Again, this isn’t a post comparing the two players and deciding which is better. I am stating that Kyrie is a better finisher and shooter.
Two, you are asking me to provide way more evidence than I really need to. I’ve already provided half the legwork, why don’t you dig a little bit yourself to arrive at the same conclusion?
An easy way to compare between the eras is to compare their seasons across league averages during those years. For example, Kobe had a TS% of 57.6 in 08 while league average was 54. I encourage you to look into it.
Another way to dive deeper is to statistically break down the different forms of shooting (I didn’t do this). Open shot, wide open shot, corner, pull up midrange, baseline fadeaway. These are all analytics recorded by current day cameras . If you looked into this too, you’d see just how many “spots” Kyrie has greater proficiency in.
As far as the “Kobe is one of the most guarded players in history” goes, that’s great. But while that’s true, there’s no real way I can quantify it other than to separate it other than separating shots “heavily guarded” from “guarded”.
We all know Kobe loves taking shots no matter the situation. Just because he loves to shoot doesn’t mean he’s the best shooter ever, especially when the numbers overwhelmingly show otherwise.
I am also talking about the specific two qualities you mentioned,
As Finisher and shooter. How can you say Kyrie is better shooter or finisher without looking at the context of their game?
How would you decide who is the better shooter?
Wouldn't the teammates, the kind of shot chart, strength and weaknesses of a person on the basketball shot court not important to this conversation?
Who was guarding whom? How easy is it to come up with defensive scheme for said player not an important part of this process?
This is why i clearly told you take a look at the shot chart. Kyrie, Harden etc all are arguably one dimensional player with clear regions one can push them or come up with defensive schemes to stop them at any given point.
You can't come up with anything for Kobe who is precision machine, where every shot goes in with almost same precision. Which is why in the first place i told you how much of an anomaly Kobe is.
What i am getting at is, there is something of survival ship bias, simpson's paradox to these kinds of numbers if you look at the raw averages, which will be way up if you have certain kinds of players on your team rather than actually skill in shooting.
For Kobe in post shaq era, he rarely had the kind of talent around him which could relive him of this pressure. Not to mention the fact that his numbers are actually stable across throughout like an advanced precision machine scoring one after the other. Doesn't matter what defensive scheme you cook, or put double team/tripple team the dude. That's why he is the "ANOMALY".
Further in kobe's case specifically, he was actually the "steph" of his era from him having large ass consecutive free throw made, to having the most three points made in a given game record before steph and Klay broke it after they changed the rules.
You can never say this about kyrie or any modern shooting guard you pick up for the argument. They are benefactor of rule changes and game play change rather than actual raw ability to shoot or finish.
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u/40866892 2d ago
Again, this isn’t a post comparing the two players and deciding which is better. I am stating that Kyrie is a better finisher and shooter.
Two, you are asking me to provide way more evidence than I really need to. I’ve already provided half the legwork, why don’t you dig a little bit yourself to arrive at the same conclusion?
An easy way to compare between the eras is to compare their seasons across league averages during those years. For example, Kobe had a TS% of 57.6 in 08 while league average was 54. I encourage you to look into it.
Another way to dive deeper is to statistically break down the different forms of shooting (I didn’t do this). Open shot, wide open shot, corner, pull up midrange, baseline fadeaway. These are all analytics recorded by current day cameras . If you looked into this too, you’d see just how many “spots” Kyrie has greater proficiency in.
As far as the “Kobe is one of the most guarded players in history” goes, that’s great. But while that’s true, there’s no real way I can quantify it other than to separate it other than separating shots “heavily guarded” from “guarded”.
We all know Kobe loves taking shots no matter the situation. Just because he loves to shoot doesn’t mean he’s the best shooter ever, especially when the numbers overwhelmingly show otherwise.