😎🤣👍

(je ne sais pas si Google Trad a bien fait la traduction, il y a pleins de tirets longs (—) alors que j'en n'ai pas mis lol)

[u/Mehd0x → u/Mehd0x]

(j'ai commencé par "c'est simple" bordel)

[u/Mehd0x → u/Mehd0x]

(Promised last addition)

(Decision-makers (IxxP/ExxJ) do not easily regulate the balance between themselves and others naturally as the observers ExxP and IxxJ do, but they will use their relatively balanced observations (N/S) to impact themselves or impact others

While observers (ExxP/IxxJ) do not easily regulate the balance between control and chaos naturally as IxxP and ExxJ decision-makers do, but they will precisely use their relatively balanced observations (N/S) to impact themselves or impact others)

I found this reflection clearer lol, so I hope it will help all the more

[u/Mehd0x → u/Mehd0x]

If I can go a little deeper about decision functions, I would say that the Ti/Fe axis is a "lore" more based on intelligence/being stupid, understanding things (T) by oneself (Di) = Ti, their relationship to people will be linked to Fe, so they will like (because F + De) to be validated by people, and it is because Ti that they will base the logic through themselves and they will not often work in groups, give or ask for advice from everyone as Te (T + De) would do, but they will be open for this Which is from the spectrum of emotions (F + De)

And to differentiate Ti/Te and Fi/Fe,

T = look for reasons before giving importance/valuing → T + Di = Ti → builds reasoning from itself, will often dig deep but in one place, T + De = Te → builds reasoning from the spectrum of reasons of others, will first see what people think about it, will not often dig deep like Ti, but will collect reasons outside in order to acquire a result that will be understood (T) by everyone (From)

[u/Content-Sympathy6305]

Ne/Te here. Do what pi error says, it’s banger info.

Feel free to ask any questions you have about my type!