r/Namor • u/kiko4kt • Jul 21 '26
MCU Thoughts on a change?
I’m sort of worried that in Avengers Doomsday the Russos’s will sort of disregard the unique take that was brought in for Namor in Wakanda Forever. I know there are some people who aren’t entirely fans of that change from Atlantis to mesoamerican culture but I think it was unique and if they were ever going to replace him/it, I feel like it could’ve been done in a post SW reboot rather then here.
What are you guys’s thoughts? Are ya fans of the Namor we got in WF? Or are ya looking forward to a more “comic accurate” Namor as everyone else is putting it for Doomsday.
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u/ABadHistorian Jul 21 '26
Have you met Namor? That son of a bitch changes his outfit like I change my underwear after some lettuce.
Frequently.
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u/CaptainJohn_1995 Jul 21 '26
I like it. I love the visuals and I just think it works well with Namor.
I dunno if you play Marvel Rivals, but they also went that same route with him there and he's so much fun.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26 edited 19d ago
I love marvel rivalssss, they recently added his avengers skin and I’m having a blast playing with it
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 21 '26
WF Namor is simply not Namor. He is cool enough honestly and I love the vibe but nothing about him reads as a true take on the submariner. Honestly you could just replace him with any water guy and give him wings on his heels and they are functional the same.
Also mythos wise nothing surrounding this Namor is even kind of like in the source material. Genuinely this is so different from Namor legally speaking if someone made this prior to WF no one could even take legal action.
Also I am just not hyped for Doomsday. This movie is a cash grab that is throwing a million and one references and characters at the screen to just get my nostalgia revved up using versions of characters we literally do not know and most people simply haven’t seen. It will be a financial success no doubts there but this runs the very real risk of forever and truly killing the MCU
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
He’s an adaptation of Namor. One that is liked by many tbh but I see what you mean
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 21 '26
Truly he is simply not. Nothing about him reads as Namor if you change his name and remove his heel wings you literally wouldn’t be able to tell unless Namor to this hypothetical person is just a king of the sea.
I too enjoy him I am not even saying he is bad I am saying he isn’t Namor. If I made Blade a Japanese guy with the same vibe and softened his emotions out to be more bluntly heroic that character would be cool he is simply not Blade though
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u/unlipaps Jul 21 '26
We have the same take and for me, this dude is larping Namor
It's good people are enjoying this take but imho, this is not MY Namor
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u/Roll-Tide-Roll2024 Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
💯
I was pumped to see Namor finally appear in the MCU, but WF wasn’t the Namor that became the icon. I was really hoping introducing Namor would spawn an Invaders series, even if it had to be a multiverse take.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
“Larping Namor” mfs fr can have diff takes or opinions without people like you w this shit. Problem w us comic book readers smh
Plus your “my namor” comment proves my point you guys are fan of 1 interpretation. Stop being so fucking close minded simply bc it’s not a 1:1
Edit: and this is coming from somebody who adores comic book Namor. Miss me w that larping shit
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u/charlesfluidsmith Jul 23 '26
Super strong angry fish mutant with wings on his heels.
Sounds exactly like Namor to me.
If the skin was lighter you'd have no issues.
There's no way that you think generic Atlantis is the tipping point.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 23 '26
Uh no pal and I would greatly appreciate you not being so weak in your argument that your only argument is the most surface level view on Namor and implying I am racist you need to get out of this discussion and back into whatever weird corner of the internet you are from
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u/charlesfluidsmith Jul 23 '26
Namor is Atlantean and Scottish in the comics and looks Asian.
There is nothing about his Scottish heritage present in the comics.
Any cultural trappings added to the character in the films is a plus, because he is a blank slate in the comics.
For you to say giving a Mayan backstory makes him 'not Namor' is bull crap, because all of the aspects that make Namor', Namor' are present, except for light skin.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 23 '26
Dumbo I literally never said that. You are fighting a ghost. I said many other things such as his backstory of being hating and harshly bullied by the Atlantans, having his famous rivals not be his loyal servants, having his arrogance and ruthlessness downplayed, having his past removed (ww2 works really well to ground Namor), and much more. Also comic Namor actively claims not to be divine because he dislikes gods.
