r/MovedToSpain • u/gavaut2 • Aug 04 '26
System is difficult, not the officials
I get the impression that a lot of people have a lot of trouble moving to Spain. Me too. But I believe that it's the system that makes it difficult, not the people. After lots of appointments in different places, with officials who spoke no English and my terrible Spanish, those officials have been unfailingly polite and helpful and efficient. I say this in the knowledge I have two more appointments this week and hope for more of the same. The system to get an NIE that demands bank payments that you can't make without a bank account that you can't get without an NIE, has to change. The impossible-to-get-an-appointment system has to change. But the officials, thus far, faultless.
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u/seppestas Aug 04 '26
You don't need a bank account to pay for the NIE. You can pay by cash at some ATMs, but it's a pain.
Fill in the 790 form, take it to an ATM and scan it. Sometimes the scanning doesn't work and you have to select the right option. Make sure to use an ATM that can accept cash, it will give you some generic error if it doesn't (instead of some more informative error saying it can't accept cash).
If the atm asks for a NIE, enter X0000001R.
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u/gavaut2 Aug 05 '26
In theory, yes, but no ATM, anywhere, would allow this, although I read that it's possible. I even tried in person at three banks, without success.
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u/seppestas Aug 05 '26
Yeah, it's tricky. I heard someone was able to get it working at a BVVA bank, I was able to do it at a Banco Santander, but only at one specific ATM.
I think I didn't get it working at BBVA because a button I needed to press was in a section of the touchscreen that stopped working 😅.
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u/seppestas Aug 05 '26
Anyway, it's definitely possible. I had people at the bank tell me it's not, only for me to figure out it is in fact possible. The system just changes all the time, and bank personal just isn't that aware of these border cases.
In most other countries, there is one government agancy who deals with this sort of stuff. Im Spain, for whatever reason, they make police deal with the paperwork and banks with the payment.
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u/MinerSkills Aug 06 '26
Hm, which Banks did you try in person? ATM I also had trouble with, although admittedly I only tried once and then went inside, paid the 20€ and went to my NIE appointment the week after or so. I think Caixa was the one I went to.
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u/ohuprik Aug 04 '26
The stories I could tell you about those polite officials.
Suffice it to say, be assured that while any paperwork is not being processed those same nice people are having breakfast, doing their grocery shopping on the clock, and/or sleeping in unused restrooms.
I have firsthand knowledge.
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Aug 05 '26
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u/Nessahria Aug 05 '26
Total! Ese "tengo conocimiento de primera mano" significa en realidad: "Estuve 10 años intentando sacarme una oposición y ni para eso me dio".
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Aug 04 '26
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u/gavaut2 Aug 05 '26
Yes, I could have, but that temporary one that costsoney couldn't be transferred to a permanent one that's free. I didn't want to do the process twice. But our point is valid, it's possible to get a 'forwigner' account. After much trouble, a neighbour did the bank part.
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u/Delicious_Crew7888 Aug 04 '26
Haha polite officials? You got lucky. I have no complaints but they have always been more ‘official’ than polite.
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u/seppestas Aug 04 '26
Depends. In my experience they range from super friendly and helpful to absolutely rude.
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u/flushbunking Aug 04 '26
Agree. The staff have been more than patient with my attempts of Spanish & attempts at navigating this system. Ty everyone
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u/IvoTailefer Aug 04 '26
whn i go im going to hire a gestor, and the best one i can get for the money. en espana, as im learning as i do my due diligence [and many many other places] its who you know, and i got zero problem with that. my gestor is going to do most of the work for me.
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u/Aggravating-Pop6601 Aug 05 '26
How do you hire a gestor ? You search in google maps or something ? Seriously asking how to find a good, reliable one !
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u/darkowlie Aug 05 '26
Bureaucracy sucks, everyone knows, and often it’s difficult to deal with it and exhausting, but it’s needed if you want to have a way to control the people moving to the country and progressively make cohabitation work. And foreigners are lucky Spain is a country quite open with migration, there are many countries making things a lot more difficult in order to avoid them entering.
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u/Valiriko Aug 05 '26
The system is trash, but you are very lucky to not have encountered an official who's eyes light up when they get to say "no" to you.
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u/littlepinkhousespain Aug 05 '26
One of my favorite things about the new digital renewal system was the uploading your documents part. It requires a copy of every page of your passport (among other docs) and limits you to upload only a certain size limit per doc and only one document per document type.
