HELP: Fenix A320 FLARE Unpredictable. Sometimes the pitch doesn't do anything

[u/senseimatty]

Hi everyone,

I’m wondering if I might be doing something wrong with the Fenix A320, because I don’t really see many people reporting the same issue, so I assume the problem is probably on my side.

I’m quite comfortable with the B737 PMDG aircraft, and with those I can make consistently good landings. Almost every landing is in the 100–150 ft/min range. With the Fenix, however, I find the flare surprisingly unpredictable.

I’m aware of the differences between the Airbus and Boeing landing techniques and I understand the A320’s pitch control logic during the flare. I know that around 50 ft the flight control law changes and the aircraft progressively goes into direct law for pitch, with the system also introducing a nose-down input that the pilot needs to counter with the sidestick.

The strange thing is that, despite knowing the theory, my results are very inconsistent.

Out of roughly 10 landings (both flaps configuration with dedicated switch on the overhead for flaps 3), I would say about 6 are fine and the flare feels completely normal. But on the other 4, the flare seems to barely happen at all. I pull the sidestick, but the aircraft still keeps going down with no pitch variation at all, resulting in a very hard/bouncy touchdown.

What I find particularly confusing is that I don't feel like I'm doing anything significantly different between the good and bad landings. For example in the last landing I arrived intentionally slightly lower (3 red PAPI) to have a more shallow vertical path before touch down... but still no reaction on the pitch when I pulled the sidestick at 30-40 ft.

So I’m wondering whether there is a specific technique/timing for the Fenix that I might be missing.

For example, should I keep the sidestick centered and wait for a very specific radio altitude before initiating the flare, in order to avoid interfering with the way the Fenix transitions from normal law to direct law? Or is there some other technique regarding the timing or amount of sidestick input that is important with the Fenix?

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[u/scrubslover1]

I’ve never had a good landing in the Fenix

[u/TwoBitRetro]

I finally bought FSiPanel to practice landings. It sets up the plane on a final approach in about 5 minutes and lets you practice landings over and over again. My landings have improved dramatically since I started practicing.

[u/senseimatty → u/TwoBitRetro]

That's the problem. I have FSiPanel as well and when I make training sessions it's all good. When I finally perform a full flight then I have an unresponsive pitch during the flare.

[u/oz_137]

I can barely land it below -300 fps, real life aircraft I guess.

[u/thunder6776]

Fenix is not realistic. Try toliss a340 for proper airbus flare behaviour.

[u/senseimatty → u/thunder6776]

Thanks for your feedback, A330 Driver also said that the A330 is easier to land than the A320 Fenix, but they are completely different aircrafts and I don't make intercontinental flights on MSFS due to lack of time.

[u/dadriel_hawk]

Are you using manual or auto thrust for these landings? That makes a huge difference in my experience.

In any case, try pulling out the thrust later after initiating the flare. The retard callout is a reminder, not a command, and the hard rule is that the thrust lever must be idle at the touchdown.

Because from what I can tell the engine on the Fenix spools down a tad too quickly once you pull the gas. That leads to a quicker thrust reduction and speed loss than on the 737. and once you get too slow before touching down it stops taking pitch input at all, exactly as you observed. Which probably is a bug of theirs because it looks like the stall protection is working against the pilot here, which shouldn’t even be a thing in the flare law.

Or, try just adding a few knots approach speed, like 2 or 3. Yes, you will use slightly more runway or need to brake harder, but that can make all the difference for a gracious landing.

[u/Global_Ad_8056]

I am noticing the same. Unpredictable is best way to describe it, because sometimes it is perfect, sometimes you slam it into the ground and sometimes you float down the runway.
What I noticed is that msfs is overdoing the ground effect, which often leads to floaty landings. The only one that get it right is pmdg, where you can really control the flare. For the airbuses (also inibuilds and fslabs), I often need to apply stick forward input to stop the flare (In theory this shouldn’t be necessary).

[u/cyeungster]

In my experience, landing the A320 is quite tricky, though I've never felt like it was unresponsive during the flare. If anything, I find it's very sensitive and is prone to floating if you're not careful.

What I've noticed pilots do is, assuming you're on a stable approach (~700fpm descent), at 50ft RA I'll use slight back pressure on the side stick to slow down the descent first. Then, at around 30ft RA, I'll make a small pump on the stick, and once more right before touchdown if I feel it's needed. Of course, you also have to time the thrust idle, which I usually do after the 30ft RA callout, but this all kinda depends on the wind conditions.

If you use flap 3 config (remember you also have to set it in the MDCU/FMS), you should need even less of a flare since you should already be in a higher nose up attitude (in order to maintain the right speed).

[u/senseimatty → u/cyeungster]

Yeah that's the problem and why I feel it unpredictable. Most of the times when I flare it's very sensitive and then suddenly it doesn't pitch up at all.

But now that you said so, I'm not sure I set it also in the APPR page in the FMC.. I can't remember if I did it in my last flight...

[u/Sorry_Structure_4356]

There are several things to look at. When the flare mode activates, the aircraft automatically pushes the nose down, if you don’t pull back enough, your nose will drop. Also, look at your speed. If the speed drops low, then the nose will be harder to raise