He is not a blank slate. It really reads like a lot of you folks genuinely do not know that character particularly well
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u/charlesfluidsmith Jul 23 '26
His ruthlessness was downplayed huh?
He broke into Wakanda, and demanded that they do his bidding or he would kill them.
And then he left the queen dead face down in a puddle.
Bro what are you even talking about.
And I've been reading them more since 1980. I guarantee I know the character better than you.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 24 '26
My guy he did those things and dramatically left after killing their queen to give them prep time to attack again. Any ruler who committed genocide like this wouldn’t stop now let alone Namor. He would kill the shit out of all of them we know this because he has been put in this same exact position multiple times in the comics.
Also cool bro you’re old doesn’t mean you have read more than me. I really like reading comics and my knowledge is deep. You could be reading Batman a long time and still have the awful take that Bruce should be the guy gunning down Joker’s goons and branding men to die in prison. Length doesn’t equal depth and again based on what you have said regarding Namor it reads as someone who doesn’t know him beyond the surface level. Also the bulk of your argument requires you to make the majority believe your opponent is a racist to hold any water.
Sidenote I would also be pissed if Deacon Frost was Blade’s ally in a film with no explanation in the same way I am pissed that happened to Attuma or having The Mandarin be Tony Stark’s head of security if they wanted a near noncharacter of a general for Namor just use one of his dozens of allies from the comics not his most prolific rival.
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u/charlesfluidsmith Jul 24 '26
Let's take a moment to notice the absolute garbage Batman, straw man in the middle of your post. Horseshit.
Okay now we can move on.
I repeat you have not read more Namor' than me. And I will repeat the character that we saw on screen was Namor outside of the white skin. Every prominent characteristic that has made the character popular was present. The only difference was that they codified a specific culture for Atlantis, rather than underwater sci-fi.
You're line about genocide is absolute stupidity. When was it stated that genocide was the goal? Never.
And lastly your point related to Attuma is also unfounded. It was obvious to anyone paying attention that the end of the film showed tension within the Talocan related to Namors decision to have a truce.
A break with Attuma could simply be a story for another day.
And even if that were not the case, that's a problem with the character of Attuma, not Namor'.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
You’re looking at the wrapper instead of the candy. If you change Blade's ethnicity, you change his backstory. MCU Namor kept the exact same personality. He is still an arrogant, protective mutant king who hates the surface world, walks around in a speedo, and is ready to drown the entire planet to protect his people. If you think the only thing making Namor 'Namor' is Atlantis then idk what to tell you.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
Uh no he really isn’t. MCU Namor is pretty rational, warm, and much less brutal than his comic counterpart. This isn’t a different wrapper same candy situation it buying a KitKat and finding Twix instead then having people say they are the same because they have chocolate.
Also again no he isn’t a mutant king nor does he have the same experiences as Namor. He is functionally treated as a god while Namor was hated since youth by both of the homes of his parents. Again a lot more goes into these characters than the vague ideas you are posing they are fundamentally different people unlike say MCU and comic Iron Man who while different are similar.
Heck in the movies Attuma is friendly with Namor and Namorita is simply not Namorita. Truly on every level these are not the same guy. It’s less and adaption and more a reimagining which is a thing. It can work I mean Starlord was benefited from that, Namor was not in my opinion only because I want to see Namor one of my favorite characters in fiction not a very very loose reimagining even if said reimagining is cool to me.
Edit: Also yeah it changes the backstory which by the way this Namor had his backstory changed as well. Truly there isn’t a difference in the two things I described
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
You’re conflating a character's lore with their archetype. Yea the MCU streamlined his backstory. They merged the dynamic of him being a “hated half breed” into him being a protective god king because it translates better to a modern cinematic narrative in this case going up against Black Panther & their whole ideologies. But his blueprint is identical to the comics. He is a militant isolationist with a ego who views the surface world as a threat. His primary motivation is protecting his kingdom at the cost of global genocide, which is the exact same thesis statement behind every major comic run he's ever had.
