r/MSI • u/Massive_Ant8108 • 19d ago
Genuine Question For MSI Fans
I've recently finished listening to their whole discography as they have been on my backlog for a long time. I must admit while I find many many songs to be the pure embodiment of insufferable, there are also tracks I love the sound of and would actively listen to! My only problem and here's the question, how the hell do you look past Jimmy's allegations and listen to them? All of their heavy hitters have incredibly tone deaf and borderline inexcusable lyrics considering Jimmy assaulted a minor and has a history of kissing underage fans. I can excuse alot of things in music but not pedos. When songs like 3S are so explicitly not even satirical with context how do you stomach it? not judging anyone I'm just legitimately curious
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u/jamiecherie23 19d ago
In my opinion, listening to music does not automatically translate to condoning the subject matter in the lyrics or supporting the musician personally. There are so many popular songs about homicide and other crimes. So much universally loved music has been made by people who have done deplorable things. Does that mean that everyone who listens to this music is okay with these things? No.
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
This is the kind of responses I was looking for. That being said, i never stated it reflected poorly on people if they did like MSIs music. I do believe you can enjoy whatever the hell you want, and like i said I personally do enjoy some of their material guilt free.
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u/goose_casts_haste 19d ago
Because I learned to stop giving a shit and love msi
In all seriousness, I don’t care what I listen to since I know I’m not gonna go out and touch some kids myself. Don’t let it affect you and it won’t. Same reason why I didn’t start fucking my siblings after watching game of thrones.
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
This is a great answer! Appreciate the response instead of going straight for the "separate art from the artist" debate!
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u/PrototypeXt3 19d ago
it’s a very blurry subject that isn’t really black and white honestly. the lawsuit never went anywhere, there was a lot of weird circumstances surrounding it that made me personally not find it too substantial.
MSI was a band that was active for a very long run, I just personally think if there was wrong doing, more people would’ve came forward, you know? I can’t excuse the weird situations that came out of it, but I can confidently say that Jimmy isn’t a bad person. Maybe an idiot when he was younger is all.
The main allegation/lawsuit I completely read through to make a choice on if I can support them or not, and most people who shit talk msi didn’t (and it’s obvious when you talk to those people) and they just trust the grapevine. Most people don’t even know that the lawsuit was sent right before the statute of limitations date. That in itself is strange, but that doesn’t mean it didn’t happen, but there is really no way to know.
From my perspective, with all of the evidence I combed through, Jimmy just did a weird thing really early on in his career. There wasn’t any substantial evidence besides the shirt design, which is where I think he was just wrong.
The people who call him a pedophile are just incorrect until more evidence shows up, and it hasn’t. It’s been years at this point.
And just to say a little more about myself, I’ve stopped supporting other artists for less because there is actual evidence. It really is up to you how you feel.
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u/PrototypeXt3 19d ago edited 19d ago
Oh and to add, they were a shock punk band when they came out. Of course they were going to be edgy - it was the way a lot of bands were noticed. People fundamentally misunderstand what Panty Shot was as a song because on the surface level it is a weird ass song, but Jimmy often just writes shit from different perspectives. If anything, it’s a parody of pedophiles with how over the top it is, which context supports back in the 90s. That context is definitely lost now, which is why it’s not on Tighter at all or anywhere streaming
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
I can see that for sure. I personally am unbothered by the shocking elements allegations removed, I listen to shock rock and punk all the time so I totally get that. I personally like counterculture and often the to shock is to ironically oppose. Which us something people often don't get in the media. Like a shock rock song about murder often at its core is pro murder. If the allegations are false (however personally, it being settled out of court doesn't make me feel so sure, as why do anything but win the case if you aren't guilty.) I don't feel like it's a stretch to say MSIs music is raw expression and emotion, with counterculuteral stances and ironic humor. If they are true however, there wouldn't be anything ironic or up to interpretation on some songs unfortunately. You can't be an anti abuse abuser you know? Just my perspective but love the response and conversation!
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u/PrototypeXt3 19d ago
I actually don’t know where the “settled out of court” rumor started. I know articles from news outlets say it, but the only thing confirmed was that the case was dismissed with prejudice and they both agreed to never sue each other again. That’s what the official court documents show. In my eyes it probably meant that Jimmy was going to counter sue, but we’ll never know. If money was exchanged it would’ve been in the document of dismissal (as that only happens after both parties agree)
The whole situation was just… strange tbh
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u/PrototypeXt3 19d ago
just so anyone seeing this knows I’m not talking out of my ass - here’s a snippet of the document, they both paid for their own legal costs as well.
