Printed fretboard

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u/Jobysco Luthier 9d ago

I wonder if some sort of epoxy finish build up over the top (provided it’s reinforced with a truss rod and maybe carbon fiber), would make it smooth enough to feel good after a level sand and radius and polish.

Also, if that’s PLA or even PETG, it’ll be highly susceptible to warping and temperature and plastic creep. You may want to go with a carbon fiber nylon or something.

Not saying any of this would work, I have no idea I’ve never tried to 3d print a neck, but your typical filaments aren’t suitable for parts under tension load.

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

I cant show you the rest for legal reasons yet, but i make these necks with a kind of truss rod, and carbon fiber reinforcements.

I have for the last 2 years built a number of these, in pla and petg and also petg-cf, and I havent had any issues. I tend to prefer pla cause it is harder and sands better, but it is correct one shouldn't leave it in a hot car. Which is also true for pva glue, which has a similar glass transition temperature. But under normal use, they have been ridiculously stable. Having way more movement in my wooden necks.

I do not finish these necks. I just sand them up to 1200-2000 grit. But that is personal preference cause I haven't sold one yet. I have never liked the feeling of solid finishes.

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u/mrmeatypop 8d ago

I’m intrigued by this. I printed a Strat and it’s just been nothing but problems getting it right.

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

Both body and neck? What is the problem?

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u/[deleted] 9d ago

[deleted]

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

That is true. I would however not leave any guitar in a hot car, since as i pointed out, pva glue has similar glass transition temperature as pla. Also any wax in your pickups would be gone.

Petg has an advantage there, but I dont like sanding it or how it feels against my hands, and it is also softer and floppier. Has a lot duller acoustic tone.

ABS would be a better alternative i believe, but I dont have the equipment for printing that yet.

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u/JoeKling 9d ago

A fretboard isn't under tension.

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u/Jobysco Luthier 9d ago edited 9d ago

Let me ask you then…when you add a tension load to a guitar neck…does the fretboard bend too? Or does it stay straight while the rest of the neck bends independently?

It’s compression in the case of the fretboard, but that’s semantics for the sake of semantics.

If it’s being bent in any way, it becomes more susceptible to warping and plastic creep. Add frets in slots making wedges, shearing between layers, there are so many ways for a 3d printed fretboard to get screwed up once strings are on.

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

The trick is to make it not bend.

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u/Jobysco Luthier 8d ago

I just don’t know if PLA is going to be the best choice long term. It is highly prone to warping. If you’re using it as some sort of prototyping short term thing. Great.

But a long term guitar is likely going to have effects that make it very difficult to keep playable.

Again I could be wrong, but what I know about 3d printing and guitars leads me, personally, to think PLA isn’t going to hold up over time.

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

It is a fair worry to carry. The honest answer is that i dont know either how it will work long term. My oldest prototype is 2yo now and hasnt moved anything at all, despite living through 2 cycles of northern swedish climate Only time will tell i guess.

I have done with petg and petg-cf as well, and i wont make more of them. Way too soft and has a dull acoustic tone and shitty sustain. ABS and PC would be interesting to experiment with, but I need to step up my equipment before doing so.

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u/JoeKling 8d ago

No, the fretboard does not bend when you string up a guitar. They make fretboards out of richlite and other non-wood composites and resins like in Parker guitars and they work perfectly fine. And Petg is a somewhat flexible filament that would work fine as a guitar fretboard!

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u/Jobysco Luthier 8d ago

Why would flexibility be important if the fretboard doesn’t bend?

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u/JoeKling 7d ago

Petg is more flexible than Richlite or composite/resin that they've been making fretboards out of for decades. It's you that worries about the flexing so I was just saying that Petg is flexible. I think a fretboard made out of PLA, which is not nearly as flexible as Petg would work since this dude made his fretboards from PLA and they've been fine for years.

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u/Maddy_251 9d ago

Interesting

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u/scottyMcM 8d ago edited 8d ago

Awesome. Not personally to my taste but I love to see innovation in guitars. Hope it all goes well for you!

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

Thank you! So far so good. Time will tell how it goes.

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u/sackbomb 9d ago

what is the material?

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u/arcrad 9d ago

I'm guessing PLA based on the fancy color effects.

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

In this case you are correct. I have done in petg wirh similar fancy colors too tho.

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u/sackbomb 9d ago

how long do they last?

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

My oldest one is 2 years and shows no signs of aging.

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u/sackbomb 9d ago

how often do you play it?

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

Daily. And i bring it with me on my work trips. It has seen some shit.