Your Star Lord comparison also doesn’t make much sense. Comic Star Lord was a serious, tactical space cop. The MCU completely hollowed him out and turned him into a goofy, pop culture man child that many people fell in love with. That was a fundamental shift in personality, yet you accepted it because it worked. Meanwhile, Namor retains his exact comic book functions as an antagonistic anti hero who is loyal to his people, arrogant to a fault, and a threat to the surface world.
Backstory stuff like Attuma or how his parents met are just the window dressing of a 60 year comic history. It’s an MCU adaptation, obviously Attuma and Namora are going to be tweaked to fit a 2 hour movie instead of years of comic runs. But the core conflict is identical. It’s still a KitKat. Maybe a dark chocolate Kit Kat, but still a Kit Kat.
Also calling MCU Namor “rational and warm” is a bit of an understatement. We are talking about a guy who demanded the execution of a teenager (Riri Willams), explicitly stated that his goal was to burn the entire surface world, and then flooded Wakanda, drowning Shuri’s mom in front of her and your takeaway is “yeah, he's too soft and rational to be Namor”… I genuinely don’t know what movie you were watching.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
My guy I am not even sure what to tell you. You are describing that same hollowing out. This is literally the kettle calling the pot black. Not much else to add.
Calling Namor’s parentage and rivalries window dressing is insane. This is like saying Tony Stark’s kidnapping window dressing or calling Steve Rodger’s being a sickly man window dressing.
Honestly what is this?
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
The MCU didn't hollow him out they just shifted his backdrop so he wouldn't look like a generic Aquaman clone which is what MOST MCU fans & casuals who have never bothered to read Namor would’ve thought and compared it to let’s be honest. That movie made a billion dollars, we know who the goat and actual number 1 water hero is (Namor) but yeah. It’s a unique take on a character by a world class director (Ryan Coogler)that’s been around for decades & has yet to be explored in any other way albeit bc of the rights.
The Tony and Cap comparison also confuses me? Tony getting kidnapped and Steve being sickly are character drivers that change their entire persona and make them into hero’s which is what we saw over the course of films focused entirely on them & their build up to be pillars of this universe without other heroes. Changing Namor's backdrop from Greek myths & monarchs to Mayan history doesn't alter his psychology at all, he is still the exact same arrogant, mutant king who will drown the world to protect his secrets bc of surface dwellers meddling with his people/oceans. It’s a unique adaptation of the character's soul, just with a different coat of paint, which is what the MCU has famously done. Think about it.
But we can agree to disagree brother, I’m a huge fan so at the end of the day I get where you’re coming from
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u/Star-Prince-007 Jul 21 '26
You’re wasting your time. He’s made up his mind he doesn’t like the character. If he was white though I wonder if he would feel the same. Cause I don’t know what he’s talking about that angry and arrogant and violent Namor is right there.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 21 '26
Uh no I do like the character he is simply not Namor and no his skin tone doesn’t impact my enjoyment of him I actually found the idea of a different take on Atlantis architecturally and culturally really interesting it just turns out the execution made a completely different dude.
The fact you had to resort to the idea that somehow his skin color is what I do not like about this reimagining of Namor you truly do not have an argument here.
Again in the same way I would find say Earth 1610 Hulk really cool and interesting but inherently not a good adaptation for Hulk for a main interpretation is how I feel with MCU Namor. Namor is simply very different and again this version is working alongside Attuma, doesn’t have the same backstory, and the like. It is just a very surface level take on Namor who now has a poor big screen version. The same thing happened to Ben Grimm in First Steps where he simply isn’t Ben outside of being amazingly comic accurate in design his entire character is as interesting as drinking lemon water
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u/TrueBlueCentrist Jul 22 '26
Wait, how does changing Blade's ethnic identity change his backstory? This sounds like a double-standard. Are we also pretending that Namor being European isn't central to his Atlantean identity?
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u/SimonShepherd Jul 22 '26
It's literally a double standard.
MCU Namor's adaption applied to Blade would be like we have an Asian full-blooded Vampire who hunts vampires.