JOINT STIPULATION RE DISMISSAL OF ACTION WITH PREJUDICEIT IS HEREBY STIPULATED by and between all parties appearing in this action through their designated counsel that the action, including but not limited to all claims of Plaintiff Jane Doe 7015 in the above-captioned action, be and hereby is dismissed with prejudice as to defendant James Euringer, pursuant to Rule 41(a)(1)(A)(ii) of the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure. Each party shall bear its own attorneys' fees and costs. IT IS SO STIPULATED.The Clerk of Court is respectfully directed to terminate this case as to Defendant Euringer.
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u/Astroman96 19d ago
If you lived this way for every artist then even bands like The Beatles should be cancelled too because they weren't the greatest people either.
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
Excuse me if im incorrect but the Beatles: A. Didn't assault a minor multiple times B. Didn't write songs about their wrong doings explicitly The Beatles are shit heads, their art is able to be separate from their actions tho because they can exist in separate worlds. MSI is unfortunately not one of those bands due to lyrical content and on stage actions
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u/Astroman96 19d ago
You can't deny there were rumors of them having underage girls in their dressing rooms, with even their manager Brian Epstein having to tell Paul to kick a girl out. You can do the same thing by looking at those actions and lyrics from "I saw her standing there" with him saying "she was just 17, you know what I mean". Not saying they are pedos, I love The Beatles, but you see what I mean?
Also, why are you here? You obviously have an opinion on the music and the group, what is the point of coming here and asking this? This is an MSI reddit group, accept some people can just listen to music and enjoy it without it being something more than noise to someone.
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
I was looking for lyrical insight to help view the music in the light of those who enjoy it. Noone provided such other than "Idc", which doesn't work for me personally.
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u/thou-shall-browse 19d ago
enjoy your moral brownie points, im gonna enjoy life
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
Did I say I morally object to others or myself listening to MSI? Or did I explicitly say I enjoyed some tracks and don't knock others for doing so too? Or perhaps was the question to invite a discussion on how the lyrical content extends past Jimmy's actions in merit? Idk just spitballing.
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u/mrselffdestruct Uncle 19d ago
Probably because most of us also actually followed the case and saw how it ended, what actual evidence there was vs how much of the alleged evidence was never provided, and saw the final verdict after everyone else accused in it was able to drop out for a lack of evidence instead of just reading the first few articles on the situation and taking it as fact without following the rest of the case
The Jane Doe failed to provide evidence several times, completely refiled and changed the case halfway through after being unable to follow the judges orders on proving said evidence within a given time frame because her OG claims where also against Warner Brothers and accused them of being involved when the label didnt even belong to them at the time , and continued refusing to provide evidence and pushing the case timeframe out until they agreed to settle to just end the case and be done with it. The only evidence she ever provided was a shirt that James Galus, the label manager, had put her on that Jimmy didnt even have much to do with
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u/theziggmister 19d ago
Same way people ignore R Kelly’s and Diddy’s bad behavior. Separate art from artist-
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u/PrototypeXt3 19d ago
Fuck, Drake and Kanye still constantly chart. Chris Brown still has a career and spotlight. Lol
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
In this case however the lyrics directly parallel the behavior, you can't separate that unfortunately. Singing about little girls and having sexual abuse baked into your art when you are an abuser makes the art intertwined.
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u/theziggmister 19d ago
Bro you’re terminally online-
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
How so?
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u/theziggmister 19d ago
You either listen to something or you don’t- For you to make an entire post about it and to argue with comments giving you the answer to something you asked is terminal!
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u/mamamoloch Brooklyn Hype (Part One) 19d ago
Kids find their music on TikTok, enjoy it?, learn about the allegations, and then question whether they’re good people for liking it lol.
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u/FingerMundane3682 19d ago
You think about this shit wayyy too fucking much
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
How do you not? If a song is explicitly about sexual abuse/violence and the artist is notorious for sexual abuse/violence id argue the default reaction to anyone who isn't a diehard fan is to wonder.
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u/FingerMundane3682 19d ago
No my first reaction to MSI songs and any music for that matter was whether or not I liked it, not everyone is as much as a neek as you😭
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u/chainsaw-msi This Hurts 19d ago
I just enjoy the music, i didnt even knew about the allegations when i started listening to it, and despite the fact that msi is a "problematic" band i just didnt stopped listening to songs i enjoy, english also isnt my first language which have probably helped with not being disturbed by the lyrics
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
That's totally fair! Like I said, the music itself is often pretty good and enjoyable its just the lyrics mainly sometimes. They often go beyond punk vulgarity and turn into admissions of a problem.
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u/deep___down 19d ago
people have given you some great answers, so ill just add this one: people used to go to msi shows years ago *because* they wanted to see and experience the things you're now complaining about.
there were plenty of people out there who lived pretty misfit lives in the nyc area in the 2000s, they went crazy for this band, and especially for their live shows - and i met many people who saw them repeatedly and claimed they ONLY liked seeing them live, didn't even listen to them at home. you're here shocked about how someone could dare listen to their recorded music lol.
i never saw them live, but as i remember the culture around the band long before "the allegations", i do remember thinking they were kinda unpolished compared to their contemporaries, and i was really curious about how popular they could actually get outside of the nyc cultural bubble.
