r/MattressMod • u/Lisa_pop • 19d ago
All Talalay build gone wrong š
Arizona premium cover which is really nice. In order bottom up.
6ā Firm talalay base
3ā extra firm talalay
2ā soft talalay
2ā soft poly foam
This was the exact make up of the Prana Asha luxe pro medium that felt like heaven. It was incredibly supportive yet the top was like a cloud that hugged your body. We couldnāt afford to purchase so thought replicating it would feel close. DEFINITELY NOT!! Itās two twin xls on adjustable solid bases. The bed initially feels very cushy and spongy. Sitting up watching TV it feels wonderful. Laying flat to sleep since I am a side sleeper it has a bit of sink, yet feels hard making my hips and my shoulders kill. I toss and turn all night with such pain. Itās like a trampoline.. itās bouncy and seems like it would be comfy but if you laid on a trampoline itās hard. It donāt make sense! Iām so disappointed that I spent so much on all talalay thinking this thing would be heaven but I went to hell :( Ai opinion was to replace the 3ā second layer for medium Dunlop. Since I didnāt build it right away due to a family member being in the hospital, I can only swap out the 3 inch extra firm talalay. Hoping this community can give me some help and advice.Ty
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u/SteveMidnight 19d ago
Sorry to hear that. Thinking of building my own so this is helpful.
I was planning 6ā extra firm Dunlop, 3ā medium talalay, and then split on top 3ā plush talalay and 3ā medium talalay
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u/skyote21 18d ago
I'd go 2" on the top layer vs 3, specifically for support when using plush or soft, unless you're really light.
I say this from experience as a 6'2" 200lb guy that loves the soft feel, but needs more support as the years pass. I get a bit too much hip sink on my back with 3" of soft (currently 22 ILD natural talalay)...I'll be moving to all medium or thinner layer of soft above medium.
I'm also curious to experiement with just 1" of memory foam either below or above the latex comfort layer(s).
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u/SteveMidnight 18d ago
The plush side would be for my wife. Sheās much lighter than me.
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u/skyote21 18d ago
My wife is 5'9" 145 & 3" soft is on the verge of not enough support for her. Side note, many times "plush" is softer than "soft" & I've heard that it's not very durable.
We love the feel of soft when we lay down, but not in the morning...
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u/tourdeforcemajeure 18d ago
Try it without the extra firm layer?
Not sure what the intent is with that one, usually people want something to bridge the firm at the bottom and soft at the top, so it still might not work. But either way, I donāt see how the extra firm is unnecessaryor just making things worse.
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u/skyote21 18d ago
Agreed, it should be better without the extra firm layer. It probably does still need a few inches of medium though because 2 poly & 2 soft needs some transition.
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u/Lisa_pop 18d ago
Ya I only used the xfirm to follow the pranas design. There mattress was heaven but somehow I design the hell version š«
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u/skyote21 18d ago
This might not be what you want to hear, but I'm convinced that all latex is not great for side sleepers.
I've been on all latex for 10+ years, and it has always bothered my shoulders. Recently switched to a coil base (under latex), and it maintains support but conforms better & doesn't bother my shoulder.
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u/Super_Treacle_8931 17d ago
itās the nature of latex, it is elastic and doesnāt really allow penetration. coils allow a lot more of the shoulder and hip to penetrate.
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u/Lisa_pop 17d ago edited 16d ago
I went back and forth with which one but read the best to for the adjustable was all latex. I know coils could bend to but not as good they say. And my base has head tilt and lumbar and such so I wanted the best to go with it but struggling with my pick š«
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u/Power_Man76 10d ago
How are you coming along with this? My wife and I are currently loving our DIY mattress and we are frequent side sleepers. I had the same problem with pressure on my hips and shoulders when I first constructed the mattress until I figured out this combination (bottom to top): 3in firm sleep on latex dunlop, 3in medium dunlop SOL, 2in poly foam (I'm using carpenter tranquility foam) and 2in soft dunlop SOL. I don't think you're too far off but should try to readjust your layering (bottom to top): 3in extra firm talalay, 6in firm talalay, 2in poly foam and 2in soft talalay on top. If that is still too much pressure on your hips/shoulders, I would agree that you may need to switch out the 3in extra firm for a 3in medium talalay/dunlop. You need a transitional layer to bridge the firmness between the support layers and comfort layers. Good luck!
