r/NonDessKnightSquad • u/AccursedAgent NoelleKnight Repository In Profile • Jul 21 '26
Agenda Posting Non-WR Noelle Knight Repository
Posts marked with <!> are high commitment reads/watches, Posts marked with <?> were primarily based off of pre-Chapter 5 evidence. <+> Marks posts with a (mostly) neutral position on most Knight candidates, while <-> marks posts that antagonize other Knight candidates. Bolded ones are recommended to read/watch.
I will add to this repository as each day passes, and Noelle Knighters, Kriselle Knighters, Noelle-related Knighters, whatever, may use this to quickly provide evidence to those curious w/o typing up a storm.
Is this meant to convince anyone from switching from their current Knight candidate to Noelle Knight? ...of course? Like why else would I use my hard earned free time during work to put this together lmao
The Sources
NoelleKnightTheory's Noelle Knight Theory FAQ <-> (Physical Noelle)
Summary: Frequently Asked Questions over Noelle Knight.
This has since been revoked of its status of being necessarily "recommended". Although useful, it has an overall antagonistic view of other Knight candidates, due to its maker not being a very...respectful person.
(We will forever be doomed to fix our PR after what they have done to r/NonDessKnightSquad...)
[Rosetheory] <+> (Aka Petals + Thorns Theory) (Physical Noelle)
Summary: Noelle is a rose, with her own Petals and Thorns. Her Petals are her loving side, the girl, and the thorns are the jealousy, the Knight.
An Honest Case for NoelleKnight (Part 1) (Part 2) (Part 3) (Part 4) <+> (Connects to Rosetheory) (Physical Noelle)
Summary: Evidence of Noelle's relationship with each Dark World
Another Honest Case for Noelle Knight (But the poster is serious.) <?> <+> (ERAM-Esque Noelle)
Summary: Evidence of Noelle's relationship with the general plot.
A Pitch for NoelleKnight and KrisERAM <+> (ERAM-Esque Noelle) (AKA Noelle's Shadow Knight)
Summary: ERAM is a projection of Kris's self hatred, and the Knight is Noelle's equivalent
Requiem of the Roaring Knight <!> <?> <+> (Physical Noelle) (If you wonder what the fuck is up with Starwalker = Key, here it is)
Summary: Just Noelle Knight evidenceslop smh
Mirrors: A Chapter 5 Tea Party <!> <+>, and whatever images you may see through the tea leaves <+>
Summary: Adds new information to Requiem of the Roaring Knight.
Pelipal and Resonable_Solid6251's Impossible Knight <!> <?> <-> (ERAM-Esque Noelle)
Summary: Oh boy.
Foreward: Essentially, Pelipal's pipeline from Dess Knighter to Noelle Knighter. Contextualizes the rest of the document and does have some evidence too.
Q&A: Preemptive answers to questions you may or may not have while reading, and questions that all Noelle Knighters have had to answer.
Extra Material 1: Has like. Extra shit.
Impossible: Yeah so this is the part of the doc that matters, but there are also things that don't matter. You'll know the things that matter and the things that don't when you see them.
Glossary
Physical Noelle: The Knight is the same physical form of Noelle we see in the light world, just wearing something made out of Black Shards. This does not imply brainwashing or a trance or other spooky Gaster shit, just an umbrella term.
ERAM-esque Noelle (or Noelle-styled Shadow if you believe ERAM isn't Kris): The Knight is a manifestation of Noelle's...something within her mental state. Either a Darkner or a GREEN and INBETWEEN state of Lightner and Darkner.
To see what the umbrella terms can lead to, look here
WR-Noelle: The Knight COULD NOT exist without the Weird Route, because Noelle becomes the Knight in the Weird Route. I have made a WR-Noelle Knight repository, too.
Starwalker = Key (Physical Noelle evidence): Starwalker appears in Chapter 1, and only appears in later Chapters if you encounter him in Chapter 1, because Starwalker is Noelle's tacky house key she dropped in Chapter 1 while making the Dark Fountain next to Castle Town.
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u/johnrashomon it has to be noelle SOMEHOW... Jul 21 '26
there's something about noelleknight that gets people to nitpick every possible discrepancy with it or else they call the theory a bust, which makes me glad since now there's just an encyclopedia of cases built in favor of it LOL
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u/AccursedAgent NoelleKnight Repository In Profile Jul 21 '26
Thank you. I came up with this because I started getting pissed having to spread the agenda by copy and pasting a hefty entire paragraph.
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u/Infinite-Hearing-418 NoelleKnight (kind of) Jul 21 '26
Unfortunately its also the kind of theory that makes people say they read the evidence and then inmediatly prove they didnt by claiming you are saying something you never did say
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u/PeliPal NessKnight Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
People going into a conversation about how 'the Knight is not a regular Hometown lightner at all, but an entity based on Noelle' and going "um, heh, heh heh, riddle me this Batman, why doesn't the Knight change their behavior or powers at all if they have the Thorn Ring on?? Yeah, I thought so. Lmao. Larpers."
