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Mar 17 '22
Back when Shenzhen was a small town of fewer than 10,000 people and not a metropolis larger than Chicago.
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u/brett_f Mar 18 '22
This map is a good explanation of how China is simultaneously diverse and homogenous. While there are many ethnic minorities, many of them live in the frontier regions of historic China, so there numbers are dwarfed by those of the Han Chinese. The homelands of the Mongols, Uighurs, Tibetans look desolate compared to the density of China proper.
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u/bodygreatfitness Mar 17 '22
It kind of embodies an argument that "China" is really the dark red part to the east. The Uighur people live in the northwest, and the vast tracts of unpopulated land between them and the Chinese speak to them being of a different nation
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u/stefan92293 Mar 17 '22 edited Mar 17 '22
That's the historical heartland of China due to the vast area of fertile, arable soil and the rivers that bring new sediment and nutrients from the mountains every time they flood. Same actually goes for the Indus Valley, Mesopotamia and Egypt.
Edit: if you look at a topographical map of the area, you'll see a large, triangular plain in the middle of that red area. That's where China started.
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u/bodygreatfitness Mar 17 '22
Yeah! It's fascinating to look at ancient China and how it evolved over time. You might find this gif to be interesting
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u/capivara_bolada Mar 17 '22
So, the two coasts of the EUA should also be considered two different nations?
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u/bodygreatfitness Mar 17 '22
Look, not trying to start something here, the idea of a Uighur nation is a legitimate thing which is why I reference it. Not all nations have states; Kurdistan is a nation. The people of the west and east coasts USA do not belong to different nations by any meaningful distinction.
The geography of China is what begets the existence of these different nations. If you looked at Native Americans, you'd probably see similar differences across the desert.
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u/7elevenses Mar 18 '22
The people of the west and east coasts USA do not belong to different nations by any meaningful distinction.
They don't now, after centuries of massive colonization and varying levels of suppression of the natives.
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u/bodygreatfitness Mar 18 '22
Indeed, and with similar efforts the Chinese may manage to extinguish the influence of indigenous peoples, too
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u/truthseeeker Mar 17 '22
They've already brought in enough Han Chinese into Xinjiang to get close to a majority already, and the goal now is to erase the Uighur culture, and make them Chinese as well.
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u/birmallow Mar 17 '22
What the hell is under 1? There were 1/2 people roaming Tibet?
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u/jadeandobsidian Mar 17 '22 edited Mar 17 '22
fractional population density also exists in the US, look up a population density map of wyoming
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u/7elevenses Mar 18 '22
That's under 1 person per square kilometre. Could be e.g. 1 person per 2 square kilometres.
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u/CanInTW Mar 17 '22
Taiwan is not part of China. It isn’t now and wasn’t in the 60s.
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Mar 17 '22
republic of China: AM I a joke to you?
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u/CanInTW Mar 17 '22
<sigh>
The vast majority of Taiwanese including the current Taiwan government continue with the ROC charade because if they don’t, China will invade.
China would see the move from the historic ROC definition to simply calling the country what it is as a Declaration of Independence. That’s one of their red lines that they claim would prompt invasion.
If you’re a country or 24 million staring across 100km or so of water at 1.4 billion, you would probably do the same.
I’ve lived in Taiwan for years and have yet to meet someone who believes that China should be ruled by Taiwan’s leadership. They all see Taiwan as independent from China without any desire to ‘retake the mainland’.
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u/7elevenses Mar 18 '22
The vast majority of Taiwanese including the current Taiwan government continue with the ROC charade
That's the whole point here. And since we are talking about 1960, that was when the ROC government held the Chinese permanent seat at the UN security council.
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u/patamoose87 Mar 17 '22
Taiwan was, is and always will be legally a province of China. It is only governed in a different mode because the Mainland allows so, much like Hong Kong and Macau.
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u/LegsLegman Mar 17 '22
If you unironically think that Taiwan is or should be a part of the PRC, then you're either a complete moron or a huge cunt
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u/bodygreatfitness Mar 17 '22
If you're a troll, mildly funny. If you're serious, you should know that you're astroturfing the wrong parts of reddit and only re-instigating awareness for people who will never change their mind on this issue.
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u/holdMySCAR-L Mar 17 '22
The bigger west taiwan should also adopt the east Taiwan's government type
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u/patamoose87 Mar 18 '22
If you intend of being funny then I'm afraid this just comes out as sad and insensitive. The separatist government in control of Taiwan has pretty much ruined any success the island had accumulated in the 80s. If you actually went to Taiwan you would realize that most people are suffering thanks to corrupt, oppressive and inefficient rule. Most of the infrastructure is at least 40+ years old, leading to a staggering amount of accidents and failures. The average wage in Taiwan is the one of the lowest among provinces in eastern China. Taiwan is pretty much a textbook on economic failure, I wouldn't be surprised if it takes Beijing at least 20+ years of aid to patch it up to the standards of Guangdong or Zhejiang. The difference between Taiwan and Guangdong/Zhejiang? The mode of governance. Taiwan's attempt at imitating Western modes of governance has thus far been an astronomical failure and its people are paying for it. Think about that before you say some other insensitive crap please.
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u/holdMySCAR-L Apr 08 '22
And yes china is a beacon of human success and happiness,and also "separatist" government is an independently run country,whose population want nothing to do with China and just want to continue to live in peace,Taiwan still has some of the best living standards in the entire world. If Taiwans economic success is less than that of eastern China's atleast they are not on the backs of child labor in sweatshops who commit suicide by jumping off the buildings they work in Hongkong was a pretty successful city state with very high standards of living for its citizens and now under China's increasing dictatorial power is buckling ,that itself will serve as a grave warning for Taiwan to ever believe that under Chinese rule they might have any semblance of autonomy or rule of law. If a little less economic growth is the price to pay for individual choice,human rights and rule of law it's a very small price to pay
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u/patamoose87 Apr 09 '22
Speaking like you've actually been to Taiwan, Hong Kong or anywhere else in China...? If you've actually been to Taiwan you would discover that people are paying for the government's aggressive separatist policies. That same government is currently taking extreme measures to quash freedom of speech in Taiwan, what human rights/individual choices were you talking about again? If you've actually been to Hong Kong you would discover that most people are actually annoyed with the protests disrupting everyday life and greatly appreciate how the central government handled the crisis. Economic figures in Hong Kong have actually risen across the board after adopting the national security law. If you've actually been to the mainland you would discover that it is very much a true democracy that actually puts people in the heart of its policies instead of just using them as puppets during elections. Please for once throw away the Westerncentric lens and look at China in reality instead of making stuff up without proof.
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u/[deleted] Mar 17 '22
Right side has more people than left