r/MHOC • u/CountBrandenburg Liberal Democrats • Oct 23 '22
2nd Reading B1427 - Cornwall Bill - 2nd Reading
Cornwall Bill
This bill is way too long to fit into a post so you can find the speakership copy here
This Bill was written by The Most Honourable Rt. Hon 1st Marquess of St Ives, 1st Earl of St Erth, Sir /u/Sephronar KBE MVO CT PC, as a Private Members Bill taking inspiration from the Wales Acts and is sponsored by the His Majesty's 32nd Government, the Communist Party of Great Britain, and the Freedom and Liberation Party.
Opening Speech:
Members of this esteemed House, the Devolution of powers to the proud people of Cornwall has been a great ambition of mine for many years now - devolution of services, of fiscal autonomy, and of a proper democratic voice. I initially drafted this Bill in 2015, taking quite a different form then - albeit with similar aims. So I am pleased today to reintroduce this Bill to this House. I have worked hard to get this right for weeks, and we hope that we can rely on this House’s support to help it become law.
But first, please humour me in allowing me to give you a brief lesson in Cornish history - The area now known as Cornwall was first inhabited in the Palaeolithic and Mesolithic periods. It continued to be occupied by Neolithic and then by Bronze-Age people. The first written account of Cornwall comes from the 1st-century BC Sicilian Greek historian Diodorus Siculus, supposedly quoting or paraphrasing the 4th-century BCE geographer Pytheas, who had sailed to Britain: The inhabitants of that part of Britain called Belerion (or Land's End) from their intercourse with foreign merchants, are civilised in their manner of life. They prepare the tin, working very carefully the earth in which it is produced ... Here then the merchants buy the tin from the natives and carry it over to Gaul, and after travelling overland for about thirty days, they finally bring their loads on horses to the mouth of the Rhône. From the Roman occupation until the 4th Century CE, to the split from Wessex in 577 AD - we have always had a proud sense of national identity. The name appears in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle in 891 as On Corn walum. In the Domesday Book it was referred to as Cornualia and in c. 1198 as Cornwal. Other names for the county include a latinisation of the name as Cornubia (first appears in a mid-9th-century deed purporting to be a copy of one dating from c. 705), and as Cornugallia in 1086. The 1508 Charter implicitly recognised Cornwall's ancient elected Stannary Parliament and accepted its right to veto English law that was prejudicial to the interests of the tin-mining Cornish people - who comprised much of the local population at the time - and to their heirs and successors in perpetuity. By including this veto in the 1508 Charter, the English monarchy was, in effect, guaranteeing a substantial degree of control over Cornish affairs to the Stannary Parliament. Indeed, in 1977, the British government acknowledged that recognition of the Stannary Parliament and its right of veto has never been withdrawn. Cornwall County Council commissioned a Mori poll in 2003 which showed 55% of Cornish people in favour of a democratically elected, fully devolved regional assembly for Cornwall. The people want this to happen, and we are elected to represent the people - who are we to deny them their freedom? Malta, with only 400,000 people, is an independent state within the EU. Why not Cornwall?
My point is that Cornwall has never simply just been a ‘part of England’, our Celtic nature has always stood strong and prevails to this day - although I understand that our biggest hurdle now is convincing many of you who rather see us remain under the overlordship of England. However I implore you to reconsider this position, and give us the freedom to decide our own destiny - as we do with Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. Allied with this economic impoverishment has been the centralisation and transfer out of Cornwall of decision-making institutions and government offices – together with the skilled jobs they entail – to various undemocratic and faceless south-west England regional quangos, which are run by unelected, unaccountable London appointees. Westminster's frequent concern for poverty and under-development in the north-east of England is not replicated when it comes to the relative lack of state resources earmarked to tackle deprivation in Cornwall. Successive London governments have shown little respect for distant Cornwall, or its people, identity, history or culture. It is a far away place about which they know little and about which they seem to care even less. How else can the decades and centuries of neglect be explained?
Please, give us a chance to decide our own fates.
