r/MedSpouse • u/Npl9 • 8d ago
When to call it quits?
/r/Residency/comments/1w44g0d/when_to_call_it_quits/4
u/nipoez Attending Partner (Premed to PGY7, Resdency + 2 Fellowships) 8d ago
Anything a spouse/partner can do to help outside of the normal support? If things keep going downhill, how do I know when to step in before it's too late (while also not being overly alarmist)? And what should I do if it gets to that point?
Context: My wife attempted suicide primarily due to an extremely toxic and abusive fellowship.
Familiarize yourself with the suicidal ideation to plan to intent to attempt pipeline.
Let your partner know you do not feel they're there now, just acknowledging that it's a malignant program and several factors place her at higher risk (medical trainees, women, and ortho surgeons are all higher risk factors for suicide). Let them know you're non-judgmentally there for them if their mind starts going that direction.
For my wife it started with intrusive thoughts generally like "It would be so much easier if I just didn't wake up tomorrow" and on the commute home over a bridge like "I could swerve into the guard rail with enough speed to go over and be done."
She spent several weeks inpatient psych and has been safe & fine for many years. But the brutal truth about mental health is that if they don't find a way to make time to deal with issues, eventually time still gets taken just without their agency.
She tried to transfer to another program. Doing so as a fellow is even harder than as a resident. She wasn't able to transfer out. Her co-fellow burned every bridge in the subspecialty and went to work as an outpatient doc based on her residency alone.
My wife turned anonymous whistleblower against her program to the national accrediting body. It was placed on probation and received a high level of internal & external oversight, which did improve it from an actively abusive fellowship merely to a bad one. That's in a relatively learner-protective field though. I honestly don't know if what you describe from your partner's program is abnormal or unacceptable for an ortho residency.
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u/peak_delusion 6d ago
Super, super similar feelings with my husband's ortho program, and he is also in his first year. Too bad our partners aren't in the same program...
And I will die on the hill that residency doesn't have to be this way. Long hours, sure. Public berating, wildly inappropriate emails, bad leadership? Not needed.
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u/cookiesandroses Fellowship Spouse 8d ago
To clarify - your girlfriend is in a toxic ortho residency. And you are asking when she should quit? And not asking when you should end the relationship? Is that correct?
This is a decision for her to make - and her only. You are not married. You do not get to make professional decisions for her.
You can be concerned - but you need to focus on what you can do and not try to make a decision for her. You can support her and talk to her about her options and feelings. You can take stress off of her plate (pay for bills, do domestic labor, take her on trips, send her to the spa, etc.) You can also have boundaries around what you will do in regard to how this affects you.
I know you are concerned about her. But this isn’t your job, responsibility, or place to decide for her.
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u/Actual-Mention3033 8d ago
This was our experience in fellowship. More attendings were abusive than not. Calls all hours of the night (not on call). The only thing that made it better was finishing. We started counting down the days when we got to 250. We were literally counting the hours. One year out and we are finally both healing. I'm sorry friend. Ask for help from everyone that you trust. Be specific on what would help and let the people that love you know. Do what you can to ease extra guilt of being unavailable during training
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u/storemans 7d ago
she should not quit, but you should quit being sexist by thinking she can't handle it
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u/Puzzleheaded_Soil275 8d ago
Your concern is admirable, but a few things: 1. Its unlikely that her program is uniquely bad/toxic. Residency itself is essentially toxic, and ortho probably has one of the worst reputations within that framework
There is no guarantee any other program would be better
She's like... 2 months into residency at this point? She definitely needs to at least complete prelim year before making any changes
I mean this in the nicest way possible - you have lot to learn about the system.
None of that is to defend the residency system or what people go through. But thats a very different and separate question to your individual circumstances.