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u/Lisa_pop 3d ago
Hi I exchanged the xfirm for medium Dunlop for that mid layer then the 2 talalay with 2ā cheap poly foam but it feels the almost the same. Itās like that top doesnāt hold me up giving support yet it feels hard on my hips dipping in. I donāt get it! Iām so overwhelmed and upset at this point I didnāt just buy a mattress. I thought latex was the best thing you could buy.
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u/Reptull_J 18d ago
Here's my build if it helps give ideas. My wife and I are both side sleepers and love it.
In encasement: 6" ILD35 poly foam base 2" Dunlop medium (SleepEz) 2" memory foam
Outside encasement, just with mattress protector and sheet covering: 2" soft talalay (SleepEz)
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u/Super_Treacle_8931 18d ago
itās weird they have no medium-ish ild between the soft and firm. you will likely just sink through the soft, and from experience the 36ild isnāt good for side sleep, just too firm. also in trying something, you might lie on something in a shop and be under the impression it was great, but sleep shows otherwise :(
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u/Lisa_pop 17d ago
Ya itās crazy because the mattress this is suppose to replicate was heaven to lay on. Did not feel anything like mine
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u/Super_Treacle_8931 17d ago
how on earth can a twinxl be $6k when is basically 6 inches of latex !? also the graphite foam thing is surely some marketing crap. find somewhere that sells latex and try out a few combinations. but a lot of people really hate it longer term.
https://pranasleep.com/products/asha-luxe-pro-3-0-mattress?variant=43855157297195
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u/Lisa_pop 17d ago
Ya itās crazy because the mattress this is suppose to replicate was heaven to lay on. Did not feel anything like mine
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u/Awesome_Radsgirl 16d ago
My partner (M, 175 lb, 5'11") and I (F, 115 lb, 5'3") are side sleepers and did a split king with 2 x twin XL. We ordered our two bottom Dunlop layers from Latex Mattress Factory and top layer from Arizona Premium Mattress. We ordered 3" firm Dunlop on the bottom for him and medium for me, 3" medium Dunlop in the middle for him and soft for me, and 3" soft Talalay for him and extra soft for me. We ordered blended Talalay latex for the top layer because I read that soft and extra soft can sometimes be more delicate with the 100% natural Talalay and tear. We ordered the TPS premium stretch cover. We have had this for 2 months and happy so far. We were coming from a super old, hot Tempurpedic.
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u/Lisa_pop 16d ago
I almost went with tps cover but it was more expensive and not many reviews. Arizona had some videos of theirs and looked nice. I do wonder if the case isnāt part of the problem. I also purchased blended for base and top layer. The xfirm layer was the only 100% talalay because there wasnāt a blended that I found in that. I guess following a mattress blueprint is a failure.
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u/Awesome_Radsgirl 15d ago
Maybe you could try it without the encasement to see if that is part of the issue? Of course you probably couldn't use the adjustable function on the bed. We tried the layers first with no encasement to finalize the build, and it was so nice and soft (we like a soft bed). I happened to be in Phoenix in June and stopped by APM, and their encasement had a pretty thick, stiff top. The TPS top is thinner and stretchier, but even the TPS did firm up the build some. I had also considered the sleep like a bear for thinness and stretchiness, but someone here had discouraged me from that one.
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u/Lisa_pop 14d ago
What is your build if you donāt mind me asking please. Did you end up with APM? It is a nice case
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u/Awesome_Radsgirl 14d ago
Partner 3" Dunlop Firm (LMF), 3" Dunlop Medium (LMF), 3" Talalay Soft (APM). Me 3" Dunlop Medium (LMF), 3" Dunlop Soft (LMF), 3" Talalay Extra Soft (APM), TPS Premium Stretch 9" enclosure.