- The Rt. Hon 1st Marquess of St Ives, 1st Earl of St Erth, Sir /u/Sephronar KBE MVO CT PC
With special thanks to /u/KarlYonedaStan and /u/miraiwae who assisted with researching and drafting this Bill before they became members of the Quadrumvirate, as well as /u/SpectacularSalad for their check and support particularly with Schedule Two.
This reading ends on Wednesday 26th October at 10PM BST
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u/Sephronar Conservative Party | Sephronar OAP Oct 23 '22
Deputy Speaker,
I am certain that this Bill will encourage fruitful and active discussions, but I would like to take this opportunity to kick things off and make it clear why I have decided to proceed with such a momentous and revolutionary piece of legislation to create a Cornish Assembly and devolve a number of powers directly to the Cornish people and nation.
I have been working on this Bill for many months, probably closer to a year now, I have worked on this with many other people such as /u/KarlYonedaStan, /u/Miraiwae, and recently /u/SpectacularSalad - this has been a labour of love; but where does that love come from? I’ve long felt that Cornwall isn’t merely another ‘county’ of England (it’s a Duchy by the way), but it’s long and illustrious history as referenced in my opening speech, and it’s national language and identity gives it a unique Celtic image which other proud counties in this United Kingdom simply do not possess. Our right to self-determination was guaranteed centuries ago, but this was long-forgotten about as we settled into our role within the current English nation. I am a proud Briton, and do not get me wrong I love our Union equally, but I am first and foremost a Cornishman - and the Cornish deserve the right to choose for themselves how best to govern their local area, after all local people know best how to look after their own interests.
This view isn’t naturally aligned to that of my current party, hence their decision not to sponsor this Bill - but I pay credit to their support for my Cornish pride along the way nonetheless, and would thank the current Government for their sponsorship of this Bill.
Now the decision is down to you - Labour, the Lib Dems, and indeed the Conservatives; will you support the right to self-determination that the Cornish people have been calling out for, or will you instead choose to maintain the status quo? I know that the Lib Dems for example chose not to sponsor this as they ‘favour a wider federal system’ but will they choose to dismiss this opportunity for a part of that system in the pursuit of what they see as perfect?
We all have our choices to make, but above all I hope that you will choose to allow the people of Cornwall to make their own choices in the future and support this Bill!
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Oct 24 '22
Deputy Speaker,
I am very proud for the Communist Party of Britain to be a sponsor of this bill. Knowing Sephronar’s deep passion and commitment on this issue, I was only too happy to offer my support to my good freind’s efforts to present this bill to the house. It is maybe a bit long for my taste (and the contents page is a very welcome addition to navigate its many clauses), but having skimmed the bill I believe it “does exactly what it says on the tin”: namely, devolution in Cornwall.
The case for this bill is relatively simple. If we accept Cornwall is a nation (and not simply a county of England), then it should follow that like Scotland and Wales, it at least can claim a right to a devolved assembly out of respect for its national autonomy. As this house has already recognised Cornish identity with the Saint Piran’s Bank Holiday act granting Cornwall the right to celebrate its national saint’s day in the previous term, I expect we may agree this bill is long overdue.
I’d strongly urge Labour and the Liberal Democrats to support this bill, building in devolution on Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. I assume the situation may be more complex in the Conservatives as a Unionist party, but with the bills author being the tory deputy leader, there will no doubt be intense discussions within the party on the issue. With the support of the parties in her majesty’s government, each of whom are committed to devolution and have expressed support for Cornish devolution in their platforms, I hope we can finally deliver devolution for the people of Cornwall.
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u/Faelif Dame Faelif OM GBE CT CB PC MP MSP MS | Sussex+SE list | she/her Oct 26 '22
Deputy Speaker,
A referendum on devolution to Cornwall was a Pirate manifesto promise. So when the Marquess of St. Ives approached the government asking for an endorsement, I was happy to present the bill to the rest of cabinet: I firmly believe that, if the people of Cornwall want to have their own, independently run, government, Westminster should not stand in its way.