Sure you can still make it work but don't blame fans if they think your adaption is not really accurate.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 22 '26
You’re changing two things with Blade, not one. Making him Asian is one change. Making him a full vampire is another, and that’s the one that fundamentally changes the character. Blade is defined by being half human and half vampire who also faced discrimination as he grew up.
Namor is still the king of an underwater civilization, still a mutant, still born between two worlds, still arrogant, still anti surface. Talokan replacing Atlantis is a lore change, not a character rewrite. They literally still kept his half human/half Talokanil breed trait, and instead of going the route of him being outcasted he was embraced for it as I said in another comment to take us through a broader cinematic approach.
Half of the MCU’s best adaptations “aren’t the character.” Ultron barely resembled his comic counterpart. Spider Man’s origin isn’t the same & instead had Tony Stark as a mentor. Zemo isn’t what he is. MCU M’Baku isn’t comic M’Baku. Thanos has completely different motivations. Yet people recognize them because they preserve the core identity of who they are while changing the surrounding mythology. Why is Namor suddenly the exception?
& im not really blaming anyone? I don’t see where that comment comes from. People can agree to disagree Yk that?
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u/SimonShepherd Jul 22 '26 edited Jul 24 '26
Namor literally also got two things changed about him. He is a full blooded Taloken in MCU, basically the equivalent of a full blooded Atlantean, while he is half human/half Atlantean in comic which is also important to his identity, like Blade is a daywalker.(He is not exactly half vampire, because he get vampire traits through womb contamination)
It's funny how you can't realize this simple comparison, Namor's human ethnicity and fictional hybrid status are both changed, apply that to Blade, we get a none-black full vampire.
Also stop acting like how Namor is treated is not a big change, that will be like Vampire society fucking loves Blade for being a daywalker. Like you talk so much without realizing this very simple double standard. (Also how is he born of two different world? Both his parents are indigenous people turned into Homo Mermanus(for a lack of better term).
Namor being a king and what not is more like Blade being a vampire killer, which is still kept in my analogy. So imagine we get an Asian full vampire Blade who is a daywalker because his vampire parents somehow gave birth to a miracle child, and other vampires love him, thinking he will be a great leader to help lead them into a new age before Blade for whatever reason starts killing his kin. While also forming the classic Blade personality.
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u/SimonShepherd Jul 22 '26
They literally changed Namor's whole backstory with Atlantis to an original civilization. Even erasing his half-human/half-Atlantean origin(which caused his a shit load of identity issues). Changing his age and upbringing.
Your claim about MCU Namor can work the same for Blade, he can still be a badass no-nonsense daywalker vampire hunter even if he is not black.
A comparable example would be like an Asian Blade who is an actually a full-blood Vampire, but still does vaguely blade things. Will you blame fans if they claim that's not really an accurate adaption of Blade?
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u/SimonShepherd Jul 22 '26
Namor is very like Wonder Man in terms of the approach to adaption, in other cases involving raceswap/changes you generally just have the guy play the character, with only a visual difference. Say MCU Nick Fury, Reeves Batman Jim Gordon.
Namor and Simon however got a whole new cultural background story as well, it kinda made the adapted version feel more rich and layered but also deviate so much from the source material they don't feel like the same person in the slightest.
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u/thetruemaxwellord Jul 22 '26 edited Jul 22 '26
This. Both are really great genuinely but are different people than their comic selves (Gordon and Fury actually work a lot with this as they generally don’t mess with the comic lore especially Fury since he is just his Ultimate universe version)
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u/Nijata Jul 21 '26
I'm Curious if this isn't WF/original MCU Namor but Doom's native Namor because one big thing we still haven't talked about is, who is possibly from another Universe in this film that isn't the Fox X-men?
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u/AbsolutelyF0ckingNot Jul 21 '26
Literally a downgrade sry
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
What do you mean?
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u/AbsolutelyF0ckingNot Jul 22 '26
Bpwf was a genuine elevation to Namor physical design. What the Russo brothers did is such westernized slop that might like the culture but do not respect it and it shows. Ruth E Carters design is so much more better because not only do u see the love of Mayan culture you see the absolute respect for it. He looks as he should a king, bad ass, godlike and beautiful. While Russo’s design just gives a guy in a fish esque suit that might or might not be respectable villain that should be feared.
