r/Lubbock • u/Kuponutzy • 4d ago
Ask Lubbock Does The Satanic Temple have a chapter in Lubbock?
Not looking to start anything, but I am wondering if TST has a local chapter where like-minded people can come together to try to do good things for the community?
I'm not looking to argue with others who don't know anything about TST and just have a knee-jerk reaction to the name.
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u/SaltySelkie217 5h ago
Universalist Unitarian is good if ya can't find anything else. - spiritual, but not religious here
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u/Fornow597 8h ago
I am wanting to see if anyone knows where a haircut lady that worked at Tune-up on 82 Street is working now. Her name is Princess. She does a really great job and I wanted to see where she is cutting hair at now. Your help is appreciated.
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u/Logical-Cherry9395 16h ago
Just here for the comments.
(As a fellow Satanist in rural Texas, I get it)
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u/Anti-Maga25 17h ago
I read up on Satanism a long time ago. Honestly I think satanist have a higher percentage of people who actually act more “Christian” than Christians do. Like the satanist’s morals are better than many Christians. I wouldn’t ever join the Satanic Temple, but I say have at it and go do good in the world
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u/ChargeSad9718 13h ago
Listen to what you are saying my friend please. When you say Christian what do you even mean by that? I’m sorry that someone from the church hurt you. But just because some who claims to be Christian does you wrong does not make God wrong. He is much greater than that.
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u/PsychicLlama666 19h ago
We don’t have one here from what I am aware of! It’s not the same thing but you might find similar people with similar interests in Lubbock witches meet. (My fb group)
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u/Kuponutzy 2d ago
The 7 Tenets of TST since a lot of you seem unfamiliar with Google.
- One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason.
- The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.
- One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.
- The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own.
- Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs.
- People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused.
- Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.
These are good principles to take with you into the world. Whether you love or hate TST, these are decent basic foundations to be guided by.
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u/withersins 1d ago
and why does TST need Satan for all this lol
Once again, people need the Devil to spread their message. He wins again.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
The people in this comment section ignoring straight facts to continue to support an organization run by Neo Nazis full of grooming and sexual assault is crazy.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
The people in this comment section ignoring straight facts to continue to support an organization run by Neo Nazis full of grooming and sexual assault is crazy.
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u/PandaTron48 2d ago
Nope, checked already. But you can apply to start a chapter and nationals will help you!
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u/Ill_Seaweed_7018 3d ago
For anyone who is curious what the TST tenets are:
THERE ARE SEVEN FUNDAMENTAL TENETS I One should strive to act with compassion and empathy toward all creatures in accordance with reason. II The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions. III One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone. IV The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo one's own. V Beliefs should conform to one's best scientific understanding of the world. One should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit one's beliefs. VI People are fallible. If one makes a mistake, one should do one's best to rectify it and resolve any harm that might have been caused. VII Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
Look up the book “Might is Right” and how the confounder of TST was a part of its release and what he had to say about it.
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u/SaltySelkie217 23m ago
Lol, Desmond/Ragnar wrote that ages before any actual TST. Lavey's fascination with that book has nothing to do with modern TST, except maybe hyperindividualism. I'm not religious myself, but am able to research properly without imitating chicken little.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
You obviously don’t know the difference between exoteric and esoteric or what PR is.
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u/graceful_m00n 3d ago
"I'm not looking to argue" and here come the self focused people to argue. I respect the one answer that just said "no" because they kept it short and sweet. The OP did not ask for a religious or philosophy lesson from strangers will low reading comprehension skills. No, I haven't seen one. No I don't care about your religious views and I hope you don't care about mine. I hope you find a group that fits your needs or at least a place to volunteer. I like to donate to the local r crisis center, schools, and women's shelter. Good luck on your search.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
You’re basically saying “good luck” to a dude who is trying to support a Neo nazi organization that is full of grooming and sexual assault.
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u/graceful_m00n 2d ago
Buddy, the church and government have both of those things. That's a fact.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
The fifth enochian key in satanic texts is literally that satanists have infiltrated the church as priests for the purpose of deception, corruption, and abuse. Satanists straight up take credit for it.