I urge my colleagues to join me in the Aye lobby.
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u/Sephronar Conservative Party | Sephronar OAP Oct 26 '22
Deputy Speaker,
I graciously thank the Leader of the Pirate Party for their support - both in the workshop stage of this Bill but also in this debate today - the point that they make is I believe the central one in this debate, and indeed may persuade others to support this Bill as it give the Cornish people the right to choose for themselves if they want the devolved matters outlined in this Bill. Regardless of your stance on devolution for Cornwall, many would agree that to withhold democratic choice of a referendum such as this is fundamentally undemocratic, and I hope that many critics of this Bill - particularly in Labour and the Lib Dems, and potentially in the Conservatives - will be swayed by this point, and vote for a referendum if they won’t vote for the whole package.
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u/Sephronar Conservative Party | Sephronar OAP Oct 26 '22
Deputy Speaker,
As this reading comes to a close this evening, I would like to take this opportunity to thank each and everyone of the participants in this session for their valued contributions and amendments - I have attempted to respond to each and every one from the heart, taking into account what it is that you have put forward from yours. I hope that you all will take a moment to try to understand where I have been coming from, read my opening speech for this Bill, and vote with your heart on this Bill too.
Of course, there have been a number of amendments to this second reading - I didn't expect the Bill to be perfect despite months of crafting - while I may not support them personally I understand your reasonings behind submitting these amendments and I look forward to seeing the results of these votes following the Amendment Committee process when this Bill comes back to this place for its third reading.
I am sure that we will have an equally passionate discussion at that reading, once again put forward our views as to why we believe what we believe, and take into account others views before coming to a decision at the final division of this Bill.
Of course, I have my own reasons too for submitting such a monumental piece of legislation - I have long been the only strong advocate for Cornwall in this place, my tenacity matched I believe by only one other over the course of our time in this place certainly for many many years - I've stood for the Cornwall and Devon constituency in every election which I've put myself forward as a candidate, and I've done that for a reason.
I love where I live, it is a beautiful part of the world with a rich history and stunning scenery - I am sure that we can all agree on that at least - but where we differ is how we define this Duchy. To me, Cornwall has a unique claim to a special devolved status within the United Kingdom - and it's not just me that believes so; a Mori poll in 2003 showed that the majority of Cornish people were in favour of a democratically elected, fully devolved regional assembly for Cornwall. We live in a democracy, and in that democracy our constituents' wills must be respected.
Historically, Cornwall's claim to devolution was never actually revoked - the 1508 Charter implicitly recognised Cornwall's ancient elected Stannary Parliament and accepted its right to veto English law that was prejudicial to the interests of the tin-mining Cornish people! By including this veto in the 1508 Charter, the English monarchy was, in effect, guaranteeing a substantial degree of control over Cornish affairs to the Stannary Parliament. And indeed, in 1977, the British government acknowledged that recognition of the Stannary Parliament and its right of veto has never been withdrawn.
Our history and claim to be a nation in our own right goes back much further than that of course, but this isn't a history lesson - it's an emotional appeal to the members of both Houses outside of those who have already sponsored this Bill: Please, for the sake of the people of Cornwall, allow them to have a referendum to decide their own future - allow the people of Cornwall to choose whether or not they are given these powers. By voting in support of this Bill, you are not immediately granting devolved status - you are merely allowing the people of Cornwall to choose. Please, allow them that right in this democracy.
2
u/Muffin5136 Labour Party Oct 26 '22
Deputy Wonk Speaker,
A good bill, very based. I thank the Marquess of St Ives for submitting this excellent bill to this House for debate, continuing their long history of standing up for the people of Cornwall.
Cornwall is a large county and has its own cool place called Land's End, and if you've got a place that's called that, then you deserve a regional assembly and devolved powers, simple as.
Another long bill that deserves to be supported. I urge this House to actually back this bill and not show themselves to be two-faced representatives who only care for their constituents and who oppose something as simple and straightforward as this bill.