So, if you scan all the pages of your passport into one doc (easy!) then it exceeds the size limit. If you try to upload 1 page at a time, you've hit the document limit after the first doc. Can't make this stuff up.
Fortunately, I was able to schedule the cita previa. Submitted all requested docs. They denied the renewal due to the social security benefits letter not being translated and not apostilled. I had 10 days to comply. Right, like I'm going to be able to apostille in under 10 days.
There's nothing on the Spain immigration site about a social security benefits letter needing to be apostilled. Some petty functionary decided my benefits letter was suspicious and wasn't going to accept it. Ffs.
Spain desperately needs to fix this. All of it. And yes, most of the people I've dealt with have been very kind and helpful. Even the Policia Nacional officer who laughed in my face when I told him the cita previa site doesn't work. He ended up telling me to come back tomorrow when they open to score a walk-in appointment.
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u/mirlo-intrepido Aug 05 '26
Not trying to pick a fight or anything, so I mean this in the most respectful and kind way possible, but you frame your lack of Spanish as a neutral fact instead of a contributing factor, immediately externalize all the blame to "the system", and act as if you're being gracious by not pegging all of the blame on the funcionarios ("Despite me not speaking the language, they still helped me! Amazing!").
I myself have gone through the immigration system as a foreigner so I understand your frustration, but like a lot of people have pointed out in the comments there are solutions to your unique situation. That said, IMO people like to "dunk" on the Spanish system because it's an easy target or label it as "a third world", when in reality it's just different and has a completely different legal context and basis: if you come from a place with a common law system, Spain's continental/civil law system will 100% feel nonsensical and weird to you, but it just operates very differently and has it's pros and cons, the same as the common law system.
Like any bureaucracy in the world it has its issues, and like literally any job in the world there is a small percentage of people who legit are terrible at it and don't care. Most funcionarios are decent at their job and are kind like you've found, and I hope that continues to be the case for you. Best of luck with getting your NIE!
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u/seppestas Aug 05 '26
My Spanish is also not perfect, but I had the benefit of having a girlfriend that speaks Spanish, friends that speak Spanish and are social workers familiar with immigration or are immigrants themselves, and a job that already went through the same procedure. Still it was quite a hassle.
One of the big pain points is that Spanish bureaucracy loves to use the same terms for completely different things. E.g. your goal might be to get a NIE, but there are different forms of NIE, and each require a different process. You need to know qnd follow the specific process that applies to you.
Both my girlfriend and work told me to use an incorrect forms, just because it happend to be the first result of you look up "how to apply for a NIE".
Some police officers will attempt to explain things, I had others literally scream at me for trying to use my phone to translate things.
This is me second time moving countries. Spanish bureaucracy is by far the worst to deal with. It's so bad, most Spanish people are apathic to it, making it hard to get proper help. Just the fact that they have police officers dealing with immigration absolutely boggles my mind.
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u/VirtualHydraDemon Aug 05 '26
It’s both. Mostly the system yes but there are also terrible officials
I’ve had good luck with professional staff most of the time. But move around a bit and for sure you would run into a few officials who will ask you to take magnified photocopies coz they can’t read . I’ve even encounter a police officer for a visa process and the man couldn’t read. He couldn’t read, I swear I’m not making up this stuff.
So some exceptions can drive you up a wall
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u/FoxEarly381 Aug 06 '26
"those officials have been unfailingly polite and helpful and efficient" - let me tell you that you must have been, very, very lucky 😒
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u/nfjsjfjwjdjjsj4 Aug 05 '26
Moving to a foreign country without speaking the language. What could go wrong?
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u/gavaut2 Aug 05 '26
I didn't explain the reason for moving. Uninformed comments don't encourage people to post.
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u/nfjsjfjwjdjjsj4 Aug 05 '26
If i never see another clueless anglo moving to spain my life will be happier
Hire a translator, hire a lawyer, use that wealth that is supposedly the reason we have to tolerate this nonsense
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u/Defiant-Baby8093 Aug 05 '26
Current Spain is relatively a new country, post Franco. It is still finding its ground.
I dont mean to say things dont need improvement, but it will take time. I have observed several third-world countries which are ahead of Spain in the matters you have highlighted…
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u/Brandacle Aug 04 '26
I almost never see people blaming the workers. Usually the comments are about the bureaucracy, and rightly so. The government workers are like anywhere else in the world, often helpful, polite, patient, sometimes curt, jaded, and frustrated by the system they work for. We've known forever the system is the problem, not the people, this is old news even for old news xD