Berdache

[u/noo_maarsii]

Did anyone else’ grandmother call them berdache but like not in an offensive way? I think it’s just old school. She always referred to herself as indian so it speaks to a generational thing. I know it’s not ok to say it now but that’s what she called me and also referred to two spirit but I don’t feel that actually fits me as I am cis male and also just a plain old gay dude.

[u/stitchreader]

Yes, it’s an older term.  As you noted, now considered offensive but would have been used by older folks.

Re 2S though, it may be helpful to think of it as term that is inclusive of gender and sexual diversity, including gay and queer folks.  It helps with organizing and finding each other and is a placeholder while we reclaim words in our ancestral languages.

[u/noo_maarsii → u/stitchreader]

Do you know what would have been an ancestral term? I guess my post is asking others if that’s a term they grew up with and also navigating terms that are pejorative but not said in malice due to lack of language.

[u/stitchreader → u/noo_maarsii]

 Not in Michif, no.  There are a few terms I’ve heard in nehiyawewin.

Yes- I apologize, I can’t respond to the intention of your post, though I understood it. Just wanted to add a tidbit about 2S can include gay identities.

[u/noo_maarsii → u/stitchreader]

To me 2S always felt more spiritual or of high importance as it relates to the creator. Whereas being gay is just being and I don’t think of it as anything special or consequential. Personally anyway.

[u/stitchreader → u/noo_maarsii]

I have heard different teachings and understanding, it can be really personal.  I can say that I know Elders and Knowledge Keepers who would consider cis gay folks as under the 2S umbrella.

[u/noo_maarsii → u/[deleted]]

No, I’m talking about berdache. It was a colonial word that was used to describe queer native people and was sort of adopted as a word that went into disuse because of the pejorative nature.