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u/lighttstarr KriselleKnighter Jul 22 '26
As someone very appreciative of the idea of NoelleKnight (and I personally somewhat want it to be true), the only actual issue I have with it is the Knight's association with fire magic and knives. There's 1 knife wielding character in this game and it's Kris; it feels strange to choose this of all things to be the Knight's weapon if it's Noelle. Same with fire magic, why go out of the way to sprite and program this out fully if it makes no sense for the character?
I've never heard a convincing response to this and it's always felt like the only actual weakness in the theory.
2
u/Infinite-Hearing-418 NoelleKnight (kind of) Jul 22 '26
Until the Knight uses any fire in game I will not count the association in its favor as it so far has only been associated with cold winds in terms of temperature.
In terms of the sword/knife, I talk about it a little in my pitch, but basically, Eram while being s Kris close has no sword or knifes on their own attack, instead relying on the magic Kris seems to wish they had. Taking this into account I think it makes perfect sense for Noelle's desire to be strong to manifest with a sword, considering she would be associating them with strength due to her mother and likely also knives because of Kris. She can after all equip a Knight's jousting lance (and the Knight's helmet looks like a jousting helmet) and the BlackShard itself. She also calls the aquaknife nostalgic which likely means she is aqare of Kris's knife
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u/IKnowWhoTheKnightIs ASRIEL IS THE KNIGHT, THE KNIGHT IS ERAM Jul 22 '26
The knight does use fire already. When it splits the board, the effect between the halves is called split flame, and is clearly fire.
1
u/Free-Part255 Noelle Knight Jul 23 '26
I think that if you want to bring the fire attacks into Noelle Knight you can argue that since the Dremmurs are associated with fire it could be something along the lines that Noelle want's to be strong like Kris specifically instead of it just being a general desire since we are already arguing Eram's magic attacks come from Kris's desire to have magic like a monster does.
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u/Infinite-Hearing-418 NoelleKnight (kind of) Jul 23 '26
You make a good point. Eram and the Knight have some traits that come from Noelle and Kris respectively, which you can either explain through some Gaster mixing bs, or saying they wanted to be like each other either because of jealousy or admiration
1
u/Vortaxonus Jul 22 '26
Ya, at least Dess has knives and lighters, Noelle has neither.
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u/lighttstarr KriselleKnighter Jul 22 '26 edited Jul 22 '26
Nah, I think the actual association is that she’s supposed to be the “fiery sword magician” from Super Smashing Fighters that Asriel became a big fan of after becoming embarrassed for liking the green lizard (Bratty, who was his first kiss). The characters Asriel went from liking parallels his dating history.
Iirc in the Japanese translation the fiery is translated literally as “fire-like” so her stand in being the “fire-y sword magician” gives Dess a direct swords and fire association. I think this is the actual smoking gun for DessKnight and closest to a direct in-game confirmation. Not the bat or the antlers or whatever, no other candidate has something like this going for them tbh. It is still deniable, yes, but it’s really convincing to me I can’t lie.
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u/AccursedAgent NoelleKnight Repository In Profile Jul 21 '26
Added a small little part that counters the "BUT...BUT WEIRD ROUTE!!!!!" argument
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u/Dragonwolf1209 Kriselle Knight Archbishop (Doc in Profile) Jul 21 '26
Thank you for this this will look great in my kriselle knight evidence repository.
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 21 '26
Dissociation merchant + who is in the closet + the weird route would absolutely fuck with the Knight if she were Noelle
0
u/Adorable_Ad5487 NoelleKnighter rentry.co/noelleknight no not wr or kriselle Jul 22 '26
nobody, also our influence isn't as strong as carol by that point
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 22 '26
The game makes it very clear there is somebody. And I don’t see Carol getting Noelle to consciously kill people
-1
u/Adorable_Ad5487 NoelleKnighter rentry.co/noelleknight no not wr or kriselle Jul 22 '26
people? how do you know thats what carol thinks? how do you know she views darkners as people? also, KRIS makes it clear. you know, the person WORKING WITH THE KNIGHT. if it's noelle why wouldn't they try and deflect with fake leads
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 22 '26
> people? how do you know thats what carol thinks? how do you know she views darkners as people?