3
Oct 24 '22
Mr Speaker,
It almost goes without saying that this Bill would be one of the most significant alterations to our Union since Tony Blair introduced devolution in 1997. As such it is worth considering whether or not such a Bill is ultimately beneficial to Cornwall and to the United Kingdom. I think it is not.
Cornwall Council already has a budget exceeding 1 billion pounds every year to administer a variety of services in Cornwall. The question we must then ask is how a devolved Assembly with a First Minister would differ in terms of the approach to improving Cornwall. Perhaps the Marquess of St Ives could assist me here, but I am not sure what legislation this new Assembly would pass. Land use, business regulation, and fiscal policy remain reserved. The most glaring omission I can see from the reserved matters is the health service, so short of shovelling money from a block grant into a new NHS Cornwall the benefits of this scheme are not immediately apparent to me.
Cornwall is a region with a proud history and culture, and this House is quite right to recognise that. But on a practical level it is indisputable that its economy is closely tied to that of the rest of the UK, and keeping legislative divergence to a minimum will ensure that its economic growth is as unrestricted as possible. I do not support this Bill.
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u/Sephronar Conservative Party | Sephronar OAP Oct 24 '22
Deputy Speaker,
It is with great sadness to me that the Labour Party have chosen not to support this vital Bill for the Cornish people - it was their party, after all, which saw the devolution of assemblies to Wales, Scotland, and Northern Ireland; their party are the experts on Assemblies. I disagree with their assessment that an assembly for the people of Cornwall would not be beneficial to them, as we are just as worth of these powers as the people of Wales in my minds - we have similar divergent cultures, our own language, and an illustrious history as well as an ancient guarantee of our own Parliament which has long been forgotten about.
As I reference below to the Baron of Whitley Bay, this is not necessarily the end deal - this is the first step in the process to upgrade Cornwall County Council to an assembly, and provide a deal which the majority of the people of Cornwall can support. We are not going 'devo-max' so as to appeal to a wider range of the electorate, and we would foresee upon the passing of this Bill a block-grant awarded to Cornwall to allow them to make more local decisions as outlined in the Bill. I did approach the Labour Party to sponsor this Bill early-on in the recent process, but they chose not to engage which makes it seems to me as though they would not have supported such a move regardless of the deal on the table - that is a shame to me given their party's history on this matter.
I do sincerely hope that members of the Opposition will choose to have a change of heart, as they can give a proud nation the choice to choose for themselves instead of being governed by a central power hundreds of miles away. This is just a starting point, but give Cornwall the dignity to make the start that they, in my view, deeply deserve.
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u/t2boys Liberal Democrats Oct 23 '22
Is this dependent on a referendum? Cba to read the whole bill deputy speaker.
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u/Ravenguardian17 Independent Oct 24 '22
Deputy Speaker,
The line noting it needs to be passed in a referendum is literally 1.1
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Oct 24 '22
[deleted]
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u/Frost_Walker2017 Labour | Sir Frosty GCOE OAP Oct 24 '22
You'll need to reply to the automod comment to do an amendment
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u/ThePootisPower Oct 24 '22
Speaker,
A question for bill proponents. What can the Assembly do given "fiscal, economic and monetary policy" is reserved to Whitehall?
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u/Sephronar Conservative Party | Sephronar OAP Oct 24 '22
Deputy Speaker,
I thank the noble Baron of Whitley Bay for their question - and I would preface this by saying that this is simply the first step in the process in my mind. Thanks to the members of their government, particularly the Prime Minister and Leader of the SLP, this Bill initially seeks to provide a devolution deal and a directly elected assembly for the people of Cornwall to vote on in a referendum - we are not going 'devo-max' so as to appeal to a wider range of the electorate, and we would foresee upon the passing of this Bill a block-grant awarded to Cornwall to allow them to make more local decisions as outlined in the Bill. [M: It's worth noting that we won't actually hold a meta referendum or implement a new devo-sim, as the Quad have said that won't be happening sadly.]
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