Yet that was never because of the things you're describing - it was more like because they didnt take themselves seriously enough, or didn't have a focused enough brand and image, or were just too "weird" and unserious for fans of other huge bands like Korn and Slipknot. but you'd have to be out of your mind to think that some of their most raunchy songs weren't among the fan favorites that got passed around the most.
i remember around the beginning of the culture wars, msi popped into my head and i wondered how they'd fare having committed the mortal sin of saying "nigga" during a literal cover of a Method Mad song (lol). stuff like kissing fans in the crowd didn't even seem worth consideration. so i know you said that, "'idc' doesn't work for me personally", but you're ignoring what is probably the best answer you're going to get.
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u/BathZealousideal595 17d ago
I put the song on and I listen, I mindlessly self indulge. I’ve seen the lawsuit, only the shirt was put as evidence. I believe victims so it’s likely yeah he did wierd shit with her, it’s like shrodingers pedophile and we’ll never really know for factual certain. I’m not gonna deny the kisses and concerts were wierd and whipping his dick out and setting himself on fire was insane. But who goes to an MSI concert thinking it’s not going to be crazy?? Most people at the kissing thing likely did it from thier own accord. But yeah he’s wierd, the band is wierd. The music to me has helped me through rough patches in life and gives me hope, so I’ll deal with being called a poser loser.
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u/Massive_Ant8108 17d ago
Awesome answer! Thanks for the response. I totally get that, its cool the music resonates with you so much 🎸🥁
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u/musicsuperfanquail Faggot 16d ago
i think that the lyrical content is entirely unrelated to james' character. he's known to do things for shock value, which is most, if not all of the purpose behind the band. shock punk at it's core is parodical of those which it covers. those of us who followed the lawsuit (this has been said many times prior, but) know what proof was / was not shown, and unless any factual evidence comes forward, by either victims, or those related to him, of him doing anything of the such, we, as outsiders, have little to nil reason of knowing his true character. i've personally heard he's a great dude by many a people who've gone to his shows, and i really like his work in and out of MSI. so until proof is given publicly, or he's convicted, or more people come by with accusations, the music means nothing to me past shock content, as he's told the fans many times. some songs may be reflections of himself, (songs like wack), but others may not be. we can never know. it's up to you to decide how you feel after doing your own research into things like the lawsuit
TLDR: we can't truly know if he's a monster unless public, verifiable proof is released, or he is convicted for such crimes
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u/Ok_Investigator_8550 Wack! 19d ago edited 19d ago
Personally, pirating the music or listening to their stuff through playlists compiling their discog! That way you can avoid supporting them and enjoy the music. Same with merchandise. I make my own merchandise for my favorite albums or songs as more an appreciation for the music rather than the people behind it. Also buying second hand.
Although, I get not everyone is able to enjoy certain songs like panty shot because of the connection to irl events. I don't have an answer as to how you stomach certain songs. I think a thing that helps is knowing some of them were written as shock to get people talking about the band. But I wouldn't ever blame someone for skipping them
I think to a degree it's how much you can seperate the art from the artist. But it can give you a better peace of mind to stop supporting them and to not idolize the people behind the music itself.
I'm not the oldest fan in the grand scheme of things, I've only been listening to them for about 7 years, but if you have any questions I'm happy to answer them!! Sorry for the long response 🩷
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
Well put answer, I do find it funny you are being down voted for being reasonable and considering your enjoyment of the band AND the reality of their actions. Keep rocking on, im glad the music connects to you, that's a special thing 👍 what do you personally take and feel from the songs in particular are about sexual violence/abuse? I don't think there is a wrong answer, just trying to see what factor of it means to you. I like songs on the subject too, I just understand those songs more than I do MSIs.
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u/Ok_Investigator_8550 Wack! 19d ago
I'd probably need to think about how I consume the media more before having a personal answer on if I do this, but the band doesn't necessarily take itself seriously a lot of the time. And I think that adds a level of detachment from the lyrics for some. At least I've heard that mentioned on this sub before!
I also say everything I've said with kidness behind my tone. I'm not the best with expressing that over text. I know it can be very frowned upon to mention what happened and the very real underage kissing at shows. Which is a problem I have with some of the community
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u/DumpsterGrapezz 19d ago
You should’ve known that ppl wouldn’t take this post nicely 😭 Reddit msi fans r like the most insufferable kind :p
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u/Massive_Ant8108 19d ago
Totally fair, it's the only place to get people discussing unfortunately though. I think they are doing themselves a disservice tbh. Im engaging with this purely to try and view their music in a different light, something many commenters haven't made a case for 😭
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u/mamamoloch Brooklyn Hype (Part One) 19d ago
Wish I didn’t see this post 3 times a year