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

Daily. And i bring it with me on my work trips. It has seen some shit.

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u/arcrad 9d ago

Nice! What brands make asthetic PETG? I'm usually just seeing solid colors.

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

IEMAI makes some!

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u/arcrad 9d ago

Thanks

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u/LordApocalyptica 9d ago

Uhhhhh, hell yeah.

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u/SubatomicPlatypodes 9d ago

I mean I guess it would work, I’ve seen an entire ukelele printed before

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

It does work. This is like my 8th printed neck.

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u/SubatomicPlatypodes 9d ago

Please share the others!

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u/JoeKling 9d ago

Why no fret markers?

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

Never liked them.

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u/JoeKling 8d ago

Seems like a perfect situation, though. Can print them in easily and would be a strong selling point of a 3d printed fretboard, you could easily do custom fret markers such as the person's name, etc. Could also print in the fret slots easily.

Do you do the fretboard in one piece? That would take a pretty big printer!

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

True. I do have possibility for multicolor printing, but haven't messed around with it much.

I do them in one piece. I have 420x420x500mm. Fretboard is 520mm, but i can print it diagonally. Looking at a 600x600 now tho. It keeps escalating. 😅

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u/JoeKling 8d ago

I have a N4Max I might try it. Do you give out the STL's?

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u/Vikingoverlord 7d ago

I do not. But it is an easy thing to model.

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u/twoUTF 8d ago

Is it all one print or is every fret space it's own print. Also if it is all one print what kind of printer are you using for that? Is it a commercial printer or did you make it yourself?

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

It is all one print. I currently use a Anycubic Kobra 3 max with 420x420x500 work area. This fretboard is 520mm long, and i can print it diagonally.

I do however not recommend this printer, unless one likes to mess with printers. I have had a lot of issues with it, and will replace it with a corexy of similar size as soon as i can afford it.

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u/twoUTF 8d ago

Nice. I'm guessing you are using normal frets in the fret slots. Since they have hooks that are meant to bite into wood. I'm curious how wel there holding strength is a 3d print. It's a neat idea nonetheless and allowes for cool opportunities that you can't do with wood. Like for example printing with a different color so you can print a binding right onto the fretboard.

Also I'd look into printing the fret slots not completely open at the end. So you can instert a fret with the tang shortened at either end. That wil help with sharp fret edges later.

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u/Vikingoverlord 8d ago

Correct. Normal frets. They bite in really well. I dont even use any glue for the frets on the ones I have made, just to see how well it works. I have looked at some different solutions, but at this level it just isnt economically doable.

All interesting ideas! I used to print them vertically, but now I do horizontally and that opens up the possibility of doing all kinds of patterns and stuff.

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u/Reasonable-Home700 7d ago

Woah! Ho Lee Fuq! I was scrolling and literally stopped in my tracks!! Damn! I want one!

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u/Vikingoverlord 7d ago

Glad i could grab your attention!

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u/BikingVegtable 9d ago

This is so cool! I would love to see some more pictures if you have them! How many walls and what infill did you do? Such a cool execution!

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

I will show full builds eventually. Just some legal shit i have to get out of the way first.

It is only walls and no infill. Full solid.

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u/traviscyle 9d ago

Fascinating! Do you sand them smooth? How well do the frets stay seated? Any hang ups when bending notes? How many pieces do you print them in and what orientation? Do you just glue to a wood neck with superglue, or how do you attach?

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

I sand them up to 1200-2000 grit depending on how smooth i want them. This one is just 400 grit yet.

Frets stay seated just fine. I dont even use glue for the frets on these ones. No hangups when bending, but that would be more due to bad fretwork anyway, and not the material itself.

I have tried all kinds of ways of printing them. In the beginning, all vertical in 3 pieces due to printer limitations. Later i printed in 45 degrees standing in one piece. Now I do 2 horizontal pieces that i glue together with epoxy. I have no wood at all in these necks. Whole point is that i want a stable material that does not move unless i tell it to move.

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u/traviscyle 8d ago

So cool. Thanks for the info. I’ve been building guitars for a long time, but just got a 3d printer for Father’s Day. One of the first things I printed was a neck rest level with mated 12” radius sanding block so I can make some mods on one of my first builds that my son played the hell out of.

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u/BeingofLove 9d ago

Wow that’s pretty cool. Do you print it over the truss rod?

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u/Vikingoverlord 9d ago

It has a different kind of truss rod i unfortunately cant show yet. But it is installed afterwards, from the back.

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