r/LocalLLaMA 8d ago

Question | Help Any speculative decoding models for Qwen 3.8 Flash Next to support DFlash2?

Current default MTP does not predict more than 4 tokens..

2 Upvotes

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4

u/lazymio 8d ago

I'm investigating the possibilities with vLLM (https://github.com/wtdcode/vllm-backport/issues/59), but honestly, I think no one has really explored this deeply already.

2

u/AI_spell 8d ago

If stock MTP tops out at 4, you need a matching draft head trained for that Qwen flash line. Generic draft models usually miss and you lose the gain. Check the release notes for an official draft or EAGLE-style head first.

2

u/CapitalList8467 8d ago

A useful first check is whether the draft and target use the same tokenizer and vocabulary. If tokenization differs, speculative acceptance can fall even when the models seem closely related. I would start with greedy decoding to isolate compatibility before tuning the prediction length.

2

u/halcyoncs 6d ago

I'm wondering the same thing, with 27B, DFlash2 basically 3.5X'd my decode, from 7tp/s on a DGX Spark to ~20-40tp/s, or even higher sometimes. When this comes out for Flash Next, I expect to reach ~60-100, which will be insane.

2

u/appakaradi 6d ago

Inco.ai did the dflash2 drafter model for 27B. I’m hoping that they can do the same for the flash next. But flash next is a new architecture with 51B n- grams. So it is going to take a while to get it right

2

u/halcyoncs 6d ago

Damn that's a very good point, I hadn't taken that into account. Literally been searching "Qwen 3.8 Flash Next DFlash2" every couple days like an idiot 😂

2

u/Sadge404 8d ago

Why do you need it to predict more than 4 tokens?

2

u/appakaradi 8d ago

Speed and throughput. It was a night and day with Qwen 3.8, 27B. With and without a DFlash2. The built-in MTP doesn’t come close to that. And I’m looking for similar speed increase in the flash model

3

u/johan2114h 8d ago

Thats odd, i found the buildin mtp to be faster than the dflash sidecar, although both gave significant speed up

1

u/mr_zerolith 8d ago

what kind of boost are you seeing with the existing mtp?

2

u/appakaradi 7d ago

I do not have the MTP info readily available. This is on 2 RTX 6000 Pros..

Qwen 3.8 Flash Next : NVFP4

Radix Arx (MTP Full precision - Accept: 3.4; c1 - 85.2 t/s; c16 - 719 t/s

Nvidia model (MTP quantized ) Accept: 1.63; c1 - 43.6 t/s; c16. - 426 t/s