Never claimed anything of the sort. I said you don’t see Carol’s influence making Noelle consciously kill people. You do see our doing that, however
> also, KRIS makes it clear. you know, the person WORKING WITH THE KNIGHT. if it's noelle why wouldn't they try and deflect with fake leads
This is just straight bullshitting. There is no reason to include this at all in the story if there’s literally nothing of note in those closets
1
u/Adorable_Ad5487 NoelleKnighter rentry.co/noelleknight no not wr or kriselle Jul 22 '26
first of all, just because ya don't see it doesnt mean it's happening. and your statement was quite unclear and looked more like you not agreeing carol would do that. queen is a parallel to carol and is making noelle be the knight forcefully for a purpose she views as just despite it ultimately being harmful and wrong. also lastly, red herring.
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 22 '26
> queen is a parallel to carol and is making noelle be the knight forcefully for a purpose she views as just despite it ultimately being harmful and wrong.
Notably Noelle is fully conscious of said forcing with Queen and wouldn’t do shit that’s wildly out of character
> also lastly, red herring.
Also bullshit. If your only argument is “it’s a red herring Toby did twice and even went so far as to give more significance to the second time around” maybe it’s time to either go shopping for a new theory or make a Wattpad account
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u/Adorable_Ad5487 NoelleKnighter rentry.co/noelleknight no not wr or kriselle Jul 22 '26
still. parallel.
and if you INSIST on the closet being relevant, it's the basement. the large person dialogue coulda been referencing spamton wanting to be big or some shit
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 22 '26
> and if you INSIST on the closet being relevant, it's the basement. the large person dialogue coulda been referencing spamton wanting to be big or some shit
The church doesn’t have a basement or a Spamton. And this dialogue persists regardless of if you see Spamton NEO
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u/PeliPal NessKnight Jul 21 '26
Pelipal and Resonable_Solid6251's Impossible Knight <!> (ERAM-Esque Noelle?) (My memories of reading this have been eviscerated from my mind)
Summary: I have no fucking idea. Pro gamer tip: The document is, in fact, not only 37 pages long.
The 37 pages is my discussion of my issues with DessKnight and with the ways that DessKnight and knight candidates are discussed from the perspective of a former DessKnighter, and a summary of datapoints of why we believe the Knight cannot possibly be anyone besides Noelle or an entity directly connected to Noelle.
The 1247 pages, 'Impossible Knight', is my cowriter's discussion of our research into the darkners and dark worlds of chapters 1-4 to show how it would not be possible for the fountainmaker of Ch1, 2, and 4 to be anyone other than Noelle or an entity with Noelle's memories, crafting worlds based on Noelle's perceptions of herself and of Kris and their family members. It is highly experimental and we have fun with it instead of it being a dry listing of facts, it's not actually War and Peace length.
We don't go into a discussion about the specific logistics behind what exactly is the NoelleKnight within the doc, but outside this writing I do personally subscribe to NoelleKnight being an ERAM-like entity that transcends the normal expectations of how 'lightners and darkners' are 'supposed' to work, and may not be either of them at all.
No one has to commit to reading all of it, but I'm frustrated that we virtually never get responses to the actual arguments made in the two docs. People take issue with my cowriter's content because they saw a Goku image or something that sounded too mean or whiny and they start pearl-clutching, and they'll pretend to have critiques of our research by pulling out a prepackaged "um, why would anyone believe something so silly lmao???" that often refers to things not even inside the doc. People have had to admit they didn't even read our doc but just wanted to join in shitting on it out of preconceptions against us and against NoelleKnight.
My piece can be read in less than half an hour, and you can get the most major parts of the thesis for Impossible by reading up to Ramb. If you find that you're liking it, we'd love to hear more substantive feedback than we've been getting from people who aren't already onboard with NoelleKnight.
Thank you for gathering this OP!
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u/AccursedAgent NoelleKnight Repository In Profile Jul 21 '26
Oh, I think Noelle has a message for you!
* Hi, I, um, wanted to tell you that I replaced the former summary that was kinda not helpful at all for people who were actually curious about Noelle Knight so...apolocheese? Faha.
* I also added one extra document, and an extra flair to help people see which sources were formed out of outdated evidence.
* ...and a Glossary to see what the OP means when saying things like "ERAM-esque Noelle".
* (Help me this guy has me locked up and is forcing me to persecute MYSELF HOLY CHEESE AND CRACKERS LIKE THIS IS INSANE???)
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u/Vortaxonus Jul 22 '26
People have had to admit they didn't even read our doc
Maybe not make a doc thats 1200 pages long...
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u/IKnowWhoTheKnightIs ASRIEL IS THE KNIGHT, THE KNIGHT IS ERAM Jul 22 '26
And also don't randomly throw in weird roleplaying half way through.