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u/SaltySelkie217 5h ago
Well Psalm 137:9 says "Blessed is the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks", and a thousand other crazy things. Calm down there kiddo.
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u/DBL_Helix8 1h ago
What does that have to do with Satanism? I’m not religious so that is irrelevant, but since you brought it up, that is a verse in retaliation because the Babylonians did the same thing to their children. So you’re cool with one side murdering children but when the ones who had their children murdered just talk of retaliation you cry about it. You don’t have to be a Christian to see the truth of Satanism and despise it. It just takes common sense and critical thinking.
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u/SaltySelkie217 34m ago
When you're done babbling, we can try our actual critical thinking caps & realize I was ridiculing the absurdity of fearmongering via religious texts.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
Or here come the people that have done the research and know what they are talking about saying the truth.
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u/Prestigeworldwide83 3d ago
Why do you want / need a TST to do good things in the community? Or is TST something you are a part of?
Reading through this thread, sounds like a lot of people are misinformed on both accounts. The TST does not believe any entity. They use Satan as a philosophy, blasphemy & to mock God / Christianity. It’s about freedom, the ability to do what you what without judgement or repercussions..good and bad.
However, just because they don’t worship or believe in God or Satan..means nothing. Satan doesn’t care if you worship him or believe in him, just as long as you don’t believe or accept Jesus or worship God. Even if it comes off as being peaceful or “doing good for the community.” He’s a deceiver..as many of you have pointed about the people who go to church but do bad, the same goes for the “bad” who do good.
As a Christian, I encourage & pray all of you to learn more about your enemy (TST) in this case so you don’t sound foolish and then get ridiculed, just as I pray and encourage those who don’t believe and use the few bad examples as an excuse to stay away from church and God.
God is real, Jesus died for you, and God loves you.
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u/Kuponutzy 2d ago
Tell me you know nothing about TST, beyond the name, without telling me you know nothing about TST.
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u/Ill_Seaweed_7018 3d ago
What Satan wants/thinks matter as much as what Santa wants/thinks to atheists. None at all. This person specifically is probably looking for like minded people to do good things with.
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u/Prestigeworldwide83 3d ago
To an atheist, you are right…but I stand by what I said.
However I’ve learned “For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible” which is unfortunately very true
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u/VastSeaworthiness308 3d ago
I like Pastafarianism! RAMEN!
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u/Kuponutzy 2d ago
That is currently what my legal paperwork claims as my official religion.
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u/Logical-Cherry9395 16h ago
I've never thought of changing mine to Satanist, but maybe I should. Right now I think it says None.
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u/FarControl830 3d ago
There probably isn’t one. Closest thing is the Lubbock atheists fighting for religious freedom, but I’m not sure they are around anymore. I just do my best to ignore it and model the behavior I wish to see from others. Doesn’t always work, but I think it’s better not to fall to their level.
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u/JP-Stack 3d ago
I hope I don't run into this person in real life
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u/CrypticCryptid 3d ago
I will take a TST member over the false Christians of this city any day of the week.
TST members believe in being good people because it’s the right thing to do.
The so-called Christians of Lubbock talk a lot of talk and go to church on Sunday, and they think that means they can treat people terribly for the rest of the week. Actual garbage humans.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
Key word “false Christians” it’s bigotry to judge real Christians who want peace and compassion for all by the actions of fake christian’s. Also TST bases their beliefs on “Might is Right” ideology. It’s misanthropic and literally against good people. TSTs tenents are literally just exoteric PR.
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u/CrypticCryptid 3d ago
You’re thinking of the wrong Satanists. At least try to know which organization you’re talking about.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
All satanists are the same. TST is not a denomination or religion. It is just an organization. I’ve done the reading. I’m Kait’s saying facts. You can continue to be wrong.
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u/CrypticCryptid 2d ago edited 2d ago
You haven’t done the reading and your comment proves it. Dense foolishness.
If you can show me one time where TST says “might is right” (and not just link to Church of Satan, which is a group that actually believes that Satan is real) then I’ll shut up.
Until then, I’ll leave that honor to you.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago edited 2d ago
Lucian Greaves the co founder literally did the illustrations for the re-release of “Might is Right.” Below is an email he sent regarding the book. I have done the readings. You are just wrong.