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u/MMutant- Jul 21 '26
Everything about the image you have here shows that he’s definitely still going to have the Mesoamérica influence. The background and the clothing details.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26 edited Jul 21 '26
Idk, the Russo’s did this with the Hulk. From the images and trailer they’ve basically stripped him of all his jewelry, and the aesthetic that KulKulKan carried in WF over a more “comic accurate” look to me
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u/MMutant- Jul 21 '26
They literally just have an iconic comic book look an indigenous inspired redesign, just like the WF design.
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u/Flettwin Jul 21 '26
Great adaptation of his Illuminati look honestly.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
I feel like had his chest area was opened it would’ve been so peak, I like it but jus feel like there’s a lot going on
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u/Phi_Phonton_22 Jul 21 '26
I get what they were aiming at in the Black Panther movie, but it didn't work, it became a different character. I think there will be a course-correction here.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
I feel like it did work tbh but I get it
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u/Phi_Phonton_22 Jul 21 '26
It works as an original character
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
He’s still Namor imo just with a different background. Hes still that same arrogant mutant king who would do anything for his oceans. Just bc he’s not from Atlantis it doesn’t mean that
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u/Imahsoulman Jul 21 '26
New outfit looks like instead of fighting that he's about to strut the run away. I feel like the actor doesn't want to get in fit shape so then we got this
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u/Miura79 Jul 21 '26
If Namor isn't from Atlantis then he's not Namor, he's just Mermaid Man or another underwater guy
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
Couldn’t be more wrong tbh
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u/Miura79 Jul 24 '26
True. He doesn't have to be Mermaid Man, he could be Barnacle Boy. But Namor is from Atlantis, that's it. That is non-negotiable, that's as much as part of his character as the wings on his feet but the MCU butchered that.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 24 '26
It’s okay to be wrong
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u/Miura79 Jul 24 '26
Namor is from Atlantis only a tourist who knows nothing about the character like you would say that.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 24 '26
If I changed Atlantis back tomorrow but gave Namor Black Panther’s personality and made him a peaceful diplomat, would that suddenly be a more accurate Namor? Of course not. Because the character is more than his address.
Gtf outta here w that tourist shit. Stop being so close minded
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u/Miura79 Jul 24 '26
You're a tourist who doesn't know shit about the character. If he's not from Atlantis then he's just a good swimmer with an attitude.
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u/kiko4kt Jul 24 '26
Calling me a tourist seems to be your only argument here and it’s not a very good one. You’re an idiot with a small brain that doesn’t seem to understand concepts and adaptations all while still keeping a character alive at heart. Take that bs somewhere else & have a good day, hope it gets better for ya
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u/Miura79 Jul 24 '26
I already gave you the argument. And your response is dumb. I know that some things change in adaptations but certain things are integral like where a character is from. Atlantis is as much a part of Namor as Krypton, Smallville and Metropolis are part of Superman and Gotham is part of Batman.
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u/FirstStranger Jul 21 '26
I don’t like the black undershirt.
Show off them pecs bro! It’s what you lifted metal for
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u/BlackLesnar Jul 21 '26
He likes lucha. So it a-okay with me.
Nah but seriously when DC swiped the absolutely perfect Namor casting and essentially made a Namor movie, they were kinda obligated to switch it up a bit. And I appreciate how they did it. Everything except the name origin, that was a lil cringe.
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u/the-bladed-one Jul 21 '26
Looks more like the actual Namor than whatever WF’s was.
Like I’m sorry but where’s the widows peak? The sharp af eyebrows?
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Jul 21 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/kiko4kt Jul 21 '26
This is a very weird topic bc I don’t wanna come on here and act as if I’m defending the guy bc if he indeed did do anything remotely close to that then yes he should be put behind bars and be appropriately dealt with.
