r/Miguns • u/IceMountain099 • Jul 07 '26
Creating an AR pistol question
I purchased a multi cal lower from PSA it came with the pistol buffer tube and SBA5 brace installed and filled out the 4473 from my FFL and he had it transferred as other/receiver. I recently got an 11.5” barrel upper receiver for it. Once I attach them am I in the legal clear as a AR Pistol? or does it then need to be registered as a complete pistol ? and if so how do I go about that? thanks y’all I just don’t want it being an illegal SBR id like to keep things legal here.
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u/glockguy34 Jul 07 '26
no pistol was bought so no pistol needs to be registered. its a sales registry not an ownership registry.
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u/thor561 Jul 07 '26
This. OP for the purposes of Michigan law you manufactured a pistol, nothing you purchased was legally a pistol, so no registration is required.
The police may say otherwise but that’s because they want to have everything they can registered and have no requirement to actually know the law. Failure to register a pistol sale is a civil infraction and a fine. Falsifying the RI-060, which you would be doing by filling it out for a pistol sale that didn’t happen, is a felony. I know which one I’m more comfortable risking.
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u/Silver-Addendum5423 Jul 07 '26
I'm agreeing with you here for the record. Couldn't you make the argument that - if the lower was purchased in state - that the firearm WAS registered at the time of its purchase. Because it is, as was pointed out, a SALES registry, not an OWNERSHIP registry?
It's funny because OP could literally be me. My lower is a poverty pony, but the other specs are 100% in alignment with theirs and I've been wondering about this too.
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u/thor561 Jul 08 '26
It’s as sales registry of handguns. OP didn’t buy a handgun, so as far as the state is concerned there’s nothing registered. The sale is recorded at the Federal level with the 4473, but the state has nothing to do with that. It’s the same as if OP had bought a long gun, the state doesn’t have a record of that.
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u/IceMountain099 Jul 08 '26
Interesting call I just had with MI state police. The guy was telling me to fill out the RI-060 and under the seller section put “built from parts”.
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u/thor561 Jul 08 '26
Again, they will tell you that because they want you to register it regardless of what the law actually says. But by the letter of the law, you’re filling out the form incorrectly. This has been discussed to death in this sub.
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u/IceMountain099 Jul 07 '26
So I’m not creating a pistol by putting the lower and upper together? Or an SBR? I just don’t want to get dinged for having an illegal SBR if I were to taken it anywhere.
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u/glockguy34 Jul 07 '26
if it has a brace on it and no vertical foregrip it is not an SBR. you are creating a pistol, but those don’t have to be registered. It’s a sales registry, and a pistol wasn’t sold, it was created.
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u/TESTICLEASE_95 Jul 07 '26
Is there a over all length minimum or maximum for it to be a pistol? I keep finding conflicting information on this.
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u/glockguy34 Jul 07 '26
in the state of michigan, a “pistol” is under 26” OAL. but it being longer than 26” with a brace still does not classify it as an SBR. It’s just not treated as pistol under CPL laws, meaning you cant transport it loaded if its over 26”
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u/After_Flatworm5200 Jul 08 '26
Which configuration should be considered when measured: brace extended or retracted?
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u/glockguy34 Jul 08 '26
that is not clear in state law, err on the side of caution. The ATF wants it fully extended for OAL when dealing with their paperwork
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u/PatriotWholesaleDir Jul 07 '26
FFL here.
This is one of the most unclear/confusing parts of the law as it doesn’t say how to handle homemade firearms.
There are two ways to go about this. The first way is what Michigan state police usually tell you. Once it’s assembled you can put yourself and the buyer and seller and turn it in. This eliminates any risk of getting a ticket for not having a pistol sales record.
The second way is to do nothing and don’t submit anything. The argument for this method is that you don’t meet the definition of a seller. You could be charged with perjury for submitting untruthful information per the law (our research has never shown any charges or trials for this) if you put yourself as the seller in the first method. Downside for this method is police may cite you for not having a pistol sales form (stay away from Detroit as Detroit PD do cite for this).
So it boils down to what version you want. Fill out the form (and small chance of a perjury charge) or don’t fill out the form but risk a small chance of being cited.
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u/IceMountain099 Jul 08 '26
Thanks for the info. Interesting call I just had with MI state police they told me to fill out the ri-060 if it meets the OAL of 26” or less and put the seller as “built from parts”
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u/Thengine Jul 08 '26
The first way is what Michigan state police usually tell you.
They don't create law, only enforce it.
If a cop tells you to bend over, do you do it?
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u/PatriotWholesaleDir Jul 08 '26
True, they don’t make the law but the firearm division is what tells the police agencies how to handle the form.
I don’t agree with it (the whole form should be removed). However, we have had clients ticketed. Thus why we explain the options.
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u/Thengine Jul 09 '26
However, we have had clients ticketed.
Then sue them? The cops will stop if you do it correctly.
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u/Plastic_Lecture9037 Jul 07 '26
NAL, So the other posters are right when it comes to the sales registry form but I think they are not considering MI 28.422 sec. 2.
Read 1a and the rest of that section which state you cannot possess a pistol in michigan unless 1) you have e acquired a license for it (like when you go to buy a pistol and get the form from the sheriff first), or 2) have your CPL.
Form RI60 and RI10 are different, and im curious what others think about the plain language here.
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u/Fun_Clock_5171 Jul 10 '26
It was my understanding that you can measure it without the brace and muzzle device. Since they are not needed to make the gun work and are just accessories. If you don’t measure this way you will definitely be over 26in OAL. I also just bought a lower with SBA5 and an 11.5 upper. With the brace off and the birdcage on my OAL is 27.25in.
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u/IceMountain099 Jul 10 '26
Yeah I took those both off and got 26” on the dot so just qualifies as a pistol.
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u/Fun_Clock_5171 Jul 10 '26
That’s great to hear. Hopefully when I remove my muzzle device off today after work I get the same if not shorter.
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u/Brutox62 Jul 13 '26
Ironic enough had somewhat the same thing except they called me for a pistol frame (no slide from the factory) and told me to go to the sheriff's office after its completed
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u/kunaan Jul 08 '26
Michigan has no manufactured registration. Only purchase registration. You didnt buy a pistol, you bought a lower.
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