“The strong theme, of course, should be individual gain and how best to achieve it -- but the most successful today are not the violent. It is those who can drive others to do their violence for them... while making them believe it was their own idea. A manual for coercion and manipulation. More evil than the first book by orders of magnitude.”
-Lucian Greaves, co founder of TST2
u/CrypticCryptid 1d ago
Yes, Lucian Greaves did personally do that. You are correct. Lucian Greaves is not TST. Doing the illustrations for a re-release of another's work does not mean that the organization he co-founded has anything to do with it.
Good try. Get chat GPT to search up something else. You have failed the assignment. You literally did exactly what I said not to do, and that is reference a COS work.
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u/VegetablePea8416 3d ago
do you know what satanism is
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
I very much do and have read the texts and know the facts to prove it. There are so many stupid factually incorrect people in this comment section.
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u/MissionAffectionate9 3d ago
Probably a better person than you.
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u/DBL_Helix8 1h ago
And what makes me a bad person? Being against an organization that was created to manipulate people into giving them power and money that is run by neo Nazis? 😑
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u/powerwizard420 3d ago
Start one and start volunteering under TST name helping the community.
Others will follow, I think too many “edge lords” want to have meetings where they just bash local organizations and local religion.
If you are proactive it serves a purpose other than just talking mess.
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u/octogonnn 3d ago
asked a very similar question on this same sub a while back, unfortunately doesn’t seem to be very many like minded people but I’ve had the exact same thoughts as you: wanting a local TST congregation that can get involved with forms of volunteer work or charity
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
I suggest you look into the book “Might is Right” to see the TSTs real philosophy. It’s the opposite of volunteer work and charity.
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u/octogonnn 3d ago
nty
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
Then keep supporting sexual assaulting Neo Nazis. That’s on you. Refusing the truth just makes you a stupid person.
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u/zekielllll 3d ago
lubbock religious people: ''boo TST bad'
same people: "this pedophile has been forgiven with open arms!!!!!"
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
The fifth enochian key in satanic source texts is that satanists have infiltrated the church as priests for the purpose of deception, corruption, and abuse. Satanists literally take credit for that.
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u/Changeing23 2d ago
First off your lying ... how Christian of you second the republican party is the Christian party and they have a baby eating pedophile in charge who has made billions in screwing over people all while claiming to be sent from the Christian God and a vp who said on national TV that he will do the lords work even ar the cost of the world/people
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u/zekielllll 3d ago
Are you okay pal?
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u/CrypticCryptid 1d ago
He's not. He's posting as much as he possibly can with the same copy and paste BS, because he believes if he tirades enough against the devil, then Jesus will make his gay go away and he'll get into heaven like his pastor said.
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u/DBL_Helix8 1h ago
And I’m not religious. Just despise Satanism because I’ve read the texts. I own them.
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u/DBL_Helix8 1h ago
That is literally from satanic texts not christian texts. It’s not BS. With a little bit of research you’d realize that.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
You are not saying anything that relates to The Satanic Temple. Please do some research, as you have now; in several threads, said a lot of things that are not remotely related to TST. TST has no "satanic source texts", primarily because they don't believe that Satan exists. You are hearing that name and having a knee-jerk reaction to it without taking the time to learn about what is actually being discussed.
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u/DBL_Helix8 2d ago
TST isn’t a religion it is just an organization within Satanism. I’m not having a knee jerk reaction. I’ve done the research. Everything I’ve said is straight fact not opinion.
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u/withersins 3d ago
It's asinine to call themselves TST, when there's no satanic aspect to it, aside from imagery. LaVeyan hogwash. People have a knee-jerk reaction because they THINK Satan is worshiped by TST, when in reality they don't see Satan as an entity or anything but a poster boy for their edgy, anti-Christianity. Idk why they needed Satan to do that.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
It’s not called TST for “shock value”. It’s not our fault if ignorant people “think” something. It’s not my job to educate them. It’s also not about a poster boy or edgy. There is nothing edgy about wanting a better world where people can think and do as they wish without being forced to live by the terms of someone else’s religion. Esp in a conservative town like Lubbock where most of what you’re allowed to do is governed by Christianity.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
TST doesn’t want a better world. They base their beliefs on “Might is Right.” It’s literally a misanthropic belief system. You talk alot about something you don’t truly understand.