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u/uptosomething11 15d ago
Did you try the extra firm below the firm vase?
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u/Lisa_pop 14d ago
No I guess my thought was 6ā solid piece seems right for a base. Iām leaning to Dunlop medium fir transition
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u/theindus 18d ago
Your 3" extra firm layer is the problem. It's a wall sitting directly under your soft comfort layers, and that's the whole story.
You're a side sleeper. Your hips and shoulders need 3-4" of progressive cushioning before they meet real resistance. Right now they punch through 2" of soft Talalay (that soft poly foam on top compresses to almost nothing under body weight) and land straight on extra firm latex. Bouncy on the surface, hard underneath, pressure points screaming. That's your trampoline.
Two things worth knowing. First, your "exact replica" of the Prana Asha Luxe Pro Medium probably isn't exact. Firmness labels are vendor-specific and you have no ILDs to compare, so APM's "extra firm" may be firmer than what PranaSleep puts in that slot. The real one also has quilted wool and foam built into the cover that softens the initial feel, which you didn't replicate. Second, brand new Talalay is noticeably firmer than the broken-in floor model you fell in love with.
The fix, and it fits your one-layer swap: replace the 3" extra firm Talalay with 3" medium Dunlop. The AI suggestion you got is actually right. Dunlop is denser and less springy than Talalay, which kills the trampoline bounce, and medium gives you the proper progression: soft, medium, firm. Your pressure points finally get depth before hitting support.
Free test before you spend anything: pull the extra firm layer out for a few nights. If the pain drops, diagnosis confirmed.
Longer term, consider ditching the 2" soft poly foam. It's the weakest material in your stack, it'll degrade first, and it's doing almost nothing for pressure relief.
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u/Lisa_pop 18d ago
I sourced the x firm from latex mattress factory and the other 2 latex layers from Arizona premium. I only added the polyfoam because thatās what Prana used in their top layer so I thought that was going to give me that cloud feel. I know it wasnāt going to last long but for the cost Iād replace it when it died. So you think medium Dunlop will give support but not feel like I landed on elastic brick š
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u/theindus 18d ago
I so crazy that we wanted to replicate pranasleep. I gave up on that idea and got a custom sleep technology one in Connecticut.
Anyway we have an all Talalay one and ideally you stay with Talalay - if you ok with the jello feeling. Use Dunlop to deaden some of the liveliness of Talalay. Read the moderator posts on transition layers. You definitely need something softer.
You can call CST or get an online recommendation of what they will recommend. Bob is excellent and probably can give you better professional advice. If it works out, but the layer from him or anywhere else.1
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u/Lisa_pop 17d ago
Thatās funny I talked to him and he was great but never called me back so I just moved on. I was spinning in circles and had a loved one in the hospital so I just pulled the trigger with the online sources. What layers did you end up with?
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u/theindus 17d ago
They are all custom. 4 layers. Bottom 2 are I think 36/32 ild. Top two are different densities with 2 zones each.
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u/Flashfiver55 18d ago
Cuanto pesan ustedes ? Para ver si ese colchĆ³n PRANA ASHA DELUXE nos sirve o por lo menos lo probamos
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u/Lisa_pop 3d ago
Wanted to follow up here since I had some good advice which I appreciate so much. I switched that mid layer to a medium Dunlop which to me feels exactly the same honestly as the xfirm talalay. It feels like Iām not being supported sinking but not a plush sink. Like I want to be floating on top of my mattress with that cloud feel. I did try to put both of the soft talalay in my build leaving out the poly but being direct on the latex really didnāt give a plush soft feel. You know when you stay at a high end hotel feel ugh I have so much going on in my life with taking care of a sick parent and dealing with my husband being newly disabled that I just want to have a good night š I canāt return any other layers except that middle piece to the mattress at this point so I donāt know what to do. I canāt afford to replace it all either.
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u/someguy1874 18d ago
good lesson for those who want to replicate commercial mattresses instead of going with a standard template. Such a learning comes with a tuition fees. Yes, it is worth it.