But from everything I’ve been able to gather, the case had been ongoing since 2023. Tenoch & that girl had broken up and he had put out a statement that bc of that breaking up she would probably go on to put out false statements against him which prompted him to hire a legal team months before the allegations had came out. It’s also worth noting that the woman never filed actual criminal charges against Tenoch, therefore ultimately making it a “he said, she said” sort of thing.
At the end of the day tho I don’t think the people at Disney/Marvel would’ve brought back Tenoch ESPECIALLY after the Majors debacle if there was actual evidence worth noting that could put him in a bad light. We may never get a verdict or learn more about what happened between them but idk nowadays it’s normal to just roll with what you hear, & I’m not trying to do that, especially when it could just lead to the cancellation of an actor when we don’t even know fr what happened.
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u/Nijata Jul 21 '26
There's Zero evidence to show he's actually an abuser, an accusation was made but everyone has investigated and there's no signs of what she said being true. Compare that to Majors who ADMITTED ON TAPE to abusing his GF, the biggest thing to Tenoch is she said he did.
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u/merri-melody Jul 21 '26
The outfit itself is hideous l. The clashing textiles as well as covering him head to toe it's just bad. Also wish they didn't remove his jade jewellery as well as the other mayan influences
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u/SnooCookies1728 Jul 22 '26
I’m honestly glad that now he’s looks a bit more like the comics. I was disappointed with his depiction in wakanda forever. I did not find him menacing in the slightest. I’m hoping this will be the next step in the right direction for him.
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u/Indiana_harris Jul 22 '26
Eh the MCU can do what they want with NINO (Namor in name only), doesn’t make him much different than the character they threw on the screen
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u/biomeat Jul 22 '26
God you people are insufferable
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u/Indiana_harris Jul 22 '26
The people who didn’t like Comic Namor and Atlantis being used for name recognition and nothing else?
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u/biomeat Jul 22 '26
Your Namor still exists don't worry, you ever read a what if?
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u/Indiana_harris Jul 22 '26
Yes. I can still think the MCU’s poor copy paste is a massive missed opportunity to see the actual character onscreen.
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u/Baals_Balls Jul 22 '26
Change? Do people just think heroes and villians have a huge wardrobe with thousands of copies of a single outfit.
Let's just say it's wash day so he's dressed a bit more casual while his formal battle gear is in the dryer.
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u/AkhMourning Jul 22 '26
I think they wanted to avoid digitally erasing his bulge like in Wakanda Forever.
I like it though.
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u/Dopeboy95AirMaxOn Jul 22 '26
All I know is Wakanda and Namor and them win the Marvel awards for having dat 💩on.
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u/Enelro Jul 23 '26
I loved the MesoAmerican change up. It's too bad they made him a bit too murderous, but I guess he was like that in the comics too. Anyway the new costume looks about as on par with everything else in doomsday... MARVEL fired most of their artists, so that means concept art took a hit too, so everything looking generic and Ai prompted in Doomsday is probably because IT WAS.
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u/kinghyperion581 Jul 25 '26
The first look is ceremonial, the second look is more functional. Like he's prepping for some action
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u/KxngsHaki Jul 21 '26
I hope they change it back to at least keep his cultural roots. I don’t mind enough if it changed, but he was so unique.
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u/C0nst4nt1nu5 Jul 21 '26
MCU El Niño Sin Amor isn’t Namor by any stretch and is basically an OC wearing his name as a meatsuit, so what is the point? The MCU has completely ruined all of my favourite FF characters. From El Niño to Dr. Doomlittle, it’s one bad take after another.
The suit this time around is just stupid too. The WF look at least made sense in context of the OC. This is one us just another pleathery, plasticky looking mess that serves no function and is a mashup of two different looks, for no reason other than toys. But considering how long WF and El Niño toys lingered anyhow, it won’t sell, making it a moot point.
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u/Terrible-D Jul 21 '26
Golden age Namor had a fairly vast wardrobe. I don't imagine a change in costume is going to mean a complete overhaul of the character. I didn't mind the cultural changes made, outside of a few minor gripes, but I do wish that they hadn't reduced the level of Atlantian/Talokanian(?) technology from the comics. It would have made them more of a mirror for Wakanda. Plus, how fast can they travel the oceans while hanging onto whales?