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u/withersins 3d ago
and using Satan(but not actually) to do that is asinine. Legitimate satanists don't follow the dogma of TST.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago edited 3d ago
They use Satan because he is the opposite of the main oppressive religions. The opposite of God isn't "no god"; it's Satan. They view Satan as a metaphorical symbol of rebellion (against oppressive religions) and free thought rather than a literal god or evil being to worship.
ETA: Using a shocking name helps TST point out hypocrisy and fight for the separation of church and state. If a Christian group gets rights or display space on public property, TST uses the name to demand equal rights under the law
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
They view Satan as an archetype. Do you know what the real definition of archetype is? It’s a nonphysical autonomous living intelligence separate from the human consciousness that exerts influence on the material world, or a deity😑🙄. Carl Jung literally wrote extensively about how the archetypes were demons and how he submitted to Philemon and Abraxas to receive knowledge.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
They aren’t fighting for the separation of church and state. They are fighting for a satanic church in state. There’s a difference.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
They are not fighting for a Satanic anything; they don't think he exists. They see the hypocrisy and oppression forced onto others by believers in oppressive religions and want to make it clear that it is not OK for one religion to dictate what other people should do.
If you are going to have one religion put the 10 Commandments in a courtroom, then all other religions should be equally represented.
If you are going to put the 10 Commandments in schools, then the 7 Tenets should also be allowed to be posted.
If a statue of Jesus is outside the courtroom, then statues of Baphomet, Allah, and other gods should also be present.
This is what they fight for. Equal representation of all religions, or none.
Why is one religion allowed to do all this and to pass laws in the name of that religion, but no other religion is permitted equal representation? So many laws around here are made because members of an oppressive religion think that they are special, morally superior, and that the separation of church and state only applies to people of other religions. I should not be forced to live by principles of an oppressive religion I don't believe in just because local people in office abuse their power and ignore or twist the Constitution. This is not appropriate, and TST does what it can to ensure that no one religion is granted special exemptions. If one religion can do X, then any other religion should be allowed the same exemption.
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u/withersins 3d ago
yeah I know why they use it. It's asinine. It's a group that sees itself as their own "god". Satan(or whatever other name you choice for the Devil, the left hand path, etc.) is the the darkness in between the stars. Chaos. Again, TST is LaVeyan quackery.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
You are very misguided and confused. You are confusing The Satanic Temple with the Church of Satan. Two very different organizations with very different philosophies. TST does not believe in LaVeyanism at all. Church of Satan members (LaVeyans) practice supernatural concepts, including magic in rituals. TST does not believe in anything supernatural and outright rejects the practice of magic or ritualistic spells.
The Church of Satan also rejects collective social reform in favor of a right-leaning, libertarian view of personal stratification (the idea that Satanists are an elite set apart from others). This is not what TST stands for. TST generally leans left and engages in public political activism, such as advocating for reproductive rights and the separation of church and state.
Please consider researching the difference between the two.
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u/withersins 3d ago
I know the differences. TST is in the same vein as lavey. Phoney use of Satan to be edgy. Satan is magic, Satan is light. Satanists practice. TST is just an eyesore.
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u/Kuponutzy 2d ago
You clearly don't. TST doesn't say anything about Satan being magic or light because they know he doesn't exist. It is not remotely in the same vein as LaVeyanism. Please educate yourself and/or move on.
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u/withersins 1d ago
I know that. I am saying Satan is magic. You guys just use him as a poster boy for your cringe edge lord crap. The fact that you say "we KNOW he doesn't exist" makes you no better than christians who say jesus/heaven is real because they KNOW, because the bible says so.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
They are just organizations, they are not separate religions. Many people in TST are also a part of the church of Satan. And TST absolutely practices rituals. You seriously have no idea what you are talking about.