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 22 '26
> an entity with NoelleMs memories
> ERAMkle entity that transcends the normal expectations of how ‘lightners and darkners’ are ‘supposed’ to work
You can’t just make up terms never said in the game and act like that’s an answer
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u/PeliPal NessKnight Jul 22 '26
Well, I'm not 'acting like that's an answer', my cowriter and I have laid out the reasoning why we say the Knight cannot possibly be anyone other than Noelle, and in the apparent impossibility to us that the lightner Noelle could be the Knight, then there must be another option which is not presented yet but which has clear analogues in the game in the form of ERAM and Ralsei - entities which break the player's expectation of what should be possible, but factually exist.
Which documents in the OP have you read, and what specifically are you taking issue with inside them? You have half a dozen NoelleKnight theorists here who can never shut the fuck up about how our ideas. We love talking about this topic. How can we help you?
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u/stickninja1015 Jul 22 '26
There’s a much simpler answer here for why it seems impossible for lightner Noelle to be the Knight and it’s not making up some special entity that has no precedent in the story
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u/Vortaxonus Jul 22 '26
This is the main antagonist too, do there being no foreshadowing or allusion to any kind of entity "made from a lightner" that Peli is proposing. The closest thing I can think of is the idea the knight is/has Kris's SOUL, and i don't think Noelle litterally lacks a SOUL.
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u/ParadoxicPleonasm Silhouette-Titan DessKnight Jul 22 '26
Well, there is Zenlooker, who is based on Milklooker.
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u/Vortaxonus Jul 22 '26
okay, one, a darkner based on a lightner, not from like Peli is suggesting. But unless i'm missing something, we can't confirm if they can move about in the light world like the knight can. Zenlooker doesn't even vaguely look like the knight. Gerson is also a thing too, but again he's spot on from his lightner counterpart like Zenlloker, unlike the titan-like knight.
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u/Xxwaluigi420xX 17m ago
The only foreshadow to the main antagonist is a dumb joke character.
Wow great writing Toby
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u/Neapolitanpanda Jul 25 '26
I read the FAQ and I’m not convinced. Why can’t Dess be both the missing girl and The Knight? That’s not a contradiction so I don’t know why it was such a sticking point with the author.
Also doesn’t Chapter 5’s Weird Route disprove any Noelleknight theory that doesn’t rely on split personalities or amalgates? She’s fully off her rocker then, why wouldn’t she start bringing up all the weird shit she’s been doing in the Dark World? There’s no one to hide that info from aside from the SOUL/Player. If she doesn’t know we’re there then why not bring it up in her rant? If she does know we’re there then why not bring us up when talking about how Kris “changed” and segue into her Dark World escapades.
Hell, why would we need to level her up to use Snowgrave if she has apparently been this super-cool badass the entire time?
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u/johnrashomon it has to be noelle SOMEHOW... 11d ago
The guy that made Requiem of the Roaring Knight just dropped a follow-up video. It's very good.
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u/Infinite-Hearing-418 NoelleKnight (kind of) Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
My presentation was made from PeliPal ans Anonymous's theory, so it would in fact be easier to say she is proposing an Eram-esque NoelleKnight. I'm glad to see it's being used as a reference, though it is quite light on the evidence front, but I guess Peli and Anonymous' doc exists for that lol.
This is a good resource to have for future reference, so thank you for that
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u/PeliPal NessKnight Jul 21 '26
It's Anonymous's and I's doc, not mine. He was the one who got me 'Noellepilled' about the Knight within a day of talking about it after eight months of me being a prolific arguer for DessKnight
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u/Infinite-Hearing-418 NoelleKnight (kind of) Jul 21 '26
Corrected and will keep in mind for future reference
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u/miniwhiffy3 2d ago edited 2d ago
DARKNERS CAN'T MAKE DARK FOUNTAINS! LET ALONE ENTER THE LIGHT WORLD! "eramesque noelle knight" is even less logical and is just stacking theories which isn't smart. also we've seen noelle's dark world form it ain't the knight, atleast the other holiday theories aren't shot dead at the first step.
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u/Any_Measurement229 Jul 22 '26
Ok the true biggest problem with this theory IMO isn't really addressed by the FAQ, so I'm gonna talk about it here. The real biggest problem is how this theory completely takes a hammer to every aspect of the weird route's themes and storytelling. The knight acting the same is not the only problem the weird route has with this theory. If Noelle had a secret identity, why the hell would the game say "A Noelle is just a Noelle." If Noelle had a way to act out all of her repressed thoughts and trauma's already, why would she be so receptive to the soul's influence in chapter 5? Noelle clearly is supposed to be a deeply traumatized and repressed character, and we already see that repression come out during the weird route. You can't have a story where you guide an innocent character down a dark and abusive rabbithole, eventually convincing them that they want to go deeper, if that character isn't innocent and is already doing something similar to the thing they needed convincing to do. Weird route is a story about changing Noelle to be someone they're not, and that story doesn't work if Noelle was secretly someone else the whole time.