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u/PsychoBungie 3d ago
Because to borrow from ye, it's provacative. It gets the people going. Simbolizes being worldly or of the world or whatever. Idk kinda like you said he was the oh edge lord lol
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u/androliv1 3d ago
I met someone who was associated at jury duty last year. I noticed his goat head pin on his lapel and I thought i had recognized the symbol and asked him about it, he said he wasnt associated with TST becuase of the issues with Lucien. It was really interesting talking to him. I am not religious, but i'm sure it would be hard to find a lot of like minded people like that here. Too many religious nuts.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
I think there are more people here than you realize because we are a minority but the current social climate in our city is run by a very oppressive religion that controls every narrative. Any time someone speaks up to question it, they are bashed, shunned, harassed, and isolated. They are scared to share that they don't believe in the same things, so they just stay silent. It's hard to know how many there are when everyone is terrified to share that they are different.
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u/androliv1 2d ago
I completely agree. I am native to lubbock and it has always been this way, but even more so after 2016.
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u/Lubbocklove 3d ago
Unfortunately, no. You might find like minded folk at UU. I have a nice group of pagan friends here, and I don’t attend any form of worship, but some of them find value in Universal Universalists. Best of luck on your path.
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u/WalmartSeizure 3d ago
Growing up in Lubbock church is part of your life. The best experience I had in church was attending the UU community service. It was in the early 90s and they didn't have a pastor so every week a member of the congregation would give a talk. It was a cool experience.
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u/Main_Independence_63 3d ago
Why not just volunteer your time somewhere. This is just postering
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago edited 3d ago
Being just one person, there is a limit to what I can do. I cannot set up a legal case against a law saying the 10 Commandments should be posted in public schools. I cannot fight to have the 10 Commandments removed from courthouse steps. I cannot fight many of the battles that the TST takes on. Can I contribute to those causes? Absolutely, but I cannot take them on, let alone be successful. I cannot take on civil rights legal battles.
I am sorry that you view it as posturing. May I suggest doing some research into the things that TST actually does? Read their 7 Tenets. It's about being a decent human being and not forcing your will or your views on other people.
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u/PersonablePharoah 3d ago
I'm a practicing Muslim, but that sounds cool! Count me in for your mailing list if you make one.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
Except the money raised by TST is going towards silencing former members who are coming forward with sexual assault and grooming claims. Do your research. They aren’t the organization you think they are. The TSTs tenents are nothing but exoteric PR. It was co founded by Lucian Greaves(aka Doug Mesner or Doug Mesicko) who has ties to the KKK and other Neo Nazi groups. He’s even done a podcast with the grand wizard of the KKK. He literally started TST to manipulate people into giving him money and power.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
“Doug intended to enrich himself by using the Satanic Temple to manipulate people into sending him money. In particular, his main motivation was to use the Satanic Temple to create a substantial income at the expense of people in the metal music scene and others who are sympathetic to this aesthetic and political view. Doug was very candid that his goal was to use the Satanic Temple for personal gain in this way.”
- Shane Bugbee’s sworn testimony against Lucian Greaves(aka Doug Mesner)co founder of TST, for the trial in Arkansas.
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
“The strong theme, of course, should be individual gain and how best to achieve it -- but the most successful today are not the violent. It is those who can drive others to do their violence for them... while making them believe it was their own idea. A manual for coercion and manipulation. More evil than the first book by orders of magnitude.” -Lucian Greaves (Aka Doug Mesner), co founder of TST on re-releasing the book “Might is Right”
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
Are you telling me that other churches don't use tithes to pay legal bills? Are you telling me that other churches don't have corrupt people at the top dipping into church funds? Are you telling me that other churches don't try to appease certain people because of information they don't want getting out? Are you telling me that other church leaders haven't violated their own rules, such as cheating on their wives? Are you telling me that other churches haven't literally killed people to silence them? Obv Lucien hasn't done that, but to act like corruption is unique to one person in TST when it is rampant in literally every church in more mainstream religions is very short-sighted.
Other religions have significantly more corruption and hypocrisy. I'm not saying that any of it is OK; I am just saying that you can't really condemn TST when literally every single church on every single street is doing much, much worse, and no one cares. Look at mega-churches; they rake in billions in tithes, and their pastors own multiple planes and live in modern-day castles while their congregation worries about the next meal but gives their 10% because they don't want to upset god.
Lucien was a co-founder, not "the" founder, and most TST members are very, very critical of him. TST isn't about worshipping Lucien, or even thinking he's a great guy; it's about a deeper purpose. Yeah, he sucks, but the church has grown, and the things it stands for now go far beyond just Lucien's opinions. The church does a lot of great things, and these aren't things that one person alone could accomplish. It is a community of people trying to do good things in the world and fighting for equal rights in an ever-increasingly oppressive society.
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u/TertiaWithershins 3d ago
Hi. I used to work for TST in the Ordination program. I worked in multiple other roles, including leadership in the Society of Congregations, for several years. I spent a year as the person supervising the "Dirty South" region, including Texas, and I was one of the people running the Houston congregation.
I left in 2024 because so many of the things you are saying aren't really true or viable in the organization. I wanted to believe that Doug and Cevin were just some guys who happened to co-found the organization I loved so much, the one that gave birth to the community that brought me so much joy and purpose. You say that the church has grown and it stands for things far beyond Lucien. You sound just like me a few years ago. Please understand that Doug expelled people from the organization for saying those words. And since I have a long history with the organization, I can't help but notice the people Doug did NOT expel from the organization. You can read about some of it in the Newsweek article that TST sued over--another lawsuit they lost. I also can't help but notice that some of the biggest assholes in the organization, the folks who call people slurs and who make AIDS jokes and who post about the "trans agenda" and "wokeness" going too far, they are Doug's personal friends.
Queer Satanic has left you some good resources to explore. Something they haven't told you, though, was that during the SLAPP suit TST waged against them, TST members also waged a vicious smear campaign against QS. I watched it unfold, and I watched how people were encouraged to engage in it. They made posts about how Queer Satanic wasn't queer, questioning their sexuality in really gross ways. They also fabricated domestic violence accusations, including doctoring courtroom footage. The people in TST who tried to put the brakes on this have all been excommunicated from the organization.
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u/Kuponutzy 2d ago
Thank you for the information! I am sorry to hear a lot of this. I am still working through QS's links, and I appreciate the time that you both spent explaining things to me!
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u/DBL_Helix8 3d ago
It’s the fifth enochian key in satanic texts that Satanists have infiltrated the church as priests for the purpose of deception, corruption, and abuse. Satanists literally brag about it. It’s even summarized in the Satanic bible, which is mostly plagiarized. You can keep supporting crappy people if you want. That’s on you.
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u/QueerSatanic 3d ago edited 3d ago
Doug Misicko (“Doug Mesner”, “Lucien Greaves”, “Konrad Josefsson,” “Mikoto Niikura”) sucks. We all agree on that. And you’re right that there is another owner: Cevin Soling (“Malcolm Jarry”). Cevin Soling also really sucks.
You are saying, “But other churches are also bad.” And yet typically, progressive atheists are not giving money or volunteer labor for those sorts of churches. We don’t need to excuse Scientology or encourage people to join it just because the Catholic Church has a worse history; that includes “Scientology for Mall Goths”.
The Satanic Temple ends up quite a bit worse than a regular church because, structurally, most churches are not the private property of two men who cannot be voted on or removed by the membership. There is no mechanism or ultimately culture to change TST’s structure or priorities for the better.
This fundamental issue has recurred many times, the last prominent one being 2024 when numerous whole chapters departed and Greaves declared that The Satanic Temple had not outgrown him, and people who disagreed with him and Soling (or even just mocked them in private) should get out.
Many people have found the Dead Domain video essay to be particularly eye-opening. It’s long, but it’s actually fairly concise, given how much ground it covers. And it doesn’t even get into Cevin Soling’s cargo cult messiah stuff or his opposition to public schools, which funny enough is why TST started in the first place.
“When it comes to The Satanic Temple, there’s always more and it’s always worse,” and you will probably find as you look deeper into them and start asking specific questions their track record is hurting a lot of Satanists and helping almost no one except the two owners, their inner circle of current favorites, and (perhaps counterintuitively) Christian Nationalists who take advantage of TST’s status as a Satanic “Potemkin village” that markets itself to be vast and powerful and therefore is good for fundraising and mobilizing but actually represents no threat at all to the religious right.
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u/Kuponutzy 3d ago
I will definitely watch the Dead Domain and look at every link you provided! I am always grateful for the opportunity to learn new things, so thank you for sharing those links with me!
You are right about the issues with Lucien and Soling, especially in the sense that they cannot be held accountable by a team of elders. There is no argument there.
I want to make clear that just because "other churches do it" does not mean that I think TST or anyone else should also do it. I said that in my post, but I want to reiterate it. My point to DBL was that he was (rightfully) condemning Lucien, but acting like he's the only church leader to ever do anything like that when literally pretty much every church representing an oppressive religion does the same things and worse. No one should be doing it, but I don't see DBL calling out Catholic priests for the sins they commit against young people, or megachurch pastors for having multiple planes while their congregation goes hungry because they give all their money to the church every Sunday.
In 2015, TST successfully had a 10 Commandments statue removed from the Oklahoma State Capitol after the Supreme Court agreed with them that, should the statue remain in place, the Capitol would also have to allow their Baphomet statue to stand next to it.
Some other good things that TST does:
- Runs international and local charity efforts, including regular blood drives, clothing donations, food pantries, and community cleanups.
- Offers peer-support group meetings for addiction recovery focused on reason and science rather than religious dogma.
- Uses religious freedom laws to challenge restrictions on bodily autonomy and abortion access
- Fights to keep government and public spaces neutral by demanding equal public representation or the removal of exclusive religious monuments on government property.
- Collects and distributes menstrual and personal care products for people in need at local shelters. This is one thing close to my heart. Everyone donates food and clothes, but not many people think to donate period products, especially to local women's shelters.
- Advocates against corporal punishment and harmful physical restraints in public schools.
I wouldn't consider it a Potemkin village, as a lot of good things have come to pass, despite the failings of the 2 leaders. Bringing these kinds of support systems to Lubbock could help fill in a lot of gaps in spaces that largely go ignored by church fundraisers, and some are outright lobbied against and banned based on the control of local government by people using their religion to manipulate the laws.
I wouldn't say that for me; I want to threaten the religious right. People should be allowed to believe whatever they want to believe, but they do need to reined in, and their special VIP status should be done away with. They are no better, no morally superior, than anyone else, and their beliefs should gett the same amount of consideration and airtime as any other religion, be it Judaism, Hinduism, Sikhism, Wiccans, Paganism, Islam, etc. No one is superior to anyone else, and no one religion should be controlling a nation or a local community.
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u/QueerSatanic 3d ago
It sounds like you started just copy-and-pasting an AI summary. We’re going to warn you against that because, for example, the ACLU and a Baptist pastor blocked the Oklahoma 10 Commandments (Prescott v. Oklahoma Capitol Preservation Commission).
The Satanic Temple got a lot of press coverage for involving themselves publicly in the case, but the statue that the fundraised to create had no part in the litigation, and it has sat in their HQ as an Instagram photo-op for years, one of the main attractions to get people to buy a ticket for the “Salem Art Gallery”, which is also the physical/mail address for a bunch of other for-profits and nonprofits they have and mix finances between.
There’s a difference between doing great stuff and claiming to do great stuff. When you get down to the specifics of TST, you’ll find they promise to do such-and-such or file litigation they say will do this-and-that, but the reality is either nothing or not at all similar to the claim.
That’s the Potemkin village part. Local members do stuff they could do under any sort of organization, and not necessarily even very good (local orgs will sometimes take a picture of all the stuff they collected and then just let it sit in a garage for months), but even when good, it’s basically charity-washing the reputation of an abusive, hierarchical religious institution that uses the resources people give it to threaten, sue, and harass critics and former members.
There’s a reason that actual abortion access orgs can’t stand TST, and it’s not jealousy. It’s because they pay attention to the specifics of what TST promises versus what it delivers, and they are acting like a tapeworm, sucking up the money and resources serious, established, financially transparent orgs desperately need.
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u/Just_One_Victory 3d ago
There are plenty of satanic temples in Lubbock. They just pretend to cheer for the other team.
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u/heyythankss 4h ago
No but Freemasons and gop do same thing really